The NHL series moving to the Frostbite engine can only be a bad thing. How does EA expect the skeleton team over at EA SPORTS Vancouver to make a hockey game thrive using an engine that was made SPECIFICALLY FOR THE BATTLEFIELD SERIES. The engine was meant for strictly high graphical-fidelity first person shooters with destructible environments.
We've already seen the ramifications of EA forcing their dev studios into using the Frostbite engine: Anthem is a big one that comes to mind. The devs at Bioware complained about how hard and un-intuitive it was to make a third person looter-shooter MMORPG game in an engine that was purpose made for FPS games. One would think that the jump between those two would be smaller than the jump between FPS and friggin HOCKEY game, right? I can only see this leading to immense frustration from the folks at EASPORTS Vancouver and many, many bugs in the future.
All that and I haven't even mentioned how the people at DICE Sweden hate working with the Frostbite engine (and they're the ones who are using it how it was meant to be used!). Don't get me wrong... the Frostbite engine is absolutely amazing and has given me my favorite game series to date (BF) with some absolutely stunning graphics and insane vehicular combat... when it is working right.
The NHL series moving to the Frostbite engine can only be a bad thing. How does EA expect the skeleton team over at EA SPORTS Vancouver to make a hockey game thrive using an engine that was made SPECIFICALLY FOR THE BATTLEFIELD SERIES. The engine was meant for strictly high graphical-fidelity first person shooters with destructible environments.
We've already seen the ramifications of EA forcing their dev studios into using the Frostbite engine: Anthem is a big one that comes to mind. The devs at Bioware complained about how hard and un-intuitive it was to make a third person looter-shooter MMORPG game in an engine that was purpose made for FPS games. One would think that the jump between those two would be smaller than the jump between FPS and friggin HOCKEY game, right? I can only see this leading to immense frustration from the folks at EASPORTS Vancouver and many, many bugs in the future.
All that and I haven't even mentioned how the people at DICE Sweden hate working with the Frostbite engine (and they're the ones who are using it how it was meant to be used!). Don't get me wrong... the Frostbite engine is absolutely amazing and has given me my favorite game series to date (BF) with some absolutely stunning graphics and insane vehicular combat... when it is working right.
I genuinely can’t believe EA is still taking the frostbite route with their games. It’s been documented how bad it is to work with, FIFA and Madden have both regressed because of it, yet they’re going to die on this hill huh?
Meanwhile, you see a game like PES where their engine is literally built for soccer and you have actual physics (not claimed or alleged physics) affecting the ball which is nothing short of amazing to experience. They have a plethora of animations in the game when it comes to passing and receiving the ball to ensure both auto passers and manual passers have a very fluid experience when passing.
The NHL series moving to the Frostbite engine can only be a bad thing. How does EA expect the skeleton team over at EA SPORTS Vancouver to make a hockey game thrive using an engine that was made SPECIFICALLY FOR THE BATTLEFIELD SERIES. The engine was meant for strictly high graphical-fidelity first person shooters with destructible environments.
We've already seen the ramifications of EA forcing their dev studios into using the Frostbite engine: Anthem is a big one that comes to mind. The devs at Bioware complained about how hard and un-intuitive it was to make a third person looter-shooter MMORPG game in an engine that was purpose made for FPS games. One would think that the jump between those two would be smaller than the jump between FPS and friggin HOCKEY game, right? I can only see this leading to immense frustration from the folks at EASPORTS Vancouver and many, many bugs in the future.
All that and I haven't even mentioned how the people at DICE Sweden hate working with the Frostbite engine (and they're the ones who are using it how it was meant to be used!). Don't get me wrong... the Frostbite engine is absolutely amazing and has given me my favorite game series to date (BF) with some absolutely stunning graphics and insane vehicular combat... when it is working right.
I genuinely can’t believe EA is still taking the frostbite route with their games. It’s been documented how bad it is to work with, FIFA and Madden have both regressed because of it, yet they’re going to die on this hill huh?
Meanwhile, you see a game like PES where their engine is literally built for soccer and you have actual physics (not claimed or alleged physics) affecting the ball which is nothing short of amazing to experience. They have a plethora of animations in the game when it comes to passing and receiving the ball to ensure both auto passers and manual passers have a very fluid experience when passing.
