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Advice for Defenseman?

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  • jiajji wrote: »
    Sgt_Kelso wrote: »
    I wasn't giving advice, I was asking if this is really the best advice you can give about this game? Or is this advice that should be given about game that tries to simulate hockey?

    Maybe you should some advice then, since you seem to know how it should be done? How do you play defence? Especially in those modes where you play just the d-man?

    I did already, its clear you don't want to hear it.

    Here's an example of skill gap, where 1 team is hitting, using poke checks and dss successfully while not taking penalties, playing sound positional hockey & keeping the other team from scoring.

    Their opponents are probably here rn, asking for beta.

    I would to say I maybe watched the first 10 mins and I must say, all I saw was mindless hockey, defensive and offensive.

    Also all white uniforms? Hate it when people do that.
  • jiajji
    329 posts Member
    edited December 2018
    EpiCxOwNeD wrote: »
    jiajji wrote: »
    Sgt_Kelso wrote: »
    I wasn't giving advice, I was asking if this is really the best advice you can give about this game? Or is this advice that should be given about game that tries to simulate hockey?

    Maybe you should some advice then, since you seem to know how it should be done? How do you play defence? Especially in those modes where you play just the d-man?

    I did already, its clear you don't want to hear it.

    Here's an example of skill gap, where 1 team is hitting, using poke checks and dss successfully while not taking penalties, playing sound positional hockey & keeping the other team from scoring.

    Their opponents are probably here rn, asking for beta.

    I would to say I maybe watched the first 10 mins and I must say, all I saw was mindless hockey, defensive and offensive.

    Also all white uniforms? Hate it when people do that.

    I hate it when people do hot pink or neon green.

    Different strokes for different folks.

    Why does everyone feel the need to dump on people playing a video game though? I hate it when people do that. When Allstar said "how this Community has fallen" earlier in the thread, that's what I thought of, everyone feels the need to crap on others & chest pound to show how superior they are. Super lame.
    Post edited by jiajji on
  • jiajji wrote: »
    EpiCxOwNeD wrote: »
    jiajji wrote: »
    Sgt_Kelso wrote: »
    I wasn't giving advice, I was asking if this is really the best advice you can give about this game? Or is this advice that should be given about game that tries to simulate hockey?

    Maybe you should some advice then, since you seem to know how it should be done? How do you play defence? Especially in those modes where you play just the d-man?

    I did already, its clear you don't want to hear it.

    Here's an example of skill gap, where 1 team is hitting, using poke checks and dss successfully while not taking penalties, playing sound positional hockey & keeping the other team from scoring.

    Their opponents are probably here rn, asking for beta.

    I would to say I maybe watched the first 10 mins and I must say, all I saw was mindless hockey, defensive and offensive.

    Also all white uniforms? Hate it when people do that.

    I hate it when people do hot pink or neon green.

    Different strokes for different folks.

    Why does everyone feel the need to dump on people playing a video game though? I hate it when people do that. When Allstar said "how this Community has fallen" earlier in the thread, that's what I thought of, everyone feels the need to crap on others & chest pound to show how superior they are. Super lame.

    Now we agree on something. Unfortunately that's most online games now.
  • Check thisout. Jeeze this game is so broken.
    https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/livefromthe2150/video/65817066
  • NHLDev
    1669 posts EA NHL Developer
    Check thisout. Jeeze this game is so broken.
    https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/livefromthe2150/video/65817066

    That hurts to see stuff like that for sure. I don't personally know what leads to that as it isn't an always issue. If you have any more info of what they did in the replay state, or if they went to action tracker between periods, etc. I would be curious if we could track down exact repro steps.

    On a side note, it is a good video to show how often players are still getting pushed off the puck, even from behind since it is just a random gameplay clip and not cherry picked from my side to prove a point or anything.
  • jiajji wrote: »
    EpiCxOwNeD wrote: »
    jiajji wrote: »
    Sgt_Kelso wrote: »
    I wasn't giving advice, I was asking if this is really the best advice you can give about this game? Or is this advice that should be given about game that tries to simulate hockey?

