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This game is a joke

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  • Treatmentworke66
    977 posts Member
    edited January 15
    This is all they do in D1 hold the puck behind the back and hold a and you become Superman , checking does nothing ,this is something that for years has been complained about and nothing has been done done....and another cheesy thing done in D1 a lot is the use of the tie up to create pics in front of the net which in hockey it's a interference penalty .. again this game isn't a good place it's in a terrible place
  • This is all they do in D1 hold the puck behind the back and hold a and you become Superman , checking does nothing ,this is something that for years has been complained about and nothing has been done done....and another cheesy thing done in D1 a lot is the use of the tie up to create pics in front of the net which in hockey it's a interference penalty .. again this game isn't a good place it's in a terrible place

    what they meant is its in a good place as far as them making money goes.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    jrago73 wrote: »
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Kmahrle83 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    TheMajjam wrote: »
    If you want to take physics on, watch players looking for rebounds in front of the net. Players that are overly open almost always get the rebound come straight to them. Just observe when you peeps get the chance.

    I know. Pucks magically find their way to their sticks every time. It's like what @WainGretSki said, it's like it's part of their game design to keep the puck from going astray to keep the game "flowing".

    If that's what's causing all this, it's such a STUPID design mechanic.

    Yup. The game doesn't flow. Most things feel forced and it cheapens the experience. Any single realism this game is trying to go for, it all goes out the window with this kind of stuff. Like explain to me how roughly 85% of rebounds go straight to an opponent's stick, and the percentage is also very high of this happening on successful poke checks.... Randomness can only account for so much.

    Also why when i finally do get a sucessfull poke does the puck always go right back to him or one of his players? If i lay a big hit on someone its like im stuck in animation while he lays there and i cant retrieve the puck, so 9 outta 10 times hell just get up after being leveled and get the puck right back....or hell get uo faster than you can get to the puck.

    I just can't agree with this. I use the poke check a lot and the majority of the time, it's a turnover. Yes, there are times they will get it back, but to say every time just isn't accurate. In my experience at least. However, I probably poke more than most people since it seems there's a big general consensus of not to use it.

    As far as laying guys out and they get the puck back, that seems to happen most often along the boards. You can't skate around them as easy to pick it back up. Most people just try to skate through them and hope for the best. You can try skating around them to get it. That works more often than continually trying to skate through their body. I get that it's frustrating, but if we made it so that players stayed down longer, we'd probably get a lot of people upset that players take to long to get back up. Forcing the puck to move away from them when physics don't dictate it would also be odd. This has been a complaint for a few years now though so I surely understand the concern. It's pretty a pretty common occurrence, but you can raise your chances of picking it up again by moving around the downed player.

    Yea, agreed that the boards play a big role in this problem, but in all honesty, even on open ice, seems like the "recovery" time from throwing a good hit is too long. It should not take more than a second to regain full control of your player after you lay someone out. I don't know if it's possible to accelerate the animation or if code needs to change, but honestly laying someone out takes almost as long to recover than the person getting laid out.

    It does take a bit to recover from laying a big hit on someone. I'm not terribly bothered by that. Yes, there are times it's unfortunate and means you can't pick up the puck, but you're putting all your energy into the hit. There's going to be some recovery time from that. If there weren't much, we'd probably see people start saying hitting is OP. Also, you can always switch to another player and try to pick it up. Regardless, it's good feedback and one we've seen mentioned many times so I know the dev team is aware of this.

    You can't always switch to another player because you have several player position locked game modes.

    I'm fine with a recovery time after laying a big hit but the victim of said hit should never recover quicker and then also end up in a better position to make the play as a result of getting laid out, this happens too often.

    I'll pay closer attention to recovering from a hit. From my experience, it has always seemed the problem was not that you didn't recover in time, but that there wasn't easy access to picking up the puck.

    Thanks for the input.

    Not being able to grab the puck from the player who got knocked down is more common and frustrating for sure but it's so common that you recognize it right away when it happens and stay in position to play D when he gets up. It bothers me much more when my hitting animation takes me past his body and he gets up with the puck and I'm now behind the play watching his scoring chance. My feedback is all eashl based btw.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    You mean where the puck magically stops on the line?


    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Pucks stopping on the line like that is intended to minimize own goals. It's one thing when a puck deflects off a defender and goes in, but if they have control of it, even for a moment like that, the puck will stop on the line. That was done after a lot of negative feedback about own goals.

