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Spring Challenge in WCS

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  • If EA deems that WCS has been mishandled, I think the actions below are appropriate:

    1. WCS 2019 world is completely reset and a new date of the reset WCS world is announced;
    2. EA developers ensure that no special events are held or applicable to the WCS world;
    3. All communication of EA developers and players are to be held in a public forum (written, video, chat) and no private meetings are to be held at any time; and
    4. EA refunds every player total cost of EA funds used in the WCS world.

  • Takman1979
    2 posts New member
    i can tell u why u are loosing. it has nothing to do with EA or developers.
    Your problems are Communication and not existing PVP skills.
    Also u have to less good diggers, when i look at your hole allies i can only see 5-6 good diggers/players the rest are only midfield. i dont want to disrespect u, because u all did not so bad the first weeks but please stop finding any mistakes by others why u loose, search in ur own rows where the mistakes are.
    I find a lot of low answers from u all here in this topic. Something like angry was first schaffa was 2nd at some time... omg this is a really low standing because when u have only a little bit skill in this game u could see that when angry was first it was only because of big fakeoffs in all their cashbases. that was the only reason why we where 2nd at that time. So please stop flaming and keep calm and try again in 2 years maybe with some new taktics.
    Thx
    Tak
  • Thank you for your clarification SpeirFein - we still hope that someone will step forward and start answering our questions.

    I see you Mr. EA_Roger - silent you are again?

    https://snag.gy/bRJWPA.jpg
  • Takman1979 wrote: »
    i can tell u why u are loosing. it has nothing to do with EA or developers.
    Your problems are Communication and not existing PVP skills.
    Also u have to less good diggers, when i look at your hole allies i can only see 5-6 good diggers/players the rest are only midfield. i dont want to disrespect u, because u all did not so bad the first weeks but please stop finding any mistakes by others why u loose, search in ur own rows where the mistakes are.
    I find a lot of low answers from u all here in this topic. Something like angry was first schaffa was 2nd at some time... omg this is a really low standing because when u have only a little bit skill in this game u could see that when angry was first it was only because of big fakeoffs in all their cashbases. that was the only reason why we where 2nd at that time. So please stop flaming and keep calm and try again in 2 years maybe with some new taktics.
    Thx
    Tak

    Let me break down some things for you, Takman:

    1. No one here is denying that Schaffa and co are awesome diggers. You are.
    2. Schaffa and co are very good at communication and pvp. You are.
    3. Most of AB had fake offenses as do almost everyone including Schaffa. Most were under level 10-20 (only significantly impacts player score first few weeks). You should know why everyone does that. It's a common tactic on FA worlds.
    4. Up until pvp, AB had the most PvE kills. In terms of digging, AB is equal to Schaffa and perhaps more so in regards to digging on average.
    5. Some of the top 10 Schaffa players were hurting big time on RT because they switched mains quickly or didn't switch fast enough. Even managing RT to under 1.5 hours per hit and also pvp'ing at the beginning of the server took a toll on many top Schaffa accounts in terms of RT. You can dispute that all you want, but the math doesn't lie.
    6. Schaffa was able to recover enough RT with the event to launch a successful bubble attack. A sound tactic for a underpowered alliance. It worked very well. Up to that point, Schaffa mains and AB mains on average were equal. AB farms had higher levels, defenses and SW on average. To counter that, the bubble attack was needed.
    7. Schaffa in general is fairly homogeneous when it comes to language (German). This does wonders for pvp. Having an international alliance like AB creates a bit more issues with regards to communication.

    In conclusion, yes, Schaffa pvp has been solid. Better diggers? No, not really.Better bases at the start of pvp? No, not really.

  • LegionF9
    16 posts Member
    You factually wrong on some of your counter-arguments.

    > @SpeirFein said:
    > 3. Most of AB had fake offenses as do almost everyone including Schaffa.

    Actually Schaffa enforced that until center fake offenses did not exceed a single low level unit.

