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EASHL Unplayable again. What a surprise.

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  • Follisimo wrote: »
    RSall14 wrote: »
    I'd like to know what changed from last gen to current in terms of connections. I never got delay from any of the last gen NHL games. Occasionally I would get fat man lag but that was when I used wifi. Back then fat man lag wasn't nearly as bad as it is now. You would still be able to play and compete. As soon as I switched to a wired connection I had no issues. Now with the current gen games I get delay if I don't play on the west servers.

    Pretty much new engines calculating more things with higher resolutions. The Ignite engine didn't last very long. If NHL goes to Frostbite it could help a tiny bit with the game being more smooth but overall it's just better eye candy ability.
    i would figure that only information going over the internet is what button your pressing at any given time and the rest is handled by you ps4 system on your end.
    on a side note: they really should go 60fps already. it would make the inputs so much more responsive. big problem in resent years has been the unresponsiveness of the controls. everything feeling clunky. fps should always go before graphics imo.

    Pretty sure it runs at 60fps. The real issue is on EA's end. They've already admitted to it and stated they have no idea how to fix it. This dates back to last year's game so don't expect them to fix it any time soon.

    Just don't buy the game if you're interested in playing online.

    is it really 60fps. it doesnt feel like it is. the amount of input delay is ridiculous at times.
  • Can anyone answer why my connection would go from my ISP to Redwood, then to Massachusetts, then back to Redwood?

    Because your DNS query returned with an IP that is advertised from a network in Redwood.

    Or are you in Redwood? Where are you and what are you trying to get to.... A URL?

    im in illinois, EA's Server that i ran a trace route was in Redwood California. So it went from illinois to Redwood, to Mass, and then finnally back to redwood.

    Hard to say without seeing it. Even then, may not be able to see if or why you are redirected. Got a trace example?
  • Follisimo wrote: »
    RSall14 wrote: »
    I'd like to know what changed from last gen to current in terms of connections. I never got delay from any of the last gen NHL games. Occasionally I would get fat man lag but that was when I used wifi. Back then fat man lag wasn't nearly as bad as it is now. You would still be able to play and compete. As soon as I switched to a wired connection I had no issues. Now with the current gen games I get delay if I don't play on the west servers.

    Pretty much new engines calculating more things with higher resolutions. The Ignite engine didn't last very long. If NHL goes to Frostbite it could help a tiny bit with the game being more smooth but overall it's just better eye candy ability.
    i would figure that only information going over the internet is what button your pressing at any given time and the rest is handled by you ps4 system on your end.
    on a side note: they really should go 60fps already. it would make the inputs so much more responsive. big problem in resent years has been the unresponsiveness of the controls. everything feeling clunky. fps should always go before graphics imo.

    Pretty sure it runs at 60fps. The real issue is on EA's end. They've already admitted to it and stated they have no idea how to fix it. This dates back to last year's game so don't expect them to fix it any time soon.

    Just don't buy the game if you're interested in playing online.

    is it really 60fps. it doesnt feel like it is. the amount of input delay is ridiculous at times.

    Can you get an fps counter on the Xbox and ps4?
  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    edited September 2017
    VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    Sinbin wrote: »

    I've tried to be helpful many times on these forums. However, I'm seen as a fanboy because I've taken the necessary steps to play lag free. It's just been my experience that my lag issues were on my end. I was able to resolve them myself.

    There are most definitely routers that max out at lower MBPS. When you get a higher speed connection, you need a DOCSYS 3 modem to handle higher speeds. That's why I suggested that.

    1st, you said ROUTER in the original post, not MODEM.

    2nd, your ISP decides what modem they give you, but not always what router you use for your network at home. DOCSYS and ADSL modems, when they first came out, were capable of maximum speeds of around 2-5 Mbps (download/upload), which is more than enough to play a game online.

    I was playing SF4 online with a puny 2 Mbps down, 1 Mbps up connection back in 2009 and it was just fine. Now I have a Fiber Optics VDSL connection at home (60/10), I still play SF4 and there is no difference in connection quality at least from my side. The times I have issues is due to the game's netcode which can sometimes be iffy due to high latency when opponents fight from a great distance appart.

    3rd, having a gaming router doesn't change much except that it can give you tools to manage your network a little better and so avoid a bottleneck that could potentially affect your online experience. But whether you have a 10 Mbps or 980 Mbps connection, your choice of router won't suddenly affect your connection quality all that much unless you have 20 devices at home, all streaming Netflix at the highest quality and downloading torrents at the highest bandwith possible.

    I have about 15 devices at home all connected to a simple non-gaming router. At any given time, there may be up to 8 devices connected simultaneously, at least 2 of them streaming Netflix movies. I can still play any game online, including NHL, without a problem. The only issue I've come up with is when my son decides to stream while I try to stream. I sadly don't have the upload to support 2 live streams (yet).