    Hasn't really helped own goals imo. Most common scenerio for own goals, in my experience, is when your goalie makes a save, and then decides they don't feel like covering the puck literally right in front of them, and your ai dman skates full speed into your own goalie pushing the puck into the net.

    Instead of having a stupid mechanic that's obviously a Band-Aid fix, why not program better spacial awareness for the ai? It's like they have zero clue that they're by their own net. Even clueless around the opponent net because they'll often skate right into the goalie, even if they have time and space to avoid it.

    Same when they're off side, and "trying" to get back on side, only to skate into the opposing ai and just basically skate on the spot without trying to go around the other player. It feels like none of the ai are aware of other objects on the ice outside of the puck.

    And why are goalies incapable of handling passes that get deflected, or passes in general that go towards them?

    Goalies not covering the puck is a different issue. What I'm talking about has reduced the amount of times defenders skate with the puck into their own net. Which was a pretty big issue prior to 18 or 19. I forget which year that change went in. Anyway, goalies not covering the puck is one we know about so I really hope to see that addressed in the future. It's pretty frustrating to have the puck loose in the crease just waiting to be poked or bumped in. When a D man does it, it's because it technically was deflected and not one he had control of. Either way, it's not something we want to see happening.

    If there is a better way to address own goals from defenders, I'm sure it would be implemented. You're talking about an animation that needs to play to move pucks out of the net. This would take more control out of your hands as well. I know people get a bit bothered by the number of animations. As far as I know, the dev team tries to put as much control in the player's hands as possible. So, having your player go into an animation that sweeps the puck out of the crease might have pros and cons associated with it. Regardless, it's something that isn't a simple resolution, but hopefully, this will perform better in the future.

    I agree it's really frustrating when they get caught offside and then skate into opposing players. Which just forces you to keep possession in the NZ until they go onside or dump it. Either way, it breaks up what could be a good play. That's also one we're aware of, but I don't have any updates on what's happening with it.

    What do you mean about goalies being unable to handle passes or deflections to them? I see those get stopped regularly. Yeah, the occasional pass squeaks through and of course, deflections are nothing new, but can you give me some more details?

    Often, a weakly deflected shot, or an errant pass or just a pass in general, appear invisible to the goalie, like they don't even react to it. I wouldn't call it occasional, more than I would "the norm". If I can remember to take a video clip I'll see if I can get you an example.

    As for dmen putting the goal into their own net, usually it's happening when the puck is loose in front of the goalie, and your own dman is just flying full tilt right into the goalie, pushing the puck through the goalie and into the net for an own goalie. If I remember correctly, it used to be the dman could basically retain control of the puck and bring it back out. Even if it crossed the line (while in possession of the puck), it wouldn't be a goal as long as you maintained possession. Sure it was unrealistic, but it was a fair sacrifice to avoid an own goal where we don't have the proper fidelity to control our stick that close.

    Are you saying those weakly deflected shots, errant or regular passes are scoring in most games you play? For me, they are very rare. I have seen those "pass goals" as well, but it's been quite a while. Of course, not every goal is going to show up on a highlight reel, but I'm seeing a lot more of those than weak ones where goalies fail to react. I know the dev team is always evaluating goalies and working to improve them. They've certainly gotten a lot better over the last few years.

    In previous years, it was a lot easier for D men to carry the puck into their own net. There were times they could skate it through the net and retain possession, but that has changed obviously. I also feel like there were still more times those ended up in your net than they do now. It's a tricky situation. We want to cut down on the own goals that aren't deflected in because you don't have as much control with clearing them out of the crease. Hopefully, a better system is put in place at some point. The current method isn't perfect, but I think it's a lot better than frequency of own goals in previous games.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager
    Kmahrle83 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    And that's a good example of when I say it doesn't feel organic, or natural, or feels forced and cheapens the experience.

    this is perfect video of why people believe tilt exists etc. Some might think the game DECIDED to do this to screw them when in reality its the terrible physics programming. If they cant get something like this fixed for years, i have a hard time believing they could implement something as intricate as dda or ice tilt.

    The puck is naturally reacting at first. It clips through the stick and the goalie deflects it to the waiting player.
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    At first I thought this looked like the puck naturally reacting according to the physics of its shape and how it's colliding with the blocker and stick. It looked ok, but now I see the puck clips through the shaft and goes off the back of the goalie's stick. Definitely hate to see that happen. I can surely understand the frustration with that. Thanks for the video.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Kmahrle83 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    And that's a good example of when I say it doesn't feel organic, or natural, or feels forced and cheapens the experience.

    this is perfect video of why people believe tilt exists etc. Some might think the game DECIDED to do this to screw them when in reality its the terrible physics programming. If they cant get something like this fixed for years, i have a hard time believing they could implement something as intricate as dda or ice tilt.

