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Thoughts on Franchise

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These game modes gave me some great ideas.

Let’s start off with coach because a) you used to have a game called head coach which sprung from how in-depth your franchise mode used to be. B) I’ve already gone in-depth at the focus on total control over players for more seamless interaction.



What if you guys brought coordinators back as a way to grow the users into more complete play callers...

Which leads me into another part of this mode. Our playbooks. What if part of the mode is you building our playbooks with us, as we play & defining our styles of play/archetypes of positions, schemes, etc?

Not to digress into another post, but I think this style of customization leads to an “expansion team” mode. You’ll have to clean up “owner” as well, & tweak the control each level has.

This dynamic of owner, hc, coordinator, player come into conflict naturally which can provide customization.


Owner controls the overall organization, different owners will have different philosophies and expectations. The pressures they put on coaches is immense!

Why not as part of creating different difficulties you have these “scenarios” for the coaching jobs?

Hard coaching job: maybe most leniency? Team in re-build mode. Now this could be a team already in re-build mode, but what about the cpu owner putting a team into rebuild mode & bringing you in?

Or maybe they want to walk in to a good situation with high expectations & be expected to make very little roster moves...

Maybe it’s a bubble team & your tweaks are all they’re missing.


Whatever the scenario is, we should be able to come in & feel the control!

How do we know what players/what positions we look for without having you out us through a “trainer/creation mode?”

In real life this is something defined by the coaching tree, in madden maybe we play with our favorite team, or maybe we’ve played madden enough we have our own little style way to attack the run & pass with limited substitutions.

Adding in an aspect where we not only get to scroll & select archetypes on a menu, but get on the field & test things out because maybe the cpu sees something we don’t.

As a HC/DC you’ll need to choose a front, 3-4/4-3/hybrid, this defines the players you’ll need/how you prioritize them. (Which breaches the subject of players positioning in different defenses & a more concrete way of defining position archetypes that allows this fluidity)

The addition of the archetypes this year & all the little mini xfactor things is awesome. Customization really allows different players to take shape, which is why I think progressing this area will help with the problem of animations in the future.

So as a player or a coach what about drills/practices/mini-games to earn or try to change some of the players skills?

Want to focus on a wr to make sideline catches? Sideline catching drills, & these can have temporary or permanent boosts.

Give us decisions to make whether it be what to focus on for ourselves as players, or from the coaches/mgmt POV.

Replies

  • Moved a franchise, kept the name & during the opening preseason game intro it said Miami on their unis...

    Which leads to a bigger problem the game has overall in immersion to feel like it’s the real nfl package at all times. Some ways it’s great but a lot of work expanding on past successes is needed as much as opening up the way you present/& we play the game.

    For instance, to try & get “the whole experience” of the long term team control/building of “coach mode” with the special
    control of the owner: relocation/stadiums, & in the future they should include a “branding” mode where you’re able to tweak the logo or set uniforms for the year, the kicker is having those things impact the way your team is put together.

    The different variants, say one throwback, one current, & one “new take” each come with goals to establish the “acceptance.”

    Say you want a throwback logo because the team hasn’t been playing well, but they used to, so give them madden goals & if they fail have a notification saying “you just didn’t live up to the old ‘standards’” & then the game auto-defaults to the current nfl logo.

    Maybe you want a new one. We all know that the nfl is the big problem here, but why can’t the nfl, Nike & ea work out a way we can customize not only the teams color schemes (tweaks in shades/tones not full sale team change) but also affect the uniforms.



    Again this brings me to another post, maybe sell the big game modes separately or bundle them together?

    Say you just like current roster nfl head-head or franchise or mut, then maybe sell that as a stand alone. But also bundle them together for 100$+


    Maybe release the play now with current rosters as a free to play game that continually grinds out the physics simulations with for the most part players in positions they’ll be in real nfl each week... (except for maybe changing playbooks & formation subs)

    Then mut is like 30-40 & franchise is 75? Or together they’re 100?

