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And just like that...the optimism faded

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  • NHLDev
    1677 posts EA NHL Developer
    the problem with this clip is the same problem in most "hitting" situations. I player is skating hard, carrying the puck, and gets hit and instead of the puck continuing on (separating the player from the puck) the puck just stops dead. this happens all the time and really shouldn't ever happen. what happens afterwards is clunky physics and puck pickup mechanisms. If instead of this situation, the physics actually worked and when a player gets hit like this the puck slides away out into open ice, then the closest defender (or even offensive player) could skate in and do something with the puck... kind of like real hockey.
    You are assuming that in all cases, the player couldn’t fight to keep their balance and control of the puck.

    If you hit a player away from the puck, in the majority of cases, the puck just keeps sliding where it was headed. We made that change a couple years back and it was one of my favourite changes from that year. You can see this by having a player glide forward and hitting them straight on.

    The more you hit a player from the side and back, the more the hit result changes how likely they are to lose the puck and at times, the player won’t fully get bumped off the puck without some form of control until a bit further into their reaction. This can cause cases where the puck stays closer.

    You may also see cases where the hit was from the front but the player was recognizing the hit coming and was rolling the puck back at the time of impact which would lessen it’s forward momentum as well, keeping it closer.
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    Honestly I appreciate that you take the time to respond to me and other disgruntled players and I mean no disrespect but this response means nothing to me when the game play is in the state it is in now.
    Fair enough. Appreciate the honesty. I will cut down on the time I put into replying to you personally.

    I hope that you actually read what I wrote after that because I described where I thought your team went wrong on the updates for this years game. Its fine in all honesty I only come to these forums to voice my displeasure because I am a passionate fan of the game you create. If you don't wish to converse with me or respond to my thoughts that's your prerogative because what I think about this game is probably the same as most in the competitive community do and they are always active in these conversations.

    I only wished to get my thoughts across and reading back my response I probably should have left that first bit out and have just left it at being constructive but it does seem at times you defend what the vision and direction you guys want a little too much when you should be a little more at the mercy of your player base because we are actually the people who play the game. You have game changers for a reason, use their knowledge of what the community actually wants versus what your team wants more! You need to engage more with the player base update the tuner more frequently in the beginning the see what players like and dislike, it seems that what we want and what you want out of the game are on completely different ends of the spectrum at the moment.
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    the problem with this clip is the same problem in most "hitting" situations. I player is skating hard, carrying the puck, and gets hit and instead of the puck continuing on (separating the player from the puck) the puck just stops dead. this happens all the time and really shouldn't ever happen. what happens afterwards is clunky physics and puck pickup mechanisms. If instead of this situation, the physics actually worked and when a player gets hit like this the puck slides away out into open ice, then the closest defender (or even offensive player) could skate in and do something with the puck... kind of like real hockey.
    You are assuming that in all cases, the player couldn’t fight to keep their balance and control of the puck.

    If you hit a player away from the puck, in the majority of cases, the puck just keeps sliding where it was headed. We made that change a couple years back and it was one of my favourite changes from that year. You can see this by having a player glide forward and hitting them straight on.

    The more you hit a player from the side and back, the more the hit result changes how likely they are to lose the puck and at times, the player won’t fully get bumped off the puck without some form of control until a bit further into their reaction. This can cause cases where the puck stays closer.

    You may also see cases where the hit was from the front but the player was recognizing the hit coming and was rolling the puck back at the time of impact which would lessen it’s forward momentum as well, keeping it closer.

    It should not matter where they are hit. Either they lose control or they don't. If they lose the puck it should not just stop moving on the ice like it froze to it. I'm not talking about little baby hits. I'm talking anything that causes them to lose possession. You can see the puck just stops moving then it becomes a puck pickup animation battle. Like the video here.

    What you described almost never happens. If I had to guess I would say it happens on 5% of hits when it should be about 80%. Even head on collisions rarely cause the puck to continue on it's path. Usually just dead stops. My theory is that the puck doesn't become loose until after the hit stops all motion.
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    the problem with this clip is the same problem in most "hitting" situations. I player is skating hard, carrying the puck, and gets hit and instead of the puck continuing on (separating the player from the puck) the puck just stops dead. this happens all the time and really shouldn't ever happen. what happens afterwards is clunky physics and puck pickup mechanisms. If instead of this situation, the physics actually worked and when a player gets hit like this the puck slides away out into open ice, then the closest defender (or even offensive player) could skate in and do something with the puck... kind of like real hockey.
    You are assuming that in all cases, the player couldn’t fight to keep their balance and control of the puck.

    If you hit a player away from the puck, in the majority of cases, the puck just keeps sliding where it was headed. We made that change a couple years back and it was one of my favourite changes from that year. You can see this by having a player glide forward and hitting them straight on.

    The more you hit a player from the side and back, the more the hit result changes how likely they are to lose the puck and at times, the player won’t fully get bumped off the puck without some form of control until a bit further into their reaction. This can cause cases where the puck stays closer.

    You may also see cases where the hit was from the front but the player was recognizing the hit coming and was rolling the puck back at the time of impact which would lessen it’s forward momentum as well, keeping it closer.

    I have seen improvement over the years but it still happens too often that the puck stops dead on ice?? How is that possible. Two NHL players could try this 100 times while moving and the puck would still be going unless it was caught against something or under a player. The time I see the puck defying logic mostly is on a poke (not stick lift) from behind. The player poking from behind often actually steals it? So his poke went by my blade, then pulled the puck cleanly back to him or somehow stopped the puck dead? I would think the puck would slide in the direction of his stick making contact with my stick or the puck?

