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Passinng and Interception

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  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Good post. I bolded those I agree with the most. EA's answer to the poke spam was to go from 0-100% on the penalties. The problem is that you didn't have to spam the poke to pick up a penalty when you were in good position for the poke. Last game I posted gifs of the stick literally going around the puck at the apex of the poke to seemingly force a trip. I never poked more than 5-6 times a game. If it was EA's wish for people not to use their stick to be an effective defender (In 6's I'm talking about), then they did a great job. Pokes are in a much better place in 21. Took a whole game for it to get there.

    Now with Interceptions, it was first 100%. Players could intercept with their backs turned. EA listened, thankfully. They took it down to 50% where class, position, stats, and line of sight played more of a role. In this game, it's now near 10%.

    For everyone.

    If I'm a PMD with the right Def/Interceptor/Def Stick, I should beat out an Enforcer forcing a pass through the middle with 60 Pass, 94 Fighting, and Goon 100.

    Pass interceptions are not at 10% lol. I’d rather see this state play out for a bit and see who can adapt before a change. If we’re too quick too change, we never progress. We can make post after post about what mechanics are lacking or OP which makes the need for higher pass assistance necessary, but then you’d be proving my point that it’s a vicious cycle that can only be broken with patience and truly attacking the problem areas.

    Why not advocate for better incidental contact? A more consistent LB mechanic? Dives that don’t automatically take a tripping penalty when utilized? Possible more pass “interceptions” that are auto but end up deflecting pucks through the slot rather than just basic 100% success rate interceptions due to an auto animation? So many things to try, but we just want to buff the game back to the same old boring state, then complain that the game always feels the same.

    We should be pushing for further accountability, not eliminating accountability to make our respective positions easier. That’s been the problem with this meta for this entire generation!
  • TheMajjam
    794 posts Member
    edited October 21
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.
  • Ah well. My team is still in a period of adaptation, but we're back to winning games. Guess I shouldn't complain, eh?

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • BTW, I still respect the fact that you're enjoying the game @untouchable_BF1 which is a far cry from all the stuff we went through on the 20 forum. Cant fault you for that! Traitor. Lol. I kid. :D

    I can myself at times when I feel that plays are made and broken based on skill and choice, and less on the lucky roll of the dice. I want to absolutely be mad at a dumb play of my own doing, rather than wonder why I tripped a guy two inches in front of me as my stick clips through the puck and takes his legs out. Or have a big goal scored against me because puck/stick clips through a goalie's stick in pads. In any case, quite a few social media EA NHL peeps have spoken out against the mechanics as well, and they seem to be the voice of reason that EA seems to listen so, we we'll see where this leads.
  • Sega82mega
    1933 posts Member
    edited October 22
    *Nice to hear your back on track with winning games majj!

    I dont know were to put this, cause its so many started threads about the same thing, but this thread feels like the official..

    Another thing when people are facing the puck carrier and are in the passing lane and don't really feel it's helping..

    Think of the speed, that to is importen, the more sync you are with every move on the ice, the better chance to get the puck.

    Work with the L2, often alot of up and down, round and round, in your own zone.. (same offensive pattern from NHL20). Cause if you just for 1-2 second happen to be in the passing lane it's not optimally, you need to 'be in he's face all the time'. 'Never stand completely still... And if you throw yourself down on the ice, it usally mean you are way behind, thats a desperate move, you only should do when you backcheck on a 2 on 1 situation, not when the opponent have the puck under control in your zone.

    And no one should bealive it's easy to play defense, it's not something you master over 1 or 2 weeks, but you gotta start somewhere.

    * I think you will have to sacrifice some wins before it startin to click, I have tryed to train over the years just by going over the red line and dump the puck to fall back and defend, over and over again. Do it at least if the game all ready over, do something good about it, before next game.
    Post edited by Sega82mega on
  • CUBS
    18 posts Member
    So I’ve been playing as a much more defensive build in club. I only play the 1 defensive spot when we have a third on it’s usually me and my buddy. I’ve been playing grinder 6’1 200lbs. With Defensive minded and Hockey Sense???(not 100% on the name off the top of my head. The defensive lapses that seemed to be out of my control definitely seemed to be non existent positioning and DSS use was dominate even against 5’7 169 sniper cherry machines. I feel like with the right build and defensive stats it’s a completely different game.

