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Glitch Goals vs Superman Goalie

BOSTONRANGER_OG
168 posts Member
edited September 2018
Nothing is more annoying that cycling, creating turnovers, and using great puck movement to get chances like these:



Only for an AI goalie to made ridiculous saves with insane post to post speed, completely bailing humans out and have your opponent do these same tired glitch goals that have been in the game for forever:



If EA removed these two glitch goals, so many people would have trouble consistently scoring.

And please don't come in here claiming if we know the shots we should know how to defend it. It's the fact that it's a shot that completely glitches the goalie out. If this shot was in the slot...ok. And if the shot went in just once in a while...okay. But it's so consistently glitching out the goalie it's a joke.

And rebound shots, pft, forget it, these take very little skill.

Replies

  • That’s the one thing about this game that aggravates me. Goalies can stop the hardest saves to make but yet let in the easiest shots to stop. I think it’s demoralizing to lose a game when your goalie lets in weak goals and have the other teams goalie stop every tough thing we throw at him.
  • NHLDev
    1303 posts NHL Developer
    edited September 2018
    Thanks for posting these. It is always great to get videos rather than just text so that we are speaking to the same things.

    I agree that at times the goalie gets over a bit fast right now. It is a combination of some goalie improvements we have made as well as some updates to the shot accuracy and power mechanic updates in one timers based on physical factors that is tipping the scale a bit more than last year.

    For one timers, keep in mind that the less of a threat the original passer is to actual shoot and score, the more the goalie is expecting a pass and will more ready and quicker to get over. In games years ago, you could just turn towards the corner to get the goalie to move furthest into their post and even when on your backhand side, you could pass a backhand across for a tap in one timer. Now, you are less of a threat to shoot and score on your backhand from bad angles and if the goalie is stationary when you make that pass rather than still in the middle of the push you made them make, they are more prepared to push over rather than having to replant to stop their momentum first.

    So if you make a quick move to your forehand and pass right after that, especially if the move to your forehand was at a place where you are a big danger to score yourself, you will find that pass across will be even more deadly for the goalie.

    So that isn't to say that the goalie could be slower to react and/or slower to get over from where they are now but just to point out that those things are considered in the ai goalies analysis of the play.

    On top of that, they pre-emptively try to take away as much of the easiest part of the net to score on as they can. So they aren't sliding over seeing the puck itself for the save in those scenarios as much as they are sliding over to blindly take away the bottom of the net and then reacting to a save after that if they can react to the puck. So if you can get it up and over their pad into the top half of the net, you will have a higher chance to score on those bang bang plays, even at the times they get over.

    For the rebound plays, there are definitely times when the rebounds are more weak and the goalie could have controlled them better but we also see rebound goals way more in games with User controlled defense than we do with ai defense due to the way players play off puck defense in the game. Notice that in may of your clips, players are concerned with the puck carrier only and at the best times, only the direct pass lane rather than the off puck player tightly marking the player that is driving the far post. The games mechanics are such that if you are on top of that player, any body on stick contact or stick on stick contact, even incidentally will disrupt a pickup or shot attempt. By being there, your defender would also have an opportunity to pickup that puck themselves as well.

    Lastly, I can touch on the shooting. The first shot was probably helped by the screen. The second one was a good shot and that player shouldn't be left alone to settle and get that shot -- it is also possible it was a sniper class or one with higher accuracy. To the perimeter of the net, the goalie was just late on it. The backhand was weaker overall but probably just caught the goalie by surprise as they aren't expecting a shot as much if you are away from the net on your backhand so the stars aligned with the power/accuracy and the resulting reaction time from the goalie there. If you are seeing that go in a lot, I would be curious to see other cases but it probably wouldn't be as common of a goal.

    So again, not saying those mechanics are perfect at all but until other improvements are made or more tuning is done, there are things to improve your success in those areas even inside the current mechanics or tuning.
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    Lastly, I can touch on the shooting. The first shot was probably helped by the screen.

    Thanks for replying. I took the time to learn how to upload and edit the videos. YouTube actually makes it very easy now, LOL.

    The bolded part of your comment: it would make sense if on a screen but you can do that shot over and over again even without a screen. I think it just goes in so consistently that it should be treated as a glitch. They're glitching out the goalie to come off the post. Players will come down on a two on one and choose to do THAT wrister than actually pass the puck and be creative. This goal is making people NOT play team hockey. It takes away from the skill of the game.

    I understand where you're coming from on the one-timers as far as if the passer isn't in the best position to shoot, he's not as big a threat so the goalie will read the pass coming. I agree with all of that. But I think alot of players would agree with me that it's still way too fast. I have some more videos I need to upload with the goalie making sprawling insane saves consecutively. Then my opponent comes down and rips a glitch wrister. This is also where people will argue they'll have triple the time of attack. I understand TOA doesn't necessarily translate into goals but more than likely, it will and should.
  • I love the way you explain away a garbage rebound play that works over and over. If you shoot from a wide angle its 90% of the time a rebound for a tap in. Such an easy way to score. Doesnt matter if you presure the puck carrier or not, go to the spot where the rebound is going, makes zero difference at all. Been a massive issue for a while and so many teams use it as a way to score.

