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Stop lying to yourselves, cross crease is trash

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  • No way we should get rid of cross creases, but I do bealive that the harder it is to find that pass, the better it is for this game.

    I dont know how were going to enlighten people that there is other - good (and fun) - ways to score in this game.

    My guess is, beacuse of the more responsibility you have to take as a defender, that we never really had before, and the cross creases is a good way to take advantage of that, we're probebly not going to see a difference in how people choose to play this game, for this year anyway.

    And no mather how they 'fix' the game, there's always going to be one goal, that will effect how the majority choose to play.

    Last years short side snipes and 1timers felt much worse, from the perspective as a defender, were it was much more complicated with the tool's we had been given to shutdown your own zone, so in that case, I much rather have it like this.

    But as I said in the beginning, the harder it is to do a cross crease, the better approval to this game. A good measure of value.
  • EA_Aljo
    3229 posts EA Community Manager
    amxblade wrote: »
    This entire game, HUT at least has become who can score the most cross ice one timers and who can spam the poke check like a magic wand the hardest. THIS IS NOT HOCKEY!

    The poke check is way op it needs nerfing , little Mary's just shake around with their stick extended with little consequences ,the skill stick should be more rewarding than just spamming the poke check

    I think the patch definitely helped mitigate the cross crease goals. AI defense has been doing a better job at breaking them up from my experiences so far.

    As far as the stick goes, I agree with the "little consequences". I posted a video trying to get an explanation with the DSS. I can't figure out when it is solid vs invisible. Players can just swing their sticks through your legs with no trips, yet still make contact with the puck. I get that this is "intended" for the reasons EA has mentioned, but it is just too frustrating to watch.

    Can you get some video of this happening? There's a brief window where you shouldn't be able to make contact with the puck when the stick passes through an object. Some video would really help understand what you're experiencing.
  • I think I am going to go back on what I previously said. I assumed the patch helped with the one time goals, but the more games I've played, the more I am not believing that to be true. I just lost to a guy 9-3. He had a total of 12 shots, all of course one-timers. Some cross crease, some more in the slot. I say whatever and play another game and go up against a guy who scores 6 unanswered goals after I was up 2-0. He ended the game with 13 shots. I know I am not this bad at this game as I break up these passes more times than I can count, but anytime they do seem to get one through, my goalie flops and gives them the whole freaking net.

    I don't disagree with this but I don't think anything is new this year regarding 1 timers other than

    a) passes go through a little easier (defending the pass is harder with nerfs to L2 and pass intercepts)
    b) active stick defending is better leading to less carrying into the slot area.

    For a few years carrying pucks into the crease and scoring was so easy that it tipped the balance that way. This year it has tipped heavily back towards work as a team to create cross ice shots.

    I think most good teams/players for years have known that 1 timers are by far the best way to score. Thats not much different than real life, just easier to execute in this game.

    Once you get to a high level of hockey if you aren't good at 1 timers you are basically are not a "scorer". I always reference an interview I saw with Jagr, one of the worlds all time greats. He said half way through his career hockey had changed so much that he had to learn how to shoot one timers as that was the only true way left to score against NHL goalies with a modern defense in front of them. Everything else was essentially luck. obviously he was exaggerating but the point is made. He made it sound like half way through his career he had never even attempted one and by the end it became the most important thing to practice.

    The difference is in real hockey it is much more difficult to get high percentage cross ice scoring chances. Other than odd man rushes it can be very difficult to get any pucks through the slot. In this game, if you know what you are doing, even the best players can't stay patient forever. Its boring. Move the puck around well, move around well without the puck, work as a team and passing lanes for easy scoring chances will open up. But how easy it is has gone up and down over the years. I still remember when they added the one timer in NHL 94. Changed everything about this game. Other than break aways I would bet 85% of the goals were scored that way for at least a decade.
  • I think I am going to go back on what I previously said. I assumed the patch helped with the one time goals, but the more games I've played, the more I am not believing that to be true. I just lost to a guy 9-3. He had a total of 12 shots, all of course one-timers. Some cross crease, some more in the slot. I say whatever and play another game and go up against a guy who scores 6 unanswered goals after I was up 2-0. He ended the game with 13 shots. I know I am not this bad at this game as I break up these passes more times than I can count, but anytime they do seem to get one through, my goalie flops and gives them the whole freaking net.

    I don't disagree with this but I don't think anything is new this year regarding 1 timers other than

    a) passes go through a little easier (defending the pass is harder with nerfs to L2 and pass intercepts)
    b) active stick defending is better leading to less carrying into the slot area.

