Re: Is EA Sports PGA Tour really listening to us??? Please Communicate with US!

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

That's a big ask there. As I remember, the only one communicating on the TW message board in the past and for EA Rory was Patel and he's at 2K now. What EA said through their communication, that we asked and really, really, really wanted was 60fps and the possibility to play career mode with only 1 round. They gave that to us, there's that. Unfortunately, it probably took a lot of resources and left all the game play issues on the backseat.  I really hope we get some answers though, maybe ApexHound will get something for us.

Who knows, maybe there will be more communication on the 2K game now. Not only the guys at HB went silence radio saying they were just devs now, and it was not their job to communicate with users anymore. They even went so far as saying they were all moving to the 2K msg board for 2K21, having new users ID for all of them,  just to never showed up a single time.  😃

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Let's be clear... there were many here including myself that stated that 60 fps was not a big issue for a golf game.

As for playing career mode with one round again something I could care less about. I feel if you want to do something go all out and do the full monty. But I have nothing against those that want it.

But let's address core issues before these other ones. GAMEPLAY is the number one issue of any game.

As for APEXHOUND... I think that is where the problem lies... EA is listening to these content providers that are gamers and at most casual weekend golfers. And what do we have...? An casual arcade style video game.

I would personally rather not have APEXHOUND as my spokesperson. We already have an arcade game... I would rather have someone that can represent the needs of the person looking for something more.

Dunno, when I look at threads on their X (twitter) account, comments about game play are rare. Just about all of them are complaining about online mode issues, they want lobby and more modes like alternate, best ball, skins, turn base stroke, and specially crossplay.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

Dunno, when I look at threads on their X (twitter) account, comments about game play are rare. Just about all of them are complaining about online mode issues, they want lobby and more modes like alternate, best ball, skins, turn base stroke, and specially crossplay.

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I don't follow their Twitter account... I think spending time here is more than enough.

I'm not saying that those other items are not issues as well. But in my opinion it is not the core problem with this game. What you are highlighting should truly be a small subset of the game. The Golf Club didn't seem to have an issue getting it right, and they were a small development group at the time. Why has it been such an issue for a juggernaut like EA with seemingly endless resources?

I think the most likely reason for the lack of communication is economics. The revenue, investment and resources are more in games such as EA FC 24 (aka FIFA), UFC 5 and NHL 24. The response time for fixes in these games are much faster because of extra manpower and resources. Latest example is the quick fixes on NHL 24 after multiple complaints on bugs.

During launch of EA PGA Tour, there were more resources and more communication. After Update 3.0, not many fixes were made on gameplay because the resources were focused on EA Formula 1 and the EA Star Wars Game. By August and now, all attention are on Madden, EA FC 24,  NHL 24 and UFC 5.

If another Tiger Woods shows up, there will be more demand, more revenue and more resources for a golf game. The last time this happened was in TW14. That game was advanced for its time and is my favorite golf game. This was a time when golf was considered cool. If this happens again, there would be more communication.

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@PalomaMarvel24 wrote:

I think the most likely reason for the lack of communication is economics. The revenue, investment and resources are more in games such as EA FC 24 (aka FIFA), UFC 5 and NHL 24. The response time for fixes in these games are much faster because of extra manpower and resources. Latest example is the quick fixes on NHL 24 after multiple complaints on bugs.

During launch of EA PGA Tour, there were more resources and more communication. After Update 3.0, not many fixes were made on gameplay because the resources were focused on EA Formula 1 and the EA Star Wars Game. By August and now, all attention are on Madden, EA FC 24,  NHL 24 and UFC 5.

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Et voilà Paloma, which was explained somewhere else. What we have left is a handful of devs working on Santa's theme for the next patch, and fixing easy stuff here and there that no one will really notice. Well, except for the things they have broken while trying to fix things, like the career leaderboard between holes.

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@PalomaMarvel24 wrote:

If another Tiger Woods shows up, there will be more demand, more revenue and more resources for a golf game. The last time this happened was in TW14. That game was advanced for its time and is my favorite golf game. This was a time when golf was considered cool. If this happens again, there would be more communication.

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Strangely enough, some of the users on twitter were bringing EA TW08 for PC. That's the game they want this one to be like, except with better graphics, of course.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

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Et voilà Paloma, which was explained somewhere else. What we have left is a handful of devs working on Santa's theme for the next patch, and fixing easy stuff here and there that no one will really notice. Well, except for the things they have broken while trying to fix things, like the career leaderboard between holes.

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I would not be surprised if they include a turkey theme to go along with the Santa theme. Imagine if a turkey or raindeer suit is added similar to the Bunny Suit in TW08 or TW09.

Speaking of TW08, that was another good one. I think that was the first to use photo gameface.

