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TPS is very good. Don't change it EA, just iron out the kinks

Replies

  • Yes...(except online) depending on your connection.
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  • Imo TPS was so promising in NHL 13. I actually love how it felt that year and I was looking really forward where it headed.

    The problem is that now in 2017 the skating/animation/ai system not improved. I actually think that starting with 15 and "autodekes" it all works worse now, significantly worse.

    That's frustrating and mind blowing.
  • SaveUs2K wrote: »
    Imo TPS was so promising in NHL 13. I actually love how it felt that year and I was looking really forward where it headed.

    The problem is that now in 2017 the skating/animation/ai system not improved. I actually think that starting with 15 and "autodekes" it all works worse now, significantly worse.

    That's frustrating and mind blowing.

    I agree DJ. 13 was the best TPS game. If it weren't for the goaline goaies, that game would still be the best TPS game released. With that said, 13-15 old gen have all been substantially better than the three years of Alpha-build demos we've been given on the next-gen consoles lol...

    Yup this is very true, the old gen games were way better. TPS or pre TPS. Give me NHL11-Legacy with NHL17 graphics and I'm the happiest of campers.
  • djneohockey
    721 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Player switching worked better lastgen, that is another big one obviously.

    Also ai could pass the puck with various power/speed.. depending on teammate position.
    That's another big issue and something that has essential impact in any mode.
  • Bmh245
    905 posts Member
    Player switching worked better lastgen, that is another big one obviously.

    Player switching was better in the last-gen games. TPS worked better. And the defensive AI, at least in 1v1 modes, was better, too.

    When skating, switching, and AI have all gotten worse in the game, that's not a good sign.

  • Imo TPS was so promising in NHL 13. I actually love how it felt that year.
    The problem is that now in 2017 it's not improved.
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Player switching worked better lastgen, that is another big one obviously.

    Player switching was better in the last-gen games. TPS worked better. And the defensive AI, at least in 1v1 modes, was better, too.

    When skating, switching, and AI have all gotten worse in the game, that's not a good sign.

    That's the sign that the reason why the game is not really growing is not that it is too sim or arcade, but because its not good enough.

    And it won't change, unless it is really excellent representation of the sport. That will make the videogame FUN.
    Because hockey in the real world already is the most fun sport on the Earth, exactly as it is.

    You don't have to force it to something different, to make it "FUN".
    Do that and you only can screw that :)
  • Imo TPS was so promising in NHL 13. I actually love how it felt that year.
    The problem is that now in 2017 it's not improved.
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Player switching worked better lastgen, that is another big one obviously.

    Player switching was better in the last-gen games. TPS worked better. And the defensive AI, at least in 1v1 modes, was better, too.

    When skating, switching, and AI have all gotten worse in the game, that's not a good sign.

    That's the sign that the reason why the game is not really growing is not that it is too sim or arcade, but because its not good enough.

    And it won't change, unless it is really excellent representation of the sport. That will make the videogame FUN.
    Because hockey in the real world already is the most fun sport on the Earth, exactly as it is.

    You don't have to force it to something different, to make it "FUN".
    Do that and you only can screw that :)
    Imo TPS was so promising in NHL 13. I actually love how it felt that year.
    The problem is that now in 2017 it's not improved.
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Player switching worked better lastgen, that is another big one obviously.

    Player switching was better in the last-gen games. TPS worked better. And the defensive AI, at least in 1v1 modes, was better, too.

    When skating, switching, and AI have all gotten worse in the game, that's not a good sign.

    That's the sign that the reason why the game is not really growing is not that it is too sim or arcade, but because its not good enough.

    And it won't change, unless it is really excellent representation of the sport. That will make the videogame FUN.
    Because hockey in the real world already is the most fun sport on the Earth, exactly as it is.

    You don't have to force it to something different, to make it "FUN".
    Do that and you only can screw that :)

    I wouldn't say it isn't improved. I would say it is alot worse actually.
  • TPS got worse on the xbox one / ps4 generation
    EA SPORTS Challenge Series Finalist - Nobounds

  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    this has to be a joke.

    Nope. It's a great skating engine. There's momentum, man. You can't just turn. You have to turnnnnnn

    Yep. This is Hockey. Hockey has physics. You want to turn 90° without consequences. Play this:

    pac-man-championship-edition-20070606050611462-000.jpg

    I bet you that game is/can be a blast to play since "the game" doesn't decide randomly whether or not your controller input will translate accurately into the game situation.

    People can say what they want about TPS, but the fact of the matter is that if you don't have a PERFECT connection online it is a nightmare to deal with. When things go bad in the game for me it's almost always controller input related and only once in a while my opponent actually opening a can of whoop-**** on me, though some games it is more legitimate than others.

    I've seen both sides of this. I've had games where everything works as intended (and it's fun when it does) and then other games where NOTHING works as intended (game literally feels broken in every way.) Thing is there usually is no in-between with this, and the in-between is where EA SHOULD be aiming for here to make things fair.

    It would just be nice to play a game where skill is the deciding factor and not the internet connection, and obviously EA is not interested in that kind of game any more. FVCK everything else and make it fair and ABLE to control.

    Sooooooooo... The problem is the connection, not TPS. But you'd have them scrap TPS because you get sh*te connection all the time?

