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NHL 20 Content Update October 25th


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Dynamic difficulty is ruining versus play

Replies

  • jake19ny wrote: »
    Why is it that when someone isn’t as successful as they used to be in Ovp - it HAS to be ice tilt / momentum / dynamic difficulty? Why is it never, “maybe I’m not as good as this year’s game than last year’s game?”

    He said he dominated every aspect of the game and only allowed 4 shots on goal. When it happens once it’s bad luck when it happens every 4-5 games it’s aonetfing else......not sure how telling someone to get better at the game fits in that situation and it’s certainly not constructive or helpful

    Excuse me, but nowhere did I tell anyone to “get better.”

    It was a simple question posed to those who think there’s a mechanic in place that’s keeps them from winning.

    And by the way, EVERYONE says that they “dominate” games on these forums.

    Either this place is a haven for all of the greatest players on earth, or maybe there’s no “ice tilt” and sometimes you win some, sometimes you lose some - and not everyone is as “dominant” as they claim.

    To be constructive - i would suggest that players stop believing in some hidden mechanic making you lose/win.

    Take the defeloper’s word for it. If you can’t take the word of the people making the game - then stop giving your money to them.


  • jake19ny wrote: »
    Why is it that when someone isn’t as successful as they used to be in Ovp - it HAS to be ice tilt / momentum / dynamic difficulty? Why is it never, “maybe I’m not as good as this year’s game than last year’s game?”

    He said he dominated every aspect of the game and only allowed 4 shots on goal. When it happens once it’s bad luck when it happens every 4-5 games it’s aonetfing else......not sure how telling someone to get better at the game fits in that situation and it’s certainly not constructive or helpful

    Excuse me, but nowhere did I tell anyone to “get better.”

    It was a simple question posed to those who think there’s a mechanic in place that’s keeps them from winning.

    And by the way, EVERYONE says that they “dominate” games on these forums.

    Either this place is a haven for all of the greatest players on earth, or maybe there’s no “ice tilt” and sometimes you win some, sometimes you lose some - and not everyone is as “dominant” as they claim.

    To be constructive - i would suggest that players stop believing in some hidden mechanic making you lose/win.

    Take the defeloper’s word for it. If you can’t take the word of the people making the game - then stop giving your money to them.


    Nobody said they dominate every game. I certainly don’t. But these bizarre things take place in the games you do dominate....odd they don’t happen when you don’t dominate.

    Nobody said that DDA makes you lose or makes someone win....it levels the playing field for thexweaker built team.

    When the developer answers the questions I posed, and I thank him for taking the time, I will absolutely take his word for it.
  • jake19ny wrote: »
    jake19ny wrote: »
    Why is it that when someone isn’t as successful as they used to be in Ovp - it HAS to be ice tilt / momentum / dynamic difficulty? Why is it never, “maybe I’m not as good as this year’s game than last year’s game?”

    He said he dominated every aspect of the game and only allowed 4 shots on goal. When it happens once it’s bad luck when it happens every 4-5 games it’s aonetfing else......not sure how telling someone to get better at the game fits in that situation and it’s certainly not constructive or helpful

    Excuse me, but nowhere did I tell anyone to “get better.”

    It was a simple question posed to those who think there’s a mechanic in place that’s keeps them from winning.

    And by the way, EVERYONE says that they “dominate” games on these forums.

    Either this place is a haven for all of the greatest players on earth, or maybe there’s no “ice tilt” and sometimes you win some, sometimes you lose some - and not everyone is as “dominant” as they claim.

    To be constructive - i would suggest that players stop believing in some hidden mechanic making you lose/win.

    Take the defeloper’s word for it. If you can’t take the word of the people making the game - then stop giving your money to them.


    Nobody said they dominate every game. I certainly don’t. But these bizarre things take place in the games you do dominate....odd they don’t happen when you don’t dominate.

    Nobody said that DDA makes you lose or makes someone win....it levels the playing field for thexweaker built team.

    When the developer answers the questions I posed, and I thank him for taking the time, I will absolutely take his word for it.

    They have definitely said in the past it doesn't exist. The community continues to argue the point.
  • ExSnake01
    454 posts Member
    edited October 2018
    I'm pretty sure DDA is in other EA sports games like Fifa and Madden. EA has a patent for slider manipulation and did papers/studies on it. All those sliders you see in settings like passing/shooting accuracy, acceleration are there for a reason. It's speculation whether it's in NHL but I suspect it is. You play this game long enough, you notice stuff like this.