    > 4. Up until pvp, AB had the most PvE kills. In terms of digging, AB is equal to Schaffa and perhaps more so in regards to digging on average.

    AB got that higher count in the first weeks of server by killing lots of useless bases using pre-hitting.
    After week 3, Schaffa was killing 50+ bases daily, and AB only 30-35, on average. AB was not falling behind in distance only because they had a much narrower tunnel. The difference is Schaffa had higher mains and could shoot a base per day from all of the accounts. AB could not do that because of lower offenses.
    Schaffa arrived to center first. Killed the first hub a couple days ahead of AB. Despite taking a longer and wider path to center.

    > 5. Some of the top 10 Schaffa players were hurting big time on RT because they switched mains quickly or didn't switch fast enough. Even managing RT to under 1.5 hours per hit and also pvp'ing at the beginning of the server took a toll on many top Schaffa accounts in terms of RT. You can dispute that all you want, but the math doesn't lie.

    However, people that used the event still had in excess of 7 days rt when pvp began. A few still have as much now.

    > 6. Schaffa was able to recover enough RT with the event to launch a successful bubble attack. A sound tactic for a underpowered alliance. It worked very well. Up to that point, Schaffa mains and AB mains on average were equal. AB farms had higher levels, defenses and SW on average. To counter that, the bubble attack was needed.

    Schaffa throughout the server had 18 or more mains in the top 30. That's a big advantage compared to the combined mains of the coalition, not just AB. And all of top 5 until maybe a week ago.
    What other measure can you possibly have in mind?
    What does farm defense matter if you can one-shot for one hour rt? All of AB was shot down for very little rt.

    Schaffa was clearly all-around better. The only advantage coalition has is numbers. It did not manage to use it properly on this server, partly because of communication, also because of lower average quality of players. It could still work out, next time.

    Some people here say that 7 days rt helped Schaffa. But coalition could have 7 days for 5 times more accounts (not people :) ). And if that was used properly, it would help coalition not Schaffa. Advantage for everybody who wants to use it. Seeing and using opportunities creates advantage, event itself does not give advantage to anyone.

    p.s. Also to those saying that there was never an event on wcs before, that's not true. There was a black friday event and then a christmas event on wcs 2015, right before the center battle, and both sides there also thought it gave the enemy an advantage. But the one who can see how to use it gets it, and the one that does not know how to use it, does not.
  • Takman and the rest who try to switch subject - the essence of this discussion is not who did what on world champ and who will win it - that is to be honest complettely irrelevant to this discussion. What we are discussing is what Envision has done and is doing.

    I agree - looking at each of their misstakes separatelly - there is an arguble explanation to why something went wrong. However if you line up all of their misstakes - a certain troubling pattern starts to emmerge - maybe I am the only one who sees it - let me put the facts on the table - you guys decide whether you also see anything strange.

    Fact 1
    Germans lost tib 30, 32, 35 - they knew that we are comming to test our coalition on tib 37 before world champ - so they entered themselves tib 37 to see for what they will be up against later. They lost tib 37 - maybe during tib 37 or directly after they had a discussion with Envision about multy accounting - how to prevent it on world champ server. Multy - accounting is apparently an "unwanted behaviour" - I don't know why it is unwanted, but it does not matter why - it is unwanted.

    How do we know it as a fact? Well - one of their guys got drunk and boldly reported on German forum that representitives of Envision visited them on their TS and spoke about patch 19.1. Master161822 started a thread on English speaking forum - rest is history.

    Sole defence Envision was that they were simply gathering information from the community.

    Fact 2
    Koegy also decided that he can say what ever he wants - so he told everyone on the forum that he was not playing himself his account whole tiberium 37 - clear violation of EAUA - but no penalty - not even a warning to him.

    Envision Entertainment told us that they do not ban players - that is up to Electronic Arts, I wrote several times to EA Community Manager - Mr. EA Roger - no reply - he did not care - let's remember this.

