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Is the game playing us instead??

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  • KidShowtime1867
    1839 posts Member
    edited April 19

    Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate dismantle decimate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    Post edited by KidShowtime1867 on
  • IceLion68
    1610 posts Member

    Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    ?? Is this a typo?

    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • IceLion68 wrote: »

    Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    ?? Is this a typo?

    LMAO forgive me - it's been a long Monday morning :D
  • IceLion68 wrote: »

    Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    ?? Is this a typo?

    He meant "decimate"

  • Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate dismantle decimate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    I feel like these two statements are related in my experiences where they appear not to be in yours. This is not ALWAYS the case, but I feel like some of my poor play has to do with the first statement in your post. I mean it's hard to play against other people when your team feels slower and weaker than they should be.

    I totally get that some players just have that much skill that it's really hard to play against them anyways, and those aren't the situations I am talking about. I'm talking about the games where my player switching is broken, passes don't go the right way, your shooters can't hit the broad side of a barn, players have that "stuck in the mud" feeling, "hustle" button doesn't do anything, AI "going against" what you're trying to do(won't breakout, power backskate away from loose puck, intentionally skates into opponents, etc)

    These are things that I generally don't have problems with when the game feels like I think it should, but for whatever reason there are a bunch of games where none of that stuff works as it should, hence the term "ice tilt" being thrown around.

    It's just funny how these issues exist since the PS4/XB1 came along, but nobody "claims" to have the answers or reasons why this happens so randomly. That's my beef.

  • Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate dismantle decimate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    I feel like these two statements are related in my experiences where they appear not to be in yours. This is not ALWAYS the case, but I feel like some of my poor play has to do with the first statement in your post. I mean it's hard to play against other people when your team feels slower and weaker than they should be.

    I totally get that some players just have that much skill that it's really hard to play against them anyways, and those aren't the situations I am talking about. I'm talking about the games where my player switching is broken, passes don't go the right way, your shooters can't hit the broad side of a barn, players have that "stuck in the mud" feeling, "hustle" button doesn't do anything, AI "going against" what you're trying to do(won't breakout, power backskate away from loose puck, intentionally skates into opponents, etc)

    These are things that I generally don't have problems with when the game feels like I think it should, but for whatever reason there are a bunch of games where none of that stuff works as it should, hence the term "ice tilt" being thrown around.

    It's just funny how these issues exist since the PS4/XB1 came along, but nobody "claims" to have the answers or reasons why this happens so randomly. That's my beef.

    Wait, you get games where player switching isn’t broken? Been playing offline all year and haven’t had even a single period where there wasn’t at least 5 instances of the game picking an egregiously wrong player for the situation. Gotta love that “contextual” player switching that gives me the 4th or 5th closest player to the puck multiple times before the 2nd, then back to the 3rd, then finally the player I wanted but now it’s too late to make a play, am I right?
  • haven’t had even a single period where there wasn’t at least 5 instances of the game picking an egregiously wrong player for the situation.

    This is an absurd amount of times. I maybe get 1 instance per game of not getting the player I want.

    I also switch players mostly by holding RT and flicking Right Stick in the direction of where I want to switch to rather than just pressing RT and hoping the game picks the right player.
  • haven’t had even a single period where there wasn’t at least 5 instances of the game picking an egregiously wrong player for the situation.

    This is an absurd amount of times. I maybe get 1 instance per game of not getting the player I want.

    I also switch players mostly by holding RT and flicking Right Stick in the direction of where I want to switch to rather than just pressing RT and hoping the game picks the right player.

    You only play modes where everything is tape-to-tape and there’s zero error or any lose pucks. You play against humans who don’t dump, don’t make area passes, because the meta doesn’t force them to. Naturally, even this game can figure out which guy you want when puck movement is minimal and the pass receiver is known by the game.

    I play offline with sliders much closer to real hockey, pass assist on 0 and pass accuracy on 5 with fatigue effect at 100. There’s a ton of pass error, bobbled pucks, and with puck carrier agility at 20, you’re forced to move the puck a lot more than default.

    Most dumps by both teams and many area passes lead to comically bad player switching. I too use the RS method to switch guys to mitigate this issue, but that too isn’t fool proof depending on the situation and density of players in a certain direction.

  • You only play modes where everything is tape-to-tape and there’s zero error or any lose pucks.

    Untrue.


  • You only play modes where everything is tape-to-tape and there’s zero error or any lose pucks.

    Untrue.