    The puck is naturally reacting at first. It clips through the stick and the goalie deflects it to the waiting player.
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    At first I thought this looked like the puck naturally reacting according to the physics of its shape and how it's colliding with the blocker and stick. It looked ok, but now I see the puck clips through the shaft and goes off the back of the goalie's stick. Definitely hate to see that happen. I can surely understand the frustration with that. Thanks for the video.

    agree with everything you just said except that I completely disagree that the physics of puck movement is accurate. Not the biggest deal in the world but the movement of the puck is not natural. Anyone that has actually played hockey knows that the weight, density, materials of the puck means that puck wouldn't act like that. Heck that puck barely even makes it to the goalie. it would drop dead and not move yet it seems to bounce off the ice, into his stick that barely moves and it shoots out off the stick like 3 ft. I've always felt the ice "friction" of the puck is to "light" as well. So that could have made it worse.

    point is in real life, if that puck flies into the goalie like that, its going to hit that ice and die. maybe bounce up just a hair, hit that stick and fall back down. and of course the goalie isn't going to have problems covering it.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Kmahrle83 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    And that's a good example of when I say it doesn't feel organic, or natural, or feels forced and cheapens the experience.

    this is perfect video of why people believe tilt exists etc. Some might think the game DECIDED to do this to screw them when in reality its the terrible physics programming. If they cant get something like this fixed for years, i have a hard time believing they could implement something as intricate as dda or ice tilt.

    The puck is naturally reacting at first. It clips through the stick and the goalie deflects it to the waiting player.
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    At first I thought this looked like the puck naturally reacting according to the physics of its shape and how it's colliding with the blocker and stick. It looked ok, but now I see the puck clips through the shaft and goes off the back of the goalie's stick. Definitely hate to see that happen. I can surely understand the frustration with that. Thanks for the video.

    agree with everything you just said except that I completely disagree that the physics of puck movement is accurate. Not the biggest deal in the world but the movement of the puck is not natural. Anyone that has actually played hockey knows that the weight, density, materials of the puck means that puck wouldn't act like that. Heck that puck barely even makes it to the goalie. it would drop dead and not move yet it seems to bounce off the ice, into his stick that barely moves and it shoots out off the stick like 3 ft. I've always felt the ice "friction" of the puck is to "light" as well. So that could have made it worse.

    point is in real life, if that puck flies into the goalie like that, its going to hit that ice and die. maybe bounce up just a hair, hit that stick and fall back down. and of course the goalie isn't going to have problems covering it.

    We're also seeing this video in slow motion. At regular speed, I think it wouldn't look like it's behaving more accurately. Regardless, I can understand what you're saying. This is a video game after all. It's not always going to have perfect, real-world physics.
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    I said this in another thread. If there is a guy near the net and he's not covered, the rebound will almost always go to him. It's not randomized, but calculated.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Kmahrle83 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    And that's a good example of when I say it doesn't feel organic, or natural, or feels forced and cheapens the experience.

    this is perfect video of why people believe tilt exists etc. Some might think the game DECIDED to do this to screw them when in reality its the terrible physics programming. If they cant get something like this fixed for years, i have a hard time believing they could implement something as intricate as dda or ice tilt.

    The puck is naturally reacting at first. It clips through the stick and the goalie deflects it to the waiting player.
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Steven5470 wrote: »
    Or the puck being soft lobbed to the goalie and suddenly ricochet quickly to the opposing team player for an open net?



    After a game I had tonight, I'm about done with this series. They've just about pushed me back into the text hockey sim games again.

    Yup. Like this:



    This must be how Grey Fox as the Cyber Ninja felt when he fought against Snake for the first time in MGS. We must all be gluttons for punishment as we keep coming back to this fushluggenah game thinking it's somehow gonna change. LOL!

    I mean it's kinda laughable that the puck takes a direct line to the opponent's stick every time. Not in front. Not behind. Doesn't bounce. Doesn't roll. Just flat on the ice, perfect reception and instant shot for a goal. Also love how my stick comes towards me, but the puck gets pushed sideways. The hitboxes in this game are phenomenal!!!

    This game makes Shaq Fu look like a gaming masterpiece by comparison.