    Fact 3
    Well Envision gathered information from world champions - why not gather also from us who represent a substantial pool of players - so on those grounds we started our discussion with Envision. I don't know why it was a problem for Takman, Nuubal or Koegy to share what was discussed between them and Envision - we on the other hand did all of our discussions in Direct Messages through this webpage - we have print screens of everything in case there will be any needed to present them for everyone in the future for some reason.

    Not sure which of our arguments expedited patch 19.2 - most probably it was the inconsistancy between what EA promiced us as subscribers of their gaming service and what Envision killed with patch 19.1. Anyone of you can open start page of tiberium alliances - if you click "About" you will see what Electronic Arts promices us all - and it is:

    "CRUSH YOUR ENEMIES
    Join forces with your friends and forge strategic alliances in-game. Storm the battlefield and lay waste to enemy bases in Player vs. Player and Player vs. Environment battles. "

    Well that thing - that we can with our friends kill PVE bases - that was torpedoed by patch 19.1.
    Envison asked for our suggestions how to fix it - we send them 3 different - one of those was similar to what they already were testing on PTE - they implemented that one.

    I thought that we are done at that point - all is good - stopped pushing. Little did I know that I was not done - but that is later in the future - I will return to it in a bit.

    Fact 3
    You guys noticed that you can finally change your nicknames in the game? Anyone know why? Well I know because we made it happen. My guys had nothing to do - between t37 and world champ - they found a cloning bug.

    How many of you tried to change your in-game nickname in Origin without any luck? Important question - how many of you, after realising that it does not change - went back to Origin and changed back your nickname to the original? I gues not so many - because it does not change in game - why bother?
    As it turned out - you shoud have done it - Origin database where you register is a separate database - just pick any nickname and register there. Once you are registered - any free in-game name is up for grabbs - so you can make a clone from everyone who previously tried to change their nickname and never botherd to go back and restore it to the original name.

    One implication is of cause harrassment. Find out (in our case) shaffa players who did not put original name back - make a clone - start writing nasty stuff on world chatt - try to ban the owner. That is mild things - what was the real problem - is that server does not distinct between the clone and the owner - it only cares about who enters it first. So if you make a clone of someone and log him first to the new server - before the owner - clone gets all priviliges - such as - alliance invites and private messages. Owner becomes the clone and cannot play at all...

    What did we do? Did we try to make clones of Shaffa - no - we went straight to Envision - pointed it out and it got resolved. Here I give you both + and a -. Plus for fixing it very fast - minus for not telling anyone anything. Why not write something like this:

    "Greetings Commanders,
    Some of you noticed a bug that allowed illegal cloning of the accounts, at the same time a lot of you wanted to change your in-game names - we fixed the bug by enabling you changing your in-game nicknames - enjoy this new opportunity..."

    But no - it seems you like to give minimum information to the community and rest is hush hush hush.

    Fact 4
    Now we arrive to start of the world champ - a lot of misstakes here from the Envision again. First and most obvious one - is of cause pre-start - why did it happen? It is not the first World Champ right? No explanations, just usual stuff - "sorry it was not suppose to happen..."

    Second misstake - you allow people to buy RT packages - and many bought as much as 30-40-50 six hours RT packages. What do you do - you close world chemp - re-open it again - RT packages are there, but not usable.

    Now comes really interesting thing - people are complaining - you need to fix it somehow - how do you fix it - you refund players in full for the RT packages, BUT!!! RT packages are still there. So those who were smart and bought RT packages - they got both all funds back and still have RT packages hanging. Why don't you delete them????

    We checked - and they are not seen on any server so far - but on world champ - they are hanging there. Why?

    Fact 5
    Back to patch 19.2 - after couple of weeks of world champ - my guys did not get how it works. Resources were burning - patch was sometimes working, sometimes not working. After killing pretty hard bases 25 attacks with several players - I was making a google docs spread sheet trying to calculate the exact amount of damage to the def units and building. 5 people were participating - for 2 hours I was putting numbers to it - still - we did not figure out why patch worked at the end - according to our calculations main hitter should have got 81 % of damage, but game mechanics calculated differently - so patch worked.

