I was under the impression low ping was the factor for online play!Meaning anything above 50 started lagging. I always get rematch request so my connection must be smooth. I messaged people to ask and they told me connection was good. I have not notice anything choppy.
Isn't it interesting that the ea studio behind this series is based on the west coast (specifically Vancouver) yet the majority of the online issues are for west coast users.
I wonder if maybe they have a harder time diagnosing west coast issues from the west coast than they do east coast issues from the west coast.
User base is much greater in the East coast. You're more likely going to find a good connection in you're in Toronto than you are in Vancouver. I don't really blame EA for that, it can't be easy to provide a great connection when some users in a game are from West coast canada and some of them might be from Florida or something like that. It leads to a frustrating game experience usually for the West coast player because we're generally in the minority in any game we're playing.
NBA2K to start the year went as far as not allowing you to cross mingle with West and East coast players on a club. Something specifically with sports games seems to be difficult to allow a smooth connection between players from all over the continent. No issues playing other games with my online buddies, but NHL is a no go unless i want to be at an extreme disadvantage.
Because sports games need to be synced up. Everyone needs to see the puck in the same spot at the same time. Other games can use interpolation and, for the most part, get away with it just fine.
Rocket league isn't always synced. Sure it's annoying when you "hit" the ball and then all of a sudden it's in your net. However that frustration leaves when you check your ping and see 300 or even 100 for that matter. In the end as long as you have ~70 or less ms of latency the game is great.
Perhaps that is why these games have so many issues online. Maybe they need to look at allowing a little more desync to happen and not break the game. It's inevitable and trying to stop it at all costs seems to be bad for the game in some instances.
No.
And it's not that simple.
And you cannot repeat cannot compare rocket car game to this game.
Care to explain more? I'm not a fan of short vague posts. You seem to have knowledge of networking and I want to know more.
I see desync in lots of games and some of them it's not a huge issue. Sure I'd be frustrated if I lost a competitive rocket league game to desync but more often than not it's user error, either I chose west servers by mistake or I was downloading something.
Now an example of where it's not acceptable is escape from tarkov. If you desync in that game your bullets no longer exist and you cannot interact with the world. You can however be killed by someone who isn't desyncing. The devs of tarkov are spending a lot of time and energy fixing their desync problems.
Idk what their solutions are as I've only noticed the desync problems getting better but don't know how or why. Maybe it's to do with matchmaking and auto server selection, which is something that exists in nhl too. I'm not a fan of it but I'm hopeful it's only due to limited players in a beta.
Yeah sorry, it's nothing personal it's just that I've given my thoughts on this in numerous and I mean numerous threads. And it's a lot of detail and explanation and frankly the majority of it is too detailed for most to digest when most need a 100k foot view.
The 100k foot view / net of it is:
12 consoles have to exchange numerous inputs and they have to be in sync. You have a puck, players, sticks, inputs for dekes, pokes, stick lifts, on and on and on and the game HAS to be n sync with all the objects being visually represented on the client side. And this game is attempting to mimic true physics - a point that is missed around here from time to time.
As far as the "desync" question, I apologize but I'm not clear on the basis of your question or point.
So what about FIFA then, don't they have similar mode to EASHL? Pro Clubs or something, where you'd need to synch 22 consoles and their inputs? Is it even worse than EASHL?
So what about FIFA then, don't they have similar mode to EASHL? Pro Clubs or something, where you'd need to synch 22 consoles and their inputs? Is it even worse than EASHL?
I don't play FIFA so I don't know.
The vast majority of EASHL games I never really saw massive input lag if we are on the east server. 5 of my teammates are on the east coast, I am southeast coast (ATL) and our 6th guy is in Edmonton.
Isn't it interesting that the ea studio behind this series is based on the west coast (specifically Vancouver) yet the majority of the online issues are for west coast users.
I wonder if maybe they have a harder time diagnosing west coast issues from the west coast than they do east coast issues from the west coast.
User base is much greater in the East coast. You're more likely going to find a good connection in you're in Toronto than you are in Vancouver. I don't really blame EA for that, it can't be easy to provide a great connection when some users in a game are from West coast canada and some of them might be from Florida or something like that. It leads to a frustrating game experience usually for the West coast player because we're generally in the minority in any game we're playing.
NBA2K to start the year went as far as not allowing you to cross mingle with West and East coast players on a club. Something specifically with sports games seems to be difficult to allow a smooth connection between players from all over the continent. No issues playing other games with my online buddies, but NHL is a no go unless i want to be at an extreme disadvantage.