    Interesting problem solving skills there! "Hey, my cart wheel is lose, what am I gonna do?", "EH... Just shoot the horses! They're useless since they can't pull a broken cart around."
    well if its well known fact that ea games have huge lag/input delay issues, then there is no point having this overly complicated skating system that just adds to the input delay. simplify the skating and make it more responsive. be done with all the unnecessary animations. its well known fact in the video game industry, that you cant have realistic animations in video games without sacrificing responsiveness. i feel that is the problem. they try so hard to make super realistic animations that they lose the responsiveness in the prosess. best example i can give has to do with the goalies. first you flick the right stick then the goalie does the kick animation after that it moves. this is called anticipation movement it looks more realistic but just adds input delay.

  • sgiz1
    537 posts Member
    "Sooooooooo... The problem is the connection, not TPS. But you'd have them scrap TPS because you get sh*te connection all the time?

    Interesting problem solving skills there! "Hey, my cart wheel is lose, what am I gonna do?", "EH... Just shoot the horses! They're useless since they can't pull a broken cart around.""

    Until EA can give all paying customers the same gaming experience, yes they should scrap the problem (TPS) until they can get it right. Your thought good for me, sucks to be you is not the answer.
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    well if its well known fact that ea games have huge lag/input delay issues, then there is no point having this overly complicated skating system that just adds to the input delay. simplify the skating and make it more responsive. be done with all the unnecessary animations. its well known fact in the video game industry, that you cant have realistic animations in video games without sacrificing responsiveness. i feel that is the problem. they try so hard to make super realistic animations that they lose the responsiveness in the prosess. best example i can give has to do with the goalies. first you flick the right stick then the goalie does the kick animation after that it moves. this is called anticipation movement it looks more realistic but just adds input delay.

    Well that's just the thing, the animations in NHL 17 aren't realistic at all. Go watch a video of a hockey pro skating and then compare it to the skating animations of NHL 17. It's not even close.

    The range of movement a real hockey player has in real life is a million times MORE complicated than what we get to experience in this game. Yet in THIS game it feels clunky even though we can't even do half the things a real skater can do and you think it's because it's "TOO" realistic?

    The problem with the goalies when ou "flick the right" stick ins't that it's too realistic. If anything it's not realistic at all. I'm a goalie, I should know. More than half the things I see the goalies do in this game (whether it's human controlled or AI) I look at and go "What goalie would ever do that??". What goalie would swing their blocker like a golf club and completely whiff on a floater from the blue line on a consistent basis like the goalies do in NHL 17? Does it happen from time to time in real life where the goalie "muffs" a save? Sure... Does it happen with the frequency it happens in NHL 17? Definitely not!

    Goalies in the NHL have a goals against avg ranging from 2.00 to 3.00 facing between 27 up to 33 shots per game in full 60 minutes per game. Goalies in NHL 17 have GAA ranging from 3.80 to well over 5.00 facing an average of about 12-17 shots per game that are played in about 15 minutes (real time).

    Something's very WRONG here and it ain't the "realism"...
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    Actually, NBA 2K's gameplay is physics driven. Every year, they polish the engine even more to where it's now become difficult to notice the "seams" in between animation transitions, which used to be a dead giveaway in past versions.

    The limitations in what you can do come from real physical limitations rather than animations in NBA 2K, even though there are now thousands of different little animations for everything. That's what gives the game individuality. Labron James controls and plays differently than DeMar DeRozan who controls and plays differently than Kevin Durant. Not just because they have "different animations" but because they have different physical attributes like height and weight. Their speed, their dribbling ability, their agility and flexibility, their physical strength. Everything about a player in NBA 2K changes how you play with them.

    And yes, most of them have their own unique animations for things like jumpers, lay ups, dunks, crossovers, etc. Which means that you have to take the time to learn their particular move set to be effective with them. But that's just another layer of depth that makes NBA 2K such a great game.

    Compare that to NHL 17, every player skates the same. Every player looks the same. They all have "different" stats and attributes, but does it really matter? I can score and deke with as much success whether I control Crosby or if I'm controlling Turris... Whether I pick a Sniper or a Grinder in EASHL. It's all the same.
  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    NHL 2K worked... And we'd probably be playing that now if the 2K Sports hadn't decided to "EA" their game instead of sticking to the formula that made it popular.

    But like you yourself said: "We'll never get to know". EA will never have the audacity to try something so bold and revolutionary as to create a hockey game that's as true to life as it can be.
  • djneohockey
    721 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    TPS got worse on the xbox one / ps4 generation

    Well ya, the TPS in NHL 13 is the most advanced system. Quite ironic isn't?

    They only tried to make it more "accessable" years after, thus literally delete some really cool layers of the code and make this arcade/sim hybrid compromise that nobody really likes.
    Not sgiz1 and not me :)

    See.. direction lost right there.


  • VeNOM2099
    3178 posts Member
    How they tackled skating? Would you believe they actually had multiple skating animations depending on the player types? IIRC, there were three distinct groups: Regular Skaters, Power Skaters and Finesse Skaters.

    It was mostly limited to how they animated but you could VISUALLY notice a player by the way he was skating on the ice.

    What I loved about 2K8 was how different players had different ranges of stick control depending on the core dekeing attributes (which were tied into the player Type). The other thing that was amazing about 2K8 was the player/gm interactions during a season/franchise. So much depth put into the contract negotiations. It was a game in itself and you could spend hours just on that aspect of the game alone and it was SUPER fun!

    The controls were a little complicated, especially if you used the ADVANCED controls, but holy crap when you took the time to learn them, did it give you SO much control over your on ice avatar.

    Oh and the Goalies... Don't get me started on the amazing Goalies!

    I loved NHL 2K8!!
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