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What is EA doing to combat puck ragging?

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  • @EA_Blueberry any word on what the big picture is?
  • EA_Blueberry
    4836 posts EA Community Manager
    @EA_Blueberry any word on what the big picture is?

    We have nothing to officially share right now. I know that isn't the answer you're looking for, but all we unfortunately are aware of on this topic at the moment.
  • an idea to solve a part of ragging is to not let poeple going down division,i mean if someone is division 2 ,he can't no longer going to division 3. At least, we should not have anymore poeple intentionally lose to go down division
  • @EA_Blueberry any word on what the big picture is?

    We have nothing to officially share right now. I know that isn't the answer you're looking for, but all we unfortunately are aware of on this topic at the moment.

    It's the answer I expected though. Thanks anyway.
  • Indeed a great post and what @Jagavekov pointed out is that you don't need to make a direct change to something to fix it when changes to other features will eventually phase the issue out.

    If a weapon in Battlefield is OP, it doesn't mean you need to make changes to it when the developers are designing maps in the future that will make it less effective.

    If a car is too fast, you design tracks in the future that will limit it's potential.

    If ragging the puck is a problem, the team has to decide whether implementing a "band-aid" or they can focus on improving the game by improving other aspects like what was mentioned above. I think it can be difficult for the community to sit on the sidelines and see specific concerns go on unaddressed. It's not that the team doesn't care, it's that they have a bigger picture in mind and all we can really do is ask you to have faith the game ill see continued improvements over time.

    Gamer: "Your game has a major flaw that makes it utterly frustrating and not fun to play!"

    Developer: "Buy next year's version and hope we fixed it (no promises)."
  • MikeyAU630 wrote: »

    Gamer: "Your game has a major flaw that makes it utterly frustrating and not fun to play!"

    Developer: "Buy next year's version and hope we fixed it (no promises)."
    I completely agree with you on this, but I think that one of the big reasons we get this is us, the people who buy this game every year. I have been playing the NHL series since its inception except for a few years from 2001-2006. I was busy being a single dad with 2 babies.

    We all know what the game is like, we all know what the Xbox one/PS4 generation sent this game spiralling down. But we still came back every year hoping it would be better. A few things have gotten better but a whole lot more things have gone to 💩crap💩 but we are still here hoping it will get better.
    In my opinion the only thing will make the game better again is competition, if sales drop to much EA would probably just quit making the game, we need another developer to make a hockey game to push EA into actually having to improve the game. As it sits now why would they pump any money into a money maker with no competition.
  • Remember when it was actually FUN to play this game??? Lmao. what a joke this game has turned into. This isn't a hockey game. Nobody plays Hockey...every game I play is cross crease goals all day. And if they can't get a cross crease its skate in circles until they get the cross crease. I lose games 5-4. 6-3 -10-3. And they are averaging 10 to 11 shots a game. Lmao. I will never buy this game again. As long as their is 97 mathews,gretzky,Mario, lindros,Ovechkin,mcdavid and all the other usual suspects on EVERYONES TEAM , I will not buy this game. I'm not a bad player. I'm actually pretty good, but you cannot stop these players because they are so over inflated with attributes and all that other garbage. It's impossible for an average 90 overall team to compete. You can say all you want it's more about the person holding the controller and I will tell you that it's an absolute bunch of LIES. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CONTROLLER IN THE HAND AND WVWRYTHING TO DO WITH THE RIDICULIUS OVERRATED PLAYERS.. FIX THIS GAME. STOP WITH THE RIDICULOUS PLAYER RATINGS. ITS NOT FUN, ITS NOT REALISTIC. ITS NOT HOCKEY!!!!!!!!!!
  • As I said before, the fact that ragging, among other things, are not being dealt with are clear and intentional decisions. If they wanted to get rid of, or change things, they would. Since they aren't, you have no choice but to move forward under the impression that they are perfectly fine with whatever gripe, in this case puck raggers, you have.
  • MikeyAU630 wrote: »
    Indeed a great post and what @Jagavekov pointed out is that you don't need to make a direct change to something to fix it when changes to other features will eventually phase the issue out.

    If a weapon in Battlefield is OP, it doesn't mean you need to make changes to it when the developers are designing maps in the future that will make it less effective.

    If a car is too fast, you design tracks in the future that will limit it's potential.

