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Transitional skating is broken for NHL 21

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  • Sega82mega
    1488 posts Member
    edited September 23
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    *I dont like how ovie could just drive trough your player that just bounce of.. Thats bad physics, I wish they just could collide with a big puck break out.
  • Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    *I dont like how ovie could just drive trough your player that just bounce of.. Thats bad physics, I wish they just could collide with a big puck break out.


    This is not an attack so please don’t try to say that it is.... but playing proper Defence means ensuring you control the closest player to the puck carrier. That didn’t happen and he paid the price by having inert A.I. Handle his mistake.
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    edited September 23
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    Plays like this are why people “skill zone” imo. That pass not shot should’ve ever gotten through/off. If you can’t trust your off-puck AI teammates, how can you possibly be expected to focus on on-puck defending? It’s ridiculous.

    I'm not actually trying to skill zone. But what you can't see on that play is that the player I'm in control of is the player that attempted a breakout pass to that very same Draisaitl who is seen coming into the zone at the beginning of the clip. Because I tried to hit him on the right side boards (left in the clip) but he stupidly turns to the center. And so the puck ended up going to the opponent instead.

    And unlike what the Devs have said about the passing, I don't get control of the receiver before he gets it, I still have control of the initial passer.

    So I got caught back in the zone and my only thought is to try to keep him away from the middle and hope that #29 can get close enough for me to switch to him and challenge the puck carrier. So instead, yeah, I tried to use my teammate as any sane hockey player would've. If people wanna call it skill zoning, then they don't know what skill zoning is.
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better put off switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    I think that pass shouldn't have gotten to Ovi in the first place, is what I think. Making a no look pass like that, against the grain, on your off foot and THREADING the needle through Draisaitl's skates like that? Not even the Great Jarri Kurri could've done it.

    The two players in front of Ovechkin while he rakes his stick through them and scores? That's just how EA works, man. It's not even a glitch, it's a FEATURE of their game.

    And then finally Koskinen being 2 feet out of position in his net? That's the cherry on the cake.

    E-A, Sports!

    "It's only game... why you HEFF to be mad?" :/
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    Plays like this are why people “skill zone” imo. That pass not shot should’ve ever gotten through/off. If you can’t trust your off-puck AI teammates, how can you possibly be expected to focus on on-puck defending? It’s ridiculous.

    I'm not actually trying to skill zone. But what you can't see on that play is that the player I'm in control of is the player that attempted a breakout pass to that very same Draisaitl who is seen coming into the zone at the beginning of the clip. Because I tried to hit him on the right side boards (left in the clip) but he stupidly turns to the center. And so the puck ended up going to the opponent instead.

    And unlike what the Devs have said about the passing, I don't get control of the receiver before he gets it, I still have control of the initial passer.

    So I got caught back in the zone and my only thought is to try to keep him away from the middle and hope that #29 can get close enough for me to switch to him and challenge the puck carrier. So instead, yeah, I tried to use my teammate as any sane hockey player would've. If people wanna call it skill zoning, then they don't know what skill zoning is.
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better put off switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    I think that pass shouldn't have gotten to Ovi in the first place, is what I think. Making a no look pass like that, against the grain, on your off foot and THREADING the needle through Draisaitl's skates like that? Not even the Great Jarri Kurri could've done it.

    The two players in front of Ovechkin while he rakes his stick through them and scores? That's just how EA works, man. It's not even a glitch, it's a FEATURE of their game.

    And then finally Koskinen being 2 feet out of position in his net? That's the cherry on the cake.

    E-A, Sports!

    "It's only game... why you HEFF to be mad?" :/

    I'd love to see test results of this play 100 times to see how very few, if any, times you were able to get the proper player switch. I've been there. Once they are clumped like that you have no idea who you will be switching to.
  • Sega82mega
    1488 posts Member
    edited September 24
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    *I dont like how ovie could just drive trough your player that just bounce of.. Thats bad physics, I wish they just could collide with a big puck break out.


    This is not an attack so please don’t try to say that it is.... but playing proper Defence means ensuring you control the closest player to the puck carrier. That didn’t happen and he paid the price by having inert A.I. Handle his mistake.

    Hmm you sure..? Cause Sometimes I can be one or two players away (my own teammates) the puck carrier, until I close down hes laine the final second when he thinks he's free. If you 2-3 steps ahead. The A.I skates in pretty straight laines, pretty easy to predict.. so I usally try to come up from the side.