Because sports games need to be synced up. Everyone needs to see the puck in the same spot at the same time. Other games can use interpolation and, for the most part, get away with it just fine.
Rocket league isn't always synced. Sure it's annoying when you "hit" the ball and then all of a sudden it's in your net. However that frustration leaves when you check your ping and see 300 or even 100 for that matter. In the end as long as you have ~70 or less ms of latency the game is great.
Perhaps that is why these games have so many issues online. Maybe they need to look at allowing a little more desync to happen and not break the game. It's inevitable and trying to stop it at all costs seems to be bad for the game in some instances.
No.
And it's not that simple.
And you cannot repeat cannot compare rocket car game to this game.
Care to explain more? I'm not a fan of short vague posts. You seem to have knowledge of networking and I want to know more.
I see desync in lots of games and some of them it's not a huge issue. Sure I'd be frustrated if I lost a competitive rocket league game to desync but more often than not it's user error, either I chose west servers by mistake or I was downloading something.
Now an example of where it's not acceptable is escape from tarkov. If you desync in that game your bullets no longer exist and you cannot interact with the world. You can however be killed by someone who isn't desyncing. The devs of tarkov are spending a lot of time and energy fixing their desync problems.
Idk what their solutions are as I've only noticed the desync problems getting better but don't know how or why. Maybe it's to do with matchmaking and auto server selection, which is something that exists in nhl too. I'm not a fan of it but I'm hopeful it's only due to limited players in a beta.
Yeah sorry, it's nothing personal it's just that I've given my thoughts on this in numerous and I mean numerous threads. And it's a lot of detail and explanation and frankly the majority of it is too detailed for most to digest when most need a 100k foot view.
The 100k foot view / net of it is:
12 consoles have to exchange numerous inputs and they have to be in sync. You have a puck, players, sticks, inputs for dekes, pokes, stick lifts, on and on and on and the game HAS to be n sync with all the objects being visually represented on the client side. And this game is attempting to mimic true physics - a point that is missed around here from time to time.
As far as the "desync" question, I apologize but I'm not clear on the basis of your question or point.
What I mean is the game desyncs and loops to try to get back without screwing one player over. I say allow the guy with the weak connection to falter or just time him out if it's bad enough.
To me the "12 consoles" point is completely moot. What about games like Arma with 64 or more players with vehicles and multiple firefights happening all over the place.
Another example I like is Beamng.drive. They are constantly asked to make it multi-player. They haven't yet because they can't find a way to send the massive amount of data that would need to be sent between the servers and clients for reliable and playable online play.
I never had issues with NHL online unless my internet was causing the problem.
From what I understand about networking and games, nhl appears to try to keep an even field despite one player having a worse connection either due to distance or slow speeds. I'm of the belief that they should just be at a disadvantage due to those circumstances. That way it's better for everyone instead of dragging everyone down. Idk if that's true but that's what it sounds like based on what many say.
Montreal. 50 mbps down, and something like 10 up. Plus, there is almost always someone else in my house on the internet. Online games, Youtube, etc. Still no issues.
what's your ping in game? I'm from montreal too and my ping increased a lot. went from 9 to 11ms to 24-26ms (that's what I had before when I was playing on the west server, now 56MS on the west server)... and I'm not the only one, all my friends using bell have the same problem except 1 of them.
Do you still have the same problem? I'm with Bell Fiber and my ping is higher since a month(25 instead of 9ms)! I asked to my friends if their ping increased too and everyone with Bell Fiber have the same issue. It work perfectly fine for my other friends with Videotron (the other isp in Québec)... So it's an issue with Bell... Bell and Telus is the same compagnie by the way.
Not only with Bell, im with Videotron and i get the same problem, my ping increase from 10 to 20 for the last month and a half now, but like OP said, no difference in the gameplay. Im from Montreal by the way.
5 friends of mine switched from bell to videotron last week because of this issue and their ping went back to 11-13ms...
There's a huge difference in nhl between 10 to 20ms. With 25ms my guy move 1sec after my buttons input.
Do you still have the same problem? I'm with Bell Fiber and my ping is higher since a month(25 instead of 9ms)! I asked to my friends if their ping increased too and everyone with Bell Fiber have the same issue. It work perfectly fine for my other friends with Videotron (the other isp in Québec)... So it's an issue with Bell... Bell and Telus is the same compagnie by the way.