    April 8th I contaced Envision again - next day we agreed on the solution - to introduce an attack aggregation calculator in the in-game build simulator. This supposed to be introduced in patch 19.3. On the question - are we talking days, weeks or months before you can do it - Envision answered that weeks - that was April 9th. Now it is May 22nd - more then 6 weeks has passed which is 1,5 month - no patch 19,3 even announced. Another misstake Envision - you should have said months, not weeks.

    Fact 6
    Obviously we are here again - another mistake - Spring Competition that never suppose to happen. Again we hear - "sorry - that was not suppose to start on world champ".

    Pattern that I see is obvious - either there is a bunch of incompetent noobs that are working for Envision - making misstake after misstake - or you are doing it on purpouse.

    It is not my job to investigate why this is happening time after time - me - as many others already spoke want to have an independent investigation launched by your employeer - Electronic Arts to answer simple questions:

    1. Why does it happen - all your small misstakes.
    2. Who is responsible for them.
    3. What are you going to do to insure all of us that it will not continue.
    Best Regards
    Cross
  • inzomn1a
    60 posts Member
    3. What are you going to do to insure all of us that it will not continue.

    I'll tell you what i'm going to do, I'm going to stop playing this game to stop enabling bad behavior from the devs. I recommend you all do that same. Enough is enough. Do I look like a fool? Certainly devs think so.
  • inzomn1a
    60 posts Member
    @Takman1979 & @LegionF9

    Nobody is denying Schaffa’s organizational skills here. As matter of fact, we all know how good they are as a unit. Though I’d argue, as individual players, only a handful is elite and others are noobs like the other players you belittle. So quit being arrogant and belittling people here.

    Getting back to the point, the devs screwed up, period. There is no arguing that. That challenge should have never happened. When someone enabled the RT caps at the start, they corrected it and refunded players. Why couldn't they do the same for WCS?

    Say all you want about THE Challenge making little difference as it is clearly not the truth (it made a whole world of difference) and you coming here trying to defend the situation by belittling us shows guilt.

    There's clearly one of two things (or both): 1) conflict of interest exist (devs/player relations) or 2) incompetent developers.

    Nuff said.
  • I had such companies working for me - they do 1 job, after that they are on my black list. Electronic Arts seems not to care - I don't believe it is to be true - they just don't see this forum, there is no EA Community Manager - if there would be - he or she would have realize the gravity of this situation and step forward.

    Time to start making some calls it seems)

    Regards
    Cross
  • LegionF9
    16 posts Member
    We are in agreement that the service is very erratic.
    I can add to this pattern that you mention:
    Every time a server is super popular, there are connection issues and server hours offline: tib 37, world 100 and many others.
    WCS 2015: starting bubbles at 18 level line were popping for some people and not others, arguably nvidia took advantage of it, while others did not, was fixed after 2 days, bubble popped and forgotten attack started upon login
    WCS 2015: the black friday event started 2 days before center pvp
    WCS 2015: fortress originally opened at level 62 (if i remember correctly), after complaints from nvidia, it was manually reset to level 50
    WCS 2017: Without prior announcement, the wcs opened with an untested setup of morale+forgotten attacks, they never explained why, but presumably this was done also to counter multi-accounting.
    Instead there were multiple reports and complaints about lockdown, but those were not addressed at the time.
    tib 10: 15 people from a single alliance were banned for "account eating" most of them with less than 10 pvp kills. A couple with only 1 pvp kill. Most were unbanned after a storm of forum complaints, 2 weeks later. The developers then came out and admitted that the punished behavior - was totally allowed now. But no apologies, no compensation.
    Other funny errors, just on top of my head:
    There was a recent server which was announced to have morale and no FA, but started with morale off. After more than a month into the server morale was unexpectedly switched on, people were stuck in areas where they could not kill anything.
    There was a server (world 97 ?) where the fortress was already open while a new patch was introduced which changed some of the fortress behavior. The fortress on the server remained lowered to level 54 for several days without need for injecting codes. The alliance that was still farming to kill it, took the opportunity and with about 10 offenses in range - after about 4 hours killed the fortress. In time for the new patch fixing a bug in the previous patch.