    At first I thought this looked like the puck naturally reacting according to the physics of its shape and how it's colliding with the blocker and stick. It looked ok, but now I see the puck clips through the shaft and goes off the back of the goalie's stick. Definitely hate to see that happen. I can surely understand the frustration with that. Thanks for the video.

    agree with everything you just said except that I completely disagree that the physics of puck movement is accurate. Not the biggest deal in the world but the movement of the puck is not natural. Anyone that has actually played hockey knows that the weight, density, materials of the puck means that puck wouldn't act like that. Heck that puck barely even makes it to the goalie. it would drop dead and not move yet it seems to bounce off the ice, into his stick that barely moves and it shoots out off the stick like 3 ft. I've always felt the ice "friction" of the puck is to "light" as well. So that could have made it worse.

    point is in real life, if that puck flies into the goalie like that, its going to hit that ice and die. maybe bounce up just a hair, hit that stick and fall back down. and of course the goalie isn't going to have problems covering it.

    We're also seeing this video in slow motion. At regular speed, I think it wouldn't look like it's behaving more accurately. Regardless, I can understand what you're saying. This is a video game after all. It's not always going to have perfect, real-world physics.

    oh i completely agree. as i said its not a big deal. its actually amazing where we are today with things like physics in video games. but sometimes in chasing realism the actual experience is worse. The games look and behave so real now that every problem with them stands out more.

    To me the bouncy puck around the goalies that seem to constantly squirt out right to someones stick is a problem. In real life it happens a lot less and when it does its more like a mad scramble to corral a puck that fell down in front of the crease and either clear it or put it back on net. more often than not those scrambles lead to no goals because even if the offense gets it, there are defenders stick/body battling them and even if they get a shot off the puck is usually right in front of the goalie and he's ready to defend it. But they definitely lead to goals just not nearly as often as in this game.

    The experience in EA hockey is more like the puck shoots away from the goalie right to someone's stick usually far away from an overlay exposed goalie whos stuck in some kind of animation and defenseless. Thanks to the broken stick checking in this game you can wildly hack away with your puck in these mucky situations like they do in real hockey. So its all about body checks, stick lifts (although those are very dangerous in a crowd) and autoanimations. But because of how this always works out its more important that defenders be positioned at each side of the goalie since that is where the rebounds always seems to go. Good humans know this and are always ready. AI , well they are challenged in this dept.

    This is one of those areas that I think can and should be improved but its not game breaking.
  • I love hockey. This game is not hockey. It is programmed intentionally to remove our control from the gameplay. The program moves human players away from the player holding the puck allowing goals to occur. There basic physics that the game should have are manipulated to allow one team an advantage. I have played games watching my player pass somewhere in a different quadrant on my Dpad than I was aiming, I wonder if I was even playing the game at all. I want to thank EA for showing me how not to treat people who financially support you. You removed the human aspect of the hockey video game and decided you wanted to decide the outcomes(kinda like the NHL). I love hockey but this game is an expensive spin top. I'm bored.

    I write this and realize what a waste of energy on my part. Money, Money, Money.
    Another company who have no respect for people.
    And I paid for it.
    Shame on me.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager
    oh i completely agree. as i said its not a big deal. its actually amazing where we are today with things like physics in video games. but sometimes in chasing realism the actual experience is worse. The games look and behave so real now that every problem with them stands out more.

    To me the bouncy puck around the goalies that seem to constantly squirt out right to someones stick is a problem. In real life it happens a lot less and when it does its more like a mad scramble to corral a puck that fell down in front of the crease and either clear it or put it back on net. more often than not those scrambles lead to no goals because even if the offense gets it, there are defenders stick/body battling them and even if they get a shot off the puck is usually right in front of the goalie and he's ready to defend it. But they definitely lead to goals just not nearly as often as in this game.

    The experience in EA hockey is more like the puck shoots away from the goalie right to someone's stick usually far away from an overlay exposed goalie whos stuck in some kind of animation and defenseless. Thanks to the broken stick checking in this game you can wildly hack away with your puck in these mucky situations like they do in real hockey. So its all about body checks, stick lifts (although those are very dangerous in a crowd) and autoanimations. But because of how this always works out its more important that defenders be positioned at each side of the goalie since that is where the rebounds always seems to go. Good humans know this and are always ready. AI , well they are challenged in this dept.

    This is one of those areas that I think can and should be improved but its not game breaking.

    Rebounds aren't programmed to go right to an opposing player.

    What do you think is broken about stick checking?