    For a few years carrying pucks into the crease and scoring was so easy that it tipped the balance that way. This year it has tipped heavily back towards work as a team to create cross ice shots.

    I think most good teams/players for years have known that 1 timers are by far the best way to score. Thats not much different than real life, just easier to execute in this game.

    Once you get to a high level of hockey if you aren't good at 1 timers you are basically are not a "scorer". I always reference an interview I saw with Jagr, one of the worlds all time greats. He said half way through his career hockey had changed so much that he had to learn how to shoot one timers as that was the only true way left to score against NHL goalies with a modern defense in front of them. Everything else was essentially luck. obviously he was exaggerating but the point is made. He made it sound like half way through his career he had never even attempted one and by the end it became the most important thing to practice.

    The difference is in real hockey it is much more difficult to get high percentage cross ice scoring chances. Other than odd man rushes it can be very difficult to get any pucks through the slot. In this game, if you know what you are doing, even the best players can't stay patient forever. Its boring. Move the puck around well, move around well without the puck, work as a team and passing lanes for easy scoring chances will open up. But how easy it is has gone up and down over the years. I still remember when they added the one timer in NHL 94. Changed everything about this game. Other than break aways I would bet 85% of the goals were scored that way for at least a decade.

    Yup well said.

    Onetimers should be the most deadly execution, to bad it's way to easy. Thats practically why everyone go for it. It should have a skill level as the lacrosse move, but I dont know, might be hard to get it that way. But I hope for the future something new will come up.
  • 32Doak wrote: »
    I don't get why a perfectly positioned defender in the passing lane doesn't stop it. That makes zero sense.

    I know but there are players saying just being in the lane and facing the player isn't enough.. yet the pass can go right through with 0 effort.

    Those players rely on it and don't want their easy goals fixed. That's all.

    I think we just want defenders doing more than just standing in the passing lane.

    A pass doesn't require zero effort either. You need to work yourself in to a position to make a pass and then aim said pass, decide whether to sauce or charge up the pass for a hard pass - and then make that pass.

    You're saying defenders should be able to just move their player in to the lane and intercept that pass with literally no other responsibility to take any other action.

    Also, those of us who think it's nice that defenders have to do more are not just saying that to keep the 'easy goals' coming - a lot of us (myself included) typically play defence exclusively so in essence, we're advocating for making the positions we play more difficult and thus - more realistic.

    Plus - we don't need those so-called 'easy goals' when we understand the passing mechanic well and can easily pull an opponent out of their defensive stance:

    Q2baLwe.gif

    Are you kidding me with that RW's pivot and return to full stride before perfectly burying a 1-t?

    You're proving the op's point with this vid.
  • Q2baLwe.gif
    That was some stanky D, guy doesnt even know how to turn around. But notice how he anticipates the cross crease?

    He anticipates it but failed to position himself very well imo. If he LT’ed and put his back to the receiver and backed up slightly quickly then stopped his inputs for a split-second, he would’ve picked the pass off.

    Look at it again, that rw is moving in a way that is completely impossible. He pivots, passes, hits stride and stops on a dime. It looks bad on a vid but if you take into account physics would dictate the RW skating through that shot then the D was perfectly positioned for the 1 timer
  • jiajji wrote: »
    32Doak wrote: »
    I don't get why a perfectly positioned defender in the passing lane doesn't stop it. That makes zero sense.

    I know but there are players saying just being in the lane and facing the player isn't enough.. yet the pass can go right through with 0 effort.

    Those players rely on it and don't want their easy goals fixed. That's all.

    I think we just want defenders doing more than just standing in the passing lane.

    A pass doesn't require zero effort either. You need to work yourself in to a position to make a pass and then aim said pass, decide whether to sauce or charge up the pass for a hard pass - and then make that pass.

    You're saying defenders should be able to just move their player in to the lane and intercept that pass with literally no other responsibility to take any other action.

    Also, those of us who think it's nice that defenders have to do more are not just saying that to keep the 'easy goals' coming - a lot of us (myself included) typically play defence exclusively so in essence, we're advocating for making the positions we play more difficult and thus - more realistic.

    Plus - we don't need those so-called 'easy goals' when we understand the passing mechanic well and can easily pull an opponent out of their defensive stance:

    Q2baLwe.gif

    Are you kidding me with that RW's pivot and return to full stride before perfectly burying a 1-t?

    You're proving the op's point with this vid.
    jiajji wrote: »
    32Doak wrote: »
    I don't get why a perfectly positioned defender in the passing lane doesn't stop it. That makes zero sense.

    I know but there are players saying just being in the lane and facing the player isn't enough.. yet the pass can go right through with 0 effort.

    Those players rely on it and don't want their easy goals fixed. That's all.

