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NHL 20 Content Update October 25th


Check out our CHEL notes with our October Patch update here.

BETA TUNER DETAILS + FEEDBACK THREAD

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  • After 3 days playing this tuner I like it more and more every time I play.

    I feel as if any goal that is scored on me I'm always at fault and could have prevented it. There is not really any cheese that I've seen in versus or 6's. A lot of the games feel like how an NHL game would play out, and some real nice goals to go with it.

    Devs I really hope this is similar to the next patch / tuner because it feels and plays like hockey. It's also great fun to play and doesn't feel like a chore.
  • This doesn't really feel like the beta that I remember. Who knows if that's due to my brain or the changes in patches. But I would still say I prefer this tuner to the gameplay that 1.03 encouraged. Anyway let's get into the specifics. My views are all based on 6v6 drop in or eashl and I play all skater positions.

    Skating- I'm not sure I actually notice a difference in speed, agility or acceleration.

    Pokes- In the games I've played they seem to cause more penalties even if you hit the puck first, I preferred the 1.03 pokes.

    Sticklifts- Same thoughts I had in the original beta, the effectiveness is fine but there should be a cooldown or something so you cant spam them add infinitum. Overall though I prefer beta version because it's at least an option.

    Hitting- I like the bumps stopping the raggers in the corner, cant stress this enough. I like that idiot's that try to skate straight through somebody get destroyed like they should. Overall I prefer the beta hitting but I'd like to see a couple things addressed:
    1. Losing the puck behind you when hit from behind. I'm not asking for "low relative speed hits" to be negated, that phrase makes me want to beat puppies. I'm even ok with a stumble when hit from behind by a bigger guy, I just very specifically hate when you throw the puck 180 degrees across your momentum as a reaction.
    2. Stun lock. Once you catch a guy for a bump you can literally check him forever until somebody comes to take the puck away and even keep going if you feel like it. Not sure if I want it to be interference once the puck is possessed by another player or somehow made less effective after the first hit (without recreating the invincible bubble) but it needs to be addressed somehow.

    Game speed- I dont see a difference between now and 1.03 but I felt like the original beta was 10-15% quicker movement and really liked how it rewarded quick decisions. Maybe its server load or I just imagined it. Maybe Ben could answer if there have been any overall game speed changes.

    Everything else- Goalies seem less likely to fall for the usual glitches but maybe fall for some new ones that are harder to get to the right spot to pull off. Shooting and passing feel the same.

    Overall the differences are subtle except for the obvious being the bumps off the puck. I'd like to see corrections to the issues mentioned for checking, pokes trip less after puck contact and a limit to sticklift spam but I prefer the gameplay of the beta tuner. Putting and end to the puck-rag army in favor of teamwork makes for a much more fun experience.
  • HandsomeCatf1sh
    1687 posts Member
    edited January 21
    jrago73 wrote: »
    This doesn't really feel like the beta that I remember. Who knows if that's due to my brain or the changes in patches. But I would still say I prefer this tuner to the gameplay that 1.03 encouraged. Anyway let's get into the specifics. My views are all based on 6v6 drop in or eashl and I play all skater positions.

    Skating- I'm not sure I actually notice a difference in speed, agility or acceleration.

    Pokes- In the games I've played they seem to cause more penalties even if you hit the puck first, I preferred the 1.03 pokes.

    Sticklifts- Same thoughts I had in the original beta, the effectiveness is fine but there should be a cooldown or something so you cant spam them add infinitum. Overall though I prefer beta version because it's at least an option.

    Hitting- I like the bumps stopping the raggers in the corner, cant stress this enough. I like that idiot's that try to skate straight through somebody get destroyed like they should. Overall I prefer the beta hitting but I'd like to see a couple things addressed:
    1. Losing the puck behind you when hit from behind. I'm not asking for "low relative speed hits" to be negated, that phrase makes me want to beat puppies. I'm even ok with a stumble when hit from behind by a bigger guy, I just very specifically hate when you throw the puck 180 degrees across your momentum as a reaction.
    2. Stun lock. Once you catch a guy for a bump you can literally check him forever until somebody comes to take the puck away and even keep going if you feel like it. Not sure if I want it to be interference once the puck is possessed by another player or somehow made less effective after the first hit (without recreating the invincible bubble) but it needs to be addressed somehow.