    XFREAK76 wrote: »
    I love hockey. This game is not hockey. It is programmed intentionally to remove our control from the gameplay. The program moves human players away from the player holding the puck allowing goals to occur. There basic physics that the game should have are manipulated to allow one team an advantage. I have played games watching my player pass somewhere in a different quadrant on my Dpad than I was aiming, I wonder if I was even playing the game at all. I want to thank EA for showing me how not to treat people who financially support you. You removed the human aspect of the hockey video game and decided you wanted to decide the outcomes(kinda like the NHL). I love hockey but this game is an expensive spin top. I'm bored.

    I write this and realize what a waste of energy on my part. Money, Money, Money.
    Another company who have no respect for people.
    And I paid for it.
    Shame on me.

    Can you get me some video showing passes going where you don't aim them? Just get a replay and hit Y/Triangle to show the controller overlay. If passes aren't going where you aim, we need to know this so it can be looked into.

    Besides that, what your saying is most definitely not true. There is no intentional programming to remove your control or move human players out of the way so goals can be scored. There is no manipulation of physics to give one team an advantage over the other.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    oh i completely agree. as i said its not a big deal. its actually amazing where we are today with things like physics in video games. but sometimes in chasing realism the actual experience is worse. The games look and behave so real now that every problem with them stands out more.

    To me the bouncy puck around the goalies that seem to constantly squirt out right to someones stick is a problem. In real life it happens a lot less and when it does its more like a mad scramble to corral a puck that fell down in front of the crease and either clear it or put it back on net. more often than not those scrambles lead to no goals because even if the offense gets it, there are defenders stick/body battling them and even if they get a shot off the puck is usually right in front of the goalie and he's ready to defend it. But they definitely lead to goals just not nearly as often as in this game.

    The experience in EA hockey is more like the puck shoots away from the goalie right to someone's stick usually far away from an overlay exposed goalie whos stuck in some kind of animation and defenseless. Thanks to the broken stick checking in this game you can wildly hack away with your puck in these mucky situations like they do in real hockey. So its all about body checks, stick lifts (although those are very dangerous in a crowd) and autoanimations. But because of how this always works out its more important that defenders be positioned at each side of the goalie since that is where the rebounds always seems to go. Good humans know this and are always ready. AI , well they are challenged in this dept.

    This is one of those areas that I think can and should be improved but its not game breaking.

    Rebounds aren't programmed to go right to an opposing player.

    What do you think is broken about stick checking?

    XFREAK76 wrote: »
    I love hockey. This game is not hockey. It is programmed intentionally to remove our control from the gameplay. The program moves human players away from the player holding the puck allowing goals to occur. There basic physics that the game should have are manipulated to allow one team an advantage. I have played games watching my player pass somewhere in a different quadrant on my Dpad than I was aiming, I wonder if I was even playing the game at all. I want to thank EA for showing me how not to treat people who financially support you. You removed the human aspect of the hockey video game and decided you wanted to decide the outcomes(kinda like the NHL). I love hockey but this game is an expensive spin top. I'm bored.

    I write this and realize what a waste of energy on my part. Money, Money, Money.
    Another company who have no respect for people.
    And I paid for it.
    Shame on me.

    Can you get me some video showing passes going where you don't aim them? Just get a replay and hit Y/Triangle to show the controller overlay. If passes aren't going where you aim, we need to know this so it can be looked into.

    Besides that, what your saying is most definitely not true. There is no intentional programming to remove your control or move human players out of the way so goals can be scored. There is no manipulation of physics to give one team an advantage over the other.

    Umm its been discussed 10K times. Stick checking causing massive trips is just bad bad programming. hence "broken". Its maybe the single most unrealistic aspect of EA Hockey.

    I had a typo, I meant to say you "CAN'T " hack away... like you can in real hockey. Anyone trying to do anything with the puck in the low slot will be attacked viciously from both the body and the stick. In EA Hockey you can't do that. the more congested, the close you are, you can't use pock checking because its basically an automatic trip. stick lift isn't much better. Thats unrealistic and leads to way to easy to score in scrums around the goalie.

    Oh and I didn't say its programmed to go right to an opposing player. I was saying its programmed to be too bouncy and way to often shoots off to one side of the goalie right where an opposing player is usually waiting back door. In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly. To counter this you have to have your backside dman sitting on the backdoor rather than playing in front of the goalie crease.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager

    Umm its been discussed 10K times. Stick checking causing massive trips is just bad bad programming. hence "broken". Its maybe the single most unrealistic aspect of EA Hockey.