    I think we just want defenders doing more than just standing in the passing lane.

    A pass doesn't require zero effort either. You need to work yourself in to a position to make a pass and then aim said pass, decide whether to sauce or charge up the pass for a hard pass - and then make that pass.

    You're saying defenders should be able to just move their player in to the lane and intercept that pass with literally no other responsibility to take any other action.

    Also, those of us who think it's nice that defenders have to do more are not just saying that to keep the 'easy goals' coming - a lot of us (myself included) typically play defence exclusively so in essence, we're advocating for making the positions we play more difficult and thus - more realistic.

    Plus - we don't need those so-called 'easy goals' when we understand the passing mechanic well and can easily pull an opponent out of their defensive stance:

    Q2baLwe.gif

    Are you kidding me with that RW's pivot and return to full stride before perfectly burying a 1-t?

    You're proving the op's point with this vid.

    i hate to be argumentative but there is really nothing wrong with what happens here. you can absolutely mohawk transition to back skating while keep forward momentum and then transition again to a forward skate, again keeping forward momentum. You will lose a bit in transition but not much.

    not sure also what your problem is with the one timer. after passing and transitioning again to front skate he takes like 3 strides, glides into a one timer in slot for easy goal.

    the animation looks a bit off at times because because i don't think the skate animations are perfect but its a video game. can't be perfect.

    also this wouldn't likely happen often in real life for various reasons. one of which is the l2 transition (done to create a bigger passing lane) isn't really necessary and would slow the whole process down. This exchange right here was one of joe thornton favorite moves in an odd man rush in the rare circumstance he was out front (slow goof that he was)

    maybe what throws this off is the use of the term pivot. i know I consider this pivoting but most people call this just a simple transition because you are not pivoting the direction of your momentum.

    also i might agree that in real life you wouldn't transition to back skate and right back to front skate again this quickly in opposite directions. again its a video game lets not get too worried about something so small. L2 has been nerfed, i think its in a good space especially on offense.
  • There's so much we do (us users) in this game that never ever would be a thing in real life.

    So to start picking on a goal that actually had some nice proper skill... is just to shot yourself in your own foot.

    I hardly see NHL teams that dont know how to backskate and play defense.

    In this game, defense is to run forward against the puck carrier with 110% DSS and then complain about the A.I when we gave up a cross crease, that took place from the very same spot that you just gave up by running mad against the puck carrier at the opposite side.

    But unfortunately it dosent have to be much harder, you can win games just by going nuts and stress the puck carrier and never think about defense, who need that if you can score enough times...?

    Nah I really wish something will be done, to all the players that dosent even seem to wanna play hockey..

  • KidShowtime1867
    1839 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    jiajji wrote: »
    Q2baLwe.gif
    That was some stanky D, guy doesnt even know how to turn around. But notice how he anticipates the cross crease?

    He anticipates it but failed to position himself very well imo. If he LT’ed and put his back to the receiver and backed up slightly quickly then stopped his inputs for a split-second, he would’ve picked the pass off.

    Look at it again, that rw is moving in a way that is completely impossible. He pivots, passes, hits stride and stops on a dime. It looks bad on a vid but if you take into account physics would dictate the RW skating through that shot then the D was perfectly positioned for the 1 timer

    The 'stopping on a dime' I will concede looks bad.. but I suggest you look up something called a Mohawk turn/transition.....
  • IceLion68
    1624 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    I think we just want defenders doing more than just standing in the passing lane.

    A pass doesn't require zero effort either. You need to work yourself in to a position to make a pass and then aim said pass, decide whether to sauce or charge up the pass for a hard pass - and then make that pass.

    You're saying defenders should be able to just move their player in to the lane and intercept that pass with literally no other responsibility to take any other action.

    Also, those of us who think it's nice that defenders have to do more are not just saying that to keep the 'easy goals' coming - a lot of us (myself included) typically play defence exclusively so in essence, we're advocating for making the positions we play more difficult and thus - more realistic.

    Plus - we don't need those so-called 'easy goals' when we understand the passing mechanic well and can easily pull an opponent out of their defensive stance:

    The issue here has been that for several years DMen trying to do more than just "standing in the passing lane" have been "rewarded" for their efforts with tripping penalties, slashing penalties, or just nothing at all...

    Have they made active/ds stick (or hitting) actually useful again for the first time in 5 years?

    FWIW: I agree that the defensive play in that clip is not very well executed, tho not terrible and he was in a bad situation.
    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • jiajji wrote: »
    Q2baLwe.gif
    That was some stanky D, guy doesnt even know how to turn around. But notice how he anticipates the cross crease?