Absolutely zero chance of any EA community dev communicating with us on this game at this point 

We had HeySteveDave on the Discord talking directly to the players but then he left for UFC about a month in

Havent heard anything since 

Are they listening? God only knows

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@agentputt wrote:

Absolutely zero chance of any EA community dev communicating with us on this game at this point 

We had HeySteveDave on the Discord talking directly to the players but then he left for UFC about a month in

Havent heard anything since 

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Yes, exactly that. Like other devs, his job was done with this game and he was sent to work on another game.

This is not a casual arcade style video game. It's as much that as it is a simulation. 

The devs are not players of their own game or else a lot of what is in it would have been caught. They seem caught up in listening to the wrong people on what the game needs or it could just be they really aren't concerned with building a game that has a fan base still playing 8 years after it's release.

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@Beerrun4u wrote:

This is not a casual arcade style video game. It's as much that as it is a simulation. 

The devs are not players of their own game or else a lot of what is in it would have been caught. They seem caught up in listening to the wrong people on what the game needs or it could just be they really aren't concerned with building a game that has a fan base still playing 8 years after it's release.

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It might be just me but i think Arcade level should be like "all play" was on the Wii an 8 year old should be able to pick up and play. The pro or masters level should be hard sim experience. Until they figure out how to do that they wont get the support they want. IMHO

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@SlimDown57 wrote:

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@Beerrun4u wrote:

This is not a casual arcade style video game. It's as much that as it is a simulation. 

The devs are not players of their own game or else a lot of what is in it would have been caught. They seem caught up in listening to the wrong people on what the game needs or it could just be they really aren't concerned with building a game that has a fan base still playing 8 years after it's release.

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It might be just me but i think Arcade level should be like "all play" was on the Wii an 8 year old should be able to pick up and play. The pro or masters level should be hard sim experience. Until they figure out how to do that they wont get the support they want. IMHO

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@SlimDown57 I think that is a fair expectation. The Golf Club actually got this right, if you disable timing and play on Amateur settings it is near impossible to hit a shot off line. And Legend is challenging though I would suggest additional features be disabled.

Though I think Simulation should be the hardest level... and Masters something approaching it. IMHO Pro still needs to exist for the average player. It seems there are many fragile egos out there that would not play a game if they felt they couldn't achieve this level of competency. Even though it is just an arbitrary label.

And the whole idea is to build a community that would continue to support the game long term.

IMHO, creating a true handicap system... and having Open and Handicap Tournaments would go a long way to getting players involved. Where even the lowest skilled players could find some success occasionally.

EA does NOT care about anything in this game... its madden, madden, madden, madden, fc24 then other games, then pga at the bottom.. if they (EA) cared, this game would be much better.

some simple things we the people ask for are HOTFIXES, but (EA) is too stupid to figure that out!

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@-Roasted513- wrote:

EA does NOT care about anything in this game... its madden, madden, madden, madden, fc24 then other games, then pga at the bottom.. if they (EA) cared, this game would be much better.

some simple things we the people ask for are HOTFIXES, but (EA) is too stupid to figure that out!

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I understand why Madden is important to them as it is a pillar of their company. But there have been outcrys of incompetence in that game for years. It has become pretty obvious that the people in charge have lost touch with their communities.

NO ONE... has created a competent simulation type golf game in decades. Even 2K has a lot of issues that have no been addressed since it's release almost a decade ago. 

And though golf games don't have the same cachet as Madden... The Golf Club series has validated that there is a committed demographic that loyally plays over a long period of time, given the right environment.

Namely... good gameplay, and an environment in which you can create a controlled even playing field for competitors.

Obvious EA has the ability to create this type of game, but whoever is in charge has their own vision... and IMHO is out of touch with the users.

If they continue down this path, the EA PGA Tour franchise is doomed to failure.

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@ELF014 wrote:

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NO ONE... has created a competent simulation type golf game in decades. Even 2K has a lot of issues that have no been addressed since it's release almost a decade ago. 

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Well this is why NO ONE care anymore, it's impossible to satisfy the Simmers. Everything is always not right, it's always wrong, it's never good enough. So why bother?  And it's looking like we're getting another one and done with EA.

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@-Roasted513- wrote:

EA does NOT care about anything in this game... its madden, madden, madden, madden, fc24 then other games, then pga at the bottom.. if they (EA) cared, this game would be much better.

some simple things we the people ask for are HOTFIXES, but (EA) is too stupid to figure that out!

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I agree PGA Tour is at the bottom. Another Tiger is needed to make golf cool again and increase revenue for the game. If no new Tiger shows up, golf games will still remain at the bottom and can no longer Rock N Roll.

I don’t think Madden is the top priority; the player customization totally sux for years. The top priority is EA FC 24 and UFC 5 while NHL is in the next tier. EA FC 24 and UFC 5 have great customization, gameplay and resources because of revenue. Response time for fixes in these games are almost immediate. NHL is next in line with a one month response time. 