    I had a typo, I meant to say you "CAN'T " hack away... like you can in real hockey. Anyone trying to do anything with the puck in the low slot will be attacked viciously from both the body and the stick. In EA Hockey you can't do that. the more congested, the close you are, you can't use pock checking because its basically an automatic trip. stick lift isn't much better. Thats unrealistic and leads to way to easy to score in scrums around the goalie.

    Oh and I didn't say its programmed to go right to an opposing player. I was saying its programmed to be too bouncy and way to often shoots off to one side of the goalie right where an opposing player is usually waiting back door. In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly. To counter this you have to have your backside dman sitting on the backdoor rather than playing in front of the goalie crease.

    What changes would you make to tripping to make it more realistic?

    Yes. You don't have the same control with your stick as a real player. Using a game controller limits what you can do. On the other hand, we can't just have everyone hacking and chopping for the puck in traffic with no penalty. Poke spam was one of the biggest issues the community raised in 17 and 18. We took measures to curb that and make poke checks require more skill. We all need to be more disciplined than just jabbing at the puck in congested areas. If we had more fidelity with the stick, it would be different, but again, a standard controller doesn't really offer that. When the puck is loose in a lot of traffic, you can still push and shove to create separation and try to pick up the puck. You can stick lift as well, but of course have to be careful with it.

    Thanks for the feedback on rebounds.
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    edited January 17
    In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly.

    This was basically my experience playing real ice hockey as a goalie. And I played in 3 different eras that saw drastic changes in the way goalie equipment was made. Back when we used to wear those Brown Leather pads, they used to get really heavy and mushy when they got wet on the ice. Pucks wouldn't bounce away so much as just make a THUD and drop almost instantly to the ice. When equipment started to get better and companies started using Nylon and Plastic along with the leather, there was a little more bounce when they hit you, but goalies would learn how to properly redirect shots and the equipment was made so as to better control them. Pads weren't just flat "pillows" you strapped to your shins anymore. They had a form to them and each part served a purpose in how you wanted to control the puck when it hit you. They were more rigid than just leather, but it still had some give. Now a days, pads are mostly Mesh and Plastic. They use hollow foaming inside so that when the puck hits it doesn't bounce away, the impact gets absorbed by the material and the puck just dies there.

    In this game it's like goalie are wearing wooden boards. Everything is an uncontrollable rebound that leaps a mile in the air or to the side... When it actually HITs them. Usually it just goes into the net. :/
    Post edited by VeNOM2099 on
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly.

    This was basically my experience playing real ice hockey as a goalie. And I played in 3 different eras that saw drastic changes in the way goalie equipment was made. Back when we used to wear those Brown Leather pads, they used to get really heavy and mushy when they got wet on the ice. Pucks wouldn't bounce away so much as just make a THUD and drop almost instantly to the ice. When equipment started to get better and companies started using Nylon and Plastic along with the leather, there was a little more bounce when they hit you, but goalies would learn how to properly redirect shots and the equipment was made so as to better control them. Pads were just flat "pillows" you strapped to your shins. They had a form to them and each part served a purpose in how you wanted to control the puck when it hit you. They were more rigid than just leather, but it still had some give. Now a days, pads are mostly Mesh and Plastic. They use hollow foaming inside so that when the puck hits it doesn't bounce away, the impact gets absorbed by the material and the puck just dies there.

    In this game it's like goalie are wearing wooden boards. Everything is an uncontrollable rebound that leaps a mile in the air or to the side... When it actually HITs them. Usually it just goes into the net. :/

    Like always Sir on point and accurate
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly.

    This was basically my experience playing real ice hockey as a goalie. And I played in 3 different eras that saw drastic changes in the way goalie equipment was made. Back when we used to wear those Brown Leather pads, they used to get really heavy and mushy when they got wet on the ice. Pucks wouldn't bounce away so much as just make a THUD and drop almost instantly to the ice. When equipment started to get better and companies started using Nylon and Plastic along with the leather, there was a little more bounce when they hit you, but goalies would learn how to properly redirect shots and the equipment was made so as to better control them. Pads weren't just flat "pillows" you strapped to your shins anymore. They had a form to them and each part served a purpose in how you wanted to control the puck when it hit you. They were more rigid than just leather, but it still had some give. Now a days, pads are mostly Mesh and Plastic. They use hollow foaming inside so that when the puck hits it doesn't bounce away, the impact gets absorbed by the material and the puck just dies there.