    He anticipates it but failed to position himself very well imo. If he LT’ed and put his back to the receiver and backed up slightly quickly then stopped his inputs for a split-second, he would’ve picked the pass off.

    Look at it again, that rw is moving in a way that is completely impossible. He pivots, passes, hits stride and stops on a dime. It looks bad on a vid but if you take into account physics would dictate the RW skating through that shot then the D was perfectly positioned for the 1 timer

    The 'stopping on a dime' I will concede looks bad.. but I suggest you look up something called a Mohawk turn/transition.....

    agreed just one more way offense is OP.

    you can go full speed but pull back while hitting L2 then instantly transition hitting up on the right stick and aiming with left and you will instantly stop and going into 1Timer animation. defense on the other hand has to work much harder to keep with you.
  • Defense is defenetly harder. You have to do everything backwards and you need to follow every step that happen, meticulously. But truth is, I rarely meet a opponent thats playing good D, but I still can't dominate in the offensive zone. Often beacuse they don't give me the time. They don't play D the hard way, they play it with a constant pressure by running against the puck carrier, if they miss, they just pick another, and repeat. Meanwhile he's A.I often is enough good for him to pick up the puck.

    To have the puck, and just dance around, waiting for a mistake to happen, isn't as near as hard. And it feels backwards, like if you play D as it is tended.

    1. You give thoose cross creases fan Boys time to twirl around. Beacuse you don't just rush blind after the puck carrier, you try to read the play instead.

    Often the same guys thats only trying to force cross creases that dont really play defense either. But somehow it feels they got more advantage of just running wild without any other plan then to destroy the puck carrier, in defensive zone and it feels like they have more advantage in the offensive zone cause they allowd to just circle around and wait for that - no look pass- in rocket speed.

    I dont see skill in how they defend and I dont see no skill in only looking for one goal - but yet - I loose, mainly cause I refuse to play anything else then hockey.

    And the same people looks terrified, thoose times were there AI can't save them and the puck ragging dosent work, they skate like little boys on there way to mommy. Don't know were to hide. It's a real pleasure, but unfortunately it takes pretty much good job, before you get them to that stage, against the rope. But when you do, it's real hockey that destroy them.

    Come on EA, get us there everytime, make it hard to turn away from the play, constant looking for that awkward hook pass, force us all to play hockey, I know you can do it! 👍


  • thegarden94
    457 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    The hook pass is just plain stupid and that behind that back pass that you can pass like a missle ,with deadly accuracy tell me EA how can that pass be more accurate and more powerful than on your forehand ,not to mention that it would be physically impossible to make that pass irl ,and let's not forget the backhand pass that you can also pass with deadly accuracy and also just as hard as when your on your forehand ,for the love of God add back some sort of realism back into this series
  • mikeq67
    141 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    Rewarding dmen for playing solid positional defense and being in a passing line with a puck intercept or at least a deflection? Bad

    Rewarding a dmen for constantly charging the puck trying to check or mashing poke check with the puck being in his skates as his terrible defensive effort turns into a rush. Perfectly fine.

    Thats everything I need to know about the god awful trajectory this game continues to be on year after year. Reward terrible play while punishing anything that resembles actual hockey. Rewarded for doing and forcing the same stuff over and over again. Just watch team after team force passes through people, meanwhile I try to utilize a saucer pass and some idiot with his back turned but slightly in the passing line will auto bat the puck out of the air as a defensive play. How in the hell can that make sense to anyone?
  • mikeq67 wrote: »
    Rewarding dmen for playing solid positional defense and being in a passing line with a puck intercept or at least a deflection? Bad

    Rewarding a dmen for constantly charging the puck trying to check or mashing poke check with the puck being in his skates as his terrible defensive effort turns into a rush. Perfectly fine.

    Thats everything I need to know about the god awful trajectory this game continues to be on year after year. Reward terrible play while punishing anything that resembles actual hockey. Rewarded for doing and forcing the same stuff over and over again. Just watch team after team force passes through people, meanwhile I try to utilize a saucer pass and some idiot with his back turned but slightly in the passing line will auto bat the puck out of the air as a defensive play. How in the hell can that make sense to anyone?

    I second this post
  • mikeq67 wrote: »
    Rewarding dmen for playing solid positional defense and being in a passing line with a puck intercept or at least a deflection? Bad

    Rewarding a dmen for constantly charging the puck trying to check or mashing poke check with the puck being in his skates as his terrible defensive effort turns into a rush. Perfectly fine.

