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An issue of concern: Developer and Player relationships

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  • kOeGy
    18 posts Member
    Hello ppl who dont have skill!

    Surprise surprise, i didnt play tib 37.. Rolsei played my account and he is well known for "pvp? Nahh, give me good outposts" ;) But ye, i dont care about your trashtalk.. Its just funny how you cry like little babies, no wonder that some ppl of yours prefer playing with us :) At least there are some honest ppl of yours who admit "we know, multi account using is ****, kills the game, but we cant help.. We dont have enough & skilled ppl do have a proper alliance.." But not you guys, no ofc not.. The germans have the advantage of the mighty mods and developers, which told us about every weakness this game had.. ROFL, are you rly believing yourself? :D

    Oh no, the game still gets supported, getting improved and patched.. Instead of being happy about that, no of course you have justify your bad gameplay and success with stupid fakenews and nonesense.. Good job.. But please go on, its funny as hell :)

    And if you really doubt about my skills and leadership, then yes again.. You dont have a clue about anything, because im the best and you know it ;)

    dont forget to register your multiaccounts as fast as possible at the wcs, it has only space for 5k players =)
  • kOeGy wrote: »
    Hello ppl who dont have skill!

    Surprise surprise, i didnt play tib 37.. Rolsei played my account and he is well known for "pvp? Nahh, give me good outposts" ;) But ye, i dont care about your trashtalk.. Its just funny how you cry like little babies, no wonder that some ppl of yours prefer playing with us :) At least there are some honest ppl of yours who admit "we know, multi account using is ****, kills the game, but we cant help.. We dont have enough & skilled ppl do have a proper alliance.." But not you guys, no ofc not.. The germans have the advantage of the mighty mods and developers, which told us about every weakness this game had.. ROFL, are you rly believing yourself? :D

    Oh no, the game still gets supported, getting improved and patched.. Instead of being happy about that, no of course you have justify your bad gameplay and success with stupid fakenews and nonesense.. Good job.. But please go on, its funny as hell :)

    And if you really doubt about my skills and leadership, then yes again.. You dont have a clue about anything, because im the best and you know it ;)

    dont forget to register your multiaccounts as fast as possible at the wcs, it has only space for 5k players =)

    Boom! Thanks for giving us an insight of your character--the mighty kOeGy! LMAO.

    You're the best, man! You want a cookie now? lol

    Peace out!
  • kOeGy wrote: »
    Hello ppl who dont have skill!

    Surprise surprise, i didnt play tib 37.. Rolsei played my account and he is well known for "pvp? Nahh, give me good outposts" ;)

    @Envision: Take note. From what your rules says https://tiberiumalliances.com/rules

    "We do not allow Account Sharing. Multiple people using the same account is not allowed. Should you give your login details to a fellow player, we will not undo anything the aforementioned player may do or cause, including but not limited to: Suspension/Ban due to actions carried out by said player"
  • kOeGy wrote: »
    Hello ppl who dont have skill!

    Surprise surprise, i didnt play tib 37.. Rolsei played my account and he is well known for "pvp? Nahh, give me good outposts" ;) But ye, i dont care about your trashtalk.. Its just funny how you cry like little babies, no wonder that some ppl of yours prefer playing with us :) At least there are some honest ppl of yours who admit "we know, multi account using is ****, kills the game, but we cant help.. We dont have enough & skilled ppl do have a proper alliance.." But not you guys, no ofc not.. The germans have the advantage of the mighty mods and developers, which told us about every weakness this game had.. ROFL, are you rly believing yourself? :D

    Oh no, the game still gets supported, getting improved and patched.. Instead of being happy about that, no of course you have justify your bad gameplay and success with stupid fakenews and nonesense.. Good job.. But please go on, its funny as hell :)

    And if you really doubt about my skills and leadership, then yes again.. You dont have a clue about anything, because im the best and you know it ;)

    dont forget to register your multiaccounts as fast as possible at the wcs, it has only space for 5k players =)

    " Rolsei played my account ".................... no one admits when when he loses............rolsei maybe write "me not in 37 Poo run my account etc...etc....etc...."playing with other accounts is against the TOS, you just assumed that rolsei has your keys .....
  • ToXXXic69
    8 posts New member
    @inzomn1a

    This blustering and argument is unnecessary.

    In your post in the thread about multi-accounts, you said "With these changes coming in, I thank Envision for helping me save my money and helped me decide to use my time elsewhere." In other words, you said that since you are incapable of winning a server without a multi-account advantage, you are leaving the game.

    Either you are no longer a factor to the future of the game, in which case your comments are irrelevant, or you were lying about leaving the game, in which case your comments again are irrelevant for lack of substance.