    But yeah, often you need the closest beacuse many people go straight against the net. But I wouldn’t say thats the most proper defense - all the time.-

    And by proper in this clip, I mean he wasen't trying to go through the player and the board with a hit, and if he gets the puck hes automatically follow up the hit with a wrister in to the board...

    😏
    Post edited by Sega82mega on
  • Socair
    2419 posts Game Changer
    edited September 24
    Personal call outs are not what we’re here for; thread will be closed if it continues.

    Decided to reopen this as its a popular discussion. Let’s keep it on topic and about the game; not each other.
    Post edited by Socair on
    NHL Series Game Changer & Volunteer Moderator
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better of switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    Plays like this are why people “skill zone” imo. That pass not shot should’ve ever gotten through/off. If you can’t trust your off-puck AI teammates, how can you possibly be expected to focus on on-puck defending? It’s ridiculous.

    I'm not actually trying to skill zone. But what you can't see on that play is that the player I'm in control of is the player that attempted a breakout pass to that very same Draisaitl who is seen coming into the zone at the beginning of the clip. Because I tried to hit him on the right side boards (left in the clip) but he stupidly turns to the center. And so the puck ended up going to the opponent instead.

    And unlike what the Devs have said about the passing, I don't get control of the receiver before he gets it, I still have control of the initial passer.

    So I got caught back in the zone and my only thought is to try to keep him away from the middle and hope that #29 can get close enough for me to switch to him and challenge the puck carrier. So instead, yeah, I tried to use my teammate as any sane hockey player would've. If people wanna call it skill zoning, then they don't know what skill zoning is.
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    FirmGrotesqueEnglishpointer-size_restricted.gif

    Looks like you're still skill-zoning. Should've maybe switched defenders..

    But yea.. the A.I. is dead in the slot. Brutal to see.

    (Shhhh... Hehe don't push it, Venom is gasoline! 😉)

    No, he's right. I did play it poorly initially having control of the RD and coasting back too much. I saw #29 barreling down and thought better put off switching to him because I know he's going to be more afraid of the AI possibly stealing the puck from him than if he's Human controlled. At that point, if he gets flustered, I have time to switch. But instead he passes through Draisaitl and now I HAVE to switch to one of the d-men in front of the net. Which I try, but the game doesn't give me the switch because it thinks the RD that I'm controlling is the better player to control and is closer to the puck.

    But that isn't even the actual issue with that play. Not that it stops our buddy Kory from trying to incite discord in a discussion by planting personal attacks.

    I'm am above such pedestrian trifles. Or he is many furlongs beneath me... Whichever tickles your fancy more. ;)

    You try at least to play properly D, you are falling back and try to maneuver him to a safe place. And by the look of your other players, thats in good position, you had him pretty good, that shot should never had happen.

    I think that pass shouldn't have gotten to Ovi in the first place, is what I think. Making a no look pass like that, against the grain, on your off foot and THREADING the needle through Draisaitl's skates like that? Not even the Great Jarri Kurri could've done it.

    The two players in front of Ovechkin while he rakes his stick through them and scores? That's just how EA works, man. It's not even a glitch, it's a FEATURE of their game.

    And then finally Koskinen being 2 feet out of position in his net? That's the cherry on the cake.

    E-A, Sports!

    "It's only game... why you HEFF to be mad?" :/

    Yeah I know you weren’t skill zoning, it’s just a relevant topic when you see a 2-on-4 (with a mini 1-on-3) result in not only a quality shot but a goal because of some terrible AI play.
  • What they don't understand is we have been here, mostly, for years wanting to love this game. None of us turn on our consoles and say "Welp, how can I hate this game today?" We make video petitions like Majjam did and get told we are wrong. I made a post 2 months ago with 18 videos that was viewed 1.4 thousand times and had 157 respondents without a single peep from anyone at EA. It showed a litany of stuff that could be addressed rather than clown gear and stupid moves that are completely unneeded.

    They wonder why we get so furious. Our frustrations are, apparently, our fault and are ignored. They then have these big marketing campaigns and feed the world lip-service about how much they care about their customers only to prove, by action, they really don't.

    We are the result of years of customer neglect, misinformation, and the slow destruction of a game that some of us have bought since 1992.

    My business partners and I currently hold the only patent in the world for our idea we hope is revolutionary. I swear before all of us that if this pans out successfully I will drop 7 figures, hire every single decent person from the old EA/2k crews, and make a game operating at a loss for a few years in hopes I could take them down or, at minimum, get them to get up off their rears and step up like we all KNOW they can.