    In EA's old hockey games, they had momentum bars that would slowly fill up over time. Also EA producers have discussed how hits or fights can change the momentum in the game in recent years. I'd suggest googling if you do not believe it.
  • Sinbin
    1324 posts Member
    ExSnake01 wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure DDA is in other EA sports games like Fifa and Madden. EA has a patent for slider manipulation and did papers/studies on it. All those sliders you see in settings like passing/shooting accuracy, acceleration are there for a reason. It's speculation whether it's in NHL but I suspect it is. You play this game long enough, you notice stuff like this.

    In EA's old hockey games, they had momentum bars that would slowly fill up over time. Also EA producers have discussed how hits or fights can change the momentum in the game in recent years. I'd suggest googling if you do not believe it.

    Momentum was in the previous generation. They have said it's not in the current gen. They are here directly saying it doesn't exist and you still don't believe them. :/
  • ExSnake01
    454 posts Member
    edited October 2018
    Sinbin wrote: »
    ExSnake01 wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure DDA is in other EA sports games like Fifa and Madden. EA has a patent for slider manipulation and did papers/studies on it. All those sliders you see in settings like passing/shooting accuracy, acceleration are there for a reason. It's speculation whether it's in NHL but I suspect it is. You play this game long enough, you notice stuff like this.

    In EA's old hockey games, they had momentum bars that would slowly fill up over time. Also EA producers have discussed how hits or fights can change the momentum in the game in recent years. I'd suggest googling if you do not believe it.

    Momentum was in the previous generation. They have said it's not in the current gen. They are here directly saying it doesn't exist and you still don't believe them. :/

    Because many people do not like the idea of a competitive game modifying the difficulty on the fly. This is a controversial selling point.

    EA are dedicating time and resources for manipulating sliders but also potentially using a more advanced matchmaking system to increase player engagement.

    When the new NHL game was released for the new gen, they said the game was built from ground-up. People found out the hard way by discovering this was NOT true after their purchase. Ever heard of the concept called lying?
  • ExSnake01 wrote: »
    Sinbin wrote: »
    ExSnake01 wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure DDA is in other EA sports games like Fifa and Madden. EA has a patent for slider manipulation and did papers/studies on it. All those sliders you see in settings like passing/shooting accuracy, acceleration are there for a reason. It's speculation whether it's in NHL but I suspect it is. You play this game long enough, you notice stuff like this.

    In EA's old hockey games, they had momentum bars that would slowly fill up over time. Also EA producers have discussed how hits or fights can change the momentum in the game in recent years. I'd suggest googling if you do not believe it.

    Momentum was in the previous generation. They have said it's not in the current gen. They are here directly saying it doesn't exist and you still don't believe them. :/

    Because many people do not like the idea of a competitive game modifying the difficulty on the fly. This is a controversial selling point.

    EA are dedicating time and resources for manipulating sliders but also potentially using a more advanced matchmaking system to increase player engagement.

    When the new NHL game was released for the new gen, they said the game was built from ground-up. People found out the hard way by discovering this was NOT true after their purchase. Ever heard of the concept called lying?

    LOL. These threads are always entertaining if nothing else.

    The only thing being manipulated is your imagination and it is your own doing. You mean to tell me you actually believe anything you wrote here?

    Yes they did say it was literally built from the ground up, and in a way it is true. The game did not exist on current gen, so it was indeed made from the ground up. Yes yes we know all about the recycled code etc etc. It was simply a play on words and a slight exaggeration, but never-the-less, there is still truth to what they said.
  • jake19ny wrote: »

    When the developer answers the questions I posed, and I thank him for taking the time, I will absolutely take his word for it.

    They have. Multiple times.
  • jake19ny wrote: »

    When the developer answers the questions I posed, and I thank him for taking the time, I will absolutely take his word for it.

    They have. Multiple times.