    Maybe I am missing something in the puck physics engine or maybe its a small bug?
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    LeFury_27 wrote: »
    That clip is exactly what makes me so confused. How is what we see here better than being shoved off the puck? This is why so many people have quit. Myself and 7 club members stopped playing because of this. Don't know how anyone can look at that clip and say it's better than 1.0.
    In this particular case, there isn’t actually anything in that clip that would change between 1.0 and 1.03

    The hit from the player wasn’t a push check at low relative speed. The collision resulted in a stumble fall (which would have to do with the variables between the players sizes, attributes and quality of the collision). The defensive player arriving second, stumbled on the fallen player. The first hitter left without ensuring they got the puck as did the second player once he recovered from the stumble, unable to pull the puck through the other players body.

    The ai player doesn’t recognize right away that the other players are going to skate away and covers the pass option and the puck carrier walks in and scores. In other situations people call out the ai for overly covering the puck that is already covered and leaving the pass option open.

    To help the result you are after, we could allow players to pickup pucks without recognizing incidental stick on body contact but in most cases that would actually hinder defense as more players could force passes and pickup pucks walking through a closely marking defender rather than that body positioning mattering.

    We did listen to players and improved our hit reactions and get up mechanics to be tied more to the hit magnitude and the stamina of the player hit so that the hittin team was more likely to recover pucks when players were knocked down with big hits but in this case it was a stumble fall and not a full fall so the recovery time is quicker.

    I completely agree that either tuner would change nothing.

    However, when other things are aggravating, such as not being able to smash puck hoggers, then these types of situations just make things all that more frustrating.

    That is where the fine line gets blurred. If you could find a happy medium between 1.01 and 1.03 when it comes to physical contact, I would most certainly think alot of people from both sides of the coin would consider it fair.

    19 was an amazing beta. I was beyond sold, and bought the game. Now I find myself pretty much defending the exact same plays I was in 18. The game was new and fresh, now it's same old same old. Pretty crappy when I think about the money I spent vs the product I saw, then got after a couple of tuners.

    It is plain and simple. If this is the type of game you wish to promote, without team play (although team play is possible, however definitely not required) then I will bid you guys good luck and part ways. I will not sit here and keep spending $100 for a team sport that is better played individually and selfishly. This is not a good representation of this great sport by any stretch or means, regardless of your intent.
  • NHLDev wrote: »
    I wish we could pick our own tuners for online. Just let everyone list the tuner they want to play under in matchmaking. EA is so convinced 1.03 is preferred, maybe they'd finally get it if people were allowed to pick. I bet 90% or more people would play on pre-1.03.

    Let their "elite players" be the only willing participants in the 1.03 glitch-a-thon
    Player choice is great and it is definitely a topic that comes up but ranked leaderboards under the same conditions and fragmenting player bases are also considerations. Doesn’t mean it couldn’t happen though.

    We aren’t ‘so convinced’. What I write on these boards are some explanations behind the thought process. Sometimes people say ‘hmm makes sense’. Other times they say ‘Makes sense, but you went too far’ and other times they just say ‘Nah, it was way better before’.

    At the end of the day when I say we are listening, it is because we are. We are actively trying other tuning all the time to see what the results are like and continuing to watch unedited games played at all levels online to see things with our own eyes rather than just read personal reviews and hand picked videos of certain moments that could have gone better. We need to consider a bigger picture than that but we still read all the individual details and watch the clips for context and to see/hear things through other eyes as well.

    I have no doubt you guys are listening, testing and trying to find a happy medium to make everyone happy. I know it is a tremendously tall order to fill, and would venture as far and say it is impossible.

    However, would I would say is possible is for things that happen on the ice to make more sense. To be more logical. If I were to break it down to the easiest possible explanation, then I would say the game has to have mechanics that counter other mechanics. If a forward does something, then defense should have a tool to counter it. If defense goes for a move, then forwards should have a tool to counter it, etc. This is where I feel the game lacks the most. There aren't enough defensive tools vs what tools we have in real life.
  • Someone tell me why the goalie let this in?

    https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/epicxowned/video/64724492

    The goalie has his glove up but when the shot comes puts it down and then up again to scoop it. What was the point of having a goalies glove up if they just put it down and up again ever glove shot?

    Here it is in full time

    https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/epicxowned/video/64724620

    Wasn’t the hardest shot taken but a a goal.
  • rename2297500
    22 posts Member
    edited January 2019
    Ea has ruined this game ive done everything i can do for connection ive tried their suggestions but still get same or slower players skating fastwr than mine or i can clearly poke the puck and they can keep skating with it even though clearly poke it 5 times hearing the click . You can hit players to the ice and have three of your players standing there looking at the puck including the one your controlling cause you cant pick it up until the one player stands up and skates with it. Full energy and synergy players on my team and losing speed races to loose pucks to players who get to excellerate and cover 3/4s of the width of the rick while your player 99excelleration and speed just barely can move to get out of the way. I've won games where this was happening as well. this is garbage. out of all the games ive played it feels like maybe 25 percent of them werent affected by tilted ice. Theres going to be flaws but this is garbage especially to the teams with low ranking players out skating you all game long. Ea thanks for ruining a game ive played for years. You cheat people out of money when they want to enjoy a game that is fair competition. is hut not about building the team up ? i will be joining the many people that i know and not giving you any more money for your fixed garbage anymore. You should refund me the money ive given you as well seeing as your product doesnt provide what you claim it does. If you think its my imagination I've played this game from the beginning and also played hockey on video games since collecovision and this is the worst gameplay as far as tilted ice is concerned since ive played online. Since I've played hut I used to just ask my friends and they explained tilted ice to me when ive pointed out these and other flaws to them. absolute joke!!!
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