    BTW, your post in patch 19.1 was absolutely hilarious. The most funny of the entire thread. I am seriously considering framing it and putting it on a wall so I can read it again for a laugh from time to time.
  • ToXXXic69 wrote: »
    @inzomn1a

    This blustering and argument is unnecessary.

    In your post in the thread about multi-accounts, you said "With these changes coming in, I thank Envision for helping me save my money and helped me decide to use my time elsewhere." In other words, you said that since you are incapable of winning a server without a multi-account advantage, you are leaving the game.

    Either you are no longer a factor to the future of the game, in which case your comments are irrelevant, or you were lying about leaving the game, in which case your comments again are irrelevant for lack of substance.

    BTW, your post in patch 19.1 was absolutely hilarious. The most funny of the entire thread. I am seriously considering framing it and putting it on a wall so I can read it again for a laugh from time to time.

    LOL. Who are you? Why don't you post with your real account so I know if I played with you before.

    Anyway, nowhere in that post from Patch 19.1 I said I was leaving the game--so I don't know where you draw your conclusions from. As for the post, please do frame it and send me a picture--glad to know someone will think of me. ;)
  • ToXXXic69
    8 posts New member
    > @inzomn1a said:
    > nowhere in that post from Patch 19.1 I said I was leaving the game--so I don't know where you draw your conclusions from.

    These were your words "With these changes coming in, I thank Envision for helping me save my money and helped me decide to use my time elsewhere."

    Deciding to use your time elsewhere means you are not using your time in this game anymore. Get it? You are the first person I have met that needs someone else to explain to them what they have said. You are exceptional.
  • @ToXXXic69

    How about interpreting it this way: alts uses up a lot of time. Therefore, the use of that time can be put elsewhere. Doesn't mean I can't play with just 1 account, lesser time. Again, I'm trying to understand what your point is and how you are contributing here--considering you began your first post in this thread with "This blustering and argument is unnecessary." How ironic.
  • frankly if they did this wcs with no funds available to use from day one to ff .. see who really can play and those who cant
  • Lol how did this discussion go from conflict of interest/private discussions with Devs to mudslinging about multis? This is not the thread to complain about multis and who used how many on what server... although if you did use 10 alts and you're complaining about others doing the same, that's hilarious...

    But let's use Patch 19.1 to dissect why one group having more influence and access than the rest of the community is a problem, and why this has real consequences. It's true that Schaffa was not the only ones complaining about multis in the forum. BUT after badly losing Tiberian 37, they were the ones who were the loudest and most aggressive in pushing for a fast solution ahead of WCS, and they were the ones suggesting changes to the resource distribution. And the Devs listened because a patch was hastily put into place and the start of WCS was delayed.

    Many other players were vocal in the forum with their concerns on how the patch would ruin teamplay while it was still being tested. Once it went live on Tiberian 38, it became clear these concerns had been ignored... leading to the outcry in the forum we are seeing. Now we find out the Devs has been having private talks with the same team that complained the most.

    So on the outside, it looks like a favored team lost a world, became a bunch of crying babies, and as a result the game had to change for everyone else. And then this team worked with their Dev friends to develop a patch so they wouldn't lose next time. Even if it's not as bad as this (no transparency means no one can know for sure), the fact is that team digging is not a major part of Schaffa's digging style compared to other alliances. The perspective and feedback they give is going to be different than others who have been more affected. If the Devs are listening primarily to one group, it's not a surprise that the new game mechanics have gone in a direction that benefit them.

    I'm not arguing in favor of multis by the way. It's like playing tennis with multiple racquets. But the way the patch was so hastily developed and how it seemed to cater to one group's digging style, while ruining the game for other players that didn't use multis but liked team digging, and now we find out that same group has been talking privately to the Devs this whole time, strikes me as wrong and grossly unethical.

    I'm not sure how the Devs can fix this and regain player trust in the integrity of the game. They certainly aren't being helped by the arrogant, dismissive attitude of the guys responsible for this debacle.
  • i think multi accounting has ruined the game to a point that lots have gotten drawn into it like the rp farming in the earlier worlds and no one tries anymore solo
  • and plays one accont and does it that way .. no wonder many dont return or get **** with same olds winning :(
  • ToXXXic69
    8 posts New member
    Makes no sense to think that the developers have suddenly met with a team in private and as a result decided to make rules for the WCS that favored that team above the others.

    Developers have been trying to get players to stop using the resources of one account to help another for a long time. This is nothing new. The 19.1 patch is designed to force players to get their gains with the resources the game gives one single account (240 CP and 24 Hours RT / day). It is a change that favors nobody. It sets a level playing field for everyone.

    It is unfair to the developers that their character is in question over this.
  • APuneet
    1 posts New member
    > @kOeGy said:
    > hey ppl who cant play the game!

