EA Forums - Banner

This is the type of game breaking stuff you absolutely need to reduce EA...

Prev134
Ka1serSoz3
64 posts Member
edited July 2019
And this has nothing to do with losing. In fact I didn’t lose all these games (just four of the five lol). But the way the goalies are tuned just makes the game teeter on unplayable.

We’ve been harping on this for far too long now. These aren’t random occurrences, they happen way too often. I’m not saying these types of goals should never occur, I’m saying the frequency of these goals should be reduced by A LOT. These clips are from just 5 of my last 7 games! And yes that McDavid wrist shot was a goal even though I messed up on recording it properly.

Could I have defended better? I don’t know. On that breakaway yes sure. Did I make some mistakes? Yes but the mistakes didn’t lead to any seriously threatening attacks from my opponents.



You guys need to stop this stuff from being so prominent in your gameplay going forward. It is seriously game breaking.
Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on

Replies

  • Kuus2
    213 posts Member
    Try less offensive pressure and take a breath when you get the puck in your D-zone.
  • I agree that the game lets in weak goals after people outplay opponents more frequent than i would like or accept No doubt ! However, as far as your video goes thats not what i meant. Thats a combination of bad defence on your part mostly.
    Im talkin about weak backhand wristers without momentum etc on good goalies.
  • Why all the complaining? We're getting a BATTLE ROYAL mode!!!! This forum should be full of excitement from the huge amount of the fanbase that has been asking for the mode for years!

    No but seriously, your issue isn't getting fixed.
  • Obviously some of these are pretty brutal goals, but the thing that probably irks me the most is the type of play that happens 24 seconds in. The goalie shouldn't be reacting to slow, long passes coming at him... at all. Just stay on your feet like you're supposed to and make the save/deflection when it gets to you. It just looks so silly, and human and AI goalies alike get burned by it.
    Casual goalie gameplay: https://t.co/tQnYxAsyKy
  • The goalies were good during the beta and little sometime after release but there was to many complaints from some of the elite streamers that the goalies were to hard to score on so they dumbed them down
  • Well then let the elite streamers buy the game and thats it. Either they cater to the majority or take a hit.
  • Follisimo
    1179 posts Member
    Goal 1 - You screened him
    Goal 2- Rebound trash that should be handled better
    Goal 3- Good goal, pass against the grain then shoot back the direction from the pass
    Goal 4- Terrible terrible (but it's EAs way of saying fluke goals happen I feel)
    Goal 5- Good goal. faceoff win to the slapshot with people in the way kinda
    Goal 6- Terrible goalie not covering a puck right in front
    Goal 7- Looked like your defense nudged your goalie causing that problem
    Goal 8- Shouldn't have thrown it out
    Goal 9- Good deflection goal

  • Ka1serSoz3
    64 posts Member
    edited July 2019
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Goal 1 - You screened him
    Goal 2- Rebound trash that should be handled better
    Goal 3- Good goal, pass against the grain then shoot back the direction from the pass
    Goal 4- Terrible terrible (but it's EAs way of saying fluke goals happen I feel)
    Goal 5- Good goal. faceoff win to the slapshot with people in the way kinda
    Goal 6- Terrible goalie not covering a puck right in front
    Goal 7- Looked like your defense nudged your goalie causing that problem
    Goal 8- Shouldn't have thrown it out
    Goal 9- Good deflection goal

    I appreciate the input guys I really do, but I strongly disagree with some of the sentiment on here. This isn’t a thread made to complain about me not wanting to get scored on, that would be laughable. A hockey game or any sports game would be boring and literally unplayable if you were guaranteed not to get scored on, so believe me it’s not that at all. I’m trying to make this game require more twitch skills and vision as opposed to what it requires now and what these goals represent. Here I’ll just use the goals that I disagree with you on as obviously they’re the ones you thought were warranted.

    Goal 1 - A situation that occurs far too often in this game especially with passing. I didn’t think the shot was bad at all except I felt I followed the shooter the whole way and had my defenseman squared up to the shot enough so that it should have been blocked. The problem I have with this goal is that had that defenseman been an AI player the shot probably would have been blocked. There’s a disconnect in this game between user controlled players and shots/passes going directly THROUGH them as opposed to AI players blocking/intercepting nearly everything. It should be the other way around. That’s the problem I have with that goal.

    Goal 3 - Not a terrible goal as it was my fault on the breakout, but it required such minimal input from my opponent. First of all, the pass ended up on my opponent’s player’s stick through no effort of his own, then he pressed pass and shoot. It wasn’t even defendable once the pass ended up on his player’s stick. I feel that my mistake wasn’t so egregious that it should have led to that easy of a goal against. Minimal effort goals have been plaguing this series for this entire gen.