    Game speed- I dont see a difference between now and 1.03 but I felt like the original beta was 10-15% quicker movement and really liked how it rewarded quick decisions. Maybe its server load or I just imagined it. Maybe Ben could answer if there have been any overall game speed changes.

    Everything else- Goalies seem less likely to fall for the usual glitches but maybe fall for some new ones that are harder to get to the right spot to pull off. Shooting and passing feel the same.

    Overall the differences are subtle except for the obvious being the bumps off the puck. I'd like to see corrections to the issues mentioned for checking, pokes trip less after puck contact and a limit to sticklift spam but I prefer the gameplay of the beta tuner. Putting and end to the puck-rag army in favor of teamwork makes for a much more fun experience.

    So basically you want tuner 1.01
    I’d be fine with that as well.
  • CMBDeadly wrote: »
    I really prefer this tuner, skating without the puck is finally where it should be. However, I do want to see a slight bump in speed for the puck carrier. As stated by others earlier, and as a defensemen myself, we are overpowered at the moment in our ability to make a play and then catch back up while the skater is set at a certain speed. This Tuner especially in vs is better about it than EASHL, however. I would love for their to be a consequence for letting a speedy winger who is breaking into the zone if they get side by side with somebody to sometimes blow past them since they have more speed than a just accelerating defensemen. The puck is too easy to poke off a lot of the time as well. We should have to make a good positional and defensive play rather than just chucking our stick somewhere to break up every shot and pass attempt.

    In the NHL players can avoid extended sticks to get their passes and shots off, but at the moment it's entirely too easy for shots to get suppressed when it just doesn't happen in the same contextual sense as the NHL.

    The offense needs to feel like a weapon and the defense needs to feel like a shield they should both not be swords because defense in the current NHL aren't built to be just defensive players. This series continuing to mold itself to that mindset is part of the issue. Defenses in the current NHL are not shot suppressors and it's time we stop treating them as such.

    In the NHL they chip and chase because they actually can't avoid those pokes and lifts if they're straight-lining into the zone.

    Personally I think carrier speed is fine. A carrier will slow down considerably while trying to do anything other than straight-lining.
  • After playing the beta tuner without reverting the patches, I have to say I preferred 1.03 except for the change to low speed collisions. This is from the perspective of a full time EASHL Defenseman.

    I wanted the beta back, but without reverting the patch changes (specifically to agility), no thanks.
  • Bring back the 1.03 tuner for human goalies please. All those positive changes made for human goalies back to square 1 now. Literally feels like playing goalie mode in NHL 17 now, the invisible barrier near the goal posts are back again. If you guys are planning on keeping the beta tuner, at least bring back all the changes that were made for human goalies.

    I kinda of stopped playing now and just waiting for them to get rid of this tuner since I only play goalie mode. Just make a new tuner with everything what the position players want, but bring back the changes made for goalies. 1.03 felt so much better to play goalie mode. This tuner brought back NHL 17 goalie mode where you cant even go near the goal posts without hugging it.
  • After playing the beta tuner without reverting the patches, I have to say I preferred 1.03 except for the change to low speed collisions. This is from the perspective of a full time EASHL Defenseman.

    I wanted the beta back, but without reverting the patch changes (specifically to agility), no thanks.

    You really felt more agile in 1.03? What build do you use?
  • 6 games played in EASHL CLUB. Awesome. Keep this + future tweaks, but WELL DONE.
  • barrett098 wrote: »
    Bring back the 1.03 tuner for human goalies please. All those positive changes made for human goalies back to square 1 now. Literally feels like playing goalie mode in NHL 17 now, the invisible barrier near the goal posts are back again. If you guys are planning on keeping the beta tuner, at least bring back all the changes that were made for human goalies.

    I kinda of stopped playing now and just waiting for them to get rid of this tuner since I only play goalie mode. Just make a new tuner with everything what the position players want, but bring back the changes made for goalies. 1.03 felt so much better to play goalie mode. This tuner brought back NHL 17 goalie mode where you cant even go near the goal posts without hugging it.

    yea goalie changes need to be reverted
    ..at least human goalie wise
  • barrett098 wrote: »
    Bring back the 1.03 tuner for human goalies please. All those positive changes made for human goalies back to square 1 now. Literally feels like playing goalie mode in NHL 17 now, the invisible barrier near the goal posts are back again. If you guys are planning on keeping the beta tuner, at least bring back all the changes that were made for human goalies.