    So you’re an offline main now? You use my exact slider set with my exact roster where I’m seeing these issues game after game, period after period? Using RS + RT is necessary to avoid the auto player switching in this game because it’s really a chore to use. When making area passes in the offensive zone, the game constantly chooses players that make zero sense for where the puck is headed which can’t be mitigated consistently with RT + RS as the switch can be auto after a pass in many cases. Hard dump around the wall? Game will give you the center first, maybe the D, then the Weakside wing who actually has a legitimate shot at the puck. This is at least two player switches even with RS+RT as you will lock onto the center before the weakside wing more often that not with a crowded NZ.

    Hard dump in the defensive zone after using a forward to supply back pressure? Game will auto switch to the strong-side D, mayne the center, then the weakside D finally. This again will require two changes at a minimum with manual switching if running a 1-4 because the crowded NZ will inevitably lead to a middle player being selected before the weakside D and the weakside D can’t always be guaranteed to be the last man back where an RT hold will be able to solve this puzzle.

    The player switching is really really bad. Worst I’ve ever seen in this series.
  • EA_Aljo
    3199 posts EA Community Manager

    You only play modes where everything is tape-to-tape and there’s zero error or any lose pucks.

    Untrue.

    So you’re an offline main now? You use my exact slider set with my exact roster where I’m seeing these issues game after game, period after period? Using RS + RT is necessary to avoid the auto player switching in this game because it’s really a chore to use. When making area passes in the offensive zone, the game constantly chooses players that make zero sense for where the puck is headed which can’t be mitigated consistently with RT + RS as the switch can be auto after a pass in many cases. Hard dump around the wall? Game will give you the center first, maybe the D, then the Weakside wing who actually has a legitimate shot at the puck. This is at least two player switches even with RS+RT as you will lock onto the center before the weakside wing more often that not with a crowded NZ.

    Hard dump in the defensive zone after using a forward to supply back pressure? Game will auto switch to the strong-side D, mayne the center, then the weakside D finally. This again will require two changes at a minimum with manual switching if running a 1-4 because the crowded NZ will inevitably lead to a middle player being selected before the weakside D and the weakside D can’t always be guaranteed to be the last man back where an RT hold will be able to solve this puzzle.

    The player switching is really really bad. Worst I’ve ever seen in this series.

    I too have the occasional bad switch. Almost every time, it's predictable and the switch goes where I expect it to. However, like @KidShowtime1867, I use a lot of manual switching so I might be seeing less bad switches than others that rely on auto switching. You're always welcome to provide some video and we'll get it sent over to the dev team.
  • Sega82mega
    4211 posts Member
    edited April 19
    The auto switching is actually a pretty interesting topic, I wouldn’t say it's bad, but also not great.

    But I dont know, it must have to do with how you prefer to play, when I get my hockey going, my mind knows exactly what player I need and the next second 'auto switching' gives me that player, like a mind-reader.

    But usally I dont switch that often, perhaps cause I dont like it to much, every switch you do will often lead to a pretty big adjustment - thats why I rather stay focus on one player.

    But I think the auto switching is a under-rated topic, when it comes to this game, I bealive it can make a pretty big difference for the game to being really good.. Or just 'good'.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »

    You only play modes where everything is tape-to-tape and there’s zero error or any lose pucks.

    Untrue.

    So you’re an offline main now? You use my exact slider set with my exact roster where I’m seeing these issues game after game, period after period? Using RS + RT is necessary to avoid the auto player switching in this game because it’s really a chore to use. When making area passes in the offensive zone, the game constantly chooses players that make zero sense for where the puck is headed which can’t be mitigated consistently with RT + RS as the switch can be auto after a pass in many cases. Hard dump around the wall? Game will give you the center first, maybe the D, then the Weakside wing who actually has a legitimate shot at the puck. This is at least two player switches even with RS+RT as you will lock onto the center before the weakside wing more often that not with a crowded NZ.

    Hard dump in the defensive zone after using a forward to supply back pressure? Game will auto switch to the strong-side D, mayne the center, then the weakside D finally. This again will require two changes at a minimum with manual switching if running a 1-4 because the crowded NZ will inevitably lead to a middle player being selected before the weakside D and the weakside D can’t always be guaranteed to be the last man back where an RT hold will be able to solve this puzzle.

    The player switching is really really bad. Worst I’ve ever seen in this series.

    I too have the occasional bad switch. Almost every time, it's predictable and the switch goes where I expect it to. However, like @KidShowtime1867, I use a lot of manual switching so I might be seeing less bad switches than others that rely on auto switching. You're always welcome to provide some video and we'll get it sent over to the dev team.