    However I feel like that may be my new issue. Those systems others have mentioned really do work. But I feel like to get genuine consistency you need to sell out on full defensive builds and ones that don’t impact speed or skating attributes. I feel like if the purpose of these issues is counter intuitive to the idea that it’s more sim and less arcade like. If defensive play is to be made manually you should be able to do so with any build choice you like. If you play as a sniper forward coming back into a 2 on 1 get in position you have a much higher chance of missing the puck. That automation of missed defensive plays seems to disrupt the idea of being in position to make the play. Manual positioning and mechanics should win out over automated stat determination in these systems.

    Credit to everyone who explained how and why the system in place is great. It truly is I made a pass last night that would have been an automated interception through a defender in hustle mode that tried to jump the original lane. I held out cut the angle and threaded an absolute dime to my buddy with a good read and patience. Last year it would have been auto intercepted and made me really consider how good it feels to have the current system in place. I just think that the automation of missed defensive by non defensively focused builds needs to be tuned down. I still stand by the idea that some of the defensive mechanics are dated and need to be reworked for quicker and more seemless play like shot blocking. But that’s something that won’t happen this year and I can live with that.
  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.
  • I Sometimes forget how I should play to get out the best of this game, it's soooo easy to fall back in old 20' habits. To just sprint up and down with no tomarow. It's when I switch player all the time to attack the puck carrier things get out of hand. But when I focus on one guy and were I best can do good on the ice with that player, im back on track.

    But it's easy to get fooled in to just 'go for it'.
  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.

    I wonder how much each game mode is impacting people's perception of pass interceptions right now?

    I've ended up playing a lot more EASHL 3s than 6s over the last couple of years ( mostly to get away from the AI when there are only a few people on ). Even though 3s is a more offensive-oriented mode due to the open ice available, my club has still been able to play a solid defensive game in years past. This year, we're definitely struggling with defending the forced passes.

    With the space available in 3s there are more high-danger areas than there are defenders. If you stay still any decent club will pick you apart. In previous years you could mitigate this because you could minimize how much you moved as a defender while still containing most passing plays and shots. In NHL 21 you need to be glued to the player getting the pass to stop a pass, but are helpless unless you're not moving. In 3s the idea that you can simultaneously stay glued to the offensive play while not touching any inputs is laughable.

    In 6s it's definitely easier to stay more "quiet" with your inputs and still defend due to having more defenders and less open ice for the offensive players to move around freely and quickly.

    I'm sure we'll figure it out eventually, but right now there's a lot of frustration about passes that you would think would be defend-able getting through.

    Like this:



    Even being "quiet" on the inputs doesn't always help:

  • CUBS
    18 posts Member
    Couldn’t agree more with PlayoffError 3s is such an up and down thing you have to be sprinting to get back. Nothing worse then having the goalie make a great save on a your 2 on 1 having the puck immediately played and upped to the forwards who left the zone early. Easily shoot out wide past the cpu D man. And you burn all your stamina getting back into position to make a play on the receiver and see it go through when it shouldn’t. The systems in place are great and really well adapted for manual defense but there’s certain scenarios that play out in 3s as opposed to 6s way more often they become extremely precise to defend against over and over again. I usually play with a buddy and a couple times a week we have a 3rd. It’s hard to be that on all the time in a rush style game mode. Really don’t have an interest in joining a 6s club again. Different tuner sets for different modes is the way really. But I don’t want to just see auto interceptions set higher they need to be more situational.
  • This thread defines a major flaw with this series. Page after page of people arguing over how they "think" certain mechanics works but there's really no information anywhere (let alone where it should be in game) to answer these questions.