    > @kOeGy said:
    > Hello ppl who dont have skill!

    > @kOeGy said:
    > Surprise surprise, i didnt play tib 37.. Rolsei played my account and he is well known for ...

    Well,

    I am definatly not the best player or most skilled or whatever, but what Mr. kOeGy says is just arrogant and highly disrespectful against all other players. I dont think thats how players should judge / talk about others. Instead of offending others you should help them to understand the game better .... but no you just to choose to be a loudmouth.

    And not enough you also tell the whole world you are cheating! really - that is epic. You are telling us you gave your account to Rolsei .... didnt you know thats against the TOS and strictly forbidden. Nuubal said you guys are talking to the devs to get rid of the exploits ... thats in fact a real good thing (even if I agree it has to be not a TS from you), but while you try and work hard to get rid of several exploits you use the account sharing at the same time? Why havent you also worked to get rid of this? Maybe cause it helps more than it hurts? .... hmmm, seems wierd for me.

    But I bet there is also a perfect explanation for this like for everything pointed out here. I just hope EA / Envision sticks to their own TOS now ...
  • "It is a change that favors nobody. It sets a level playing field for everyone." -ToXXXic69

    if you don't enjoy attacking bases with friends and you're more of a solo digger or farmer, the patch won't affect you. if your alliance is made up of a bunch of solo diggers and farmers, it now has an advantage over other alliances who relied on digging in teams and sharing resources to help everyone grow. It's not a level playing field, it's a change to the game that favors one style of play.

    It does smell fishy if the idea being pushed by guys who were talking to the developers in their teamspeak was the only one that made it into the patch. If you look at all the things these players have said in the forum since then, they are ecstatic. None of them have posted anything giving ideas on how to bring back team play in the german or english forums. So it's odd they would invite the developers to their teamspeak to discuss how to fix a problem they don't seem to care that much about. Guess it's out of the goodness of their heart and has absolutely nothing to do with wanting to influence the direction of any future changes to the patch.

    I do feel some sympathy for the developers if their intentions were innocent, even though they brought this problem on themselves.
  • @Klobuchar If you make accusations here you should inform yourself better if you have no idea what you are talking about.

    Every alliance relies on Teamwork and shooting in teams. Yes you are right, there are players who shoot their bases mostly solo, me for example, but also most Schaffa/nVidia/Mara or whatever you call it players normally shoot their bases in teams, especially on non moral worlds, which now is not possible anymore due to the patch.
    Every alliance suffers because shooting in teams is no longer worthy.
    Klobuchar wrote: »
    "
    It does smell fishy if the idea being pushed by guys who were talking to the developers in their teamspeak was the only one that made it into the patch.

    Yes we were talking to the developers about the patch and told them our idea to prevent multi account abuse and don't destroy teamwork at the same time. Then they released 19.1. and what was the result. They made the new ressource distribution rule completely different than our suggestion.
    But noone cares about this, because now that it is known that the devs have been on Schaffa TS several times everybody thinks that the devs take our suggestion 1 to 1 in game.
    It's just funny how everybody believes in this fakenews. The devs heard our feedback, but also the feedback of many others who were complaining about the multi account problem and found - even it is far not optimal - a solution to prevent it. So, no the patch does not play us in our cards, because it wasn't even our suggestion. We suffer like everyone else because shooting in teams is no longer possible obviously.
    Klobuchar wrote: »
    If you look at all the things these players have said in the forum since then, they are ecstatic. None of them have posted anything giving ideas on how to bring back team play in the german or english forums.

    Also false. If you just would take some time and go through the recent topics you would see that many Schaffa etc. players made suggestions to optimize the patch so that teamwork doesnt get destroyed.
    E.g: https://forums.ea.com/en/commandandconquer/discussion/236932/patchnotes-19-1-pte/p4

    Especially I tested the new patch precisely on PTE, found many bugs, which were not intended by the devs (e.g. that all ressources are shared, not only when killing the CY) . Also I, like many other normal players, enemies of Schaffa etc. and Schaffa etc. players, suggested solutions which will work better than the current ressource distribution rule and the devs responded to it and said if it's possible or if there will be problems with this alternative solution.

    So what are you all complaining now. There is no minimal advantage the devs gave us because they visted our TS and heard our feedback. It's just one of many suggestions and what they implement in the game afterwards depends on the devs and not uniquely and exclusively on our feedback. This idea is the only hilarious thing...

    Uncle

  • ToXXXic69
    8 posts New member
    @Klobuchar

    Lost resources kills teamwork and that is very bad for the game experience for all teams. Some teams perhaps will feel this more than others, but it is still a level playing field.
  • I haven't seen the same kind of team digging in Schaffa that other alliances use. What i have always seen is a good number of individual players digging solo, spread apart from each other, with the rest of the alliance in the back in a grid farming outposts.