    If ragging the puck is a problem, the team has to decide whether implementing a "band-aid" or they can focus on improving the game by improving other aspects like what was mentioned above. I think it can be difficult for the community to sit on the sidelines and see specific concerns go on unaddressed. It's not that the team doesn't care, it's that they have a bigger picture in mind and all we can really do is ask you to have faith the game ill see continued improvements over time.

    Gamer: "Your game has a major flaw that makes it utterly frustrating and not fun to play!"

    Developer: "Buy next year's version and hope we fixed it (no promises)."

    Lol this is spot on, absolutely perfect and exactly what happened. Well done sir
  • quartermaine28
    49 posts Member
    edited April 2021
    Jagavekov wrote: »
    How about a delay of game penalty like in real life?

    I just think that is a band aid, and the exploiters will just find a way around it.

    If the developers address the source of the problem directly - what enables a team to play keep away for so long in this game without consequences - then it would be a much better solution and have a positive impact on the rest of the game.

    They need to get together and watch some actual NHL hockey, and specifically watch NHL teams deal with forecheck pressure, and then think "What is different about this from NHL 21?". Why don't teams winning by a goal in game 7 of the Cup Finals just rag the puck? They want to win the cup pretty bad right? So why don't they just play keep away while the clock runs down like people do in competitive modes in this game?

    It is because it is difficult to keep possession of the puck for long periods in real hockey. The puck carrier can't escape pressure with insane acelleration and agility, their time and space is limited by the boards (which essentially don't exist in NHL 21), passing to players you can't see and from awkward angles is extremely difficult, and pucks can be bobbled as result of too much stickhandling or making difficult passes/receptions. So there is a much greater risk involved, and a mistake in this scenario can result in a high quality chance against.

    These changes wouldn't just reduce puck ragging, but make the game better, more realistic, and a little sloppier and more unpredictable in every zone.

    Instead of using fast players to figure skate and spin and skate backwards and cross crease, you go off the glass or dump-in and use fast players to forecheck and pressure d-men and cause turnovers and score that way, like actual hockey. Maybe then 99% of people in this game wouldn't play the 0-5 trap.


    This is a great post. Too bad they only focus on the first paragraph.

    Indeed a great post and what @Jagavekov pointed out is that you don't need to make a direct change to something to fix it when changes to other features will eventually phase the issue out.

    If a weapon in Battlefield is OP, it doesn't mean you need to make changes to it when the developers are designing maps in the future that will make it less effective.

    If a car is too fast, you design tracks in the future that will limit it's potential.

    If ragging the puck is a problem, the team has to decide whether implementing a "band-aid" or they can focus on improving the game by improving other aspects like what was mentioned above. I think it can be difficult for the community to sit on the sidelines and see specific concerns go on unaddressed. It's not that the team doesn't care, it's that they have a bigger picture in mind and all we can really do is ask you to have faith the game ill see continued improvements over time.

    We've seen literally zero improvements since the game was released, and it's beyond halfway through its lifecycle. Respectfully, it's massively insulting and also asinine that you'd ask anyone who's ever played this game to have faith in developers who have improved nothing all year.

    If you're asking us to have faith that it'll be better next year, the same applies. I've spent more than I care to share on DLC. For you to think that I'll blindly trust EA when you say "we know we've done absolutely nothing, but just trust us, we will eventually, have faith"....... absolutely not.

    When you invest a lot of time and money in a product, and you find flaws in it (the same flaws that thousands of other customers have found), and you bring it to the producer of that product, and that producer says "yeah we know it's frustrating, but that's all we're going to tell you. We won't commit to fixing it. We won't even confirm that we're attempting to fix it. But you should have faith in us and buy it again."...... are you kidding me? Seriously, that's a joke right?

    I like hockey video games but I don't love them enough to get slapped in the face by EA again next year with another game where you get puck ragged with no recourse. I'll play NBA2K, and if I miss NHL games, I'll go to some NHL forum somewhere and read the same complaints next year about how you've still done nothing to fix ragging. If nothing else, I guess I should say thanks for saving me the money I would have spent on NHL next year.
  • GrundleDemon333
    107 posts Member
    edited June 2021
    EA_Aljo wrote: »
    EA_Aljo wrote: »

    You shouldn't be letting someone freely skate circles around their net for a whole period. You can force them to do otherwise. Yes, I know this means they pass the puck to a teammate and continue to keep it away. I'm not debating how frustrating this is and how it shouldn't be in the game. We have to be careful with what features are added to stop this though. There are people that legitimately use their own zone to set up a breakout. I do this very frequently to get through the NZ trap. I wouldn't want to be slapped with a delay of game penalty because I need to work the puck between my teammates to pull the trap out of position and breakout.