    2 games max is all I can do, even with my sliders and custom league. That’s the absolute max I can handle before everything just starts to really bug me. I can play along and pretend the AI is forcing me to play hockey for 2, 6-minute period games and then I grab highlights, post to Instagram, and I’m done for the day lol. Then it’s on to rocket league.
  • Sega82mega
    1488 posts Member
    edited September 24
    I was asking in another thread:

    would like to hear how people define skillzoning?

    I think this concept is lead by a big misunderstanding.

    I was playing a guy that refused to make a move anywhere near my net, I keept my controlled player in steady motion in the center around my goalie, to cut him off and to keep him on the outside, and all he was waiting for was for me to give up position so he could go short side or 1timer.
    Why should I switch to my AI player and do the same chasin my AI can do, when I can do a much better job if I stay in line and cut him off..?

    After the game a got a message that I was skillzoning, when all I did was playing D without getting fooled.

    So if thats skillzoning you might just as well give up the concept of getting a smarter AI, cause thats whats very many looking for, to exploit AI and go for a cheese. And if they dont, they blame you for skillzoning....

    *And sorry for off-topic Majjam, it's so easy to get carried away, but its about the game, at least... 😏

    Post edited by Sega82mega on
  • thegarden94
    155 posts Member
    edited September 24
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players
  • Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    And by sit in the middle you mean basically stand still, and if so, there's a big difference between that and be active with your D thats in control, but to stay around the center. But some people seem to have hard to see that difference.
  • What they don't understand is we have been here, mostly, for years wanting to love this game. None of us turn on our consoles and say "Welp, how can I hate this game today?" We make video petitions like Majjam did and get told we are wrong. I made a post 2 months ago with 18 videos that was viewed 1.4 thousand times and had 157 respondents without a single peep from anyone at EA. It showed a litany of stuff that could be addressed rather than clown gear and stupid moves that are completely unneeded.

    They wonder why we get so furious. Our frustrations are, apparently, our fault and are ignored. They then have these big marketing campaigns and feed the world lip-service about how much they care about their customers only to prove, by action, they really don't.

    We are the result of years of customer neglect, misinformation, and the slow destruction of a game that some of us have bought since 1992.

    My business partners and I currently hold the only patent in the world for our idea we hope is revolutionary. I swear before all of us that if this pans out successfully I will drop 7 figures, hire every single decent person from the old EA/2k crews, and make a game operating at a loss for a few years in hopes I could take them down or, at minimum, get them to get up off their rears and step up like we all KNOW they can.

    2 games max is all I can do, even with my sliders and custom league. That’s the absolute max I can handle before everything just starts to really bug me. I can play along and pretend the AI is forcing me to play hockey for 2, 6-minute period games and then I grab highlights, post to Instagram, and I’m done for the day lol. Then it’s on to rocket league.

    How doesn't this ring a bell in someone's head? "We have customers who are hockey players/love the game who cannot stand playing for more than 2 games at one sitting and go and play other sports games for longer durations". I have been playing since I was 3, I am now 35. It is my game. I cannot play this without being like "meh". I can boot up NHL 04 Rebuilt, NHL 14, 2k8/10, and play the every loving heck out of those games but the modern NHL is so...lame.

    I will say it forever...if hockey plays/strategies/systems were put into the game it would actually open up the game and make it more dynamic rather than the same, what, 3 entires/shots?

    At the very least give us Create-A-Play and sharing of these plays. The community itself would be able to put hockey into the game.
  • Sega82mega wrote: »
    I was asking in another thread:

    would like to hear how people define skillzoning?

    I think this concept is lead by a big misunderstanding.

    I was playing a guy that refused to make a move anywhere near my net, I keept my controlled player in steady motion in the center around my goalie, to cut him off and to keep him on the outside, and all he was waiting for was for me to give up position so he could go short side or 1timer.
    Why should I switch to my AI player and do the same chasin my AI can do, when I can do a much better job if I stay in line and cut him off..?

    After the game a got a message that I was skillzoning, when all I did was playing D without getting fooled.

    So if thats skillzoning you might just as well give up the concept of getting a smarter AI, cause thats whats very many looking for, to exploit AI and go for a cheese. And if they dont, they blame you for skillzoning....