    Goal 5 - Another completely minimal effort goal. I’m not saying these goals should never happen, they just happen way too frequently in this game compared to real life. Too easy and a great equalizer for lesser skilled players.

    Goal 7 was actually that bad angle wrister by McDavid which I didn’t get the whole recording of but you can see where the shot was from. Another easy, minimal effort type of situation leading to a goal which this current dev seems to love. Wristers from that spot on the ice with no screens are so rare in the NHL.

    Goal 8 - I shouldn’t have thrown it out but I’ve never seen the AI just automatically give a poke check on a thrown out puck like that. That’s ridiculous for a competitive game in my book. I’d totally understand if the user had done it himself.

    Goal 9 - COMPLETE NONSENSE. I don’t even have words for this one as my opponent is obviously frantically mashing the shoot button. He even fans on a slapper and the puck goes right back to him on a tee. This game rewards button mashing way too much while punishing well thought out plays.

    Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on
  • It’s because all of the “elite” players who have never played a game of real hockey in their life complained that the goalies were too hard to score on.

    The goaltending is awful I fully agree, you need to be in 120% perfect position every single play or your goalie is just going to get cheesed with those high glove shots through “traffic” or the low shots that for some reason not a single goalie in the game can control? You’re telling me that every single nhl caliber goalie is going to kick every single rebound right to the slot or a dangerous position? No they’ll try their damn best to either control the rebound or direct it into the corner away from danger.

    Unfortunately EA probably won’t even bat an eye at your complaint and if they do they’ll just tell you to change your strategies and play better position. I’ve never heard them admit their game is faulty or buggy. Hell they think their game is really close to a hockey sim but it plays nothing like real hockey, the animations that happen in the game are clunky at best and slow the game down like crazy.

    But according to EA NHL 19 goaltending is perfect you just need to play better defence.
  • Ka1serSoz3
    64 posts Member
    edited July 2019
    I agree and the thing is it’s not even that the goalies are just bad... they’re also way too good as demonstrated here:





    Now before some of you jump on me I’m not saying long goals or rebound goals should never happen, nor am I saying goalies shouldn’t make tough saves. They definitely should do both as it keeps the game more interesting/realistic. However, the frequency of each is way out of whack in this game. It’s almost the exact opposite of what it should be.

    This creates a scenario where any type of real thought, vision or thumb skill isn’t really a necessity and leads to extremely mundane gameplay. I just want the skill requirement that the old games had back when it came to scoring goals and defending.

    Well I want more than just that, but it’s a start.
    Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on
  • I’ve been saying it since NHL 16, the teams goalies never play evenly. I understand that every goalie plays differently but in the end all these goalies are nhl goalies and they all should have some sort of goaltending sense.

    But it seems like one goalie is always caught out of position easily, never tries making desperation saves when caught out, seems to give up on the play. Meanwhile the other will never give up on the puck until the pucks in the net. And all EA says is it’s the way the puck gets moved around the zone. Well for some reason it seems skating circles in the corner until you can cut to the middle and snipe it is a way better and more consistent way than actually setting up a cycle or even getting an aggressive forecheck in.

    It seems the goalies can almost read the real hockey plays but are completely clueless on every other non hockey play that happens in this game.
  • Follisimo
    1179 posts Member
    Ka1serSoz3 wrote: »
    Follisimo wrote: »
    Goal 1 - You screened him
    Goal 2- Rebound trash that should be handled better
    Goal 3- Good goal, pass against the grain then shoot back the direction from the pass
    Goal 4- Terrible terrible (but it's EAs way of saying fluke goals happen I feel)
    Goal 5- Good goal. faceoff win to the slapshot with people in the way kinda
    Goal 6- Terrible goalie not covering a puck right in front
    Goal 7- Looked like your defense nudged your goalie causing that problem
    Goal 8- Shouldn't have thrown it out
    Goal 9- Good deflection goal

    I appreciate the input guys I really do, but I strongly disagree with some of the sentiment on here. This isn’t a thread made to complain about me not wanting to get scored on, that would be laughable. A hockey game or any sports game would be boring and literally unplayable if you were guaranteed not to get scored on, so believe me it’s not that at all. I’m trying to make this game require more twitch skills and vision as opposed to what it requires now and what these goals represent. Here I’ll just use the goals that I disagree with you on as obviously they’re the ones you thought were warranted.