    & while talking about money & what’s worth paying for like in MUT, it’d be stadiums, uniforms, logos/relocating
  • The gameplay is overall the same as before. The cpu will do anything & everything to make you lose, & no absurdity is out of the question. You’ll make the right read, you’ll tell it high pass, you’ll press up on directional stick, you click the button to put touch on the ball & your elite qb underthrows it by 5+ yards to the defense, over & over.

    If the cpu absolutely needs a play it will get it, no matter the ratings or coverages/play call or even user input, inexplicably in the moments you want to see real action you get scripted nonsense.
  • There is no way to play. You put the players into position to make plays & they will be outplayed continuously by far inferior players, endlessly. There is no way to see out your team besides simming it & upgrading & maybe playing eventually, but the game at its core is broken.

    Had clear momentum on my side & a player disappears & is reclipped making a big hit to stop him. Watching replay you can see him break his ankle & all of physics to get in front of the player who I had up on both sticks & r1 to lean forward for the 1st... 4th & inches. It’s not luck when it’s programmed in.

    This has been my number 1 gripe of madden since at least 2000, your ai is terrible & humanless. You can’t take being beat one second, one drive, one game you break the game, physics realism & then try & tell us we got a bad break or god forbid made an actual mistake.

    & the cpu? Throwing darts, catching everything, blocking like glue, breaking blocks, defying everything just to satisfy their lazy attempt at “difficulty.”

    you know what we’re doing & you control the ai. making it difficult for us to win isn’t hard for you at all.

    But how about instead of strategically forcing a mistake or bad luck, just let me make my own mistake & get my own bad luck?
  • I mean my depth chart & formation subs just get erased & I get to play with wherever madden feels like I should have people.
  • My punter just lined up at re, not in any depth chart in that position, but he’s there.
  • Players in zone biting on imaginary moves like they were in man & getting beat in the zone I put them in. Get out madden. Try not cheating next madden.

    If you have to move my players out of the way so you can win? You got issues
  • Everything’s perfect in the menus with my formation subs. When I go to games it switches it all around. My strong side & weak side flip, players out of position, it’s a struggle the whole time
  • Games basically unplayable to me in some modes.

    I wanted the cowboys defense to flip, so I did it, but by the time I got in the game? They were back. Again, & again & again, no matter the team madden does it. Madden doesn’t like your sublb? Safeties will appear in your depth chart, as head coach without even asking.

    Anyone else feel like ea hates you for playing their video games?

    Like I’m sorry about the cool simulation/animation thing you got going on, but I’m trying to play a football game & can’t help but feel I get in the way of whatever thing you & the ai got going on.

    Why else would every game my team literally find ways to lose every single play, down, drive, game, season? Why else would a dB in a zone get faked out like they were in man, covering a zone that’s not theirs? No how about you just have my players do what I tell them to? You know like a video game is supposed to be? When I tell the controller right I expect it go right. I don’t expect you to break the laws of physics of your little animation football game just to stop me every single big play.

    Players disappear & are re-imaged in, breaking the physics of the whole entire game, just to stop a human being from doing something they want. At any aspect of this game, you will stop at nothing.

    On that first down play that I uploaded to YouTube, it’s crystal clear that they had an objective not to let me get a first down because they broke the physics of the game over & over to stop you.

    The momentum of the actual hit based on physics & reality would have gotten me a first down, but nope, let’s clip him out & reclip him with his momentum coming from a direction that’d stop him!


    ?

    There’s no reason other than malicious intent to the user. Absolutely no reason to have anything in this game that changes what the user actually did.

    Oh look a Counter, but you didn’t bite?

    Hmm, what to do, ah! before you take one step, the opposite guard has come out across your face & reached blocked you & your guy refuses to go right. Your controls go unresponsive & madden takes over. That’s their trump card. Watch the replay? That guard combo blocked on his way. Omg what’s his rating he’s the next great? Nope terrible player will probably be out of the league in a year or two.. absolutely no reason to break the game over this. It’s just a play, a drive, a game, a season? Why cheat?