The difference is night and day.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable for EA to get some ROI on the millions they’ve invested into developing Frosbite.
But I do agree a hockey specific engine would be amazing. However, creating an all new engine with the yearly development cycle would be impossible.
But I do agree a hockey specific engine would be amazing. However, creating an all new engine with the yearly development cycle would be impossible.
And NHL is certainly not the game this would happen for.
Agreed. Although the collaboration with the UFC development team was an indicator that there is still a priority for the NHL series to evolve in different ways.
Although I fear the move to Frostbite may remove some of the benefits we've seen with the locomotion engine, adopted from UFC.
I don't know enough about what's entailed with a move to Frostbite and what can/can't be carried over in terms of animation frameworks - but I hope the locomotion stuff sticks because it's definitely improved player animations and skating physics.
The NHL series moving to the Frostbite engine can only be a bad thing. How does EA expect the skeleton team over at EA SPORTS Vancouver to make a hockey game thrive using an engine that was made SPECIFICALLY FOR THE BATTLEFIELD SERIES. The engine was meant for strictly high graphical-fidelity first person shooters with destructible environments.
We've already seen the ramifications of EA forcing their dev studios into using the Frostbite engine: Anthem is a big one that comes to mind. The devs at Bioware complained about how hard and un-intuitive it was to make a third person looter-shooter MMORPG game in an engine that was purpose made for FPS games. One would think that the jump between those two would be smaller than the jump between FPS and friggin HOCKEY game, right? I can only see this leading to immense frustration from the folks at EASPORTS Vancouver and many, many bugs in the future.
All that and I haven't even mentioned how the people at DICE Sweden hate working with the Frostbite engine (and they're the ones who are using it how it was meant to be used!). Don't get me wrong... the Frostbite engine is absolutely amazing and has given me my favorite game series to date (BF) with some absolutely stunning graphics and insane vehicular combat... when it is working right.
I genuinely can’t believe EA is still taking the frostbite route with their games. It’s been documented how bad it is to work with, FIFA and Madden have both regressed because of it, yet they’re going to die on this hill huh?
Meanwhile, you see a game like PES where their engine is literally built for soccer and you have actual physics (not claimed or alleged physics) affecting the ball which is nothing short of amazing to experience. They have a plethora of animations in the game when it comes to passing and receiving the ball to ensure both auto passers and manual passers have a very fluid experience when passing.
The difference is night and day.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable for EA to get some ROI on the millions they’ve invested into developing Frosbite.
But I do agree a hockey specific engine would be amazing. However, creating an all new engine with the yearly development cycle would be impossible.
I mean, they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles so Frostbite will help the bottom line for pushing out gambling simulators with semi-okay sports games tacked on.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
The dev team determines how the game develops. There's no army of suits lurking over them. Like much of what people come up with on these forums, this is another inaccurate assumption.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
I get that the show is easier, won’t disagree with you there, but if it’s easier, it makes sense that it’s a better sim right?
If you play it like a sim, it can occasionally look like hockey. Unfortunately, the AI struggle more at low speeds than high which right away makes for a lesser “sim” experience. Goalies still don’t play anything like their real life counterparts, the AI still get to break the physics engine and pickup pucks users can’t whenever convenient, and the in-zone positioning and movement of players is incredibly static and/or outdated compared to the real life sport.
It’s definitely EA’s best attempt, it definitely does some things the best of any hockey game ever, but also struggles on some fronts that other hockey games have done much better. This is the worst part because I still find goalies from 2k and the overall feel of unpredictability of 2k and NHL Hitz Pro to give me much more consistent fun than this game.
The sliders are there for sim gameplay, the AI however is not which is not fixable on my end. If only the AI for my team and the CPU’s were programmed the same and if only the CPU couldn’t cheat physics and puck pickups then the game would magically take another huge stride forward. Unfortunately, they get to keep doing 270 stop and starts without losing speed and my AI still don’t care about the puck compared to their AI counterparts which makes the game feel much more arcadey than it probably deserves. If I could play a human with my sliders, I’m sure it’d be a blast.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
I get that the show is easier, won’t disagree with you there, but if it’s easier, it makes sense that it’s a better sim right?