Not only with Bell, im with Videotron and i get the same problem, my ping increase from 10 to 20 for the last month and a half now, but like OP said, no difference in the gameplay. Im from Montreal by the way.
5 friends of mine switched from bell to videotron last week because of this issue and their ping went back to 11-13ms...
There's a huge difference in nhl between 10 to 20ms. With 25ms my guy move 1sec after my buttons input.
There really is...when I'm on the west server 11-13ms. East server about 38. (Which isn't really high) but no doubt can feel the sluggishness
Remember, iirc, someone said that ping being reported is only the trip going one way not the round trip time. You have to double it to get the true ping.
Isn't it interesting that the ea studio behind this series is based on the west coast (specifically Vancouver) yet the majority of the online issues are for west coast users.
I wonder if maybe they have a harder time diagnosing west coast issues from the west coast than they do east coast issues from the west coast.
User base is much greater in the East coast. You're more likely going to find a good connection in you're in Toronto than you are in Vancouver. I don't really blame EA for that, it can't be easy to provide a great connection when some users in a game are from West coast canada and some of them might be from Florida or something like that. It leads to a frustrating game experience usually for the West coast player because we're generally in the minority in any game we're playing.
NBA2K to start the year went as far as not allowing you to cross mingle with West and East coast players on a club. Something specifically with sports games seems to be difficult to allow a smooth connection between players from all over the continent. No issues playing other games with my online buddies, but NHL is a no go unless i want to be at an extreme disadvantage.
Because sports games need to be synced up. Everyone needs to see the puck in the same spot at the same time. Other games can use interpolation and, for the most part, get away with it just fine.
Rocket league isn't always synced. Sure it's annoying when you "hit" the ball and then all of a sudden it's in your net. However that frustration leaves when you check your ping and see 300 or even 100 for that matter. In the end as long as you have ~70 or less ms of latency the game is great.
Perhaps that is why these games have so many issues online. Maybe they need to look at allowing a little more desync to happen and not break the game. It's inevitable and trying to stop it at all costs seems to be bad for the game in some instances.
No.
And it's not that simple.
And you cannot repeat cannot compare rocket car game to this game.
Care to explain more? I'm not a fan of short vague posts. You seem to have knowledge of networking and I want to know more.
I see desync in lots of games and some of them it's not a huge issue. Sure I'd be frustrated if I lost a competitive rocket league game to desync but more often than not it's user error, either I chose west servers by mistake or I was downloading something.
Now an example of where it's not acceptable is escape from tarkov. If you desync in that game your bullets no longer exist and you cannot interact with the world. You can however be killed by someone who isn't desyncing. The devs of tarkov are spending a lot of time and energy fixing their desync problems.
Idk what their solutions are as I've only noticed the desync problems getting better but don't know how or why. Maybe it's to do with matchmaking and auto server selection, which is something that exists in nhl too. I'm not a fan of it but I'm hopeful it's only due to limited players in a beta.
Yeah sorry, it's nothing personal it's just that I've given my thoughts on this in numerous and I mean numerous threads. And it's a lot of detail and explanation and frankly the majority of it is too detailed for most to digest when most need a 100k foot view.
The 100k foot view / net of it is:
12 consoles have to exchange numerous inputs and they have to be in sync. You have a puck, players, sticks, inputs for dekes, pokes, stick lifts, on and on and on and the game HAS to be n sync with all the objects being visually represented on the client side. And this game is attempting to mimic true physics - a point that is missed around here from time to time.
As far as the "desync" question, I apologize but I'm not clear on the basis of your question or point.
What I mean is the game desyncs and loops to try to get back without screwing one player over. I say allow the guy with the weak connection to falter or just time him out if it's bad enough.
To me the "12 consoles" point is completely moot. What about games like Arma with 64 or more players with vehicles and multiple firefights happening all over the place.
Another example I like is Beamng.drive. They are constantly asked to make it multi-player. They haven't yet because they can't find a way to send the massive amount of data that would need to be sent between the servers and clients for reliable and playable online play.
I never had issues with NHL online unless my internet was causing the problem.