    If people have problems with connection to a game, it's either your telephone/cable lines or it's the game's netcode. If all other games are fine, it's not the router or modem or your lines. Chances are it's the game and its netcode that are the issue.

    You can replace the modem you get from your ISP with your own. That was the problem with my connection. Once I replaced it all my issues were resolved. Plus, you aren't paying to lease the equipment from your provider.

    I don't have a gaming router. It's a decent router, but several years old at this point and works just fine.

    What really bugs me is that people here blame netcode when they have no idea what that even is. They heard someone else make that assumption and repeated it. Then it gets out of control. The simple fact is that nobody here has any clue what the netcode is like since they don't have access to that code. It's just easy to blame when you don't know any better. I'm not saying that there is no issue with netcode. I couldn't tell you. I don't write netcode and I don't have access to the actual code to even check it. Wiki's netcode definition can give more information on what it actually is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netcode.
  • Can anyone answer why my connection would go from my ISP to Redwood, then to Massachusetts, then back to Redwood?

    That is a prime example of the poor netcode behind this game. There is no reason for it. Although I guess there could be reason for it if you were connected to the east coast servers, but imo no reason for you to be connected to those.

    Do a trace route for someone other than EA. You'll see your connection jump around all over. I might be wrong, but to my knowledge netcode doesn't determine the path your connection takes. It manages how that data is sent/recieved. Netcode is actually not even an industry term and was made up by the gaming community.
  • MartinScoresEZ
    42 posts Member
    edited September 2017
    Sinbin wrote: »

    You can replace the modem you get from your ISP with your own. That was the problem with my connection. Once I replaced it all my issues were resolved. Plus, you aren't paying to lease the equipment from your provider.

    What really bugs me is when people assume that what they did to fix their problems automatically will do the same for everyone. I bought my own good router and modem, have 150-200 download, 25 upload, port forwarding, switched ISP's, tried different TV's, even moved once. I've done everything imaginable to try and fix these problems, and the game still plays like absolute dog sh**. And it has for me since NHL '09. Maybe it's time to start blaming EA.
  • I think it has some control over the route. But that wiki page did raise one important question I forgot about that could easily be the source of all the problems.

    What is the tick rate of these servers? I remember bf4 was on a 10 tick server on launch and it was awful having similar problems to NHL. Csgo, a truly competitive game, has anywhere from 64 tick to 128 tick servers.

    A tick is when the server is updated with the client side game state. So 10 ticks the server is updated with the client 10 times every second. Now knowing that you can begin to see where the problems can arise in a game as fast as NHL or any shooters. The tick rate is really important.
  • B_Bunny
    888 posts Moderator
    Follisimo wrote: »
    RSall14 wrote: »
    I'd like to know what changed from last gen to current in terms of connections. I never got delay from any of the last gen NHL games. Occasionally I would get fat man lag but that was when I used wifi. Back then fat man lag wasn't nearly as bad as it is now. You would still be able to play and compete. As soon as I switched to a wired connection I had no issues. Now with the current gen games I get delay if I don't play on the west servers.

    Pretty much new engines calculating more things with higher resolutions. The Ignite engine didn't last very long. If NHL goes to Frostbite it could help a tiny bit with the game being more smooth but overall it's just better eye candy ability.
    i would figure that only information going over the internet is what button your pressing at any given time and the rest is handled by you ps4 system on your end.
    on a side note: they really should go 60fps already. it would make the inputs so much more responsive. big problem in resent years has been the unresponsiveness of the controls. everything feeling clunky. fps should always go before graphics imo.

    Pretty sure it runs at 60fps. The real issue is on EA's end. They've already admitted to it and stated they have no idea how to fix it. This dates back to last year's game so don't expect them to fix it any time soon.

    Just don't buy the game if you're interested in playing online.

    is it really 60fps. it doesnt feel like it is. the amount of input delay is ridiculous at times.

    Play offline lol, easy to see then
    PSN: B-Bunny
  • Sinbin wrote: »
    Can anyone answer why my connection would go from my ISP to Redwood, then to Massachusetts, then back to Redwood?

    That is a prime example of the poor netcode behind this game. There is no reason for it. Although I guess there could be reason for it if you were connected to the east coast servers, but imo no reason for you to be connected to those.

    Do a trace route for someone other than EA. You'll see your connection jump around all over. I might be wrong, but to my knowledge netcode doesn't determine the path your connection takes. It manages how that data is sent/recieved. Netcode is actually not even an industry term and was made up by the gaming community.

    "Netcode" of a game does not dictate IP routing. Your machines typically make a DNS query request, unless the program / app has an IP hardcoded so the machine / app already knows the destination. For DNS resolution requests, typically your ISP's DNS platform is used, unless you manually set it in you console or router to another IP (i.e. 8.8.8.8 which is Google's DNS). Then the DNS appliance sends back an actual IP address (single "A" for IPv4 and "AAAA" or "quad A" for IPv6). IP addresses of servers and machines on the internet are advertised from the local area network of which they reside using routing protocols such as BGP. So, in this case what IP address you get back from that DNS platform can determine which server you try to get to.