    In this game it's like goalie are wearing wooden boards. Everything is an uncontrollable rebound that leaps a mile in the air or to the side... When it actually HITs them. Usually it just goes into the net. :/

    Yea a few years back, maybe 5 or 6, goalies actually wanted pads that gave big rebounds. The difference is, the goalies would direct those big rebounds and obviously would direct them into safe areas whenever possible. The reason behind that was the further the rebound, the further from the net the puck would be (duh) thus giving the goalie more time to recover and re position. Ideally, no one wants the puck to fall flat to the ice and try to have control in the chaos of everyone hacking away at the puck near the crease.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »

    Umm its been discussed 10K times. Stick checking causing massive trips is just bad bad programming. hence "broken". Its maybe the single most unrealistic aspect of EA Hockey.

    I had a typo, I meant to say you "CAN'T " hack away... like you can in real hockey. Anyone trying to do anything with the puck in the low slot will be attacked viciously from both the body and the stick. In EA Hockey you can't do that. the more congested, the close you are, you can't use pock checking because its basically an automatic trip. stick lift isn't much better. Thats unrealistic and leads to way to easy to score in scrums around the goalie.

    Oh and I didn't say its programmed to go right to an opposing player. I was saying its programmed to be too bouncy and way to often shoots off to one side of the goalie right where an opposing player is usually waiting back door. In real hockey unless you are ripping a big shot and hit them in bouncy areas of the pads its pretty much going to hit the goalie and drop down somewhere in front of him and die on the ice almost instantly. To counter this you have to have your backside dman sitting on the backdoor rather than playing in front of the goalie crease.

    What changes would you make to tripping to make it more realistic?

    Yes. You don't have the same control with your stick as a real player. Using a game controller limits what you can do. On the other hand, we can't just have everyone hacking and chopping for the puck in traffic with no penalty. Poke spam was one of the biggest issues the community raised in 17 and 18. We took measures to curb that and make poke checks require more skill. We all need to be more disciplined than just jabbing at the puck in congested areas. If we had more fidelity with the stick, it would be different, but again, a standard controller doesn't really offer that. When the puck is loose in a lot of traffic, you can still push and shove to create separation and try to pick up the puck. You can stick lift as well, but of course have to be careful with it.

    Thanks for the feedback on rebounds.

    As for changes, what I would like to see are much more specific to the DSS. As a defenseman using only one hand on my stick, I feel most times I should not get a tripping call because I tapped one skate with my stick. In real life, your stick simply stops right there and cannot follow through its trajectory because the carrier's leg simply stops the stick. At that point you have to pull your stick back to you and re position your stick. In any case, it is extremely rare you will trip a player because you are sweeping one-handed. Also, in real life, it is a struggle to get into the offensive zone and maintain control of the puck, so generally players will fight pretty hard to stay on their skates and not give up puck possession. Not every fall equals a penalty call. Also, in this game, skaters never blow a tire and fall on their own. Putting pressure on the carrier does not do all that much and certainly does not affect his skating ability in any way.

    As for straight up pokes, I am more or less ok with it as it currently is especially from a straight up RB poke instead of an R3 poke from the DSS position. If you are to lunge your stick, then it makes more sense to get a trip and also for the sake that this is a video game. Sadly, would be better if we had control over how far we lunge our sticks. That would be a fantastic addition, but with a controller, I guess it would be quite the feat to implement. Maybe have it that a quick tap is a short lunge and holding the button is a longer and maybe stronger lunge. Something like that.
  • Sgt_Kelso
    1291 posts Member
    edited January 17
    EA_Aljo wrote: »

    What changes would you make to tripping to make it more realistic?

    Yes. You don't have the same control with your stick as a real player. Using a game controller limits what you can do. On the other hand, we can't just have everyone hacking and chopping for the puck in traffic with no penalty. Poke spam was one of the biggest issues the community raised in 17 and 18. We took measures to curb that and make poke checks require more skill. We all need to be more disciplined than just jabbing at the puck in congested areas. If we had more fidelity with the stick, it would be different, but again, a standard controller doesn't really offer that. When the puck is loose in a lot of traffic, you can still push and shove to create separation and try to pick up the puck. You can stick lift as well, but of course have to be careful with it.

    Thanks for the feedback on rebounds.

    DSS should not get you a penalty, unless you do sweeping motion straight to opponent's legs. Otherwise, if you just hold it to close a lane, and the opponent skates into it, it should never be a penalty. That's what it's for, but it causes trips way too often.