    Doing a drill, I’m a olb 2 yards outside a te who at snap is going to make the rb cut back his sweep. That’s the drill. Nope, your lb is going to be stunned at the snap as he has to diagnose it for himself? & that te will reach block you 🤷🏻‍♂️

    Blitzing through a gap? Oh those lineman will disengage and get you no matter their skill.

    Oops, play fake!? let’s go through unblocked like the cpu! Nope your guy will either go tackle the run/engage him (even if your not telling them to) a different ol will use his 99+ ovr awr & get you or the qb will start shrugging off sacks like they’re X factors...


    At the end of the day in my opinion there’s no reason/thinking outside of evil, malicious intent to feel the need to stop the people, who bought this game & pay your salary, by going outside the bounds of the actual, real life physics & the user input=output relationship that is the basis of video games.

    & the sad part is the games been like this for as long as I can remember.
  • Here’s the YouTube vid:

    I cut out the slow mo breakdown where you can see how they broke Derwin James ankle by changing his momentum, but you can still see him go into his hit stick animation.


    Which brings up a bigger point any penalties for the broken hit stick? I still see them whiff & regather themselves to make the play a second later...
  • As created players giving us in-depth choices off the field that affect the on the field game would be fun.


    Some of the drills are ok, but drills to start or create a goal to develop traits like sideline catching, bull/spin/swim, aggressive catch, rac catch, etc. would be awesome!

    Also what about playing weight & what we are focused on for that season?

    Weight changes in the nfl, by incorporating it you guys can really start to define the weight/strength ratio of the different nfl positions.

    So much so that you could do a player creator, go through the intro/skills sessions evaluator & then give you a couple options of how teams see you in the nfl...

    Easiest example is 3-4 personnel versus 4-3 personnel. But could also go into offensive positioning as well.

    With the low rating route it’d be fun to grind out the pre-season, special teams, scheme fit. Say we wanted to be a 4-3 de, but a 3-4 team drafted you(the whole choose a team is lame) do you sign? Ask to stay in 43? Or are you open to the position change?


    Then there’s the idea of what we’re focused on for that season... this could mean the goals & how we expect ourselves & team to perform, but what where we want to our “training.”
    This is very much like the idea of skill drills to develop & earn traits (which don’t mean much unless there’s sensible button combos attached to them & physics)

    Easiest example again is the pass rush/ol aspect. Want to perform a rip move? Well maybe L2 to square up the opponent, left/right stick flick to punch opponent shoulder, drag right stick (right arm) to dip & then release L2 & switch to R2 to finish ripping right arm through. This keeps the idea of L2 as modifier/finesse/control & R2 as the speed/acceleration/burst

    Seems like a lot of buttons? but then imagine ways to earn a trimmed down semi-controlled animations combo by becoming proficient at it while maintaining the fundamental buttons that earned it

    Obviously the ol will need the same sort of player movement control focus as well but that’s why I think you should increase the cost of the game/rethink how it’s sold.

  • QB play idea:


    First off pressing L2 in the pocket makes you become a runner! Took me a couple times to realize why my player wasn’t throwing/was sliding etc. but I was pressing L2 for low throw & then releasing it when it became covered.


    After figuring it out it was ok because adding in this modifier has been my idea for years, but I think it’s backwards.

    For me I think it should be L2 that is held to keep qb poise in the pocket & then use the right stick to move around the pocket aggressively while left stick is used to aim where on wr you want to throw (but adding in the mechanic of it leading to drifting in the pocket would be cool too)

    Need to escape? Just release L2 & boom your Qb has taken his eyes off from down field & is now scrambling. This modifier button combo will not only train qb’s better I think it’ll really enable the different types of qbs to shine.