If you play it like a sim, it can occasionally look like hockey. Unfortunately, the AI struggle more at low speeds than high which right away makes for a lesser “sim” experience. Goalies still don’t play anything like their real life counterparts, the AI still get to break the physics engine and pickup pucks users can’t whenever convenient, and the in-zone positioning and movement of players is incredibly static and/or outdated compared to the real life sport.
It’s definitely EA’s best attempt, it definitely does some things the best of any hockey game ever, but also struggles on some fronts that other hockey games have done much better.
The sliders are there for sim gameplay, the AI however is not which is not fixable on my end. If only the AI for my team and the CPU’s were programmed the same and if only the CPU couldn’t cheat physics and puck pickups then the game would magically take another huge stride forward. Unfortunately, they get to keep doing 270 stop and starts without losing speed and my AI still don’t care about the puck compared to their AI counterparts which makes the game feel much more arcadey than it probably deserves. If I could play a human with my sliders, I’m sure it’d be a blast.
The lack of being able to play online with custom sliders, especially ones created by passionate users such as yourself, is a real tragedy, IMO.
And I agree with much of your assessment of the A.I. I've posted a lot of gifs outlining my hatred for some of their decisions for sure.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
I get that the show is easier, won’t disagree with you there, but if it’s easier, it makes sense that it’s a better sim right?
If you play it like a sim, it can occasionally look like hockey. Unfortunately, the AI struggle more at low speeds than high which right away makes for a lesser “sim” experience. Goalies still don’t play anything like their real life counterparts, the AI still get to break the physics engine and pickup pucks users can’t whenever convenient, and the in-zone positioning and movement of players is incredibly static and/or outdated compared to the real life sport.
It’s definitely EA’s best attempt, it definitely does some things the best of any hockey game ever, but also struggles on some fronts that other hockey games have done much better.
The sliders are there for sim gameplay, the AI however is not which is not fixable on my end. If only the AI for my team and the CPU’s were programmed the same and if only the CPU couldn’t cheat physics and puck pickups then the game would magically take another huge stride forward. Unfortunately, they get to keep doing 270 stop and starts without losing speed and my AI still don’t care about the puck compared to their AI counterparts which makes the game feel much more arcadey than it probably deserves. If I could play a human with my sliders, I’m sure it’d be a blast.
The lack of being able to play online with custom sliders, especially ones created by passionate users such as yourself, is a real tragedy, IMO.
And I agree with much of your assessment of the A.I. I've posted a lot of gifs outlining my hatred for some of their decisions for sure.
Yes I know you have. That’s my biggest gripe with the series. Like, I think AI deficiencies were way higher up on the “what makes gameplay frustrating” list than “realistic shooting animations” but bock of the box features sell games.
I just want my AI to do things like “ok” even 50% of the time. That’s my wish. Or give me custom plays back so I can mitigate many of these problems.
they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
I get that the show is easier, won’t disagree with you there, but if it’s easier, it makes sense that it’s a better sim right?
If you play it like a sim, it can occasionally look like hockey. Unfortunately, the AI struggle more at low speeds than high which right away makes for a lesser “sim” experience. Goalies still don’t play anything like their real life counterparts, the AI still get to break the physics engine and pickup pucks users can’t whenever convenient, and the in-zone positioning and movement of players is incredibly static and/or outdated compared to the real life sport.
It’s definitely EA’s best attempt, it definitely does some things the best of any hockey game ever, but also struggles on some fronts that other hockey games have done much better.
The sliders are there for sim gameplay, the AI however is not which is not fixable on my end. If only the AI for my team and the CPU’s were programmed the same and if only the CPU couldn’t cheat physics and puck pickups then the game would magically take another huge stride forward. Unfortunately, they get to keep doing 270 stop and starts without losing speed and my AI still don’t care about the puck compared to their AI counterparts which makes the game feel much more arcadey than it probably deserves. If I could play a human with my sliders, I’m sure it’d be a blast.
The lack of being able to play online with custom sliders, especially ones created by passionate users such as yourself, is a real tragedy, IMO.
And I agree with much of your assessment of the A.I. I've posted a lot of gifs outlining my hatred for some of their decisions for sure.
