Forum Discussion

ThereAtTheEnd's avatar
ThereAtTheEnd
New Adventurer
1 month ago

Dark Veil Needs More Love

Firstly, Dark Veil has no synergy with Barricade or Piercing Spikes. Previously (technically, currently) Piercing Spikes also didn't trigger Barricade, but now they do. The value of Piercing Spikes still remains unchanged when Dark Veil is used, & vice versa. An optimal example of a Legend with good synergy would be Wattson. Spark of Genius & Interception Pylon can work together to restore shields at a higher rate (& at an even higher rate with Energised Healer). Perimeter Security can keep players at bay, inhibiting them from shooting Interception Pylon, especially in buildings with elevator-esque ziplines. In return, Interception Pylon can prevent grenades from destroying Perimeter Security. I propose implementing Catalyst's introductory animation into gameplay by bolstering Dark Veil with a continuous line of Piercing Spikes at its base. Not only would this make enemies more hesitant to cross Dark Veil, as people stopped caring about being pseudo-blinded long ago, but it would also provide tremendous synergy with Piercing Spikes when used indoors by making accurate deployment easier, which would alleviate the problem of Catalysts being afraid to waste Dark Veil indoors.

Secondly, I propose permitting shorter Dark Veils to be raised without requiring that the Ultimate be fully charged or consuming its entire charge (especially when Dark Veil hits an obstacle & stops). This would be similar to Rampart's Sheila, with the exception that Dark Veil's total charge would be split into two components, where shorter Dark Veils can only be raised when at least one component is fully charged & would only consume a percentage of the component proportional to the length of Dark Veil deployed. This would allow for better Ultimate use in & between buildings, as the shorter Dark Veils would be functionally identical sans the fear of wasting the Ultimate's entire charge when used indoors or when it hits an obstacle & stops. Only one component would be charging at any given time, unless both are fully charged, to prevent doubling the rate of charge gain. A fully charged component won't recharge until fully depleted to prevent Catalyst from continuously raising Dark Veils by switching components.

Finally, the straightness of Dark Veil isn't always optimal, & its optimality decreases the more perpendicularly spread out the enemy team is. It's too common for enemies to already be at the sides of Dark Veil before Catalyst's team even finishes recovering because, even when they're sandwiched between a wall & Dark Veil, there will necessarily be some space at at least one side that enemies can spray you from. I propose implementing a 3rd toggle for the deployment of Dark Veil that raises Dark Veil as you move your crosshair along the ground, which would facilitate temporary pockets of calm for a safe recovery, unless an enemy gains height or uses the Void to get inside them. Presumably, this would co-occur with the second proposal, allowing shorter Dark Veils to be raised in shapes of Catalyst's choice as the other component charges up until the component being used is depleted, unless the other component is also fully charged. If one component is depleted while in this toggle, raising Dark Veil would begin drawing charge from the other component if it's fully charged.

5 Replies

  • EA_Mako's avatar
    EA_Mako
    Icon for Community Manager rankCommunity Manager
    1 month ago

    Thanks for the detailed points of feedback ThereAtTheEnd​!

    While not quite as in-depth as what you've proposed here, Catalyst is picking up a couple nice buffs with the start of Split 2 tomorrow.

    Check out the patch notes for more details and let us know how she feels once you've had the time to get a few matches in with her!

    Apex Legends™: Marked Midseason Patch Notes

  • ThereAtTheEnd's avatar
    ThereAtTheEnd
    New Adventurer
    1 month ago

    Hello EA_Mako​ & thanks for the response.

    I was already aware of the upcoming (now present) buffs at the time of posting.

    I approve of moving the then-level-3 perks to level 2, as Ferro-Door will be heavily desired early in games as the increasingly popular Fuse's Knuckle Clusters & Mad Maggie's Riot Drill bombard Catalyst's shelter, & Resilient Veil would also be desired heavily for early rotations. Decreasing Dark Veil's deployment time was also needed, as I cannot count how many times I've placed the line of spikes only to be beamed before they can rise. Catalyst used to be the only controller who couldn't effectively make a door unavailable to an enemy with their Tactical, & it's nice that doors can be reinforced from afar. However, along with their aforementioned lack of synergy with Dark Veil (which is a problem concerning Dark Veil), I still have some quarrels with Piercing Spikes. In fact, my personal list of suggestions for Catalyst suggested increasing the height of Piercing Spikes' hitbox & making them reinforce doors they touch, both of which have now been implemented.