    In LG, teams use it as a strategy because the goalie cannot cover a simple shot and forces the rebound out in front. However, you have a way to describe how it works but never touch on the fact that a goalie wouldnt give that up hardly ever.
  • I love the way you explain away a garbage rebound play that works over and over. If you shoot from a wide angle its 90% of the time a rebound for a tap in. Such an easy way to score. Doesnt matter if you presure the puck carrier or not, go to the spot where the rebound is going, makes zero difference at all. Been a massive issue for a while and so many teams use it as a way to score.

    In LG, teams use it as a strategy because the goalie cannot cover a simple shot and forces the rebound out in front. However, you have a way to describe how it works but never touch on the fact that a goalie wouldnt give that up hardly ever.

    I thought I covered that when I said "For the rebound plays, there are definitely times when the rebounds are more weak and the goalie could have controlled them better but we also see rebound goals way more in games with User controlled defense than we do with ai defense due to the way players play off puck defense in the game."

    I would like to give the goalie themselves more tools to deflect pucks to the corners or slide over and cover/control weaker shots but until additional features are added, it still doesn't mean that players shouldn't play better off puck defense.
  • BOSTONRANGER_OG
    168 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    Seeing goalies deflect pucks into non-dangerous areas would be great.
  • EpiCxOwNeD
    575 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    guacapoli wrote: »
    Seeing goalies deflect pucks into non-dangerous areas would be great.

    I’m not no goalie expert or nothing, but is not that basic goaltending? Kicking picks towards the boards away from the net?
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    I love the way you explain away a garbage rebound play that works over and over. If you shoot from a wide angle its 90% of the time a rebound for a tap in. Such an easy way to score. Doesnt matter if you presure the puck carrier or not, go to the spot where the rebound is going, makes zero difference at all. Been a massive issue for a while and so many teams use it as a way to score.

    In LG, teams use it as a strategy because the goalie cannot cover a simple shot and forces the rebound out in front. However, you have a way to describe how it works but never touch on the fact that a goalie wouldnt give that up hardly ever.

    I thought I covered that when I said "For the rebound plays, there are definitely times when the rebounds are more weak and the goalie could have controlled them better but we also see rebound goals way more in games with User controlled defense than we do with ai defense due to the way players play off puck defense in the game."

    I would like to give the goalie themselves more tools to deflect pucks to the corners or slide over and cover/control weaker shots but until additional features are added, it still doesn't mean that players shouldn't play better off puck defense.

    Yes you said that it happens but not about trying to fix it or trying to change the fact that goalies dont allow that rebound for a tap in. Just that it happens.
  • guacapoli wrote: »
    NHLDev wrote: »
    Lastly, I can touch on the shooting. The first shot was probably helped by the screen.

    Thanks for replying. I took the time to learn how to upload and edit the videos. YouTube actually makes it very easy now, LOL.

    The bolded part of your comment: it would make sense if on a screen but you can do that shot over and over again even without a screen. I think it just goes in so consistently that it should be treated as a glitch. They're glitching out the goalie to come off the post. Players will come down on a two on one and choose to do THAT wrister than actually pass the puck and be creative. This goal is making people NOT play team hockey. It takes away from the skill of the game.

    I understand where you're coming from on the one-timers as far as if the passer isn't in the best position to shoot, he's not as big a threat so the goalie will read the pass coming. I agree with all of that. But I think alot of players would agree with me that it's still way too fast. I have some more videos I need to upload with the goalie making sprawling insane saves consecutively. Then my opponent comes down and rips a glitch wrister. This is also where people will argue they'll have triple the time of attack. I understand TOA doesn't necessarily translate into goals but more than likely, it will and should.

    Yep, understood. That is why I can see eye to eye on the goalies getting across too fast sometimes still and that changes in mechanics impacting shot accuracy and power on one timers could impact that as well but I know that in online vs with even better goalies in net (attribute wise), I score a lot of one timers. This then means, it is the subtle control pieces of two human players controlling the unique players and/or the player classes chosen and the attributes of each that are making up some of that delta as well.

    For the shots, you are placing them all in the same bucket but there are subtle pieces of those shots that do make a difference. You can score unscreened wrist shots from the slot for sure but you probably wouldn't score as much from the top of the circles as you would the mid slot due to reaction time for the goalie. That is why I said in that first case the screen helped the cause. Unscreened, he may have needed to be a few feet closer to score but it is possible you would score from that spot when picking that far post perfectly when releasing the puck just as you get the goalie to move over more the opposite way and shoot against his momentum. That is where a defensive team can't give a good shooter time to settle.

    As with anything balance related, we watch a lot of games people are playing and play the game a ton ourselves. I have things flagged to keep an eye on some of which are further from our intention than others but we also have to give the community time to adapt as well before we make any drastic changes/updates.

    You will see us tune things as the year goes on but anything that makes it into a tuner goes through a lot of consideration before it is done.
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