    I kinda of stopped playing now and just waiting for them to get rid of this tuner since I only play goalie mode. Just make a new tuner with everything what the position players want, but bring back the changes made for goalies. 1.03 felt so much better to play goalie mode. This tuner brought back NHL 17 goalie mode where you cant even go near the goal posts without hugging it.

    yea goalie changes need to be reverted
    ..at least human goalie wise

    Ya keep this tuner for skaters...but patch back all the improvements that were made for human goalies.
  • After playing the beta tuner without reverting the patches, I have to say I preferred 1.03 except for the change to low speed collisions. This is from the perspective of a full time EASHL Defenseman.

    I wanted the beta back, but without reverting the patch changes (specifically to agility), no thanks.

    You really felt more agile in 1.03? What build do you use?

    DD
  • Ive been playing this tuner a lot and i usually place top 50 in CS and HUT champs every event and have friends who are also top and agree with me

    1. Please leave skating how it is! its amazing
    2. Tune down the bumping on defence a bit its kinda OP now
    3. Revert the goalies back to how they were on 1.03 , they were fine if you know to how play defence
    4. Fix Passing IQ
    5. Keep line energy the same or lower it a bit
  • VeNOM2099
    2595 posts Member
    edited January 21
    barrett098 wrote: »
    Bring back the 1.03 tuner for human goalies please. All those positive changes made for human goalies back to square 1 now. Literally feels like playing goalie mode in NHL 17 now, the invisible barrier near the goal posts are back again. If you guys are planning on keeping the beta tuner, at least bring back all the changes that were made for human goalies.

    I kinda of stopped playing now and just waiting for them to get rid of this tuner since I only play goalie mode. Just make a new tuner with everything what the position players want, but bring back the changes made for goalies. 1.03 felt so much better to play goalie mode. This tuner brought back NHL 17 goalie mode where you cant even go near the goal posts without hugging it.

    Strange... I thought most of the goalie changes came inside the patches, not the tuner. Especially one of the most recent ones that saw the blending of post hugging/VH into and out of the posts be much more fluid and responsive. I think the only change that affected goalies with the rollback was their pass aim assist is back to being a tad too high (holding LEFT to pass, but puck instead goes right up the middle to an opponent's stick). Maybe @NHLDev can confirm, but I haven't felt any significant changes to the goalies with the rollback, though granted I haven't played goalie as often as I used to, though the times I did it was the same ol' scenario of being only as good as the players in front of me allow me to be.

    That said I think I'm done playing this game for a while, again. It was... interesting (to say the least) to get back into it after a long while of inactivity. I went in with low expectations and I can't say I'm too surprised at my experience with the game for the past week or so. It hasn't deviated much from what I remember, namely the brainless, skill-less offense that is so readily rewarded, while defense takes so much discipline and skill for much less rewards. Goaltending is slightly worse off than defense still, in that we have much less "manual" control over our actions, yet we also get punished severely for our teammates mistakes on top of mistakes we may make.

    It was also interesting to see people's varying reactions to the changes the rollback had on gameplay. Especially people in stream chats! LOL!!

    My feedback on the rollback tuner survey is going to remain largely unchanged from what I said for the PRE-rollback survey. Namely that the game needs a better skating engine tuning (less 360° movement, more agility when changing direction), better tools for defense and goaltending, and a slight nerf to the offense which has traditionally been overpowered in EA Hockey.

    The game is not beyond saving at this point. Let's see what happens for here on out.
    YouTube: VeNOM3099
    Twitch: twitch.tv/venom3099

  • I just want to say that this community really showed up for this. There's no question that although some of us debate endlessly about what should be in the game, how mechanics should work, what's 'hockey' and whatnot, we can all still come together and put significant changes to the test and have quality discussions surrounding the impact of those changes.

    If anything, the reversion to beta has proven that although we all have our disagreements and maybe get a little passionate in our discussions, every single one of us just wants an awesome hockey game and that's really it. We all share in that mentality and it's nice to see it on display.

    I think everyone has pretty much covered most things in this thread. I don't want to re-iterate anything, so I'll stick to a couple of things I've noticed.