    *And sorry for off-topic Majjam, it's so easy to get carried away, but its about the game, at least... 😏

    You should pay no mind to such claims. Hockey is a team sport that relies upon supporting each teammate. You cannot control them all and, as you said, the moment you chase is the moment you lose. Given the power of offense and the higher number of tools they have, you are forced in this game to be passive and play contain.

    If, for instance, they put in "bodying up" or things like true stick checking, defenders would be more apt to being aggressive.
  • What they don't understand is we have been here, mostly, for years wanting to love this game. None of us turn on our consoles and say "Welp, how can I hate this game today?" We make video petitions like Majjam did and get told we are wrong. I made a post 2 months ago with 18 videos that was viewed 1.4 thousand times and had 157 respondents without a single peep from anyone at EA. It showed a litany of stuff that could be addressed rather than clown gear and stupid moves that are completely unneeded.

    They wonder why we get so furious. Our frustrations are, apparently, our fault and are ignored. They then have these big marketing campaigns and feed the world lip-service about how much they care about their customers only to prove, by action, they really don't.

    We are the result of years of customer neglect, misinformation, and the slow destruction of a game that some of us have bought since 1992.

    My business partners and I currently hold the only patent in the world for our idea we hope is revolutionary. I swear before all of us that if this pans out successfully I will drop 7 figures, hire every single decent person from the old EA/2k crews, and make a game operating at a loss for a few years in hopes I could take them down or, at minimum, get them to get up off their rears and step up like we all KNOW they can.

    2 games max is all I can do, even with my sliders and custom league. That’s the absolute max I can handle before everything just starts to really bug me. I can play along and pretend the AI is forcing me to play hockey for 2, 6-minute period games and then I grab highlights, post to Instagram, and I’m done for the day lol. Then it’s on to rocket league.

    I can really see how you compare RL to hockey, I tryed it this morning and I had a really fun time, I even laugh out load, a LOL..

    And it's all about finding the right angel to attack and defend, speed with slow finesse, read the play, 2-3 step ahead.

    First game OT winner. 😃✌️

    *thanks for the tip
  • thegarden94
    155 posts Member
    edited September 24
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    And by sit in the middle you mean basically stand still, and if so, there's a big difference between that and be active with your D thats in control, but to stay around the center. But some people seem to have hard to see that difference.

    Like I said sit in the middle and let your AI play your d for you while you sit in the middle ,most of the time these same guys ,play the 0-5 or trap or both letting AI do the work
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    edited September 24
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    I was asking in another thread:

    would like to hear how people define skillzoning?

    I think this concept is lead by a big misunderstanding.

    I was playing a guy that refused to make a move anywhere near my net, I keept my controlled player in steady motion in the center around my goalie, to cut him off and to keep him on the outside, and all he was waiting for was for me to give up position so he could go short side or 1timer.
    Why should I switch to my AI player and do the same chasin my AI can do, when I can do a much better job if I stay in line and cut him off..?

    After the game a got a message that I was skillzoning, when all I did was playing D without getting fooled.

    So if thats skillzoning you might just as well give up the concept of getting a smarter AI, cause thats whats very many looking for, to exploit AI and go for a cheese. And if they dont, they blame you for skillzoning....

    *And sorry for off-topic Majjam, it's so easy to get carried away, but its about the game, at least... 😏

    Well, let me tell you what is NOT skill-zoning:
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    THAT is not skill zoning...

    The act of "skill zoning" is basically users parking their player and letting the AI do the work, whether on the forecheck, backcheck or defensive zone. You can be in your defensive zone and as soon as your opponent loses the puck and you can start your breakout from your zone, he quickly switches off to his defender and skates back into his zone while letting his AI chase your around? That's skill zoning.

    What our friend is describing above is more like "babysitting the AI" which likes to run around chasing the puck carrier without any regard for the human player's position. When that happens your best bet is to just observe and switch when the AI generated chaos will permit. In fact, many "top players" will use this tactic like Top Shelf Cookie, Nuke and Pens91. Go try telling them they're skill zoning. LOL!

    Also, the act of skill zoning is a sure fire way of alerting your opponent of your lack of skill and that they can exploit the stupid AI all they want. Good players know this and will capitalize on an opponent that thinks only relying on the AI to bail him out will do him any good.