    They have not answered my questions once. If you find my questions and then find their answer to those questions please share it.
  • Perfect example of DDA that cannot be attributed to poor connection or player skill. I just played a game where my opponents AI teammates played fantastic. I could cycle the puck and control the play in his end but his AI teammates were like glue on my AI teammates and I could never set up a good scoring chance and my guy in front of his net had an AI defender tying him up. My AI teammates in my own end just wandered around. I could actually watch the plays unfold. We would battle for pucks in the corner or along the boards and I would watch my AI defenders skate away from his AI teammates leaving them wide open. He scored 4 goals all because I had zero AI teammates anywhere near the slot so if he managed to get the pass through it was an easy one timer goal. 4 goals on 6 shots...,. Its such an indictment that you can call what’s going to happen like reading a script.
  • jake19ny wrote: »
    Perfect example of DDA that cannot be attributed to poor connection or player skill. I just played a game where my opponents AI teammates played fantastic. I could cycle the puck and control the play in his end but his AI teammates were like glue on my AI teammates and I could never set up a good scoring chance and my guy in front of his net had an AI defender tying him up. My AI teammates in my own end just wandered around. I could actually watch the plays unfold. We would battle for pucks in the corner or along the boards and I would watch my AI defenders skate away from his AI teammates leaving them wide open. He scored 4 goals all because I had zero AI teammates anywhere near the slot so if he managed to get the pass through it was an easy one timer goal. 4 goals on 6 shots...,. Its such an indictment that you can call what’s going to happen like reading a script.

    With a poor connection you get poor AI. I can bet you that you're opponent was the home team.

    But, you are free to believe whatever you want to believe.
  • jake19ny wrote: »
    Perfect example of DDA that cannot be attributed to poor connection or player skill. I just played a game where my opponents AI teammates played fantastic. I could cycle the puck and control the play in his end but his AI teammates were like glue on my AI teammates and I could never set up a good scoring chance and my guy in front of his net had an AI defender tying him up. My AI teammates in my own end just wandered around. I could actually watch the plays unfold. We would battle for pucks in the corner or along the boards and I would watch my AI defenders skate away from his AI teammates leaving them wide open. He scored 4 goals all because I had zero AI teammates anywhere near the slot so if he managed to get the pass through it was an easy one timer goal. 4 goals on 6 shots...,. Its such an indictment that you can call what’s going to happen like reading a script.

    With a poor connection you get poor AI. I can bet you that you're opponent was the home team.

    But, you are free to believe whatever you want to believe.

    How can connection, which by the way my connection is fine, cause the AI to not play position? They are moving the same as the opponents but instead of actually playing hockey they just wander randomly. They will actually turn and skate away from a loose puck before you take control of them as if they don’t even recognize the puck is there. They will skate to cover someone thenjust wander away.....it’s bizarre and less it makes no sense
  • jake19ny wrote: »
    jake19ny wrote: »
    Perfect example of DDA that cannot be attributed to poor connection or player skill. I just played a game where my opponents AI teammates played fantastic. I could cycle the puck and control the play in his end but his AI teammates were like glue on my AI teammates and I could never set up a good scoring chance and my guy in front of his net had an AI defender tying him up. My AI teammates in my own end just wandered around. I could actually watch the plays unfold. We would battle for pucks in the corner or along the boards and I would watch my AI defenders skate away from his AI teammates leaving them wide open. He scored 4 goals all because I had zero AI teammates anywhere near the slot so if he managed to get the pass through it was an easy one timer goal. 4 goals on 6 shots...,. Its such an indictment that you can call what’s going to happen like reading a script.

    With a poor connection you get poor AI. I can bet you that you're opponent was the home team.

    But, you are free to believe whatever you want to believe.

    How can connection, which by the way my connection is fine, cause the AI to not play position? They are moving the same as the opponents but instead of actually playing hockey they just wander randomly. They will actually turn and skate away from a loose puck before you take control of them as if they don’t even recognize the puck is there. They will skate to cover someone thenjust wander away.....it’s bizarre and less it makes no sense

    How can you say your connection is fine in a p2p environment?

    Were you the away team or not?

    When you feel laggy or slow, your AI plays like that too.
  • HockeyCityUSA
    500 posts Member
    edited October 2018
    @jake19ny could you post a video of what you're encountering? I agree with @WainGretSki, I bet it's just a connection issue or your strategy are on defend lead or something. My AI are quite dumb at times, but to say it's because of DDA? I just blame poor coding
    Post edited by HockeyCityUSA on
  • WainGretSki
    3021 posts Member
    edited October 2018
    @jake19ny could you post a video of what you're encountering? I agree with @WainGretSki, I bet it's just a connection issue or your strategy are on defend lead or something. My AI are quite dumb at times, but say it's because of DDA. I just blame poor coding

    I know it is connection related. some players are home team and start streaming or uploading junk to bog their opponent's connection. This trick is as old as online vs itself. Or they do all kinds of searches on their cell phones to bog connections down. Add in streaming your games and holy cow....