    We have not added anything to the Terms of Service that states ragging is a bannable offense. It's a cheap move and unsportsmanlike, but it's not going to get you banned. We also frequently see posts from people showing how they stopped someone from ragging and made them pay for using that tactic so it's not exactly impossible to stop them. Regardless, we'd all love to see ragging come to an end, but it's got to be done right. So far, a perfect solution hasn't been found.

    Obviously, no one is letting raggers skate in circles. You pursue them and they escape.

    No one "legitimately uses their own zone to set up a breakout" by skating and cycling in their own zone for an entire period.

    There are plenty of times I and other players have made someone pay for ragging. Full forecheck 2-3 turn up the heat, yeah, we get it. And yeah, it's not exactly impossible. But to stop it efficiently and often (and get it done quickly) is nearly impossible.

    There's absolutely zero reason not to add this to ToS as a bannable offense. None. I'd love to hear a single one. You can report people for killing teammates in first person shooters. You can report people for intentionally wrecking in racing games. You can even get booted from online races for driving backwards. Those offenses get reported, reviewed, and acted upon. There's no reason that can't happen here. If that adds a lot of manual effort for EA to review, I couldn't possibly care less and don't want to hear the slightest bit of whining about it. EA can take some of the 1.49 billion, that's billion with a B, dollars they made off of selling UT content in 2020 and put some of that towards hiring entry level staff to do those reviews (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sportbible.com/football/gaming-news-the-figures-behind-ea-sports-net-revenue-from-ultimate-team-20200521.amp.html). If people abuse that report function, warn them and take action if necessary.

    Ragging isn't simply a "cheap move and unsportsmanlike", it's exploiting poorly compiled AI by doing something that absolutely never happens in real hockey. Ever. Minimizing it (and the effect it has on the user experience) by only calling it cheap and unsportsmanlike is what enables and motivates people to use it as a strategy. Why do you think so many players say "Yeah you like that? Want some more?" after they do it? There's zero consequence. Put it in the ToS until you implement the proper mechanics.

    Also, there's no perfect solution and never will be. Saying the solution has to be perfect is essentially saying "Yeah we could implement something that improves the user experience for everyone by removing a massive vulnerability and problem and replacing it with a minor inconvenience, which would be a net gain, but no. We prefer not to bring a problem down from massive to minor, and instead will wait for a miracle". Put a survey out and ask people "would you rather continue getting puckragged as often as you do, especially in HUT Champs, or would you rather have to potentially deal with an inaccurate delay of game penalty once every 200 games or so (assuming you spend a lot of time in your own zone)?" Pretty obvious what the answer will be. By saying the solution had to be perfect, you might as well say it's never coming.

    This isn't hard to fix, there just has to be a desire to fix it; EA clearly has no desire to. Put it in the ToS. Improve the AI learning to pick up patterns so that your AI teammates actually help you stop it. Give people a delay of game penalty if they've had uninterrupted possession of the puck within their own zone for five minutes. Give me one good reason why any of those wouldn't work.

    Or, just admit that EA isn't touching it for 21, because they don't find value in correcting a major programming issue for a game whose life cycle is half over, and own up to the fact that the most toxic part of NHL 21 exists because EA enables it.

    1.49 billion dollars made in just one year off of DLC and yet the customers who hand you that cash are still forced to deal with elementary toxic garbage gameplay flaws like this?

    I never said it shouldn't be a bannable offense. It currently isn't so someone isn't going to get banned for it. The problem with having it automated is that it runs the risk of legit players getting called for skating back to their own zone. I don't mean for a whole period. I mean for long enough to make a line change, or maybe make several passes to break up the NZ trap. There are times it most likely looks like I'm ragging because I don't bolt for my offensive zone as fast as I can. I wouldn't want to get an unnecessary delay of game penalty or have someone report me for ragging when that's not what I'm doing.

    I'll say it again. If this wasn't hard to fix, it would have been done already. You're not considering the knock effects from having a solution like blowing a tire or a delay of game penalty. Those can be manipulated and avoided. What's to stop someone from passing when they figure out how long it takes to get a delay of game penalty? What would stop them from passing to a teammate before fatigue causes them to blow a tire?