    This is just to illustrate that this erratic and borderline-incompetent behavior has always been with the developers, even as the developer team changed completely several times over this period.

    But the demands and ultimatums above are unjustified and more similar to childish tantrum.
    Here is how it looks:

    You come to a restaurant, part of a big franchise (say McDonalds), and find that the service is not particularly good, there is no ice, some of the utensils seem to be dirty. The restroom stinks. But you really like their burgers. What do you do?
    1) Ignore the small problems and enjoy the burger.
    2) Go to a different restaurant.
    3) Call for the manager, berate the attendants publicly, demand that they find those responsible for the bad service and make a commitment to improve???
    4) Take the franchise parent company to court???
  • inzomn1a
    60 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    Your analogy of using a fast food chain as comparison is nonsense. It's like saying orange is apple. There are more at stake here (money and time) than a delicious cheeseburger. lol

    Try using something from a competitive environment instead.
    Here's an example: NBA basketball. There are no draw or tie to games; a team has to win.

    Consider this, Golden State Warriors vs Cleveland Cavaliers. Game is on its second overtime, GSW roster is depleted as many fouled out. Then in an unlikely event (like the emergence of the Spring Challenge in WCS), the NBA commissioner said we allow draw if both teams are still tied at the end of the current Overtime.

    This is not the best example but point I was trying to make is the Cavs will be **** and so would be many players/fans if that happened. You can't just introduce rules on the fly. That is what happened in WCS; hence, rules were set prior and that is purchase of RT was not allowed--but the devs introduced a new rule on the fly after the server started in the form of a Challenge that benefited Schaffa.

    You said it yourself that devs screwed up. Not the first it happened. All we're saying is these things tend to happen when this certain group of players has a lot to gain or benefit from. Taking into account the incidents Cross pointed out, that's a whole lot of coincidences. This Schaffa team is one very organized team and one very very lucky team. :D

    Is it really luck or is there more to this than meets the eye?

    If the Challenge was introduced when the server was absolutely won (as in Schaffa killed the fort), then it wouldn't be such a controversy.
  • LegionF9
    16 posts Member
    the total prize money of wcs is on the order of 5000 bucks, tops
    all the spending of all players on such a server as wcs is probably around 10-20k
    a potential class action suit to mcdonalds is an order of magnitude larger, in hunderds of thousands
    so my little mcdonalds analogy is already taking this inconvenience out of proportion
    NBA gains/losses from championship is in the tens of millions of dollars
    You are truly exaggerating it my friend :)
  • inzomn1a
    60 posts Member
    Economical size/impact wasn't what I was alluding to. But to your argument, fair enough. As you said, this **** by players who loss $20k tops is probably too little to reach the ears of someone that actually cares about its customers. And judging by the little responses we've seen so far from Envision, it is safe to say they just don't care.

    STILL, as someone who felt cheated, we have the right to voice our discontentment in public forum so that other players who felt the same can step up be heard as well. So that makes us crybabies now? Wonder how you show your dissatisfaction when a company screws you over--maybe you just like to bend down and take it all in?

    You guys keep trying to derail this and make it something it is not.
  • resort to a take-out occasionally, do not spend time in the restaurant itself, get the burger, avoid bad service, and write an occasional bad review on google
    that is what the issue is worth
  • Well, that’s why I stop going to McDonalds. 😉
  • I left the game years ago, but i always pop back to visit and watch the WCS.

    On multiple servers i've been the pvp commander against mara and other german teams and wcs 2017 I watched and ended up jumping in after a month. Which was funny because i was still one of the first 100 players to the middle. Actually its not funny... it was a problem then and still is.


    @Takman1979 was just being polite.