    Great scrambling qbs will be able to quickly get back to downfield (after escaping) pocket passers will move around in the pocket to find room to throw but it’ll take training to have them recompose themselves if taken out of the ready position


  • Haha, you can’t even create an OL?
  • DyeusVita
    328 posts Member
    edited September 2019
    This is what the cpu does to not only win the game, season, etc. but to get a first down in the first preseason game of the year:




    The ball & his arms phase through the players all so they maintain the animation of their catch, for their opening drive in the first preseason game of the year? What lengths would they go to if the game actually mattered?

    Why does it matter to the cpu so much to win that it cheats at every turn?


    And what about any momentum & force or anything resembling a tackle with a fraction of the force in the proper physical direction of you know physics/life in general? Nope.
  • At every turn you cheat. It’s a way of life for you guys, how you view video games as a whole.

    At the most basic level as a coach you’re supposed to put people in position to make plays.

    When you do & you don’t have a chance to switch to them, you don’t expect the cpu to aid itself in scoring a touchdown in the most ludicrous of ways.

    Whether it’s players taking off in the opposite direction you input, getting clipped out of reality into animation land & then back in as they come back with where they think the cpu “should be” like the Derwin James hit up there.

    Or it’s something as basic as setting up your depth chart & making sure everyone’s in the right position with formation subs. Only to find out the cpu fairy comes around & moves people to where they think they should be at times with nothing to do with actual nfl positioning. Just putting “known” names in for new players who happen to fit a role with the team boosting their value to the organization. Happens every year in the nfl, but not in madden apparently




  • DyeusVita
    328 posts Member
    edited September 2019
    Not one game against the cpu where they resist the urge to just break all reality to hand out our bad breaks or dominate the tide of the game.





    This is a starting nfl qb, in 2020 at 79 ovr. He can’t throw a 7 yard pass to a standing target? I mean ok, I wanted it to be low, then chunk it half way between them. This is intentionally thrown away by the cpu after not being able to get 3rd down.

    Next series on offense for them? Wr breaks 3 tackles on slant & takes it 80 yards for td like he was 6’6 250lbs & ran a 4.3 40. Since when did “hard mode” become oppressive cpu breaking the reality of the nfl, football, physics & all life in general


    I just want to play football. Did you guys forget that’s what people come for?
  • DyeusVita
    328 posts Member
    edited September 2019
    What you guys got wrong about the head coach game was that you assumed people didn’t want to actually play the game, & were cool with just simming it.

    I know the reason I end up just simming & managing players is because they’re not playing up to my standards usually. & so I’ll aim & periodically keep trying to play with them until I feel we are on the same page. & it usually never occurs against the cpu, so ya most time is just spent managing players & trying to build a team that I think can compete in the nfl.

    I’d rather be playing but when you come in with your fairy god powers of cpu & manufacture losses for me to take by breaking physics, football, life in general, instead of you know delivering people a simulation football game & then trying to manage & teach them as you try to find the best way to maximize the efficiency of user input to output. The literal basis of video games, you want to do something, so you use the controller to try & do something, you’re supposed to interpret the input & try to understand it & work your hardest to fulfill that. But in madden land?

    No. The game becomes that loud obnoxious person who repeats themselves & yells to silence a room. Any “mistake” or non conforming input you make is laughed at & animated to fail.

    Shouldn’t the harder it gets the game become more & more realistic??? Like isn’t the hard part about the nfl, the game you created a simulation for, the fact that they are professionals & when people put them into position to make plays & succeed things happen. Isn’t the hard part putting them in position to make those plays as much as it is quickly switching to players (which from dpov is much different & harder to do) & triggering animations properly? Isn’t the hard part trying to control these peoples bodies as naturally as possible to keep them from taking those physics penalties the cpu phases itself through like the silver surfer or something. While reading & reacting to the offense?

    (Which is very realistic from dpov. & I’m so happy that you guys have in the game it makes it so much more authentic.)


    I guess what I’m trying to say is: isn’t what makes the game hard supposed to be the game of football & physics & not just pleasing the madden gods & your weird lineup fairies who alter your depth charts once you start the game & every once in a while in the menus.