    Goal 1 - A situation that occurs far too often in this game especially with passing. I didn’t think the shot was bad at all except I felt I followed the shooter the whole way and had my defenseman squared up to the shot enough so that it should have been blocked. The problem I have with this goal is that had that defenseman been an AI player the shot probably would have been blocked. There’s a disconnect in this game between user controlled players and shots/passes going directly THROUGH them as opposed to AI players blocking/intercepting nearly everything. It should be the other way around. That’s the problem I have with that goal.

    Goal 3 - Not a terrible goal as it was my fault on the breakout, but it required such minimal input from my opponent. First of all, the pass ended up on my opponent’s player’s stick through no effort of his own, then he pressed pass and shoot. It wasn’t even defendable once the pass ended up on his player’s stick. I feel that my mistake wasn’t so egregious that it should have led to that easy of a goal against. Minimal effort goals have been plaguing this series for this entire gen.

    Goal 5 - Another completely minimal effort goal. I’m not saying these goals should never happen, they just happen way too frequently in this game compared to real life. Too easy and a great equalizer for lesser skilled players.

    Goal 7 was actually that bad angle wrister by McDavid which I didn’t get the whole recording of but you can see where the shot was from. Another easy, minimal effort type of situation leading to a goal which this current dev seems to love. Wristers from that spot on the ice with no screens are so rare in the NHL.

    Goal 8 - I shouldn’t have thrown it out but I’ve never seen the AI just automatically give a poke check on a thrown out puck like that. That’s ridiculous for a competitive game in my book. I’d totally understand if the user had done it himself.

    Goal 9 - COMPLETE NONSENSE. I don’t even have words for this one as my opponent is obviously frantically mashing the shoot button. He even fans on a slapper and the puck goes right back to him on a tee. This game rewards button mashing way too much while punishing well thought out plays.

    Look I get how you feel and I simply was telling you why they happened. Remember goals happen more often than they should because we are playing 4min periods and not 20min periods. Even in 20min periods the game isn't programmed to act like that even with lots of slider changes. Once people figure out the AI they attack it and EA could change it but people will just find a new way to abuse it. If they start to make AI more sporadic doing different things all the time then we get complaints about Oh Ice Tilt stuff to an even greater degree.

    I'm mostly a 6's player that dabbles in HUT. I much prefer all humans so the effects of these things don't happen as often.


  • Ka1serSoz3
    64 posts Member
    edited July 2019
    It’s all good I’m not really trying to argue with you, just breaking down why they aren’t good goals (for the most part).

    “Remember goals happen more often than they should because we are playing 4m periods and not 20m periods”.

    I did address that point in another post above as did the other poster, fastguy. Goalies in this game read and react superbly to shots and plays that should wind up as goals while at the same time they react poorly to shots that they should save 99.9% of the time. That’s my whole issue with the goalie tuning in this series right now. The amount of goals would be roughly the same if they tuned the goalies properly, but the path to those goals would be different.
    Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on
  • Follisimo
    1179 posts Member
    Ka1serSoz3 wrote: »
    It’s all good I’m not really trying to argue with you, just breaking down my interpretation of the goals.

    “Remember goals happen more often than they should because we are playing 4m periods and not 20m periods”.

    I addressed that point in another post above as did the other poster, fastguy. Goalies in this game are read and react superbly to shots and plays that should be goals while at the same time they react poorly to shots that they should save 99.9% of the time. That’s my whole issue with the goalie tuning in this series right now.

    Not sure if you played but during the PS360 era we had goalies that were beyond amazing. We called them spider-man goalies because they stopped things there was no way they should have come close on. People hated that more than loved it.

    We also had people complain about about AI being terrible in EASHL...so next year they made them very viable and then people whined and complained to nerf them... they of course nerfed them.

    So when they make a change usually for the better it ends up getting reverted back because people can't adapt and instead want the same old routine.

  • Ka1serSoz3
    64 posts Member
    edited July 2019
    Prior to this gen the shot totals would generally reflect real life shot totals. Typically about 60 shots per game. Now, with the suffocating manner in which the AI is programmed - intercepting passes left right and centre, blocking shot after shot - you or I probably couldn’t get to 60 total shots if our lives depended on it. In over 400 games I can probably count on one hand how many times I’ve had 60 total shots occur in a game.