    Thats everything I need to know about the god awful trajectory this game continues to be on year after year. Reward terrible play while punishing anything that resembles actual hockey. Rewarded for doing and forcing the same stuff over and over again. Just watch team after team force passes through people, meanwhile I try to utilize a saucer pass and some idiot with his back turned but slightly in the passing line will auto bat the puck out of the air as a defensive play. How in the hell can that make sense to anyone?

    They make they hockey game based on watching Youtube goal highlights. I don't think these guys ever player actual hockey or even seen a full game start to finish. That or cater to hut players who want non stop goals with no gaming balance. Blows my mind why 6s ESHL has same tuner as 1v1 mode Hut.
  • mikeq67 wrote: »
    Rewarding dmen for playing solid positional defense and being in a passing line with a puck intercept or at least a deflection? Bad

    Rewarding a dmen for constantly charging the puck trying to check or mashing poke check with the puck being in his skates as his terrible defensive effort turns into a rush. Perfectly fine.

    Thats everything I need to know about the god awful trajectory this game continues to be on year after year. Reward terrible play while punishing anything that resembles actual hockey. Rewarded for doing and forcing the same stuff over and over again. Just watch team after team force passes through people, meanwhile I try to utilize a saucer pass and some idiot with his back turned but slightly in the passing line will auto bat the puck out of the air as a defensive play. How in the hell can that make sense to anyone?

    They make they hockey game based on watching Youtube goal highlights. I don't think these guys ever player actual hockey or even seen a full game start to finish. That or cater to hut players who want non stop goals with no gaming balance. Blows my mind why 6s ESHL has same tuner as 1v1 mode Hut.

    Hut right now is a horror show
  • Sega82mega
    4308 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    mikeq67 wrote: »
    Rewarding dmen for playing solid positional defense and being in a passing line with a puck intercept or at least a deflection? Bad

    Rewarding a dmen for constantly charging the puck trying to check or mashing poke check with the puck being in his skates as his terrible defensive effort turns into a rush. Perfectly fine.

    Thats everything I need to know about the god awful trajectory this game continues to be on year after year. Reward terrible play while punishing anything that resembles actual hockey. Rewarded for doing and forcing the same stuff over and over again. Just watch team after team force passes through people, meanwhile I try to utilize a saucer pass and some idiot with his back turned but slightly in the passing line will auto bat the puck out of the air as a defensive play. How in the hell can that make sense to anyone?

    Im also one of all thats on your side.

    All though, I am 100% sure, EA don't want it to be this way.

    I see it as EA has a pretty decent product here, but the problem is that 'no one' of the consumers like to use their product as EA wish us to do. Instead 90% of the player base has find a loophole and are doing everything they can to stick to that game - plan.

    And it is a problem, for everyone that buy this game to enjoy hockey in it's most beautiful way, and it's probably exactly the same way of a problem for the developers.

    Its obvious not that easy to prevent this destructive approach many people have when they playing, cause if it was easy, it wouldn’t exist.

    This goes by me, but this close to 'getting thoose people' has EA never been in 5 years, so I still think a patch will bring us home.

    But just beacuse it's so close but still very much frustration to play this guys, it makes it somehow even more hard to handle.

    But I really do think this will be pretty good in the end!

    * Even though it feels longer, the game has only been out for 5-7 weeks, I must try to have some patience and trust. 😏
  • This might sound a bit weird, but does anyone else feels some sort of scripting in online matches? For couple of weeks I have been in this odd limbo in div 3 where I feel like that I am playing pretty well, but I can't get winning streak going on. Obviously the connection and level of lag varies, but I feel like that I have lost absurd amount of games where I am outplaying my opponent but my efforts does nothing to the scoreboard. It's almost like I am destined to lose. Am I sore loser, crazy, or do I need to completely rethink my strategies?
  • thegarden94
    457 posts Member
    edited November 2020
    Zkibu wrote: »
    This might sound a bit weird, but does anyone else feels some sort of scripting in online matches? For couple of weeks I have been in this odd limbo in div 3 where I feel like that I am playing pretty well, but I can't get winning streak going on. Obviously the connection and level of lag varies, but I feel like that I have lost absurd amount of games where I am outplaying my opponent but my efforts does nothing to the scoreboard. It's almost like I am destined to lose. Am I sore loser, crazy, or do I need to completely rethink my strategies?

    It's not you , and you're not crazy ,it's funny you post this because EA has a law suit against them for what you are asking about ,and there is also another thread talking about this also

    https://forums.ea.com/en/nhl/discussion/265214/ea-sports-dynamic-difficulty-adjustment-its-in-the-game#latest

    https://forums.ea.com/en/nhl/discussion/265214/ea-sports-dynamic-difficulty-adjustment-its-in-the-game#latest
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