    1. Changes to DSS

    In this example (Pre-Beta Tuner) I am able to use DSS to discourage the player from making a play by sticking out DSS and forcing him outside:

    mQjnzey.gif

    Similar example Post-Beta, and it seems as though the amount of distance required between you and the puck carrier so as to NOT get a penalty, has increased:

    L2qyt6x.gif

    I believe this should be reigned in a little to act more like what happened in GIF 1. I should still be required to use DSS as to not trip, but I should be given some frames to ensure my stick doesn't cross the body or touch the puck carrier. With the Beta tuner, it seems as though there's no room for error at all. I'd like to see this changes as it encourages proper use of DSS.

    2. Stick Breaks & Error-prone Game State

    I feel the stick break introduces an 'error' to your team in the 'game state'. I feel when this happens, your team is suddenly more error-prone than normal. I think this is demonstrated in this gif where the stick breaks - introducing an 'error-prone' state my team, and the player in the front of the net who should EASILY possess the puck (or at least have enough awareness to shovel the puck to the corner) attempts to get the puck but it seemingly goes right through him:

    cPsZ1H3.gif

    Speaking of an error-prone game state - here is another clip where it seems my opponent's team is stuck in a state where they cannot interact with the puck. I took this clip because as I noticed that he was unable to switch players and/or his CPU player just couldn't interact with that puck at all, I said out loud to myself, "I'm going to score on the next shot I take".

    I could sense that something was amiss here and I truly believed I would score on my next shot. I took a random shot with Connor - which was blocked - but the puck fell right on Wheeler's stick and I decided to just hit shoot again:

    omNDUkX.gif

    Here is another scenario where I believe this error-prone state (EPS) is introduced to Tampa Bay after the goalie gives up a 'rebound' (which is really a mishandled dump-in). Nobody on Tampa can handle the puck after this 'error' is made, and I score on my next shot:

    24Lae1w.gif


    When scenarios play out like the ones above, I definitely understand why people would cry Ice-Tilt.

    I am not sure if the beta tuner introduces more "error-prone" states to teams that make mistakes, but if this is the case, I'd like to see those states become less obvious.

    I could be way out to lunch here and I don't want anyone to think I'm on the side of people who claim 'ice tilt' - but this reversion is tuners has made me hyper vigilant for things - and the idea of an 'error-prone' state being put on your team seems likely considering the above scenarios.


    Own goals on defense have already been discussed, but I wanted to add some GIFs to showcase this as I feel this has increased significantly since the beta tuner was released:

    aa014Ac.gif

    srX2iBV.gif










  • Own goals on defense have already been discussed, but I wanted to add some GIFs to showcase this as I feel this has increased significantly since the beta tuner was released:

    srX2iBV.gif

    The biggest problem with the new tuner, to me, is the crazy bounces the puck takes - it's basically a pinball game out there much of the time. I think that accounts for some of the own goals, like in the gif above - that "bounce" off the D-man's stick looks totally unrealistic. Same with the bounce off the goalie's glove on the dump-in GIF. It all just adds another layer of randomness that this game does not need.

  • VeNOM2099
    2595 posts Member
    edited January 21
    Bmh245 wrote: »
    Own goals on defense have already been discussed, but I wanted to add some GIFs to showcase this as I feel this has increased significantly since the beta tuner was released:

    srX2iBV.gif

    The biggest problem with the new tuner, to me, is the crazy bounces the puck takes - it's basically a pinball game out there much of the time. I think that accounts for some of the own goals, like in the gif above - that "bounce" off the D-man's stick looks totally unrealistic. Same with the bounce off the goalie's glove on the dump-in GIF. It all just adds another layer of randomness that this game does not need.

    I disagree... I think a bit of randomness adds a little bit of tension to the gameplay. But plays like in that GIF... I know Ben hates it when I use this, but that's what I mean by something being "contrived". Like I know that it is simply the game reacting to the objects and applying the "real time" physics engine to resolve the action, but sometimes in order to get something closer to realism, you need to manipulate it. Like at that point, instead of the puck hitting the stick and ricocheting like banked bullet into the net, maybe have the game have the stick "absorb" the puck and then animate the d-man trying to bat the puck down onto the ice.

    I know, it would probably be more "contrived" to do it that way (ironically), but it would be the less frustrating of the scenarios for both players.