    Speaking from personal experience, my games average under 30 TOTAL shots. That’s one of the biggest issues with this “realistic” approach the current dev team is taking. It’s super stifling and yet it’s not any more realistic than last gen’s games. It’s just a different brand of unrealistic, where the AI hound and mirror your every movement (as the puck carrier). The user doesn’t even have to really do much on defense because the AI will do a pretty good job at keeping their opponent at bay. Just keep a guy back in a free safety type role. Switch players every now and again. Add in the beyond dumb offensive AI and this game is too often a mess. A dice roll where the puck gets passed into a scrum, your opponent keeps jamming shoot and voila, a top corner shot hits the back of your net! Yay, skill.

    The old games had flow, they had flair, twitch skills mattered, understanding hockey to a degree mattered. Especially in the 09 to 11 versions. If you played those games right or against the right people... WOW. People talk about ballerinas and it being too easy to score and difficult to defend back then. I don’t know who they were playing. I discovered EASHL starting in 10 and I played a lot of it. Drop ins, clubs, whatever. When you played full 6s (or at least 5s no goalies) with top tier players it was hard to even gain zone entry. Games would end up 2-1, 3-2 regularly or even 1-0 (at times). Dump and chase was necessary unlike some people will have you believe about those old games. This is what I experienced with those games.

    So how do shot totals tie in to this issue you might be wondering. Well for starters, they had maybe a quarter the amount of cheesy goals these new games have. I believe these new games are programmed to have a heavier dose of easy goals - because it’s so hard to get a decent amount of shots through - so the scores won’t end 0-0.

    The Spider-Man goalies still exist. They just routinely slip out of their spidey suits when facing 25 foot, step-over-the-blue turd wristers.
    Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on
  • EA_Roger
    1483 posts EA Community Manager
    I've removed a few replies here as they were derailing the thread to call out Game Changers & Streamers, this isn't something that we will allow on the forum. I also encourage you to check out this FAQ on Game Changers, they provide feedback however they don't "decide" which direction the game takes. This is a decision made by the devs based on feedback taken all around the community. If you have any questions on the removed replies hit me up via DM, thanks.
  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    Ka1serSoz3 wrote: »
    Prior to this gen the shot totals would generally reflect real life shot totals. Typically about 60 shots per game. Now, with the suffocating manner in which the AI is programmed - intercepting passes left right and centre, blocking shot after shot - you or I probably couldn’t get to 60 total shots if our lives depended on it. In over 400 games I can probably count on one hand how many times I’ve had 60 total shots occur in a game.

    Speaking from personal experience, my games average under 30 TOTAL shots. That’s one of the biggest issues with this “realistic” approach the current dev team is taking. It’s super stifling and yet it’s not any more realistic than last gen’s games. It’s just a different brand of unrealistic, where the AI hound and mirror your every movement (as the puck carrier). The user doesn’t even have to really do much on defense because the AI will do a pretty good job at keeping their opponent at bay. Just keep a guy back in a free safety type role. Switch players every now and again. Add in the beyond dumb offensive AI and this game is too often a mess. A dice roll where the puck gets passed into a scrum, your opponent keeps jamming shoot and voila, a top corner shot hits the back of your net! Yay, skill.

    The old games had flow, they had flair, twitch skills mattered, understanding hockey to a degree mattered. Especially in the 09 to 11 versions. If you played those games right or against the right people... WOW. People talk about ballerinas and it being too easy to score and difficult to defend back then. I don’t know who they were playing. I discovered EASHL starting in 10 and I played a lot of it. Drop ins, clubs, whatever. When you played full 6s (or at least 5s no goalies) with top tier players it was hard to even gain zone entry. Games would end up 2-1, 3-2 regularly or even 1-0 (at times). Dump and chase was necessary unlike some people will have you believe about those old games. This is what I experienced with those games.

    So how do shot totals tie in to this issue you might be wondering. Well for starters, they had maybe a quarter the amount of cheesy goals these new games have. I believe these new games are programmed to have a heavier dose of easy goals - because it’s so hard to get a decent amount of shots through - so the scores won’t end 0-0.

    The Spider-Man goalies still exist. They just routinely slip out of their spidey suits when facing 25 foot, step-over-the-blue turd wristers.

    Just because you had more shots then doesn't mean it was a more skilled game. I think it takes more skill now to be good at this game. 10 years ago it was way more arcade-like. Pucks were glued to your stick. Passes were tape to tape. You didn't have to worry about fanning on a slapshot. You were more agile and could literally skate sideways. People complained about glitch shots then as well. I remember when slap passes were a big complaint. There was a time when cross-crease one timers were considered a glitch. The famous curve shot. There's always something.

