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Let's talk RP system

The current RP systems ranks you based on W/L. How about we rank up RP, based on the coach grades instead? Why should I lose 500 RP for losing a game because others played terribly? And only gain like 200RP for winning on a team that was "ok"

Replies

  • jrago73
    633 posts Member
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...
  • how about simply allow RP by game ,who play the most instead of winning. that should be more fair for weaker player too.why always the better have the best reward?btw i'm div 3 right now
  • jrago73 wrote: »
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...

    Yeah because they’re horrible and especially if you’re a goalie. Also an A or more Team Play” grade is hard to get if you don’t play a very physical game.

  • how about simply allow RP by game ,who play the most instead of winning. that should be more fair for weaker player too.why always the better have the best reward?btw i'm div 3 right now

    When you play drop-ins, there are allot of people that don't know how to play their positions, why should they be rewarded just as much as someone who is actually playing the game the correct way?
  • how about simply allow RP by game ,who play the most instead of winning. that should be more fair for weaker player too.why always the better have the best reward?btw i'm div 3 right now

    When you play drop-ins, there are allot of people that don't know how to play their positions, why should they be rewarded just as much as someone who is actually playing the game the correct way?

    i had in mind the rivals mode sorry if it was intended for another mode
  • how about simply allow RP by game ,who play the most instead of winning. that should be more fair for weaker player too.why always the better have the best reward?btw i'm div 3 right now

    When you play drop-ins, there are allot of people that don't know how to play their positions, why should they be rewarded just as much as someone who is actually playing the game the correct way?

    i had in mind the rivals mode sorry if it was intended for another mode

    No you're good, it might work better that way for rivals, sorry I usually do drop-ins, lol
  • Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • jrago73 wrote: »
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...

    Coaches grades can be pretty bad but I would still rather take that - even in its current state - than the current W/L binary.
    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • jrago73
    633 posts Member
    IceLion68 wrote: »
    jrago73 wrote: »
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...

    Coaches grades can be pretty bad but I would still rather take that - even in its current state - than the current W/L binary.

    Enjoy those games of all enforcers trying to hit anything that moves and dumping every puck out of the zone to try and work up teamplay. The better solution is no ranking or leaderboards altogether so people focus on trying to help a team win instead of individual rankings or stats, like most athletes in a real sport.
  • IceLion68
    1354 posts Member
    jrago73 wrote: »
    Enjoy those games of all enforcers trying to hit anything that moves and dumping every puck out of the zone to try and work up teamplay.

    Under the old card system I would no question accept this as the explanation/motivation for these behaviours... but I am not sure I believe this is what's actually going on here. Hitting is just, well, fun... and as long as it doesn't result in an odd man rush then I am not sure it's "bad behaviour" Does dumping the puck (at even strength presumably you mean?) actually give you a plus on team play? Even so, the return for playing well individually means nothing if your behaviour torpedos your team's chances of winning - you will straight up still lose RP. I don't really buy this. I feel this is a combination of just bad hockey IQ and "I'll play the way I want". Something someone literally said to me when I pointed out that their "play style" was hurting the team.
    jrago73 wrote: »
    The better solution is no ranking or leaderboards altogether so people focus on trying to help a team win instead of individual rankings or stats, like most athletes in a real sport.

    For the most part, doing things that boost your individual feedback ratings - goals, assists, hits, stick lifts, etc - generally *should* contribute to a team win. I can't think of any specific individual behaviour that contributes positively to someone's gameplay rating yet is detrimental to a team win - if it were properly gauged and balanced. e.g. If you put a hit on someone but if it results in an odd man rush than your net teamplay should be negative - and the game should be very explicit about that. If you dump the puck out of the zone but it results in icing; again, net negative.

    The other thing is if you gut this, you effectively "disappear" the entire progression system... so it would have to be replaced with something...

    At the end of the day I just don't like MY RP being tied to whether or not the rest of my team sucks or not.

    On a higher level, for drop-ins I am not sure that the "team win" is all that much of a personal reward if you drop in with a bunch of strangers and no one talks to one another - the typical scenario. It is a rare occasion when I find a random group that clicks, and has communication and even then, the lobby tends to disintegrate after one game. EASHL dropins doesnt feel like a "real sport" in this regard.
    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • jrago73
    633 posts Member
    Not sure if even strength dumps still add to teamplay, but you sure could tell who was on their grind to an A- back in the legend 3 days. I was just implying that the current cruddy coach grading formula will lead to behavior detrimental to the team if grades will determine your rating.

    Your caveat above about the grades being properly gauged and balanced is exactly my point, I don't think the current system is anywhere near that point. For instance, d man feedback about winning faceoffs.

    Stats need to overlap different categories or those categories changed or eliminated. Clean hits for instance are teamplay, even if it gave up a breakaway. Goals are offense... ok. Passes are teamplay but an assist doesn't help offense grade? Now I'm shooting my rear end trying to score instead of passing. Got a teammate that keeps forcing passes to you while you're in the middle of a crowd, enjoy credit for those turnovers tanking your teamplay.