    Especially considering that, like @Stovetop9620 said, chasing the puck like a madman gets you in trouble. And the only thing the AI do is chase the puck.
  • Sega82mega
    1488 posts Member
    edited September 24
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    And by sit in the middle you mean basically stand still, and if so, there's a big difference between that and be active with your D thats in control, but to stay around the center. But some people seem to have hard to see that difference.

    Like I said sit in the middle and let your AI play your d for you while you sit in the middle some guys are real good and usually the skill zone guys play the 0-5 and or trap

    Yeah but the AI is not 'allowed' to take any action other then staying in position, for that to happen you cant just stand completely still, (beacuse AI reflect of your own movement) in that case, I eat the opponent's AI up. If you can beat the AI, skill zone in is right meaning is useless, and I cant understand thats something people find satisfying. To -just- stand still in a video game and let the computer have all of the fun......

    But to get me right, I know skill zoning 'works', somehow it can get the job done, and thats a shame, that people only need to know how to score if you wanna win, defense? No problem, AI got that!
  • Sega82mega wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    And by sit in the middle you mean basically stand still, and if so, there's a big difference between that and be active with your D thats in control, but to stay around the center. But some people seem to have hard to see that difference.

    Like I said sit in the middle and let your AI play your d for you while you sit in the middle some guys are real good and usually the skill zone guys play the 0-5 and or trap

    Yeah but the AI is not 'allowed' to take any action other then staying in position, for that to happen you cant just stand completely still, (beacuse AI reflect of your own movement) in that case, I eat the opponent's AI up. If you can beat the AI, skill zone in is right meaning aint no problem, and I cant understand thats something people find satisfying. To -just- stand still in a video game and let the computer have all of the fun......

    I don't skill zone so your asking the wrong person on that ,but there are guys that are actually good at it ,and as for the AI not doing and kind of action well ...
  • Sega82mega wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players

    And by sit in the middle you mean basically stand still, and if so, there's a big difference between that and be active with your D thats in control, but to stay around the center. But some people seem to have hard to see that difference.

    Like I said sit in the middle and let your AI play your d for you while you sit in the middle some guys are real good and usually the skill zone guys play the 0-5 and or trap

    Yeah but the AI is not 'allowed' to take any action other then staying in position, for that to happen you cant just stand completely still, (beacuse AI reflect of your own movement) in that case, I eat the opponent's AI up. If you can beat the AI, skill zone in is right meaning aint no problem, and I cant understand thats something people find satisfying. To -just- stand still in a video game and let the computer have all of the fun......

    I don't skill zone so your asking the wrong person on that ,but there are guys that are actually good at it ,and as for the AI not doing and kind of action well ...

    Yeah it wasen't aimed for you in that meaning, im talking more generally about thoose that do it..

    And yeah as you imply, AI can save many people when it comes to playing D.

    But it's a complex issue, cause I must trust that my AI can do the job when it comes to players that love to L't in the corners, we're I have no business of being cause I need to cut off 1timers and short side in the central area around my net. So if the AI would suck it would become impossible, and if the AI is too good, no one will bother to play defense the right way....
  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sega82mega wrote: »
    I was asking in another thread:

    would like to hear how people define skillzoning?

    I think this concept is lead by a big misunderstanding.

    I was playing a guy that refused to make a move anywhere near my net, I keept my controlled player in steady motion in the center around my goalie, to cut him off and to keep him on the outside, and all he was waiting for was for me to give up position so he could go short side or 1timer.
    Why should I switch to my AI player and do the same chasin my AI can do, when I can do a much better job if I stay in line and cut him off..?

    After the game a got a message that I was skillzoning, when all I did was playing D without getting fooled.

    So if thats skillzoning you might just as well give up the concept of getting a smarter AI, cause thats whats very many looking for, to exploit AI and go for a cheese. And if they dont, they blame you for skillzoning....

    *And sorry for off-topic Majjam, it's so easy to get carried away, but its about the game, at least... 😏

    Well, let me tell you what is NOT skill-zoning:
    Skill zoning is when you just control one guy usually the center and just sit in the middle and hardly switch players



    What our friend is describing above is more like "babysitting the AI" which likes to run around chasing the puck carrier without any regard for the human player's position. When that happens your best bet is to just observe and switch when the AI generated chaos will permit. In fact, many "top players" will use this tactic like Top Shelf Cookie, Nuke and Pens91. Go try telling them they're skill zoning. LOL!


    But I honestly don't see any other good options to defend myself against players that dont want to play hockey. Instead they turn themselves inside out in the corners. Im not going to play cat and mouse.
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