    Huge point: there’s probably a reason right? Why not just make that an immersive part of the game? Make it a coordinator or owner if you’re a HC making a suggestion & have it come with its own goals. Or the HC (& hopefully full coaching staff) if you’re the owner. Make it a realistic immersive scenario instead of just a legacy bug based on things happening that have been embedded into background/simulated code or something.
    Post edited by DyeusVita on
  • in my mind a lot of the things that happen probably could be fixed with this more immersive philosophy I’m imagining. This may echo earlier posts:


    There are really 2 game modes. As a player locked in, & as a coach/owner.

    You do a pretty good job at teaching people how to be individual players. Continuing the button mapping to smooth out player control at every position & will help making a completely immersive game.


    But you haven’t ever really helped us in the coach/owner department...

    & This is where my create a coach intro/trainer really comes to mind.


    We create a coach.

    We choose looks, but instead of our playbooks we choose things like our philosophy, our basic offensive & defensive formation package. Maybe choose a coaching tree or start a new one,

    With this barebones selections building the skeleton of our coach we go into the trainer. First thing they ask? Do you like to receive, or kick, or perhaps you say it doesn’t matter/depends? That’s saved.

    Whichever side you choose gets a bonus or a focus or something. You haven’t signed an oc/dc & you aren’t necessarily going to be a head coach, but in the trainer madden should grade you, build your playbooks up & perhaps reward bonuses/traits for specialized/focus positions that you as a user have done well with/become proficient at. Boom: Attracting fa’s, Scouting rewards, & an increased goal/xp ratio?(but also a increases the chance they walk in FA?)


    So. Now you’ve completed the coach trainer & received grades for all aspects over the course of a few training games/scenarios & also some traits etc.

    What happens next? In my opinion they give you a few options. Be honest about their skill while also letting them know the whole focus of this mode is to get you better, if you want.

    Say you’re an “A” DC but your OC is just a “C.”
    Option 1: you take a coordinator job. You have complete control of that group on the field (except maybe a HC interjects at key moments & you get graded on whether you override them or not?!?!) downside? The opposite side of the ball is going to be stripped down some how. Maybe you’re player locked, maybe the plays are called for you, maybe it’s super-simmed? whatever it is the goal of it has to be about the game making the user better at that side if they want. About progressing them to the head coach level.


    Which brings up the next progression, once you’ve made a name for yourself at a coordinator or maybe you made the jump right away you are HC. Now you hire coordinators just like the cpu did for you, but you have choices... do you try to stack positional boosts & try to develop superstars/xfactors at only a few positions? or do you try to spread them out & go for a balanced approach & maybe a few superstars/xfactors if you play your cards right?

    These coordinators should be the missing key in our players playbooks. They’ve developed their philosophy, their schemes, but they’ll need to make more choices about how to assemble their team & playbook.



    After this, it’d be amazing if we could compete online against other players online & stuff, but 🤷🏻‍♂️
  • I mean players going and try to catch a ball behind a player like it gonna go through him still. Like what?

    Maybe he hesitated then went for the pick & missed in front. But nope. They just drag & drop you out of their way
  • I can’t get out of the first game without just quitting & restarting the game to see if maybe the cpu won’t continually cheat?







    I want an actual football game. Let us worry about are matchups, who is covering who/blocking who. Let us find the weak links in the matchups so we can know what plays to call.

    This will also help the depth chart reorganizing/lineup fairy as you’ll be able to assign players on how to line up against outside the in-game menu.

    Say you want your Sam following around a TE & have the cpu adjust the defensive flips accordingly.


    The way I see it could be:

    You load up for the game, the different match-ups are highlighted. Once the loading screen is over/all the matchups are highlighted. You get a chance to make those adjustments.

    Idk. I guess my hope is that they make the game hard by making it a hard football game, not programming me out of their way at every second. Just let me make my mistakes and beat me that way? Why choose to beat me by overriding a good defense of play I call & just physics itself in general.
  • Not a big deal, but I moved the bills to Toronto & now I don’t get my team name called
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