    For all I care, regular poke can stay as it is.


    Speaking of penalties, I am fairly sick of getting crosschecked in the neck three times in a row, just like the CPU likes to do it, following your player around on the ice, and then they just move you bodily over the blue line... maybe it's a regular check but since they just follow behind you and their hands and the stick do all the work, it sure looks like a cross-check (which should be a penalty, but hey - it's not in the game).

    Besides, how often do you see body checks where the opponent is moving AWAY from you and you're just following him. I don't think it's plausible physically in most cases.
  • EA_Aljo
    1704 posts EA Community Manager

    As for changes, what I would like to see are much more specific to the DSS. As a defenseman using only one hand on my stick, I feel most times I should not get a tripping call because I tapped one skate with my stick. In real life, your stick simply stops right there and cannot follow through its trajectory because the carrier's leg simply stops the stick. At that point you have to pull your stick back to you and re position your stick. In any case, it is extremely rare you will trip a player because you are sweeping one-handed. Also, in real life, it is a struggle to get into the offensive zone and maintain control of the puck, so generally players will fight pretty hard to stay on their skates and not give up puck possession. Not every fall equals a penalty call. Also, in this game, skaters never blow a tire and fall on their own. Putting pressure on the carrier does not do all that much and certainly does not affect his skating ability in any way.

    As for straight up pokes, I am more or less ok with it as it currently is especially from a straight up RB poke instead of an R3 poke from the DSS position. If you are to lunge your stick, then it makes more sense to get a trip and also for the sake that this is a video game. Sadly, would be better if we had control over how far we lunge our sticks. That would be a fantastic addition, but with a controller, I guess it would be quite the feat to implement. Maybe have it that a quick tap is a short lunge and holding the button is a longer and maybe stronger lunge. Something like that.

    That's already how DSS works. You don't cause a trip if you hit the outside of their skate and pass through. If you go from inside to outside though, that will cause a trip. Your stick is between their skates. If you then go to the outside, it will trip the player.

    There are also stumbles where no penalty is called. It would be nice to see players blow a tire like we had several years back.

    Putting pressure on the carrier forces them to move the puck. Otherwise, it's probably going to result in a turnover if they try to hold on to it.

    It would be great to be able to control the depth of your poke. Like you were saying, using a game controller has its limitations. It would be great to see this added somehow though.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »

    As for changes, what I would like to see are much more specific to the DSS. As a defenseman using only one hand on my stick, I feel most times I should not get a tripping call because I tapped one skate with my stick. In real life, your stick simply stops right there and cannot follow through its trajectory because the carrier's leg simply stops the stick. At that point you have to pull your stick back to you and re position your stick. In any case, it is extremely rare you will trip a player because you are sweeping one-handed. Also, in real life, it is a struggle to get into the offensive zone and maintain control of the puck, so generally players will fight pretty hard to stay on their skates and not give up puck possession. Not every fall equals a penalty call. Also, in this game, skaters never blow a tire and fall on their own. Putting pressure on the carrier does not do all that much and certainly does not affect his skating ability in any way.

    As for straight up pokes, I am more or less ok with it as it currently is especially from a straight up RB poke instead of an R3 poke from the DSS position. If you are to lunge your stick, then it makes more sense to get a trip and also for the sake that this is a video game. Sadly, would be better if we had control over how far we lunge our sticks. That would be a fantastic addition, but with a controller, I guess it would be quite the feat to implement. Maybe have it that a quick tap is a short lunge and holding the button is a longer and maybe stronger lunge. Something like that.

    That's already how DSS works. You don't cause a trip if you hit the outside of their skate and pass through. If you go from inside to outside though, that will cause a trip. Your stick is between their skates. If you then go to the outside, it will trip the player.

    There are also stumbles where no penalty is called. It would be nice to see players blow a tire like we had several years back.

    Putting pressure on the carrier forces them to move the puck. Otherwise, it's probably going to result in a turnover if they try to hold on to it.

    It would be great to be able to control the depth of your poke. Like you were saying, using a game controller has its limitations. It would be great to see this added somehow though.

    It's nearly impossible to go from inside to outside without first going from outside to inside. You would have to start between there legs lol.

    Here it is in plain English. When a stick comes in contact with legs it should basically disappear. It can't trip it can't dislodge pucks, it can't pick up pucks, can't keep carrying the puck. This state should stay that way until the stick is returned to the outside body part it entered or if it exists another outside part of body then small timer like 1-3 secs.
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