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Let's Talk: NHL 21 Gameplay Trailer

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  • I have zero expectations for human goalies, I was talking ai, who I also now had developed zero expectations for during the tech test.
  • Ok so, as with everyone else i saw the same old ai errors in the video, and a few new offensive tools. Heres the thing...even if it releases with better d and all that, how long will it be til the streamers are whining and most of the changes go right back to where they were before? Theyve done it before. Sold us one game then immediately tuned it to crap again so, these trailers are useless because 1 month after release, this will all be tweaked and the game will play differently anyways.
  • Ok so, as with everyone else i saw the same old ai errors in the video, and a few new offensive tools. Heres the thing...even if it releases with better d and all that, how long will it be til the streamers are whining and most of the changes go right back to where they were before? Theyve done it before. Sold us one game then immediately tuned it to crap again so, these trailers are useless because 1 month after release, this will all be tweaked and the game will play differently anyways.

    Last year they didn't change things for the most part besides some bug fixes I believe. Chances are the feedback from 20 was taken and thus we have NHL 21 and it probably won't see any changes either and they will just go focus on trying to get NHL 22 next-gen ready hopefully.

  • This trailer reminds me of a quote I once knew...

    "Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive..."

    This isn't the first time EA has claimed the AI is better. That defense is better. That goalies are better. It isn't even the 2nd or the 3rd time.

    Spoiler Alert: they've never been right either.
  • CantHoldMeDown12
    96 posts Member
    edited September 17
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Ok so, as with everyone else i saw the same old ai errors in the video, and a few new offensive tools. Heres the thing...even if it releases with better d and all that, how long will it be til the streamers are whining and most of the changes go right back to where they were before? Theyve done it before. Sold us one game then immediately tuned it to crap again so, these trailers are useless because 1 month after release, this will all be tweaked and the game will play differently anyways.

    Last year they didn't change things for the most part besides some bug fixes I believe. Chances are the feedback from 20 was taken and thus we have NHL 21 and it probably won't see any changes either and they will just go focus on trying to get NHL 22 next-gen ready hopefully.

    people loved the nhl19 beta but the whiners whined and ea listened to them and only them, and tuned it right back to how people DIDNT want it.

    Also if their focus is already on nhl 22, then they have zero business putting out 21.
  • TheMajjam
    727 posts Member
    edited September 17
    :/

    QoCH9AD.png

    Hahaha. No.
  • Follisimo
    1006 posts Member
    edited September 17
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Ok so, as with everyone else i saw the same old ai errors in the video, and a few new offensive tools. Heres the thing...even if it releases with better d and all that, how long will it be til the streamers are whining and most of the changes go right back to where they were before? Theyve done it before. Sold us one game then immediately tuned it to crap again so, these trailers are useless because 1 month after release, this will all be tweaked and the game will play differently anyways.

    Last year they didn't change things for the most part besides some bug fixes I believe. Chances are the feedback from 20 was taken and thus we have NHL 21 and it probably won't see any changes either and they will just go focus on trying to get NHL 22 next-gen ready hopefully.

    people loved the nhl19 beta but the whiners whined and ea listened to them and only them, and tuned it right back to how people DIDNT want it.

    Also if their focus is already on nhl 22, then they have zero business putting out 21.

    Yes that was NHL 19 they made the changes and theyn they even said they weren't going to touch NHL 20 for the most part. They did exactly that. Chances are NHL 21 won't get touched either so it will be what it is. All of the yearly releases are always focusing on the next iteration within a month or 2 after a game releases and they just do small touch-ups here and there on the current.

  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    :/

    QoCH9AD.png

    Hahaha. No.

    Get the base game Jam!
  • Sega82mega
    1553 posts Member
    edited September 17
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Ok so, as with everyone else i saw the same old ai errors in the video, and a few new offensive tools. Heres the thing...even if it releases with better d and all that, how long will it be til the streamers are whining and most of the changes go right back to where they were before? Theyve done it before. Sold us one game then immediately tuned it to crap again so, these trailers are useless because 1 month after release, this will all be tweaked and the game will play differently anyways.

    Last year they didn't change things for the most part besides some bug fixes I believe. Chances are the feedback from 20 was taken and thus we have NHL 21 and it probably won't see any changes either and they will just go focus on trying to get NHL 22 next-gen ready hopefully.

    people loved the nhl19 beta but the whiners whined and ea listened to them and only them, and tuned it right back to how people DIDNT want it.

    Also if their focus is already on nhl 22, then they have zero business putting out 21.

    Yes that was NHL 19 they made the changes and theyn they even said they weren't going to touch NHL 20 for the most part. They did exactly that. Chances are NHL 21 won't get touched either so it will be what it is. All of the yearly releases are always focusing on the next iteration within a month or 2 after a game releases and they just do small touch-ups here and there on the current.