    Okay thanks for proving my point. The situations where player switching struggles to find the right guy is “predictable” even when playing online with near-perfect passing, so add-in more area passes, bobbled passes, slower acceleration levels where it should be obvious who is “moving” to a spot and who is not, then add in longer period lengths and you can easily see why I’m seeing at least 5x a period in getting someone that doesn’t make sense for the situation.

    I use manual switching almost exclusively so again, this isn’t a “I can’t figure out how to mitigate this issue” it’s a “this is blatantly an issue regardless of manual switching existing or not” issue. I’ve also explained how manual switching does NOT resolve all problems with player switching.

    Especially on sliders where acceleration is low which creates more time and space where it makes sense (ie hard dumps) I lose races solely because of the fact that auto switching is so painfully bad that I need to resort to doing two manual switches rather than one auto switch which means that’s another split second my guy isn’t at full speed to contest the dump.

  • Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate dismantle decimate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    I feel like these two statements are related in my experiences where they appear not to be in yours. This is not ALWAYS the case, but I feel like some of my poor play has to do with the first statement in your post. I mean it's hard to play against other people when your team feels slower and weaker than they should be.

    I totally get that some players just have that much skill that it's really hard to play against them anyways, and those aren't the situations I am talking about. I'm talking about the games where my player switching is broken, passes don't go the right way, your shooters can't hit the broad side of a barn, players have that "stuck in the mud" feeling, "hustle" button doesn't do anything, AI "going against" what you're trying to do(won't breakout, power backskate away from loose puck, intentionally skates into opponents, etc)

    These are things that I generally don't have problems with when the game feels like I think it should, but for whatever reason there are a bunch of games where none of that stuff works as it should, hence the term "ice tilt" being thrown around.

    It's just funny how these issues exist since the PS4/XB1 came along, but nobody "claims" to have the answers or reasons why this happens so randomly. That's my beef.

    Wait, you get games where player switching isn’t broken? Been playing offline all year and haven’t had even a single period where there wasn’t at least 5 instances of the game picking an egregiously wrong player for the situation. Gotta love that “contextual” player switching that gives me the 4th or 5th closest player to the puck multiple times before the 2nd, then back to the 3rd, then finally the player I wanted but now it’s too late to make a play, am I right?

    Yeah, player switching has been brokEAn for a while. I just want the player nearest the puck because that is mostly what I focus on when I decide to intervene (make a play). Why has this been so difficult for so long!!!!
    My favorites scenarios:
    I have to switch 2 or 3 times to get the LEAD FORE CHECKER. The context is the FORE CHECK. Design or brokEAn? Has to be brokEAn. It makes no sense.
    The player nearest the opposing goalie to freeze the play. I always get the second man whether he's in the high-slot or behind the net. Design or brokEAn? Probably design to appease the mostly impulsive player base, but it shouldn't be for offline Full-Sim.
    After I score a goal and my defensemen decide to spread out and leave a wide gap after the face-off. And I can never get the defenseman on the puck carrier. I always get the weak side D and I usually pull him out of position. Design or brokEAn? Because it always happens it could be brokEAn, but I'm not sure it isn't both.

  • Have you ever played an NHL game vs somebody who looks like their team is on crack when yours can hardly move? I assume you probably haven't.

    Your assumption is correct.
    Have you ever seen your opponent's 75 overall player out-everything your 90 overall player (with multiple synergies active even!!)?

    When I'm playing poor defensive hockey I have absolutely seen a 75 OVR avg line disseminate dismantle decimate my 80/90+ OVR. And I have zero issue with that.

    I feel like these two statements are related in my experiences where they appear not to be in yours. This is not ALWAYS the case, but I feel like some of my poor play has to do with the first statement in your post. I mean it's hard to play against other people when your team feels slower and weaker than they should be.

    I totally get that some players just have that much skill that it's really hard to play against them anyways, and those aren't the situations I am talking about. I'm talking about the games where my player switching is broken, passes don't go the right way, your shooters can't hit the broad side of a barn, players have that "stuck in the mud" feeling, "hustle" button doesn't do anything, AI "going against" what you're trying to do(won't breakout, power backskate away from loose puck, intentionally skates into opponents, etc)

    These are things that I generally don't have problems with when the game feels like I think it should, but for whatever reason there are a bunch of games where none of that stuff works as it should, hence the term "ice tilt" being thrown around.

    It's just funny how these issues exist since the PS4/XB1 came along, but nobody "claims" to have the answers or reasons why this happens so randomly. That's my beef.

