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NHL 20 Patch Details April 3rd

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EA, please fix your Face-Offs.

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Replies

  • Socair
    2296 posts Game Changer
    edited March 2018
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Lag actually has very little effect on faceoffs - even in laggy games, the more skilled person will win the vast majority of the faceoffs.

    As a west-coaster, I highly disagree with your lag assessment. If you have the trainer, sometimes you'll have a perfectly timed faceoff and still lose the majority of them. I also think there's momentum swings with the faceoff engine because there will be plenty of games where you can't win a faceoff to save your life against somebody and then you win the next 10 straight.

    I don't know how it works in EASHL, but in 1v1 modes this just is not true. In thousands of games, I've never played a game where I couldn't win a faceoff to save my life. I win less than 50% of my faceoffs maybe 1 out of every 20 games. And I deal with lag all the time.

    There's definitely a difference between EASHL and 1v1 modes. In 1v1 modes regardless of lag I can always win my share of faceoffs. In EASHL there will be some games where the only hope I have to win a face off is to make my attempt before I see the ref move. Basically I have to guess and pray.

    Not every game, but probably 1 out of 5 or so.
    Curious if it’s not the actual face off attribute of the centres in Versus/HUT as compared to the set attribute for the builds in EASHL. P2P/server connections aside, perhaps the higher face off attribute of certain “real” centres helps, as you would see in a single player mode. In EASHL everyone is the same.
    NHL Series Game Changer & Volunteer Moderator
  • Bmh245 wrote: »
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Lag actually has very little effect on faceoffs - even in laggy games, the more skilled person will win the vast majority of the faceoffs.

    As a west-coaster, I highly disagree with your lag assessment. If you have the trainer, sometimes you'll have a perfectly timed faceoff and still lose the majority of them. I also think there's momentum swings with the faceoff engine because there will be plenty of games where you can't win a faceoff to save your life against somebody and then you win the next 10 straight.

    I don't know how it works in EASHL, but in 1v1 modes this just is not true. In thousands of games, I've never played a game where I couldn't win a faceoff to save my life. I win less than 50% of my faceoffs maybe 1 out of every 20 games. And I deal with lag all the time.

    Yeah there's a huge difference between VS and Hut as opposed to EASHL. In Vs my faceoff percentage is I think around 65, in EASHL it's around 52 or something like that. Definitely feel the faceoffs work great in peer to peer connections.
  • Some people here get it others are just ea apologist that obviously have no idea what they are talking about.

    this started a few years back. Before that I was probably a 65-70% faceoff winner never below 50 unless I was having a laggy game.

    And yes lag does play a part, perfect timing has to be adjusted.

    Also the rock paper scissors game has been exactly the same for many years. And it used to be consistent yet now I'll lose to guys that are doing the wrong counter over and over. And then I'll switch it up and start doing the opposite of what I should and win 10 in a row.

    It's more about timing than anything else. And any penalty you get for moving early is minimal or glitchy. You should lose every time if you start spamming grip changes right before puck drop and I've seen guys win 75% doing exactly that... And no I'm not talking about them making me move early.

    all you need to know to be sure that faceoffs are glitchy is to watch a player let go of his controller and start winning faceoffs without doing anything. That's been happening for years.

    This year somehow seems better than last year. But still not good.
  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    BlahQGhozT wrote: »

    As a west-coaster, I highly disagree with your lag assessment. If you have the trainer, sometimes you'll have a perfectly timed faceoff and still lose the majority of them. I also think there's momentum swings with the faceoff engine because there will be plenty of games where you can't win a faceoff to save your life against somebody and then you win the next 10 straight.

    Timing is crucial, but there's more going on. Using the right counter is obviously important. In the case of versus/HUT, player ratings are also factored in. So, just because your timing is good it doesn't guarantee you'll get the win.

  • Since everyone has the same faceoff stat I'm curious which category trumps the other, grip or timing? I assume it's timing and grip gives a bonus.
  • Bmh245 wrote: »
    BlahQGhozT wrote: »
    What jmwalsh is describing is when a center is repeatedly flicking back n forth on RS causing a glitchy animation aka constant movement. An example of it can be seen below:



    There are other timings and movements that do similar actions, but you get the idea.

    Granted in the video the non glitchy center moves at the wrong time at the end, but IMO he should have won the faceoff in comparison to the other guy.

    For the glitchy center, I wouldn't categorize it as strategy. It's just spam that gives a weird animation that's distracting. That spamming shouldn't be able to win faceoffs.

    Come on. All you have to do to beat that strategy is to not move until the puck drops. That' s it. If you just ignore what the other guy is doing and focus on timing the faceoff correctly, you win. That's not hard to do.

    And generally speaking, faceoffs are one of the few parts of this game that aren't glitchy. If you know what you're doing, you'll consistently win 60-70% of your faceoffs. If two players who both know what they're doing play each other, faceoffs will split roughly 50-50 (with some allowance for pure luck). Lag actually has very little effect on faceoffs - even in laggy games, the more skilled person will win the vast majority of the faceoffs.