    I personally am not sure I agree with what's being said here. I'm much more active now than I was in the past. To intercept/pickup/steal pucks in the past you had to make sure you didn't touch anything. It was a "feather the left stick but try not to do anything else" approach. Now I use L2 when I can (because the transitioning in and out of L2 is atrocious) and I don't find myself having issues intercepting pucks that come in the path of my stick. Or even picking up loose pucks while using DSS. Seem to pick it up pretty quick.

    The biggest issue I see is that you have to be facing the path the puck takes and it seems to be kind of narrow. And the faster the pass the less likely you will intercept. I find it works to L2 back into the pass receiver and either I intercept or sometimes just disrupt the puck as it comes into the intended target. Of course often, in close, rocket passes just go right though, no issue. I seem to have issue with it but somehow the offensive player has no problem catching it or even 1 timing it. Thats what really needs to be tweaked if you ask me.

    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.
  • KidShowtime1867
    1300 posts Member
    edited October 22
    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    They used to explain exactly how these mechanics worked in the forums. We were told this stopped happening because of the arguing people did with the developers.

    I absolutely loved when Ben would come here and provide technical breakdowns of mechanics - but the hockey IQ gods argued with him and said he was wrong about the gameplay mechanics he produces and then claimed his breakdowns were "too technical" and provided no real service.

    Well, they provided me tons of info that I used to up my game and many others as well.
  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.

    I wonder how much each game mode is impacting people's perception of pass interceptions right now?

    I've ended up playing a lot more EASHL 3s than 6s over the last couple of years ( mostly to get away from the AI when there are only a few people on ). Even though 3s is a more offensive-oriented mode due to the open ice available, my club has still been able to play a solid defensive game in years past. This year, we're definitely struggling with defending the forced passes.

    With the space available in 3s there are more high-danger areas than there are defenders. If you stay still any decent club will pick you apart. In previous years you could mitigate this because you could minimize how much you moved as a defender while still containing most passing plays and shots. In NHL 21 you need to be glued to the player getting the pass to stop a pass, but are helpless unless you're not moving. In 3s the idea that you can simultaneously stay glued to the offensive play while not touching any inputs is laughable.

    In 6s it's definitely easier to stay more "quiet" with your inputs and still defend due to having more defenders and less open ice for the offensive players to move around freely and quickly.

    I'm sure we'll figure it out eventually, but right now there's a lot of frustration about passes that you would think would be defend-able getting through.

    Like this:



    Even being "quiet" on the inputs doesn't always help:


    The first video, red does exactly what I said you can’t do. He makes a small adjustment literally as the puck is coming along with the CPU. I guarantee he picks this off if he doesn’t move there. If we want to dive deeper into the play, the AI was moving as well and green went for a hit rather than an easy poke as the attacker left the puck hanging there. Three mistakes by three players = goal.

    The second clip, the pass interceptions worked, the puck was stripped from incidental contact so this isn’t a clip that shows “broken interceptions” imo. Why was it stripped? The defender lost a step. You know that incidental contact is probably going to come into play there, so if you’re beat, you gotta be a little more desperate. Sprint then lay down, LB, use DSS, possibly get the stick lift in. I wouldn’t have tried to simply intercept that pass if I’m behind a step.

    I literally played the most defensive-oriented 3s game last night, we won 1-0 and both teams didn’t even put up 10 shots each. Pass interceptions and people taking away time and space all over the place.
    This thread defines a major flaw with this series. Page after page of people arguing over how they "think" certain mechanics works but there's really no information anywhere (let alone where it should be in game) to answer these questions.

    I personally am not sure I agree with what's being said here. I'm much more active now than I was in the past. To intercept/pickup/steal pucks in the past you had to make sure you didn't touch anything. It was a "feather the left stick but try not to do anything else" approach. Now I use L2 when I can (because the transitioning in and out of L2 is atrocious) and I don't find myself having issues intercepting pucks that come in the path of my stick. Or even picking up loose pucks while using DSS. Seem to pick it up pretty quick.