    Now though we have a higher level of realism. Not to mention how people have built their skills over the years plus chemistry with their teammates. It's just very different than it was 10 years ago.
  • Ka1serSoz3
    64 posts Member
    edited July 2019
    You totally missed my point about the shot totals but whatever it’s not that important. What I’m curious about is why you feel this game takes more skill to be good at?

    Like I really don’t understand what the skilled part is. There’s way less skilled ‘stuff’ needed to do to win in this game.

    On defence you can let your cpu do a whole heck of a lot for you. You can move yourself way out of position and your AI will bee line it back to cover your spot. That didn’t happen in the old games. If you wildly went for hits like an idiot against any decent player you’d lose by double digits.

    On offence you can continually chuck slappers, wristers and weak backhanders on net until a couple of them go in/the cpu puts them in from a rebound. You don’t even need to have skill in this regard.

    On top of all that random shoot is happening all the time, which favours the lesser skilled player. Video games in which user control influences things MORE and AI influences things LESS favour the player with more actual skill. This one’s kinda backwards.

    Skating into the zone BACKWARDS is actually a preferable strategy in this game for gaining entry, yet you claim these games are higher in realism.

    I must be missing something here. I’m referring here to VS/HUT though not EASHL so maybe that’s where the disconnect could be.
    Post edited by Ka1serSoz3 on
  • Follisimo
    1179 posts Member
    Ka1serSoz3 wrote: »
    You totally missed my point about the shot totals but whatever it’s not that important. What I’m curious about is why you feel this game takes more skill to be good at?

    Like I really don’t understand what the skilled part is. There’s way less skilled ‘stuff’ needed to do to win in this game.

    On defence you can let your cpu do a whole heck of a lot for you. You can move yourself way out of position and your AI will bee line it back to cover your spot. That didn’t happen in the old games. If you wildly went for hits like an idiot against any decent player you’d lose by double digits.

    On offence you can continually chuck slappers, wristers and weak backhanders on net until a couple of them go in/the cpu puts them in from a rebound. You don’t even need to have skill in this regard.

    On top of all that random shoot is happening all the time, which favours the lesser skilled player. The games in which user control influences things more are then ones that favour the player with more actual skill.

    Skating into the zone BACKWARDS is actually a preferable strategy in this game for gaining entry, yet you claim these games are higher in realism.

    I must be missing something here. I’m referring here to VS/HUT though not EASHL so maybe that’s where the disconnect could be.

    He's a 6s player and think he was talking about that to a degree

  • Sinbin
    1331 posts Member
    Ka1serSoz3 wrote: »
    You totally missed my point about the shot totals but whatever it’s not that important. What I’m curious about is why you feel this game takes more skill to be good at?

    Like I really don’t understand what the skilled part is. There’s way less skilled ‘stuff’ needed to do to win in this game.

    On defence you can let your cpu do a whole heck of a lot for you. You can move yourself way out of position and your AI will bee line it back to cover your spot. That didn’t happen in the old games. If you wildly went for hits like an idiot against any decent player you’d lose by double digits.

    On offence you can continually chuck slappers, wristers and weak backhanders on net until a couple of them go in/the cpu puts them in from a rebound. You don’t even need to have skill in this regard.

    On top of all that random shoot is happening all the time, which favours the lesser skilled player. The games in which user control influences things more are then ones that favour the player with more actual skill.

    Skating into the zone BACKWARDS is actually a preferable strategy in this game for gaining entry, yet you claim these games are higher in realism.

    I must be missing something here. I’m referring here to VS/HUT though not EASHL so maybe that’s where the disconnect could be.

    Someone that is legitimately good at this game is going to beat someone that lets the AI do the work for them most every time. Those guys LT'ing are skilled players. No, I don't think it's realistic, but it's not easy to do. I recognize their skill. They're also the same guys that can use it to create space and weave through traffic. I don't have a problem with it being used in those situations. I definitely don't like it being abused with backskating in to your offensive zone, but you can always step up for a hit on them as well. It's not like it can't be countered. You can throw pucks on net and hope for rebounds and greasy goals. You could do that in the previous games as well. That's a part of hockey. Now it takes more skill to actually work the puck around, set up good scoring chances and put the puck in the back of the net. Passes aren't so tape to tape, you have to be more conscious of having the puck settled, you can't just force passes through traffic for easy one Ts, defense is a lot harder to get past, etc. It's a looser game altogether requires more fine input from the person holding the controller. That is to actually be good at the game. Letting the AI play for you doesn't make you good. Again, someone that knows what they're doing is going to shut down people that don't manually control their defenders.
Sign In or Register to comment.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!