    Maybe you should some advice then, since you seem to know how it should be done? How do you play defence? Especially in those modes where you play just the d-man?

    I did already, its clear you don't want to hear it.

    Here's an example of skill gap, where 1 team is hitting, using poke checks and dss successfully while not taking penalties, playing sound positional hockey & keeping the other team from scoring.

    Their opponents are probably here rn, asking for beta.

    I would to say I maybe watched the first 10 mins and I must say, all I saw was mindless hockey, defensive and offensive.

    Also all white uniforms? Hate it when people do that.

    I hate it when people do hot pink or neon green.

    Different strokes for different folks.

    Why does everyone feel the need to dump on people playing a video game though? I hate it when people do that. When Allstar said "how this Community has fallen" earlier in the thread, that's what I thought of, everyone feels the need to crap on others & chest pound to show how superior they are. Super lame.

    I didn’t mean “crap” on you. A lot of that 10 mins wasn’t much. You guys did make some good plays. At 1:15 when you guys grouped up to try to strip the puck away and some home three guys didn’t get the puck, that grinds my gears. He skated into guys and still got the puck. That’s what I meant by mindless hockey. He could have sent it around to his teammates, but because of how the game is, you can mindlessly skate through people without being fazed

    A lot of that 10 mins was sitting in corner and waiting for a backfoor feed that was forced through.

    Here’s a good tip. At 3:15, have your winter go behind the net and see if the dman chases. If he does chase it’s wide open back door.

    When one of the goals went in and someone said “how that get through” at 3:45, he wasn’t in good position to intercept the pass. His body wasnt facing the player with the puck. You were probably holding vision control and it did nothing. Happens to me too.

    There is a skill gap. Some teams are better at where to be and can anticipate plays. Then there’s another kind of skill gap. The kind in which who can rag the puck and bounce off hits and abuse mechanics. The Watermelons are no doubt quite good.

    On a side note, I’d rather have people wear bright neon green or pink than white. I’d least I can see those before I go blind.
  • I appreciate it but that's not my club, it's just a random video I found on YouTube.

    I'm kind of done talking about it, people seem to be getting heated over the discussion. I've been accused of both bickering & being stupid by two different people and I'm not into all that. Crap attracts flies I guess.
  • Best advice, don't play if you aren't hosting team. Sad but true.
  • https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/epicxowned/video/65954404

    How on Earth did he get that rebound? It’s like the puck magnetically went to his stick. If anyone can slow down the video. It’ll be helpful because I know for a fact that puck went right to him.
  • jiajji wrote: »
    If the Watermelons are considered “good” then this community has really dropped off lol. That was some of the worst virtual hockey I’ve ever watched.

    As for advice, the “less is more” approach is the best advice I’ve seen posted. I’m a from ESHL/Pro series D, the biggest issue I see with people struggling to get interceptions is they are moving too much and holding “LT”. Try it for yourself everyone, it’s been like this since TPS ruined the community seven years back. You have to feather LT and then let it go when you’re reading a pass coming through.

    My other big tip would be to get your skates on the shooter’s stock this year. In the beta due to everything being fast an exciting again, I was noticing that there were more situations where standing nearly still and feathering wasn’t a viable option against elite teams. I instead played very man-to-man in hopes to make the 1T whiff due to my skate positioning. That, along with feathering LT when I was in good enough position to use that tool to force interceptions gave me very good results.

    What is clearly missing from the beta is the strategy to finish checks in the corner. Nerfing the hitting really took a tool that’s used very commonly in real-life away from the Dmen and that was finishing checks. With the hitting how it is now, I couldn’t recommend that strategy, but it certainly was a viable one during the beta which lead to the most memorable, exciting gameplay I’d seen in this series since 2011.

    Last tip, don’t chase outside the dots. It’s not worth it with the new glide and tickle tuners. Stay patient inside the dots like a pylon and just feather LT to pick off the pass. This game has returned to the same stale, mundane gameplay that everyone has mastered since 16 and it’s made defense repetitive and easy again.