    The biggest issue I see is that you have to be facing the path the puck takes and it seems to be kind of narrow. And the faster the pass the less likely you will intercept. I find it works to L2 back into the pass receiver and either I intercept or sometimes just disrupt the puck as it comes into the intended target. Of course often, in close, rocket passes just go right though, no issue. I seem to have issue with it but somehow the offensive player has no problem catching it or even 1 timing it. Thats what really needs to be tweaked if you ask me.

    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    What do you mean by “facing the path of the puck” here? I’ve picked passes off from passing coming straight on and also from a perpendicular angle while gliding which I found rather surprising and satisfying.

    At the end of the day, I guess I’m the crazy person here but I will not be one to join the pass interceptions buff brigade. Should be making offensive players be more accountable to counter the new interceptions rather than dumbing defense down and losing an important step towards a much mote skilled game overall. The only “fix” I see acceptable is making auto interceptions more consistent when using LT (maybe tie this ability into DA threshold). I’ve been doing literally using the same techniques as 13-20 to pickoff passes and I haven’t had an issue. If anything, this shows how easy interceptions have been the last few years.
  • Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    They used to explain exactly how these mechanics worked in the forums. We were told this stopped happening because of the arguing people did with the developers.

    I absolutely loved when Ben would come here and provide technical breakdowns of mechanics - but the hockey IQ gods argued with him and said he was wrong about the gameplay mechanics he produces and then claimed his breakdowns were "too technical" and provided no real service.

    Well, they provided me tons of info that I used to up my game and many others as well.

    This is a “technical breakdown” id love to see right now because I feel like I’m sounding like a madman when I say that I haven’t had a problem with interceptions. When I explain my method of not providing input for like the split-second I read a pass is coming, people are taking that as if I’m playing against a bunch of pylons and we’re all just playing a gentlemen’s game where we stand Super still lol. Like trust me, I’m playing the same sweaty community you guys are. I’m a PMD. I’m fast and small and definitely very active as not being active removes the skating advantage I have over many classes. I don’t think I can articulate any further that I already have that in both 3s and 6s, I’m not having issues with pass interceptions while playing this game very similarly to 13-20. The biggest difference is maintaining a good gap and speed as you can get walked a lot easier this year if you’re not careful.

    So, I’d love to see Ben chime in and explain what are the “under-the-hood” elements that dictate pass interception success rates. Clearly some of us play different styles and clearly some of us are having more success than others. I’d love to see if my theory is close to true as I’m one of the few saying “give people some time, they’ll adjust” rather than “this is literally broken” you know? I just find pass interceptions this year to be so drastically different from the poke checking last year. Those were insanely frustrating and forced everyone to be just passive zombies. With more leniency on the trips this year, you have way more control over actively affecting the play before you’d ever need to rely on an interception. I really think that’s the biggest difference at the moment. People who just backed up and clumped are having a tough time atm.
  • TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.

    Its completely illogical that holding LT to face the passer would hurt your chances of intercepting. Silly as that may be, it seems to be true this year. I played last night and it was clearly easier to grab passes when not holding LT. It doesn't make sense but I think you're right.
  • EA_Aljo
    1924 posts EA Community Manager
    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    They used to explain exactly how these mechanics worked in the forums. We were told this stopped happening because of the arguing people did with the developers.

    I absolutely loved when Ben would come here and provide technical breakdowns of mechanics - but the hockey IQ gods argued with him and said he was wrong about the gameplay mechanics he produces and then claimed his breakdowns were "too technical" and provided no real service.

    Well, they provided me tons of info that I used to up my game and many others as well.

    This is a “technical breakdown” id love to see right now because I feel like I’m sounding like a madman when I say that I haven’t had a problem with interceptions. When I explain my method of not providing input for like the split-second I read a pass is coming, people are taking that as if I’m playing against a bunch of pylons and we’re all just playing a gentlemen’s game where we stand Super still lol. Like trust me, I’m playing the same sweaty community you guys are. I’m a PMD. I’m fast and small and definitely very active as not being active removes the skating advantage I have over many classes. I don’t think I can articulate any further that I already have that in both 3s and 6s, I’m not having issues with pass interceptions while playing this game very similarly to 13-20. The biggest difference is maintaining a good gap and speed as you can get walked a lot easier this year if you’re not careful.