    Then you factor in possible tunnels and front end entry points for game traffic that may re-route via tunnels and you have a more complicated scenario.

    it's for these reasons and others that I always was skeptical of the "I blocked Ireland" workaround.

    And notice I used "netcode" in quotes.

    B)
  • Sinbin wrote: »

    You can replace the modem you get from your ISP with your own. That was the problem with my connection. Once I replaced it all my issues were resolved. Plus, you aren't paying to lease the equipment from your provider.

    What really bugs me is when people assume that what they did to fix their problems automatically will do the same for everyone. I bought my own good router and modem, have 150-200 download, 25 upload, port forwarding, switched ISP's, tried different TV's, even moved once. I've done everything imaginable to try and fix these problems, and the game still plays like absolute dog sh**. And it has for me since NHL '09. Maybe it's time to start blaming EA.

    the real issue is quantifying the problem.

    we hardly ever see video of a person using their controller and showing their screen and controller at the same time so people can see if the delay matches the complaints of others.

    then we never get much info... i.e. wired vs. wired, ISP. location, speedtests, latency tests, what has been bypassed, has the actual modem been logged into to check for frame errors, buffering... all that.

    unfortunately diagnosing latency issues is not typically tier 1 ISP helpdesk ****.
  • So let's stop talking about netcode and talk about something that for sure exists and has been known to be a source of delay related issues in other games.

    What is the tick rate of this games servers? @NHLDev
  • EASHL has been nigh unplayable ever since the introduction of the (useless) cookie cutter system. The games are sluggish, have all the pace of senior citizen on a YMCA walking track, and the skill of Timbits players during the intermission of your local Jr teams's games. Input lag has been there since forever, but really became a problem when they jumped to the "next gen" consoles.
  • Lol it honestly almost feels worse this year so far...cant tell if it's just the game speed turned to molasses though.

    i think the players just dont react as quick...this gives a more realistic feel as opposed to arcade-like style some are used to...game is harder which is better
  • mike50591 wrote: »
    Lol it honestly almost feels worse this year so far...cant tell if it's just the game speed turned to molasses though.

    i think the players just dont react as quick...this gives a more realistic feel as opposed to arcade-like style some are used to...game is harder which is better

    SIM!
  • mike50591 wrote: »
    Lol it honestly almost feels worse this year so far...cant tell if it's just the game speed turned to molasses though.

    i think the players just dont react as quick...this gives a more realistic feel as opposed to arcade-like style some are used to...game is harder which is better

    SIM!

    idk what SIM means but yes a lot of the time they make video games too easy and your controlled user players too impressive...that is not realistic...people need that instant gratification though (and still complain). hockey especially. this removes the arcade feel in my opinion. it should be a challenge.
  • B_Bunny
    888 posts Moderator
    Literally unplayable.
    PSN: B-Bunny
  • B-Bunny wrote: »
    Literally unplayable.

    It is if you don't own a console. Lol
  • It's the servers 100%. My friends and I bought the game on release day and were playing it. It was smooth. We were stunned. The game was responsive, fluent and overall enjoyable. Fast forward to last night and it now feels like you are skating in mud. Skaters feel like 280 lbs lineman out there with skates on. I haven't even brought up the fighting glitch or the timeless classic face-off loop. My goodness EA. Stop repackaging the same garbage and selling it to us!
  • Dan1mal33 wrote: »
    It's the servers 100%. My friends and I bought the game on release day and were playing it. It was smooth. We were stunned. The game was responsive, fluent and overall enjoyable. Fast forward to last night and it now feels like you are skating in mud. Skaters feel like 280 lbs lineman out there with skates on. I haven't even brought up the fighting glitch or the timeless classic face-off loop. My goodness EA. Stop repackaging the same garbage and selling it to us!

    right but.... nobody is forcing anyone to buy anything.

    Ayn-Rand-Quotes-13.jpg
  • Dan1mal33 wrote: »
    It's the servers 100%. My friends and I bought the game on release day and were playing it. It was smooth. We were stunned. The game was responsive, fluent and overall enjoyable. Fast forward to last night and it now feels like you are skating in mud. Skaters feel like 280 lbs lineman out there with skates on. I haven't even brought up the fighting glitch or the timeless classic face-off loop. My goodness EA. Stop repackaging the same garbage and selling it to us!

    right but.... nobody is forcing anyone to buy anything.

    Ayn-Rand-Quotes-13.jpg

    Awww cute my first encounter with a fanboy. Yes you are 100% correct. I guess I will have to not play hockey since there is no other hockey game on the market. Silly me and my high expectations. I suppose you are used to the mediocre garbage and have become numb to it?!
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