    Touch to much will only harm more then do good, every game 18,19,20,21 etc. is a build up from one to another, tearing it into pieces every new game would be a disaster.

    I think the beta 19 is still a big piece of what we have to day.

    I have no idea how they will move on to the next gen, hopefully they dont need to start all over and keep the ground base added with some horsepower from the next gen engine.

    I would love to see new menus and all stuff around thats been more or less the same as longest I can remember. But of course, gameplay is why im here.
  • EA_Blueberry
    3146 posts EA Community Manager
    Always cool to see the "Behind-the-scenes" stuff. Tossing this in here since it's related:

  • Always cool to see the "Behind-the-scenes" stuff. Tossing this in here since it's related:


    Why not have some defensive players come do this so we can get real defensive tools that work?
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    edited September 17
    Always cool to see the "Behind-the-scenes" stuff. Tossing this in here since it's related:


    "Let's get that in the game..."

    ...


    ...

    Everybody in the NHL community:

    cvpkdjzdxenx.gif

    Except ONE person.
  • Always cool to see the "Behind-the-scenes" stuff. Tossing this in here since it's related:


    where's the goalie, no defense? 😮

    Cool stuff. Looks cool the making of a video game. I wonder how many body movements thats in the game...
  • Sega82mega wrote: »
    Always cool to see the "Behind-the-scenes" stuff. Tossing this in here since it's related:


    where's the goalie, no defense? 😮

    Cool stuff. Looks cool the making of a video game. I wonder how many body movements thats in the game...

    They did goalies in the past, it was around the start of the decline.
  • I still see the AI steps up before you can take full control , it's the same AI as 20 ..,clip 1.25....but at least you pointed out the user error...lol
  • Interesting info from Ben on reddit:

    "We have continued to make improvements to the core pokecheck mechanics and tripping penalty logic as well. The pokechecks themselves have an increased min and max range and are much more reliable. Player attributes and context still weigh in so you are at your best in control and poking directly in front of your player with a skilled defender than you are poking against your momentum behind you with a lower skilled defender where you would be more inaccurate. It is also important to time your poke so that the future position of the puck is consistent.

    For the tripping logic, we added to the concept of tolerance of your stick blade hitting the skates from the front of the puck carrier. This now isn't just the front of that player but the front of where they are moving so if they pivot to a backskate a poke into their skates with just your stick blade (showing you are in good position and have a good gap and aren't making contact that would easily cause a trip) they won't fall.

    We have also done a lot of work to identify the forceful frames of the poke itself to more reliably know when you are blending into the action or blending out with the intention being that you will only see a player trip if you make contact with them during the forceful frames of the pokecheck.

    For interference, we have made improvements to both player and goalie interference. These rules in real life can be subjective at times but we feel our overall logic is much tighter and we are always listening to the community to understand edge cases."
  • Lol really on interference ,the net battle mechanic is used to create pic plays they are also used to hold up one of the D men in offensive zone which if you are following nhl rules is an INTERFERENCE PENALTY
  • Lol really on interference ,the net battle mechanic is used to create pic plays they are also used to hold up one of the D men in offensive zone which if you are following nhl rules is an INTERFERENCE PENALTY

    Been complaining about this for years too but its on the defensive side of the game so its ignored
  • The reddit post was actually very informative. I read through it. I like what I saw. But I still wonder if it's enough.
  • Lame!

    New dekes:
    - Michigan, Kucherov, Tkachuk - Childish Gimmicks
    - Crosby's bank pass - Nice, but I remember seeing Datsyuk do it first.
    - Banking pucks off the boards - Great, but didn't realize Ovi and McDavid were the only players that did that.
    - Pavel Barber? The only person in the hockey community I find more obnoxious than Nasher.

    Custom Skating Styles:
    - Actually very cool. Been wanting that in the game for year. Surprised it' in there.
    - I think someone mentioned more custom shooting styles as well. Also good.

    Goalies:
    - Separating upper and lower body, having body momentum actually be a factor - Make sense. But we've all seen the laws of physics broken before to bail goalies out.

    Honestly, some good stuff in the trailer. But anyone who's been playing this game for a while knows the AI and their super-human abilities are gonna pretty much ruin it. Forget the fact that nothing was done to poke checks, stick lifts, board play, net-front battles, passing, precision skating, collisions, puck physics, and all the other broken gameplay mechanics that are more important in hockey than a Michigan goal. EA's overall approach to AI just kills just about every other thing that's in this game. They're all about manufacturing ways to get goals, not creating a sandbox where your creativity offensively and structure defensively determines the experience you have. Just like Madden, as long as the game relies too much on animation and not enough on real physics, every game will play and feel the same, no matter what silly tricks the players are given.
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