    So, I’d love to see Ben chime in and explain what are the “under-the-hood” elements that dictate pass interception success rates. Clearly some of us play different styles and clearly some of us are having more success than others. I’d love to see if my theory is close to true as I’m one of the few saying “give people some time, they’ll adjust” rather than “this is literally broken” you know? I just find pass interceptions this year to be so drastically different from the poke checking last year. Those were insanely frustrating and forced everyone to be just passive zombies. With more leniency on the trips this year, you have way more control over actively affecting the play before you’d ever need to rely on an interception. I really think that’s the biggest difference at the moment. People who just backed up and clumped are having a tough time atm.

    Your defensive awareness rating is most important for auto-intercepting passes.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    They used to explain exactly how these mechanics worked in the forums. We were told this stopped happening because of the arguing people did with the developers.

    I absolutely loved when Ben would come here and provide technical breakdowns of mechanics - but the hockey IQ gods argued with him and said he was wrong about the gameplay mechanics he produces and then claimed his breakdowns were "too technical" and provided no real service.

    Well, they provided me tons of info that I used to up my game and many others as well.

    This is a “technical breakdown” id love to see right now because I feel like I’m sounding like a madman when I say that I haven’t had a problem with interceptions. When I explain my method of not providing input for like the split-second I read a pass is coming, people are taking that as if I’m playing against a bunch of pylons and we’re all just playing a gentlemen’s game where we stand Super still lol. Like trust me, I’m playing the same sweaty community you guys are. I’m a PMD. I’m fast and small and definitely very active as not being active removes the skating advantage I have over many classes. I don’t think I can articulate any further that I already have that in both 3s and 6s, I’m not having issues with pass interceptions while playing this game very similarly to 13-20. The biggest difference is maintaining a good gap and speed as you can get walked a lot easier this year if you’re not careful.

    So, I’d love to see Ben chime in and explain what are the “under-the-hood” elements that dictate pass interception success rates. Clearly some of us play different styles and clearly some of us are having more success than others. I’d love to see if my theory is close to true as I’m one of the few saying “give people some time, they’ll adjust” rather than “this is literally broken” you know? I just find pass interceptions this year to be so drastically different from the poke checking last year. Those were insanely frustrating and forced everyone to be just passive zombies. With more leniency on the trips this year, you have way more control over actively affecting the play before you’d ever need to rely on an interception. I really think that’s the biggest difference at the moment. People who just backed up and clumped are having a tough time atm.

    Your defensive awareness rating is most important for auto-intercepting passes.

    Is it more important than stopping inputs? Cause I definitely don’t have 95 DA like Majjam’s teammate does, yet I seemingly don’t have as many problems intercepting passes. There’s gotta be something I’m doing that others are not, right? Genuinely asking, because I’m confused and not wanting to be the village crazy person lol!
    jrago73 wrote: »
    TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.

    Its completely illogical that holding LT to face the passer would hurt your chances of intercepting. Silly as that may be, it seems to be true this year. I played last night and it was clearly easier to grab passes when not holding LT. It doesn't make sense but I think you're right.

    It’s a little weird, but it’s part of the skill imo. If you’re going to rely on an auto-animation, you have to time it right and put yourself in a good place to have it trigger. Again though, this is something I would be fine seeing removed from the game or say 90+ DA allows for auto-interceptions while holding LT. Some threshold where most defenders will reach it, but forwards would have to sacrifice somewhere to get the same perk.
  • CUBS
    18 posts Member
    If the goal from the dev team is more manual defense isn’t tying it to an attribute system completely convoluting the point of that?
  • CUBS wrote: »
    If the goal from the dev team is more manual defense isn’t tying it to an attribute system completely convoluting the point of that?

    I’m fine with where it is now, but if the community wants attributes to matter, my suggestion was a “meet in the middle” suggestion you know? I mean, right now interceptions are allegedly broken, this compromise would result in some classes being able to have more of a crutch at the expense of something else.
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »
    Again the real problem is that all of this is just how we personally feel the game plays. We don't know because they don't tell us. Huge problem this game has, keeping the customers informed on exactly how all of the game mechanics work.