    Nah dude, that's the point of the post. If all you had to do against players who do this was stay still and time the ref as you'd do normally there wouldn't even be a post about this, at least from myself.

    I'll admit there are many players out there who do not know how to take faceoffs (knowing the counters, how to watch the ref, where to aim LS, judge lag, etc). I assure you I'm not one of those people.

    That line on
    Lag actually has very little effect on faceoffs - even in laggy games, the more skilled person will win the vast majority of the faceoffs.
    almost made me choke on my soda. If you're lagging, you're screwed on faceoffs as far as consistency goes no matter how good you are. You may win a few because you're trying so hard to anticipate the drop and get lucky or the other center messes up bad enough, other than that forget it. Ultimately you gotta depend on your team to be ready to be on the defensive most of the game.

    But I digress..... the point of my post, which was obviously missed, is that the mechanic is broken IMO (you have your opinion), and has been for many years, when it comes to moving / spamming before the faceoff. It should simply be an auto loss. In the event both centers are spamming or timing is off for both a more scrum / scramble type situation should occur.

    Few things can be added to faceoffs:

    1) Slap towards the boards (ala Crosby)
    2) Avoid / sidestep the faceoff and go straight for the dman to anticipate the 'loss'. Not the normal deke around attempt.
    3) The option to have another forward take faceoffs if you're having a bad go of it (maybe be able to switch once or twice per period)
    4) Maybe on the scrum idea you can still win it back by spamming RS down after the puck is dropped (like a second / third effort). Different builds would be better than others at this.

    We've had the same face off system for a long time. About time something got done to spice it up and make it more dynamic.
    BlahQz - Owner of WikkiD VI / D6 NatioN - Our EASHL games are available here on YouTube and Twitch!
  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    Since everyone has the same faceoff stat I'm curious which category trumps the other, grip or timing? I assume it's timing and grip gives a bonus.

    You need to choose a grip that counters your opponent's grip. Even if you do that, but your timing is bad, they can still win.
  • I learned the counters this year:

    Before: ~ 52 % FO won
    After: ~ 75 % FO won

    Don't tell me it's not important it changes everything and if I knew what opponent would do every time I would win over 90 %.
  • mikeq67
    109 posts Member
    If you dont think faceoffs are broken, youre lying to yourself.

    Definitely part of its connections issues which is annoying as hell but whatever. But there are also faceoffs where I dont hit a button and the kid im facing doesnt move early and I win the draw, and vice versa. The entire system needs to be redone. The fact that if I do one of the sticklift faceoffs the other team can intercept a clean win back before my dman can receive the puck is a joke. Total overhaul is necessary.
  • Sinbin wrote: »
    BlahQGhozT wrote: »

    As a west-coaster, I highly disagree with your lag assessment. If you have the trainer, sometimes you'll have a perfectly timed faceoff and still lose the majority of them. I also think there's momentum swings with the faceoff engine because there will be plenty of games where you can't win a faceoff to save your life against somebody and then you win the next 10 straight.

    Timing is crucial, but there's more going on. Using the right counter is obviously important. In the case of versus/HUT, player ratings are also factored in. So, just because your timing is good it doesn't guarantee you'll get the win.

    But what about literally perfect timing (where it's a guess through experience) and you're countering their faceoff? You literally can't time it any better AND you've chosen the right draw? Why are we losing these draws?
  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    Sinbin wrote: »
    BlahQGhozT wrote: »

    As a west-coaster, I highly disagree with your lag assessment. If you have the trainer, sometimes you'll have a perfectly timed faceoff and still lose the majority of them. I also think there's momentum swings with the faceoff engine because there will be plenty of games where you can't win a faceoff to save your life against somebody and then you win the next 10 straight.

    Timing is crucial, but there's more going on. Using the right counter is obviously important. In the case of versus/HUT, player ratings are also factored in. So, just because your timing is good it doesn't guarantee you'll get the win.

    But what about literally perfect timing (where it's a guess through experience) and you're countering their faceoff? You literally can't time it any better AND you've chosen the right draw? Why are we losing these draws?

    If you're talking about EASHL, everyone has the same rating so it would have to come down to countering and timing. Even though your timing might be perfect, you're talking about frames, which are an incredibly short amount of time. It's entirely possible your opponent beat you by a frame. That would still give the feeling of perfect timing when it wasn't as perfect as your opponent. Hopefully NHLDev can chime in here.
  • whats happening when you constantly win faceoffs by tying up pushing the opponent back but your players either don’t come in to pick it or do but they can’t get control and it just bounces off their stick right to the opponent? There’s definitely more then just skill involved.
  • I've practiced every face-off boys. It's the game.

    Lol this is one case where it is actually not the game. If you know counters and can compensate for any lag you may have then you can rule at faceoffs.
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