    This is a cultural problem. Thats what i told Gpa at the end of WCS 2017. This is coming from a commander whos had to fight many of schaffas players on many servers as Mara.


    Its because Germans understand that victory only comes by sacrifices made by individuals, so the collective good can be achieved. They will all die a hundred deaths if it ensures victory of their team.

    READ THAT AGAIN. Just so you people understand. Because its sad how badly many dont.

    Germans knocked down 5 times get up 6
    Coalition knocked down 5 times... they dont get knocked down 5 times. After 2 they sector and respawn and farm and cry because nobody wants to be demoted. :D Everybody secretly sits around and hopes sorrowman can farm up and come and one shot all the "bad germans" and win the server for everybody.

    If you honestly believe its the forgotten event and not the lack of aggression, courage and coordination. Then next time, it'll only be WORSE. Because schaffa is NOT mara and koegy is NOT eksies. The fact they arent being swarmed from all sides and stripped of pois speaks volumes of the true reason the war was lost against schaffa. because if birds was also doing what section 8 is doing now 2 weeks ago TOGETHER, schaffa wouldnt be in the middle.

    But sure... blame a forgotten contest that every had equal access too. Another wcs.. another crying baby excuse on why they lost. No changes will be made. and next wcs... same result.

    I looked at the pvp stats... this is embaressing. they have 5x the pvp kills you guys do. What were you guys doing? praying you'd wake up and they'd disappear? schaffa is way too thin... not challenged at all. schaffa has been sitting there soaking up bonuses until they've hit god mode... no serious challenges. If the allies want to talk about facts talk about this FACT. Talk about this if you ever hope to win.


    p.s. Why complain about the game, just move on... how do you guys keep pumping thousands into a old, unbalanced and broken game? i dont complain or give devs a hard time, theyre doing the best they can. But i have voted with my wallet and moved on.
  • To clear up the WCS2015 bubble issue - it had the pre-sign up sheet. Those who signed up early got brought into the game with a different method, they were not assigned the jump limit for bubble pop, those who signed up after server open were standard accounts subject to the bubble pop. Bubble pop was introduced later in the games software life cycle and whatever method they used to bring the pre-registration accounts into the world bypasses these safe-guards.
    I left the game years ago, but i always pop back to visit and watch the WCS.

    On multiple servers i've been the pvp commander against mara and other german teams and wcs 2017 I watched and ended up jumping in after a month. Which was funny because i was still one of the first 100 players to the middle. Actually its not funny... it was a problem then and still is.


    @Takman1979 was just being polite.

    etc etc

    What you say is true, however this point would not have been reached if we stayed on topic with the RT situation. More RT was spent in the first couple skirmishes than realized. The score of the Schaffa mains was in accumulators, my weak top 50 main had a equal O and D to Koegy at the time of the initial bubble attack. Brilliant attack, well executed, wonderful coordination - no sane person will deny any of these things. It's why we have a coalition to begin with, that much is obvious. That RT would have not been available had the event not materialized. We had superfluous amounts of RT due to the coalition plan, with or without the event we were fine. You can argue all you want about poor coordination and you'd be right, however, that attack at that time does not happen without the prior event. You are lying to yourself if you say otherwise, guys have even admitted it.



  • Nevermore316
    13 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    x-HiWay-x wrote: »

    What you say is true, however this point would not have been reached if we stayed on topic with the RT situation. More RT was spent in the first couple skirmishes than realized. The score of the Schaffa mains was in accumulators, my weak top 50 main had a equal O and D to Koegy at the time of the initial bubble attack. Brilliant attack, well executed, wonderful coordination - no sane person will deny any of these things. It's why we have a coalition to begin with, that much is obvious. That RT would have not been available had the event not materialized. We had superfluous amounts of RT due to the coalition plan, with or without the event we were fine. You can argue all you want about poor coordination and you'd be right, however, that attack at that time does not happen without the prior event. You are lying to yourself if you say otherwise, guys have even admitted it.



    straight question. Do you think if this didnt happen you guys would win?