    I agree that playing on a bad team killing your rp sucks, I just don't agree that a bad coach rating that sucks tanking your rp instead is any better. The system would need work before you could rely on it, and since there have ever been grades of any kind I dont think its been implemented particularly well.
  • jrago73 wrote: »
    IceLion68 wrote: »
    jrago73 wrote: »
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...

    Coaches grades can be pretty bad but I would still rather take that - even in its current state - than the current W/L binary.

    Enjoy those games of all enforcers trying to hit anything that moves and dumping every puck out of the zone to try and work up teamplay. The better solution is no ranking or leaderboards altogether so people focus on trying to help a team win instead of individual rankings or stats, like most athletes in a real sport.

    Anyone that plays that style makes it easy, because they're being super aggressive, which means you play to that, let them try to line up that big hit, just move the puck around, I've taken countless of, "big hits" playing drop-ins, but I've gotten rewarded on a number of occasions. Eventually one of your teammates will open up if the whole team is playing that way. But simple solution imo, just move the puck more.
  • jrago73 wrote: »
    IceLion68 wrote: »
    jrago73 wrote: »
    Because the coach grades needs to be fixed first...

    Coaches grades can be pretty bad but I would still rather take that - even in its current state - than the current W/L binary.

    Enjoy those games of all enforcers trying to hit anything that moves and dumping every puck out of the zone to try and work up teamplay. The better solution is no ranking or leaderboards altogether so people focus on trying to help a team win instead of individual rankings or stats, like most athletes in a real sport.

    Anyone that plays that style makes it easy, because they're being super aggressive, which means you play to that, let them try to line up that big hit, just move the puck around, I've taken countless of, "big hits" playing drop-ins, but I've gotten rewarded on a number of occasions. Eventually one of your teammates will open up if the whole team is playing that way. But simple solution imo, just move the puck more.

    Sorry to interrupt.

    But this: I've taken countless of, "big hits".

    Is so good.

    People is so scared of being hit that they are ready to do anything to avoid it.

    Take some hits sometimes, it can really give you some advantage, aaaand it's hockey!
  • IceLion68
    1354 posts Member
    jrago73 wrote: »
    Your caveat above about the grades being properly gauged and balanced is exactly my point, I don't think the current system is anywhere near that point. For instance, d man feedback about winning faceoffs.
    Yes that one is aparticular fave of mine being a full Dman LOL. That and the missed assignment/odd man rush deduction for being literally the only guy back on 2 on 1s :/
    jrago73 wrote: »

    Stats need to overlap different categories or those categories changed or eliminated. Clean hits for instance are teamplay, even if it gave up a breakaway. Goals are offense... ok. Passes are teamplay but an assist doesn't help offense grade? Now I'm shooting my rear end trying to score instead of passing. Got a teammate that keeps forcing passes to you while you're in the middle of a crowd, enjoy credit for those turnovers tanking your teamplay.
    Ya we are def on the same page I think. Those cases should be a net negatives as I was saying above.
    jrago73 wrote: »
    I agree that playing on a bad team killing your rp sucks, I just don't agree that a bad coach rating that sucks tanking your rp instead is any better. The system would need work before you could rely on it, and since there have ever been grades of any kind I dont think its been implemented particularly well.
    Maybe not. But at least the latter is a *little* more under my control. Regardless, I agree the coach ratings need to be much better either way.
    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • IceLion68
    1354 posts Member
    Anyone that plays that style makes it easy, because they're being super aggressive, which means you play to that, let them try to line up that big hit, just move the puck around, I've taken countless of, "big hits" playing drop-ins, but I've gotten rewarded on a number of occasions. Eventually one of your teammates will open up if the whole team is playing that way. But simple solution imo, just move the puck more.

    To be clear - we are lamenting the people on YOUR OWN TEAM that play this way. Not what anyone on the other team is doing...
    Dad. Gamer. Rocker. Geek.
  • They need to untie it from win/loss record especially in drop in. I can play 100/100/100 and still lose RP because we lose in OT. Why?
  • Either have it go by personal performance(NOT +/- because bad teammates can screw you), or have +350 for a win, and -350 for a loss. None of this nonsense where the Rank of your opponent determines it.
  • FloundinatorQQ
    111 posts Member
    edited March 24
    IceLion68 wrote: »
    Anyone that plays that style makes it easy, because they're being super aggressive, which means you play to that, let them try to line up that big hit, just move the puck around, I've taken countless of, "big hits" playing drop-ins, but I've gotten rewarded on a number of occasions. Eventually one of your teammates will open up if the whole team is playing that way. But simple solution imo, just move the puck more.

    To be clear - we are lamenting the people on YOUR OWN TEAM that play this way. Not what anyone on the other team is doing...

    My apologies, but playing drop-ins, you're not going to get away from people on your own team that play this way, no matter what you do... the best way to negate this is, when you play people on drop-ins that you actually enjoy playing with and you mesh well, start a club or just play drop-ins with them. But like I said there really isn't a way to get away from people that play that way 100%.
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