    I honestly could not tell you the last time I heard someone complain about this while being the home team.

    Also, it is irrelevant even if you say your internet speed in 2 gajillion trigabytes download speed if your opponent is home team and has 1 mb upload speed. And that 1 mb is in optimal conditions, btw, which is probably not a majority of the time. Add in the fact some a wireless on top of that.

    Have no idea why EA chooses this p2p route as all it does is add these issues that no one wants.
  • ExSnake01
    454 posts Member
    edited October 2018

    LOL. These threads are always entertaining if nothing else.

    The only thing being manipulated is your imagination and it is your own doing. You mean to tell me you actually believe anything you wrote here?

    Yes they did say it was literally built from the ground up, and in a way it is true. The game did not exist on current gen, so it was indeed made from the ground up. Yes yes we know all about the recycled code etc etc. It was simply a play on words and a slight exaggeration, but never-the-less, there is still truth to what they said.

    It's currently happening whether you believe it or not.

    http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2017/0259177.html

    The game wasn't built from ground up when we experienced the same exact issues 10+ years ago. The code was recycled with some new animations and prettier graphics.
  • ExSnake01 wrote: »

    LOL. These threads are always entertaining if nothing else.

    The only thing being manipulated is your imagination and it is your own doing. You mean to tell me you actually believe anything you wrote here?

    Yes they did say it was literally built from the ground up, and in a way it is true. The game did not exist on current gen, so it was indeed made from the ground up. Yes yes we know all about the recycled code etc etc. It was simply a play on words and a slight exaggeration, but never-the-less, there is still truth to what they said.

    It's currently happening whether you believe it or not.

    http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2017/0259177.html

    The game wasn't built from ground up when we experienced the same exact issues 10+ years ago. The code was recycled with some new animations and prettier graphics.

    Sigh...do you know how many patents exist, but are never actually used? You're making an assumption on what is happening without the necessary proof. If that's what you want to believe, then fine, but it doesn't make it true. You even use the word "potentially" meaning it sounds like you are unsure of it yourself.

    Also, this patent does not specifically state what game they are looking at. You can find articles stating this is directed at their mobile divisions. Some other articles say they "believe" it's been implemented in Madden, FIFA, and NHL, but they even say in the same articles they have no evidence to say this is true.
  • I find it hard to believe that EA would invest time in getting a patent for something they don’t plan on using. I understand being skeptical but in the age of micro transactions it is plausible and would be desirable for them to include this in the game. It’s fine if you don’t buy into but what would be a good reason for EA not to use it?
  • Socair
    1826 posts Game Changer
    edited October 2018
    jake19ny wrote: »
    I find it hard to believe that EA would invest time in getting a patent for something they don’t plan on using. I understand being skeptical but in the age of micro transactions it is plausible and would be desirable for them to include this in the game. It’s fine if you don’t buy into but what would be a good reason for EA not to use it?
    That people would stop buying their full price games knowing they are rigged?
    If it’s implemented into free or $0.99 apps as a way to keep people engaged and to trigger add on purchases, fine... but having people know that a $70 major console/PC game is coded to balance the game to make it harder for you to win would kill sales.
    NHL Series Game Changer & Volunteer Moderator
  • Socair wrote: »
    jake19ny wrote: »
    I find it hard to believe that EA would invest time in getting a patent for something they don’t plan on using. I understand being skeptical but in the age of micro transactions it is plausible and would be desirable for them to include this in the game. It’s fine if you don’t buy into but what would be a good reason for EA not to use it?
    That people would stop buying their full price games knowing they are rigged?
    If it’s implemented into free or $0.99 apps as a way to keep people engaged and to trigger add on purchases, fine... but having people know that a $70 major console/PC game is coded to balance the game to make it harder for you to win would kill sales.

    I completely agree with this. There is already an uproar on these forums, social media, Reddit, etc. and that is all based on theories. If you want to see the sales of NHL really plummet, just have EA confirm that they implemented DDA.

    I see this patent more tied to mobile gaming as it is similar to most mobile games that are currently out there now. There was an episode of 60 minutes, yes I know I'm old, talking about cell phone addiction and how companies purposely implement coding that will keep you wanting more. I don't see this patent any different and I believe that is the possible route EA is taking.
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