    The beta actually had a skill gap because people who passively poked and face huge gaps were absolutely shredded by forwards using LT and quick passing. Never seen so many fast-paces, high action 6s games in my life than in the ESHL scene during the beta. Sad that this game was ruined only months after.

    Nobody said the team was good, but they were experiencing success. It's funny how all of the old gen players think they're better than everyone else though, as if ajrockers didn't figure skate his way through 11

    It has nothing to do with being an “old-gen” player, it just has to do with being around the “elite” players. Weirdly enough, no matter how you tune the game the same people will be elite. NHL 19 was the first year that I saw the “elite” actually have a distinct skill gap between them due to the quickness and necessity to pass and make decisions quickly. This game became so much more mental and “Hockey IQ” based than thumbskill-based than ever before and it was due to the effective body checking.

    I get tired of reading arguments that try to justify the hitting nerf by saying “it still works” then cherry-picking a video where hitting works when lining some terrible player up in a public match. Hitting was nerfed and nerfed hard. If you play with the “elite” players, you would’ve noticed how some of the really top-tier teams struggled in the beta due to their go-to plays that required wiggling and gliding being negated. You saw passive dmen get eaten alive but good puck handlers because it lead to lots of trips. This game for once promoted man-to-man, tight-gap defense with lots of physicality to be successful and the passive players weren’t told to “adapt” or “get gud.”

    I’m a defensemen at the highest level, have been since last-gen and have been successful in every iteration which I only bring up to satisfy the “you’re only good because of” arguments that usually pop-up. I’ve played passively for years with success, but man was this beta such a breath of fresh air. Different meta, more realistic physicality imo, and a game where knowing hockey might’ve been your best assets at the top-level. To have all of that ruined in two months then justify it with less then impressive videos against players than can barely protect the puck effectively just seems like a tired argument to me.

    Totally agree with this.
  • ExSnake01 wrote: »
    It seems pass interceptions have been toned down with the tuner but the AI goalie stopping these have increased by a lot. Once in a while, I also see AI players poke checking. This was something I didn't see much in 1.0 tuner.

    Are you sure you see AI poke checking? I ask because EA have said on several occasions that they completely disabled all AI defensive maneuvers like hitting, lifting, and poking.

    Yes they nerfed AI involvement but not for EASHL. Only the other 1vs1 modes.
  • MooseHunter10
    402 posts Member
    edited January 2019
    NHLDev wrote: »
    The devs have confirmed that you are not eligible for an interception / puck pickup if youre in another animation, so pretty much this.
    That seems to be twisting something that was said before. I have seen people say you can't be skating backwards and intercept the puck. You can definitely do that and it happens all the time.

    There are some positions in stops and pivots that limit your abilities due to the differences in what you are trying to do and the physical position you are in but overall, you should be able to blend into a pickup/interception as long as you have enough reaction time when looking at the pucks relative speed to you and the angle/position it is passing you in. Your players ratings will play into this calculation as well so you will see way more inteceptions in EASHL with a two way forward or defensive defenseman than you will a sniper or offensive defensemen for example.

    A steady backwards coast isn't a problem, nor small intermittent feathered movements, but it seems that during any animation where your feet would be kicking up snow (turning, stopping, accelerating), you aren't able to gain possession that wasn't meant for you. I would assume complaints about no interceptions while backskating included using backwards crossovers to enter the pucks path.

    My experience & bias is that the automated successes favour the offensive team, while all the responsibility to control skating movements perfectly are on the defensive team. Is this that offensive players have less frames in their blends? Don't require a reaction check before triggering the blend?


    Why shouldn't DSS have all the automated benefits of the L2+Up auto-onetimer, no matter how out of control your skating is?

    I've adapted to what I think the game wants from me, and play a very collapsed and stationary defensive zone, taking no risks in the NZ.
    Post edited by MooseHunter10 on
    EASHL player
  • At the end of this clip (around 20 sec). There's an example of backskating stopping an intercept from happening.


    If I had let go of L2, I would probably have stopped that puck.
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