Current PGA Tour ranks last in revenue compared to other EA Titles. That is reason it is also last in response time and resources. It is unlikely to expect a hot fix on a game sitting in last place.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

Well this is why NO ONE care anymore, it's impossible to satisfy the Simmers. Everything is always not right, it's always wrong, it's never good enough. So why bother?  And it's looking like we're getting another one and done with EA.

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Simmers are not the only ones complaining about this game. The voices of discontentment is across the board from all levels of players.

As for never good enough... I never complained about the Links series... it could get better but that you hope would be a natural evolution of the product.

When I am talking about with The Golf Club series is actual shortfalls (ie. bugs) that have existed in the game for almost a decade that have never been addressed.

2K23 is definitely playable... and currently my golf game of choice. But it doesn't mean it doesn't bother me when a decade old bug occurs during play.

I guess my issue/disappointment is that after 30+ years of golf games on the market they really haven't evolved much and in some cases are not as advanced from the original releases from the late 80's.

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@PalomaMarvel24 wrote:

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Current PGA Tour ranks last in revenue compared to other EA Titles. That is reason it is also last in response time and resources. It is unlikely to expect a hot fix on a game sitting in last place.

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No more money to be done, game is going soon to EA Vault, top devs have moved to other game. And EA will have some explanation to do to shareholders why they made another golf game in the first place when it's not selling. One and done again, sadly. And 35,000 copies sold on PC, more explanation on why they used valuable resources on this.

On the other hand, I saw the largest shareholder of EA was PIF, the same Saudis fund owning LIV, and Vanguard.  The Saudis love golf, maybe there's a chance for one more golf game with some good old sport-washing. Maybe we will have music blaring in the background when we're on the course.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

No more money to be done, game is going soon to EA Vault, top devs have moved to other game. And EA will have some explanation to do to shareholders why they made another golf game in the first place when it's not selling. One and done again, sadly. And 35,000 copies sold on PC, more explanation on why they used valuable resources on this.

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I don't disagree with you that it is possible this could shortly go back into the EA Vault.

As for top devs... well, that I would question. The game is a mess... and I'm pretty sure companies don't like losing important resources.

But you are absolutely right about poor extended sales, but that comes from negative feedback. If the game was better, I would expect at a minimum the same sales numbers as the 2K series.

I don't have numbers for 2K23... but 2K21 sales total were at 3 million units at the end of May 2022. So there does seem to be a market for Golf video games, just not this one.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

On the other hand, I saw the largest shareholder of EA was PIF, the same Saudis fund owning LIV, and Vanguard.  The Saudis love golf, maybe there's a chance for one more golf game with some good old sport-washing. Maybe we will have music blaring in the background when we're on the course.

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Even though golf games don’t have the high demand and revenue as EA FC or any other sports game, the key attribute to a successful golf game is a good first impression. As @ELF014  pointed out, PGA Tour 2K21 had that first impression and sold 3 million copies. 2K21 was one of my favorite golf games; TW08 to TW14 are the ones that top that game. 

If next iteration can do what 2K21 did, there is a chance of the series surviving. Golf games failing to make a good first impression is doomed to fail because it does not have the market or wiggle room like an EA FC game. If next PGA Tour iteration is the same as the current game except for the music blaring in the background, the series would be a one and done like Rory.

Dunno, golf was a dying game in my area, courses were closing all over the places. Owners of courses were complaining business was dying. Then Covid came, and golf was just about the only sport open for customers, no problem with distance restrictions. Suddenly golf was booming again in summer 2020, and it was very hard to book a tee time. And it was the same for video games, there was not much else to do when everybody were restricted to their homes. PGA 2K21 went on sale at the perfect time.  And EA were boasting some record sales for their games too. We will probably never see those numbers again.

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@Katybee_1313 wrote:

Dunno, golf was a dying game in my area, courses were closing all over the places. Owners of courses were complaining business was dying. Then Covid came, and golf was just about the only sport open for customers, no problem with distance restrictions. Suddenly golf was booming again in summer 2020, and it was very hard to book a tee time. And it was the same for video games, there was not much else to do when everybody were restricted to their homes. PGA 2K21 went on sale at the perfect time.  And EA were boasting some record sales for their games too. We will probably never see those numbers again.

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This response makes total sense. I just forgot how the restrictions made golf boom again. PGA Tour 2K23 has sold 20K copies in its first month, but there is no new sales data on it. It is safe to assume that it was not close to the sales for PGA Tour 2K21. 2K21 came at the right place at the right time. The market does not favor a golf game until a new Tiger Woods comes along. The market favors Football/Soccer and Basketball since those are the top two international sports. American Football, Hockey, and UFC would be in the next tier for international sales. Boxing and Tennis are other sports that don’t have a large market share like golf. The weird thing is there is a larger market for Wrasslin than golf; there are 2 wrasslin games available.