Yes I know you have. That’s my biggest gripe with the series. Like, I think AI deficiencies were way higher up on the “what makes gameplay frustrating” list than “realistic shooting animations” but bock of the box features sell games.
I just want my AI to do things like “ok” even 50% of the time. That’s my wish. Or give me custom plays back so I can mitigate many of these problems.
And excited, will it be good or bad or just abit better or way worst.
The future is holding on the answer..😬🥺😄
IMO, the biggest change we'll likely notice first is a change in the 'look' of NHL.
It appears one of the areas that's stagnated is lighting adjustments. I don't know if it's the fault of the current engine or just the direction the presentation team is taking things, but I feel Frostbite will allow more dynamic lighting which could significantly change the appearance of the game right off the bat.
It does feel the NHL series is too 'perfect' with regards to how the ice and player models are lit up. Some more dynamic shading and possibly even some difference in lighting from arena to arena could bring a lot of life back to the series.
And excited, will it be good or bad or just abit better or way worst.
The future is holding on the answer..😬🥺😄
IMO, the biggest change we'll likely notice first is a change in the 'look' of NHL.
It appears one of the areas that's stagnated is lighting adjustments. I don't know if it's the fault of the current engine or just the direction the presentation team is taking things, but I feel Frostbite will allow more dynamic lighting which could significantly change the appearance of the game right off the bat.
It does feel the NHL series is too 'perfect' with regards to how the ice and player models are lit up. Some more dynamic shading and possibly even some difference in lighting from arena to arena could bring a lot of life back to the series.
Yup-Yup-Yup!
Thats exactly what makes me hot...
Just the color-deep on the ice.. Maybe you can see snow and 'scars' on the ice in a more realistic manner.
Face-scans.
The crowd.
The sound.
There’s so much more + then - when I think about it.
Replies
We've already seen the ramifications of EA forcing their dev studios into using the Frostbite engine: Anthem is a big one that comes to mind. The devs at Bioware complained about how hard and un-intuitive it was to make a third person looter-shooter MMORPG game in an engine that was purpose made for FPS games. One would think that the jump between those two would be smaller than the jump between FPS and friggin HOCKEY game, right? I can only see this leading to immense frustration from the folks at EASPORTS Vancouver and many, many bugs in the future.
All that and I haven't even mentioned how the people at DICE Sweden hate working with the Frostbite engine (and they're the ones who are using it how it was meant to be used!). Don't get me wrong... the Frostbite engine is absolutely amazing and has given me my favorite game series to date (BF) with some absolutely stunning graphics and insane vehicular combat... when it is working right.
I genuinely can’t believe EA is still taking the frostbite route with their games. It’s been documented how bad it is to work with, FIFA and Madden have both regressed because of it, yet they’re going to die on this hill huh?
Meanwhile, you see a game like PES where their engine is literally built for soccer and you have actual physics (not claimed or alleged physics) affecting the ball which is nothing short of amazing to experience. They have a plethora of animations in the game when it comes to passing and receiving the ball to ensure both auto passers and manual passers have a very fluid experience when passing.
The difference is night and day.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable for EA to get some ROI on the millions they’ve invested into developing Frosbite.
But I do agree a hockey specific engine would be amazing. However, creating an all new engine with the yearly development cycle would be impossible.
Agreed. Although the collaboration with the UFC development team was an indicator that there is still a priority for the NHL series to evolve in different ways.
Although I fear the move to Frostbite may remove some of the benefits we've seen with the locomotion engine, adopted from UFC.
I don't know enough about what's entailed with a move to Frostbite and what can/can't be carried over in terms of animation frameworks - but I hope the locomotion stuff sticks because it's definitely improved player animations and skating physics.
I mean, they clearly lack the desire to produce high quality sports titles so Frostbite will help the bottom line for pushing out gambling simulators with semi-okay sports games tacked on.
UFC is a superb game.
FIFA/Madden/NHL are high quality products. IMO - any game that gets daily play from thousands of users is high quality.
I think it's unfair to say that the development team doesn't care about putting out a high quality product.
Didn’t say the dev team, said the suits. The suits dictate the yearly release model and “high quality” is very subjective but I will say that both games are objectively NOT simulation games. Maybe they’re fun (well idk about fun either), “high quality” arcade games, but they are not high quality simulations.