    I can only judge from what I see, just like other players who weren't involved in these private discussions with developers can only make judgments from what they see. No one knows what suggestions you made because, GUESS WHAT, you guys made them in a secret conversation using your own personal hotline instead of doing it above board. So maybe what you're saying is true and maybe it's not. I don't believe you but it's not like I can for sure say you're lying... and it's your own fault if other players don't believe you either. This whole thing was super shady to begin with and it came to public knowledge by accident when one player made the accusation on the german forum and someone else copped to it.

    That thread you linked to was closed a month ago, and the only Schaffa player I see making any kind of suggestion on team play is yours. There have been 15 threads that have started in the forum since the patch went live. I also looked through the recent threads in the german forum including one on the patch and how it destroyed team play, and there's not a peep from the big-name Schaffa guys.

    "But I bet there is also a perfect explanation for this like for everything pointed out here."

    Agree with APuneet. Everything can be explained away somehow, and it all sounds sooo reasonable, and poor Schaffa is just a victim in all this.
  • nuubal
    40 posts Member
    But let's use Patch 19.1 to dissect why one group having more influence and access than the rest of the community is a problem, and why this has real consequences. It's true that Schaffa was not the only ones complaining about multis in the forum. BUT after badly losing Tiberian 37, they were the ones who were the loudest and most aggressive in pushing for a fast solution ahead of WCS, and they were the ones suggesting changes to the resource distribution. And the Devs listened because a patch was hastily put into place and the start of WCS was delayed..

    After the first week of tib 37 it was clear what was happening on tib 37. I dont even care about loosing a server. Playing with a mass of alts is not skill. It is just some ****.
    After all the years I only have one questions about this: Do you think that average players will be the best godlike player in this game by using alts? Hm. LOL. What will happen if the the best players in this game will use the same of alts in this game? The average player will still be average. You all wont see the PROs to use alts.............................................. Even without using alts I was able to be that good as the prehitter.
    Many other players were vocal in the forum with their concerns on how the patch would ruin teamplay while it was still being tested.

    We also knew that the teamplay was killed with this patch. We discussed some options to help the teamplay (ups, we did that on TS, huge problem, so we shoud totally **** up teamplay)
    So on the outside, it looks like a favored team lost a world, became a bunch of crying babies, and as a result the game had to change for everyone else. And then this team worked with their Dev friends to develop a patch so they wouldn't lose next time. Even if it's not as bad as this (no transparency means no one can know for sure), the fact is that team digging is not a major part of Schaffa's digging style compared to other alliances. The perspective and feedback they give is going to be different than others who have been more affected. If the Devs are listening primarily to one group, it's not a surprise that the new game mechanics have gone in a direction that benefit them.

    First of all, you talk about Schaffa. There was no Schaffa in that whole topic!
    Answer me just one question: Do you like using a massive amount of alts to push a main account?
    I'm not arguing in favor of multis by the way. It's like playing tennis with multiple racquets. But the way the patch was so hastily developed and how it seemed to cater to one group's digging style, while ruining the game for other players that didn't use multis but liked team digging, and now we find out that same group has been talking privately to the Devs this whole time, strikes me as wrong and grossly unethical.

    The whole problem of this while thread is that we spoke with the guys about this. You say that you dont like to kill teamplay. We also do. We talk with them to restore the teamplay. We discussed some options to get teamplay back.

    AND EXACTLY THIS DISCUSSION IS NOW THE PROBLEM, BUT YOU ALL WANT TO HAVE TEAMPLAY BACK. SORRY FOR TRYING TO HELP ALL LEGAL PLAYERS.
    [/quote]
  • Questions were asked about other ways private conversations with developers could be abused. Besides having more influence on game mechanics and future patches, there is the potential for gaining detailed knowledge of the math and formulas behind the game and developing private scripts.

    This is a topic that’s come up before, but the reveal of an ongoing developer/player relationship has given it new importance. One example is the German sector script that was used by Nvidia/Schaffa for years before being accidentally leaked to the rest of the community. In addition to the recent script leak, the formula for sectoring was also eventually given in the forum, but this doesn’t explain how the German script-writer got the exact math years before anyone else did. Also, Schaffa’s detailed mathematical knowledge of the mechanics behind tunnels can have only been gained through inside sources.

    Another interesting point someone brought up is new game strategies created based on detailed knowledge of the game. Such as the invention of wave farming by putting cash bases in no-wave zones on Forgotten Attack worlds that was used by Schaffa players soon after these world’s first started.

    So there’s no one smoking gun that players can point to. It’s the accumulation of many things over the years that look suspicious, combined with the recent revelation that has made this a hot-button issue.
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