    They used to explain exactly how these mechanics worked in the forums. We were told this stopped happening because of the arguing people did with the developers.

    I absolutely loved when Ben would come here and provide technical breakdowns of mechanics - but the hockey IQ gods argued with him and said he was wrong about the gameplay mechanics he produces and then claimed his breakdowns were "too technical" and provided no real service.

    Well, they provided me tons of info that I used to up my game and many others as well.

    This is a “technical breakdown” id love to see right now because I feel like I’m sounding like a madman when I say that I haven’t had a problem with interceptions. When I explain my method of not providing input for like the split-second I read a pass is coming, people are taking that as if I’m playing against a bunch of pylons and we’re all just playing a gentlemen’s game where we stand Super still lol. Like trust me, I’m playing the same sweaty community you guys are. I’m a PMD. I’m fast and small and definitely very active as not being active removes the skating advantage I have over many classes. I don’t think I can articulate any further that I already have that in both 3s and 6s, I’m not having issues with pass interceptions while playing this game very similarly to 13-20. The biggest difference is maintaining a good gap and speed as you can get walked a lot easier this year if you’re not careful.

    So, I’d love to see Ben chime in and explain what are the “under-the-hood” elements that dictate pass interception success rates. Clearly some of us play different styles and clearly some of us are having more success than others. I’d love to see if my theory is close to true as I’m one of the few saying “give people some time, they’ll adjust” rather than “this is literally broken” you know? I just find pass interceptions this year to be so drastically different from the poke checking last year. Those were insanely frustrating and forced everyone to be just passive zombies. With more leniency on the trips this year, you have way more control over actively affecting the play before you’d ever need to rely on an interception. I really think that’s the biggest difference at the moment. People who just backed up and clumped are having a tough time atm.

    Your defensive awareness rating is most important for auto-intercepting passes.

    Is it more important than stopping inputs? Cause I definitely don’t have 95 DA like Majjam’s teammate does, yet I seemingly don’t have as many problems intercepting passes. There’s gotta be something I’m doing that others are not, right? Genuinely asking, because I’m confused and not wanting to be the village crazy person lol!
    jrago73 wrote: »
    TheMajjam wrote: »
    CUBS wrote: »
    > @untouchable_BF1 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > This is why I think this change is one for the better. If I have to feather LT + LS, face the puck, and time my adjustments so that they don’t happen when the puck is released, that’s a lot of skill and play recognition that goes into that interception. If I don’t think I’ll be able to do that, I need to go to plan B which can be anything from DSS to a dive, block pass, stick lift, shove, or incidental contact. The speed of the play forced me to read that I was in trouble and adapt. Again, that’s a skill gap. Players that just hold LT and backup are now forced to be active.
    >


    In theory that’s exactly how it should work but they’re all mechanics that we’ve been trained not to use because of the penalty risk of them. And the systems designed for them aren’t implemented the way you would use them to intercept a pass. In a real world scenario you could reach your stick out with a poke check deaden the puck and seemly take it with you with ease regardless of motion. In NHL you have to account for directional precision to avoid accidental tripping, you only have bidirectional control of your stick and can’t move it independently closer or farther. Then if you avoid tripping and get the blade of the stick in the passing lane you still have 0 puck control and have to hope it deflects to the spot you are going as opposed to another player or towards your net.

    L1 to block let’s be real this one is probably the most outdated mechanic in the game. You completely kill momentum at unrealistic rates and turn into a statue and hope it hits you with no control of actually adjusting to puck. With still a risk having the stick clip the skate of the offensive player.

    Diving is a death sentence your just bowling ball at the point looking for some pims to knock down(credit that pun please) with all the same issues as blocking with less momentum degradation.

    Stick lift is a slot machine and even more so this year. A stationary receiver taking a one timer that your able to get in the lane of a should not require a stick lift in any situation. At high speed puck and two players arriving all at the same time you have to be in an exact position for that to work properly.