I disagree. NHL is a high quality simulation. It's not perfect, but there isn't a single sports game that is.
MLB the Show is a high quality simulation that isn’t perfect. People complain about 90-man vs 115-man rosters, generated prospects not looking right in franchise mode, and some injury replacement/rotation confusing the CPU has. Those are nitpicking items.
NHL has defensemen literally stand still and let offensive players blow by for open passes. They can’t cycle to save their life, they prioritize random spots on the ice over the puck, and scoring revolves around simple one-timers and gliding at specific angles to pick a corner because shooting isn’t realistic.
We are FAR away from getting to The Show levels of nitpicking about generated prospect attire and minor personnel management items in NHL. It can be fun at times, sure. It’s not a simulation though.
Baseball is much easier to simulate, especially when most of the simulation is just numbers.
Hockey is such a different sport - comparing the two is not fair.
If you play it like a sim, it can be sim. If you play it like arcade hockey, it can be arcade hockey.
The tools are there to simulate the sport and it's the best version we've had to date.
The dev team determines how the game develops. There's no army of suits lurking over them. Like much of what people come up with on these forums, this is another inaccurate assumption.
I get that the show is easier, won’t disagree with you there, but if it’s easier, it makes sense that it’s a better sim right?
If you play it like a sim, it can occasionally look like hockey. Unfortunately, the AI struggle more at low speeds than high which right away makes for a lesser “sim” experience. Goalies still don’t play anything like their real life counterparts, the AI still get to break the physics engine and pickup pucks users can’t whenever convenient, and the in-zone positioning and movement of players is incredibly static and/or outdated compared to the real life sport.
It’s definitely EA’s best attempt, it definitely does some things the best of any hockey game ever, but also struggles on some fronts that other hockey games have done much better. This is the worst part because I still find goalies from 2k and the overall feel of unpredictability of 2k and NHL Hitz Pro to give me much more consistent fun than this game.
The sliders are there for sim gameplay, the AI however is not which is not fixable on my end. If only the AI for my team and the CPU’s were programmed the same and if only the CPU couldn’t cheat physics and puck pickups then the game would magically take another huge stride forward. Unfortunately, they get to keep doing 270 stop and starts without losing speed and my AI still don’t care about the puck compared to their AI counterparts which makes the game feel much more arcadey than it probably deserves. If I could play a human with my sliders, I’m sure it’d be a blast.
The lack of being able to play online with custom sliders, especially ones created by passionate users such as yourself, is a real tragedy, IMO.
And I agree with much of your assessment of the A.I. I've posted a lot of gifs outlining my hatred for some of their decisions for sure.
Yes I know you have. That’s my biggest gripe with the series. Like, I think AI deficiencies were way higher up on the “what makes gameplay frustrating” list than “realistic shooting animations” but bock of the box features sell games.
I just want my AI to do things like “ok” even 50% of the time. That’s my wish. Or give me custom plays back so I can mitigate many of these problems.
Yes I know you have. That’s my biggest gripe with the series. Like, I think AI deficiencies were way higher up on the “what makes gameplay frustrating” list than “realistic shooting animations” but bock of the box features sell games.
I just want my AI to do things like “ok” even 50% of the time. That’s my wish. Or give me custom plays back so I can mitigate many of these problems.
And excited, will it be good or bad or just abit better or way worst.
The future is holding on the answer..😬🥺😄
IMO, the biggest change we'll likely notice first is a change in the 'look' of NHL.
It appears one of the areas that's stagnated is lighting adjustments. I don't know if it's the fault of the current engine or just the direction the presentation team is taking things, but I feel Frostbite will allow more dynamic lighting which could significantly change the appearance of the game right off the bat.
It does feel the NHL series is too 'perfect' with regards to how the ice and player models are lit up. Some more dynamic shading and possibly even some difference in lighting from arena to arena could bring a lot of life back to the series.
Yup-Yup-Yup!
Thats exactly what makes me hot...
Just the color-deep on the ice.. Maybe you can see snow and 'scars' on the ice in a more realistic manner.
Face-scans.
The crowd.
The sound.
There’s so much more + then - when I think about it.
This can't be worst, it just cant!
<winces> I think I speak for everyone when I say we don't want to hear what "makes you hot" LOL