From what I understand about networking and games, nhl appears to try to keep an even field despite one player having a worse connection either due to distance or slow speeds. I'm of the belief that they should just be at a disadvantage due to those circumstances. That way it's better for everyone instead of dragging everyone down. Idk if that's true but that's what it sounds like based on what many say.
first bolded point: a player desync or desync in general is not apples to apples with a game session in it's entirety experiencing input delay. if a player's connection experiences an increase in latency or packet loss that hit's a threshold they will be booted, as designed.
second bolded part: this is what I was talking about before. the "FPS vs. Hockey" comparison horse has been beaten so bad that there is nothing but blood and fur left. FPS... there is a map, people are a plot on the map, their munitions have specific linear equations that don't deviate and using client side predictability a very small and quick transaction is sent to show the linear path and the player getting hit on your screen is actually predicted by the client side which means that this data transaction, in it's entirety, is not being exchanged between console / pc and server. it's more like... the map knows where everyone is (there coordinates / plot) and the munition fire is based on a linear path and your console animates on screen if it is a hit. there are countless times I have seen people screaming b l o o d y murder over "i hit that guy" or "i got shot thru the wall" or "that guy walked thru the wall" and so on.
third bolded part: well, EA yanked Madden online play for years.... and rightfully so cause it played like a pig in a Cadillac.
"I never had issues with NHL online unless my internet was causing the problem" - pretty much. same here. but I am in Atlanta and there is massive and rather direct infrastructure between me and the east coast server.
as for your last bolded part - I am inclined to believe that it is possible that the game speed itself may slow to the slowest connection present in the game. kinda of like a "flow control" of some sorts. but, if that is the case and they did what you wanted, some folks might have a problem finding a game or staying in one - so that would be a balancing act with thresholds. and the idea of "punishing one user".... well, i have seen folks with NAT issues that have pretty solid input delay and only they are affected.... i have been in games in years past with people stating "my guy is sluggish" (AKA "fat man lag") when I was fine. typically happens when a west coast person ends up playing on east coast server.
Club mate of mine from mainland BC is with Shaw and dealt with this last month. It corrected after a week or so.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
Club mate of mine from mainland BC is with Shaw and dealt with this last month. It corrected after a week or so.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
oh sure, it's possible.
but west coast peeps including someone in Cali said they were still getting same times to west server and @RSall14 changed providers and the times went down.
I could be wrong, but I am still leaning towards traffic being routed back east a tad (i.e. towards Denver or Chicago) then back west - instead of using a Vancouver / Seattle western peering point for users of certain providers. it is not unheard of and has happened here in the past.... and if I recall it was just last year or 16 when a chap from a certain provider was on here and dug and dug and got a problem corrected
Club mate of mine from mainland BC is with Shaw and dealt with this last month. It corrected after a week or so.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
Club mate of mine from mainland BC is with Shaw and dealt with this last month. It corrected after a week or so.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
2ms? Do you think there's a difference? I don't.
Difference in what? Gameplay? No. It’s just a tad odd when, after all of last year and first few months of this year, our ping to the west was very consistent and now it’s increased slightly.
I wouldn’t have bothered mentioning it, but mainly just chiming in with the whole isp routing issue so many westerners are experiencing.
Club mate of mine from mainland BC is with Shaw and dealt with this last month. It corrected after a week or so.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
2ms? Do you think there's a difference? I don't.
Difference in what? Gameplay? No. It’s just a tad odd when, after all of last year and first few months of this year, our ping to the west was very consistent and now it’s increased slightly.
I wouldn’t have bothered mentioning it, but mainly just chiming in with the whole isp routing issue so many westerners are experiencing.
Ok. I meant gameplay precisely.
On the other hand I doubt if game's Network Performance Monitor is reliable in first place...
Before I left Telus they referred me to a specialized department that deals with cases that are more challenging. I didn't bother to call them as I was about to switch providers. That being said I would advise you guys to get in contact with a Telus rep and then ask them to refer you to their tech department that deals with more unique cases. Then ask them about routing issues like @BoboFloggins has suggested, the base line workers will just tell you there's no routing issue. Not sure if they'll be able to fix it or give you a different answer but it's worth a shot.
Replies
My ping was 9ms...still choppy as all h3ll. With Rogers. I smell ISP throttling again
Probably. Dial Up days were so good lol.
Yeah sorry, it's nothing personal it's just that I've given my thoughts on this in numerous and I mean numerous threads. And it's a lot of detail and explanation and frankly the majority of it is too detailed for most to digest when most need a 100k foot view.
The 100k foot view / net of it is:
12 consoles have to exchange numerous inputs and they have to be in sync. You have a puck, players, sticks, inputs for dekes, pokes, stick lifts, on and on and on and the game HAS to be n sync with all the objects being visually represented on the client side. And this game is attempting to mimic true physics - a point that is missed around here from time to time.