    I love that Piercing Spikes finally reinforce doorways, but I'm sad to see Sole Piercer leave. Its replacement does 10 more damage per second & eases the problem of enemies leaving the spikes before taking a second tick of damage, but getting any damage at all with the size of Sole-Piercing spikes when used at a distance was already hard enough. Ferro-Frenzy spikes are even smaller than I thought they'd be after watching the gameplay trailer, & are also much easier to escape early without taking any damage due to the slower activation. It's only slightly helpful that the perk lets you place 1 more spike at a time because it doesn't grant +1 maximum charge, so 2 will cover roughly the same already-small area as 1, but leave you with nothing left to throw. It would be better if it either activated quickly, had the same size as regular spikes, or granted +1 maximum charge.

    I've never picked Hidden Spikes, & that aversion has only been exacerbated by Piercing Spikes reinforcing doorways. Hidden Spikes shone when enemies opened a door to have spikes materialise under their feet. This would be unexpected because the orb would be hidden behind or beside an innocent-looking door, but that's no longer viable with ferrofluid on the door, which also deters enemies from passing through the doorway. Hidden Spikes have only become more situational & less viable with their automatic reinforcement. Due to how situational they are, I expected Hidden Spikes to be incorporated into Catalyst's base kit & replaced by another perk before I knew what the buffs would be. I now think a perk that implements the suggestions for Dark Veil would be a good candidate for that replacement.

    Those are just my buff-related quarrels with Piercing Spikes.

    By default, Catalyst should be able to have a maximum of 4 Piercing Spikes in existence to (1) match the maximum of 4 reinforced doorways & (2) facilitate owning space more similarly to other Controllers (except Rampart, whom I see as an Assault Legend). However, implementing the aforementioned Dark Veil suggestions would already let Catalyst hold that much space, so this wouldn't be needed as much.

    You should also see a highlight (such as the one given by Hidden Spikes) in the shape of Piercing Spikes (much like Dark Veil), so you know how it'll manifest after throwing it. This is especially needed now that Piercing Spikes reinforce doorways, as you sometimes throw the central orb near a doorway only for it not to get reinforced because the spikes didn't go through it.

    The central orb of Piercing Spikes should change colour from blue to red through walls (so it's still blue if you have line of sight to it) when they're activated, since simply rising a couple of inches (millimetres IRL) isn't noticeable from afar.

  • ThereAtTheEnd wrote:

    The central orb of Piercing Spikes should change colour from blue to red through walls (so it's still blue if you have line of sight to it) when they're activated, since simply rising a couple of inches (millimetres IRL) isn't noticeable from afar.

    By "activated," I'm referring to when Piercing Spikes flare up due to a nearby enemy. EA_Mako​

  • Solution to Dark Veil's Clipping Bug/Feature

    An exemplary clip (you may have to pause to see how the veil clipped):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5pMvSuYbX8

    The solution is simple & would solve the utter waste of ultimate charge from her veil getting clipped. If (& only if) the veil encounters an obstacle it can't ignore, it should change orientation. By that, I mean that it should start climbing its sides. In the exemplary clip above, that would mean it would continue rising on the inner walls of the crate: 1st horizontally, then upside down, then horizontally again, then upright, repeating until its length has been exhausted. If it were to exit the crate from the ceiling, then it would grow out of the crate, then turn on the upper rim onto its roof & continue growing with the same angle of 'reflection' as its angle of incidence. If this is incomprehensible, then think of it as a light beam. If you're standing on a thin, levitating, square sheet or platform mid-air, then place a veil 30° to one of its edges, then (rather than stopping), it would continue growing under the platform at the same angle to the same edge, seemingly reflected by said edge (ignoring the small length of veil that would rise on the sides of the platform before turning under).

    However, with perpendicular veils (which rise from the crosshair to the left & right), this would be the last resort. While in preview mode for a perpendicular veil, if only 1 side of the veil is predicted to be clipped, then the centre of the veil (while still in preview) would shift to the side that isn't predicted to be clipped by the same distance as the length of the veil that's predicted to fail to rise. For example, if there's a wall 5m to my right that's too tall for the veil to ignore, & there's nothing to my left but flat land as far as the eye can see, then while I'm previewing my perpendicular veil, its centre should be 5m to my left, compensating for the length that would've been wasted if it had been right in front of me. This wouldn't apply to parallel veils because there's no conceivable benefit to your veil rising further behind you (beyond filling the small gap left by not looking down before placing the veil). The suggestion in the 1st paragraph would only apply to perpendicular veils when both sides would necessarily be clipped, even with adjustments to the centre.

    Midnight9746​

  • ThereAtTheEnd's avatar
    ThereAtTheEnd
    New Adventurer
    1 day ago

    The climbing, reflecting, etc., would also be shown in preview mode.

Featured Places

Node avatar for Apex Legends Feedback

Apex Legends Feedback

Give feedback about the Legends, maps, weapons, loot and more in the Apex Legends community forums.Latest Activity: 1 hour ago
35,521 Posts

Recent Discussions