    Bump/hitting you won’t arrive on time to stop a shot your either early or late. And the bump is unpredictable and not something you can consistently use effectively.

    And with all those outside of the bumping hitting method also require an exit animation that completely disrupts the flow of intercepting a pass you have to preform the move make sure the puck is loose relive the input wait for your player to be active for puck pickup again and then continue the play. There’s nothing seemless about any of those mechanics and all have big risks with them.

    I agree last years interception rate was too high but to make them near impossible isn’t a viable solution. You still need to be able to make seemless interceptions in the passing lane on the move with correct timing.

    Well again, they’re not impossible with the correct timing. It seems as if they drastically reduced the window of “correct” timing but again, I am picking off passes with a PMD when I glide, face the play, and don’t touch LT when I’m anticipating the pass. I’ve also had a lot of success using the DSS and shoves and dives to bail me out of sticky situations. I’ve found that the team I play with is aggressive in the neutral zone so we breakdown a lot of plays before it can even get messy in the defense zone.

    Touch, come on man. The LT button is literally called Vision Control. It's to aid your players in making plays. Especially without the puck. But it's literally a deking tool for the offense. For the defense, you're advocating not even using it. Lol. Using it as a D-men on rush situations, the speed and viability of the pivot was nerfed. Lol. How much do you want to keep holding us accountable for when the mechanics are BAD.

    Just hear me out, I’m not “advocating” for not using LT as I’ve stated it’s a change I’d like to see made, all I’m saying is that the game clearly does not want you to be making any LT or LS inputs this year when trying to intercept a pass so I’m simply stating that you need to refrain from using it when a pass is imminent. I like how you have to be closer to the receiver to intercept the pass with an auto-animation, but I’d definitely be open to allowing auto interceptions while holding LT IF we are still forced to play the lane/gap the way we do now.

    I played another 4 games online last night in pro clubs, severely delaying my offline league which is a problem lol, and once again I found a lot of consistency in intercepting passes as a PMD without any perks to buff my defensive awareness. I even didn’t have to face the puck. Had 5-6 examples of scenarios where I was back checking or tailing a forward making a cut from the tops of the circles towards the backdoor where I skated on their inside hip, the proceeded to start gliding to the near post to “get in the lane” and then stopped providing inputs of any kind of a half a second and saw a successful puck interception. I had zero forced passes go through me all night, not even hyping when I did this method. Simply stopped supplying inputs when I read the pass was coming and the game rewarded me. I had 2 forced passes through me in the four games where I was actively supplying inputs and game didn’t let me pick it off, making me believe in my own method/theory even more. I’m not finding the transition skating or pivoting to be a problem at all. I always make sure to keep my momentum and always baiting attackers into doing what I know they want to do I can easily defend the move with DSS.

    Just giving you my honest experience of the game. I’d pass interceptions we’re literally broken, shouldn’t I be having some serious issues with a PMD with no additional perks to help those auto animations out? I’m just not seeing it. I’m playing those scenarios where I would like an intercept the same way I learned with TPS on old-gen. Feather LT + LS and stop inputs when you expect the pass. I honestly think hitting along the wall is in a much worse state than pass interceptions if I’m being completely honest.

    Its completely illogical that holding LT to face the passer would hurt your chances of intercepting. Silly as that may be, it seems to be true this year. I played last night and it was clearly easier to grab passes when not holding LT. It doesn't make sense but I think you're right.

    It’s a little weird, but it’s part of the skill imo. If you’re going to rely on an auto-animation, you have to time it right and put yourself in a good place to have it trigger. Again though, this is something I would be fine seeing removed from the game or say 90+ DA allows for auto-interceptions while holding LT. Some threshold where most defenders will reach it, but forwards would have to sacrifice somewhere to get the same perk.

    My eyes and brain know when a pass wouldn't get through irl and EA just spent what, 3 years, teaching us to LT in the passing lane? But now that I'm aware I will ignore my brain screaming out in agony and adapt my game to the programming.

    Also for what it's worth my build has been pmd with intercept and stick em up.
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