As far as the "desync" question, I apologize but I'm not clear on the basis of your question or point.
I don't play FIFA so I don't know.
The vast majority of EASHL games I never really saw massive input lag if we are on the east server. 5 of my teammates are on the east coast, I am southeast coast (ATL) and our 6th guy is in Edmonton.
What I mean is the game desyncs and loops to try to get back without screwing one player over. I say allow the guy with the weak connection to falter or just time him out if it's bad enough.
To me the "12 consoles" point is completely moot. What about games like Arma with 64 or more players with vehicles and multiple firefights happening all over the place.
Another example I like is Beamng.drive. They are constantly asked to make it multi-player. They haven't yet because they can't find a way to send the massive amount of data that would need to be sent between the servers and clients for reliable and playable online play.
I never had issues with NHL online unless my internet was causing the problem.
From what I understand about networking and games, nhl appears to try to keep an even field despite one player having a worse connection either due to distance or slow speeds. I'm of the belief that they should just be at a disadvantage due to those circumstances. That way it's better for everyone instead of dragging everyone down. Idk if that's true but that's what it sounds like based on what many say.
what's your ping in game? I'm from montreal too and my ping increased a lot. went from 9 to 11ms to 24-26ms (that's what I had before when I was playing on the west server, now 56MS on the west server)... and I'm not the only one, all my friends using bell have the same problem except 1 of them.
5 friends of mine switched from bell to videotron last week because of this issue and their ping went back to 11-13ms...
There's a huge difference in nhl between 10 to 20ms. With 25ms my guy move 1sec after my buttons input.
first bolded point: a player desync or desync in general is not apples to apples with a game session in it's entirety experiencing input delay. if a player's connection experiences an increase in latency or packet loss that hit's a threshold they will be booted, as designed.
second bolded part: this is what I was talking about before. the "FPS vs. Hockey" comparison horse has been beaten so bad that there is nothing but blood and fur left. FPS... there is a map, people are a plot on the map, their munitions have specific linear equations that don't deviate and using client side predictability a very small and quick transaction is sent to show the linear path and the player getting hit on your screen is actually predicted by the client side which means that this data transaction, in it's entirety, is not being exchanged between console / pc and server. it's more like... the map knows where everyone is (there coordinates / plot) and the munition fire is based on a linear path and your console animates on screen if it is a hit. there are countless times I have seen people screaming b l o o d y murder over "i hit that guy" or "i got shot thru the wall" or "that guy walked thru the wall" and so on.
third bolded part: well, EA yanked Madden online play for years.... and rightfully so cause it played like a pig in a Cadillac.
"I never had issues with NHL online unless my internet was causing the problem" - pretty much. same here. but I am in Atlanta and there is massive and rather direct infrastructure between me and the east coast server.
as for your last bolded part - I am inclined to believe that it is possible that the game speed itself may slow to the slowest connection present in the game. kinda of like a "flow control" of some sorts. but, if that is the case and they did what you wanted, some folks might have a problem finding a game or staying in one - so that would be a balancing act with thresholds. and the idea of "punishing one user".... well, i have seen folks with NAT issues that have pretty solid input delay and only they are affected.... i have been in games in years past with people stating "my guy is sluggish" (AKA "fat man lag") when I was fine. typically happens when a west coast person ends up playing on east coast server.
Live in North Vancouver and a Telus customer.
Averaged 13ms since games release. Now average 30ms for last couple weeks.
yes.... Telus.
check out the start of the thread. I spoke about likely scenario that is going on there.
I believe it was a convo with @RSall14.
It’s all very odd if many isp’s are involved. We’ve noticed a slight 2ms overall increase in ping to the west server since sometime in December I believe. Possible server change?
oh sure, it's possible.
but west coast peeps including someone in Cali said they were still getting same times to west server and @RSall14 changed providers and the times went down.
I could be wrong, but I am still leaning towards traffic being routed back east a tad (i.e. towards Denver or Chicago) then back west - instead of using a Vancouver / Seattle western peering point for users of certain providers. it is not unheard of and has happened here in the past.... and if I recall it was just last year or 16 when a chap from a certain provider was on here and dug and dug and got a problem corrected
I wouldn’t have bothered mentioning it, but mainly just chiming in with the whole isp routing issue so many westerners are experiencing.
On the other hand I doubt if game's Network Performance Monitor is reliable in first place...