    Wait, you get games where player switching isn’t broken? Been playing offline all year and haven’t had even a single period where there wasn’t at least 5 instances of the game picking an egregiously wrong player for the situation. Gotta love that “contextual” player switching that gives me the 4th or 5th closest player to the puck multiple times before the 2nd, then back to the 3rd, then finally the player I wanted but now it’s too late to make a play, am I right?

    Well no it's not perfect by any means. I can NEVER switch to the right player to beat the icing call, and the right player sure as hell won't even try on his own. It's almost like the AI doesn't have any programming for an icing situation as the players skate into the zone and just turn and skate sideways for no reason.

    When the game feels correctly playable I don't seem to have a lot of problems with switching players in general. When the game feels NOT playable due to things I've mentioned before I don't feel like player switching is anywhere close to useful. It's like the game's programming is seeing something different happening than what I am seeing and reacting to that instead...if that makes sense.
  • Sega82mega
    4211 posts Member
    edited April 20
    I usally only use auto-switch but as I said before, I rarely switch between players, I go between auto and this "click" you can do with RS to get your last player most close your goalie.(which is flawless to 99%)

    When im 'in the zone' and the auto-switch also is 'in the zone' I tend to switch much more, and that gives me a big advantage being able to pressure the puck carrier in a whole nother way.

    When you chase the puck behind the opponent's net.. I usally have to 'click 2-3' times before anything happen.

    It sometimes feels when the speed is close to max, the player switching gets behind, like it can't keep up to the pace.
  • I too have problems switching to the correct player (resp. the player I WANT to switch to).

    Especially during a break, where the attackers taking speed, and I would like to switch to my last defender, to prepair a check against that player that comes through.
    EA does not allow me to switch to the last defender, EA only allows to switch to the players around the two or three attackers.
    That is a pitty, because the last player does everything else than that, what I would do.
    And at the end of the attack, when the attackers come in the near of my last defender (and EA allows to switch to this defender), often it is too late to make a good check. Yes I love these again and again returning situations with EA restrictions!
    Why do I want to switch to my last defender?
    Because EA makes the attackers protected, so that you can poke, and small check them, without any result. So you know, that when they make the break, no matter how you try to disturb them, that the very last thing to stop them is a well prepaired check against the player that comes through.
    But as I see again and again, EA cheats by not letting you switch to the player you want.

    Finally when its too late, resp. you are not able to check the first attacker any more, EA allows to switch to your last defender! No poking and no checking is possible any more because this last defender is far too tar away. Yes, that is great!

    Perhaps this once again is a result of EA's thrilling factor... :(

    BTW There is one of the next cheats of EA.
    Did you see how often and fast the CPUs defenders are able to skate backwards, and did you see, how slowly the users defenders are able to skate backwards?

    But as all DEVs again and again say, no there isn't any cheating on CPU players side... NO NO NO.
    Yes, I see it again and again. There isn't any cheating from CPU players side. o:)
  • KidShowtime1867
    1839 posts Member
    edited April 20
    IMO, player switching issues are from people frantically trying to switch to the right player, clicking RT too much. I do it too when I have moments where manual switching has escaped me and I revert back to just auto-select.

    Again, using manual switching I've mitigated 99% of these issues. Yes, sometimes it still selects the wrong player but I chalk that up to my mistake, assuming my angle on LS was good.

    For those trying to get last man back, hold RT and click RS. Literally 100% of the time you'll take control of the last man back.

    Now.. I think we can all agree that player switching issues and some passing issues could be remedied with some good old icon-based passing, a la NBA & NHL 2k.

    gdynqf2.png

  • Now.. I think we can all agree that player switching issues and some passing issues could be remedied with some good old icon-based passing, a la NBA & NHL 2k.

    gdynqf2.png

    That would be amazing.
  • EA_Aljo
    3199 posts EA Community Manager
    IMO, player switching issues are from people frantically trying to switch to the right player, clicking RT too much. I do it too when I have moments where manual switching has escaped me and I revert back to just auto-select.

    Again, using manual switching I've mitigated 99% of these issues. Yes, sometimes it still selects the wrong player but I chalk that up to my mistake, assuming my angle on LS was good.

    For those trying to get last man back, hold RT and click RS. Literally 100% of the time you'll take control of the last man back.

    Now.. I think we can all agree that player switching issues and some passing issues could be remedied with some good old icon-based passing, a la NBA & NHL 2k.

    gdynqf2.png

    I feel like this would take away from the skill with passing and automate it too much. There were a lot of complaints about tape to tape passing with the 360/PS3 generation of games. Wouldn't this also go against requests from the hardcore community that want more accountability for their play?
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