    Oh, and I had this discussion with a moderator on Realmiviens stream last night and as I said to him, goals like these where players are "accidently" bopping the puck into the net were happening before the rollback tuners. I used to have like at least a good dozen clips on my account alone of pucks being knocked into the net by the goalie (me) or my d-men or my forwards. And funny how the pucks were always being knocked backwards into the net and almost never away from the net... :expressionless:
    YouTube: VeNOM3099
    Twitch: twitch.tv/venom3099

  • VeNOM2099 wrote: »
    barrett098 wrote: »
    Bring back the 1.03 tuner for human goalies please. All those positive changes made for human goalies back to square 1 now. Literally feels like playing goalie mode in NHL 17 now, the invisible barrier near the goal posts are back again. If you guys are planning on keeping the beta tuner, at least bring back all the changes that were made for human goalies.

    I kinda of stopped playing now and just waiting for them to get rid of this tuner since I only play goalie mode. Just make a new tuner with everything what the position players want, but bring back the changes made for goalies. 1.03 felt so much better to play goalie mode. This tuner brought back NHL 17 goalie mode where you cant even go near the goal posts without hugging it.

    Strange... I thought most of the goalie changes came inside the patches, not the tuner. Especially one of the most recent ones that saw the blending of post hugging/VH into and out of the posts be much more fluid and responsive. I think the only change that affected goalies with the rollback was their pass aim assist is back to being a tad too high (holding LEFT to pass, but puck instead goes right up the middle to an opponent's stick). Maybe @NHLDev can confirm, but I haven't felt any significant changes to the goalies with the rollback, though granted I haven't played goalie as often as I used to, though the times I did it was the same ol' scenario of being only as good as the players in front of me allow me to be.

    That said I think I'm done playing this game for a while, again. It was... interesting (to say the least) to get back into it after a long while of inactivity. I went in with low expectations and I can't say I'm too surprised at my experience with the game for the past week or so. It hasn't deviated much from what I remember, namely the brainless, skill-less offense that is so readily rewarded, while defense takes so much discipline and skill for much less rewards. Goaltending is slightly worse off than defense still, in that we have much less "manual" control over our actions, yet we also get punished severely for our teammates mistakes on top of mistakes we may make.

    It was also interesting to see people's varying reactions to the changes the rollback had on gameplay. Especially people in stream chats! LOL!!

    My feedback on the rollback tuner survey is going to remain largely unchanged from what I said for the PRE-rollback survey. Namely that the game needs a better skating engine tuning (less 360° movement, more agility when changing direction), better tools for defense and goaltending, and a slight nerf to the offense which has traditionally been overpowered in EA Hockey.

    The game is not beyond saving at this point. Let's see what happens for here on out.

    I've actually found a big difference on that. Me and a buddy of mine who used to play a lot of twos did some club last night and we won four out of five games. Normally we go one out of five or two out of five because we get cheesed to death. But we were able to actually defend last night. Different people have different experiences I suppose
  • I was always under the impression that only the tuners were being rolled back.

    Patches would remain.

    If you honestly thought EA was going to unpatch their game to 1.00 - you may have been mistaken, not misled.

    EA's been pretty clear that this was always going to be a tuner adjustment, not an adjustment of actual game code.

    You even said yourself that going back to previous versions was a bad idea. You asked if I was ok with all the tripping calls we would get, etc. You were clearly not speaking like someone who knew these fixes would remain and only tuners would be reverted.
  • LeFury_27 wrote: »
    Is it just me or are goalies still weak as hell on short side goals? I mean I've seen a lot less of them but they still go in real easy from what I've seen.

    Short side is still very money. Breakaway goals are still the same as last week. These AI goalies are not the beta goalies.
  • I was always under the impression that only the tuners were being rolled back.

    Patches would remain.

    If you honestly thought EA was going to unpatch their game to 1.00 - you may have been mistaken, not misled.

    EA's been pretty clear that this was always going to be a tuner adjustment, not an adjustment of actual game code.

    You even said yourself that going back to previous versions was a bad idea. You asked if I was ok with all the tripping calls we would get, etc. You were clearly not speaking like someone who knew these fixes would remain and only tuners would be reverted.

    What? I did say going back was a bad idea and I was clearly wrong about that in some areas of this game.

    I never EVER said the game code would revert - anyone who assumed that doesn't understand the relationship between tuners and patches.

    Patches = Changing of actual game code
    Tuners = Changing of internal 'sliders' that have significant changes to gameplay

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