    Because i say it wouldve delayed it. it was enviable. i wasnt there in the beginning so what did i miss? i just see schaffa SMASHING everybody with 2000+ pvp kills and the next 3 coalition teams combined and cant match that. did they account eat? did that come back? somebody show me the gross injustice that caused this one sided **** kicking? Their wing has more pvp kills then the next top allied coalition pvp count.

    Coalition guys deserve the win? REALLY!!!

    Every year there was complaints about it being unfair. Every year i logged in and watch it unfold and what gets told here is very rarely reflected what i see on the battle field.

    Not saying this to rub salt on former allies and friends. Im saying this because UNLESS leadershp learns or changes. This will only repeat and its gotten sad how blind leadership is to the blunt truth. making excuses will NOT change the end result.

    Allies have always struggled with the best pvp teams cant dig and grow. the best farmers cant pvp at all. Germans even under a soft leader can win just because they collectively can do both.
  • WarriorXG
    13 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    If you honestly believe its the forgotten event and not the lack of aggression, courage and coordination.

    Talk is cheap, perhaps you can fire up Deadly Republic and show us how it's done. :D

    Many thoughts in your essays seem silly to me. German cultural superiority due to sacrifice... If there was ever a culture that was into self-sacrifice, it would have to be the Japanese, and they did not do so well in WWII. Perhaps you can tell my grandfather that his brother, who died in the Ardennes in France fighting against the German army, lacked self-sacrifice, because he is culturally inferior, but it is a silly thing to do. Saying that coalition players in WCS lack self-sacrifice is disconnected from truth. Saying that the coalition do not coordinate is also not true.

    Also, the qualities you mention of aggression and courage are not what wins this game. It is strategy, preparation, and steadfast execution that win it. You don't just charge, you hit what needs to be hit when it needs to be hit.

    What is being claimed here is that the change of introducing the infected RT threw a wrench into the coalition strategy. Would the result be different? maybe not. Would Michael Jordan have been MVP 6 times if he measured 4 inches less? Maybe, maybe not. The point is that there would be a detrimental effect to his game.

    The argument that if-it-is-the-same-for-all it is not biased, is simply not true. When the 6th army of the Germans was surrounded in Stalingrad, and they were starving and most infantry men were out of ammo, if God said "I will give all teams 6 months supply of food and ammunition", it would be a very biased contribution, and the Russians would probably be very unhappy with their free 6 months of ammo and feel it was not "fair", because their strategy was dependent on the Germans running out of supplies.
  • Really? Somebody explain this to me? Im actually curious how this happens?
    4e6mm669ihit.png

    Even the wings? really?

    What exactly happened when the forgotten event started? has it been awhile? Did everybody get scared and panic and didnt know what to do? Except schaffa?

    Was it ONLY in their sector?

    Come on guys, you're better then that.

    They're very good players and know what they are doing. To create this narrative that some fluke event happened and thats why they won is a gross disservice. And shows you grossly under estimated your opponents. Because has happened EVERY year.

    Funny you use the analogy of michael jordan. What do you think would hurt more? 4 inches shorter. or losing pippen and his supporting team?

    Takman was not being a poor sportsman, he had a legit insight. He was respectful in delivering it.

    I legit believe if the 2017 coalition played just schaffa, they wouldve lost with out mara. I was there. mara got swept time after time. Its the hardest task is to rally the troops after you'v'e been swept and you need to jump and respawn. Until proven i dont believe Koegy is same battle commander Eksies is. They shouldve been tested.

    But its not over yet. Section 8 guys are tough, them guys they have now are the old stay tuned guys. They'll fight you. lol and their poi targeting is on point. But its like in my original point. The best fighters struggle to gain size and unless theres a super team. where groups of core players come together that can match schaffas players. its always going to be tough. their top 10 players are all number 1 players on past servers and they can dig and fight. While coalition teams have reputations for doing either or not both.
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