    We want the same thing here, but you're assuming it's a simple issue to resolve. I truly wish it were.

    @EA_Aljo, if it is true that EA truly has worked hard to resolve this massive issue, but has been unable to come up with literally anything workable, let the community help by sharing with us what EA has tried and why it does not/will not work. We'll brainstorm around this. Let's solve it. There is no way that it is just too difficult an issue for any and all potential solutions. Why not just make it a delay of game penalty if you spend more than X seconds of the last minute in your own zone while no opposing players are present in the zone? Won't something like that work?

    Right now, your game literally encourages this at the very highest level because it is an easy way to get a win while leading. It can't be just a matter of blaming the "poor sportsmanship" of these players, because people are competitive and will do what it takes to win. It's really that simple. Your celebrated "elite" and top-ranked players do this to get the W. Happened to me 3 times last night playing Vs. against players with CR near 1000. This is how you advance in this game.

    As has been well-established now, it is just far too easy to do because the devs have chosen to go the route of unrealistic gameplay when it comes to the physics/collisions (hits and shoves have no/little impact on the puck carrier at low speeds, allowing the puck carrier to drag sticks through solid objects, etc.), and puck magnetism (vs. a realistic loose puck which makes such behavior far riskier), and of course, horrifically useless AI.

    If the devs are going to continue with their meta of the fanciful, it needs to be balanced with something to protect against the further nonsense it encourages. Devs shrugging their shoulders can't be the response.
    Post edited by GrundleDemon333 on
  • EA_Aljo
    3229 posts EA Community Manager

    @EA_Aljo, if it is true that EA truly has worked hard to resolve this massive issue, but has been unable to come up with literally anything workable, let the community help by sharing with us what EA has tried and why it does not/will not work. We'll brainstorm around this. Let's solve it. There is no way that it is just too difficult an issue for any and all potential solutions. Why not just make it a delay of game penalty if you spend more than X seconds of the last minute in your own zone while no opposing players are present in the zone? Won't something like that work?

    The problem with this is that they can just leave the zone and reset the clock. People will figure out how to get around this. Regardless, I get your point and I promise you that ragging is something we'd all like to see resolved. Again, it's not as simple as many think.
    Right now, your game literally encourages this at the very highest level because it is an easy way to get a win while leading. It can't be just a matter of blaming the "poor sportsmanship" of these players, because people are competitive and will do what it takes to win. It's really that simple. Your celebrated "elite" and top-ranked players do this to get the W. Happened to me 3 times last night playing Vs. against players with CR near 1000. This is how you advance in this game.

    We're not encouraging this behavior. It's not like there's a tip that pops up on loading screens telling you to rag the puck. Just like we don't offer tips saying you should backskate into the opposing zone. No matter the game, the community is going to find the easiest way to win and employ those tactics. We don't want to just remove mechanics that are good for the game, but are also exploited. We need to find a better way to encourage more realistic play from people without sacrificing those mechanics. I think we can all agree backskating has its time and place on offense, but obviously some take it too far. We don't want to punish the good with the bad so an appropriate solution isn't terribly easy to implement.
    As has been well-established now, it is just far too easy to do because the devs have chosen to go the route of unrealistic gameplay when it comes to the physics/collisions (hits and shoves have no/little impact on the puck carrier at low speeds, allowing the puck carrier to drag sticks through solid objects, etc.), and puck magnetism (vs. a realistic loose puck which makes such behavior far riskier), and of course, horrifically useless AI.

    There are technical reasons for sticks dragging through solid objects. While the outcome isn't exactly unrealistic with the puck being dislodged, I get the optics of it. I would love to see that change. As far as hits go, if we have players too easily impacted at low speeds, we get the complaints that you breathe on a player and they lose the puck. There are different variables considered with these. Physical momentum of players, the angles they take, the directions they are traveling and facing and player ratings to name some. Every low-speed hit isn't going to have a big impact as the bigger the hit from higher speed is going to have a bigger result. Keep in mind, the game is supposed to mimic pro players. They don't always lose the puck with every low-speed collision.
    If the devs are going to continue with their meta of the fanciful, it needs to be balanced with something to protect against the further nonsense it encourages. Devs shrugging their shoulders can't be the response.

    There is no shrugging of shoulders. I get you don't see responses from devs these days, but that doesn't mean you're being ignored. There's a huge amount of feedback gathered across various channels that goes into the game each year.
  • GrundleDemon333
    107 posts Member
    edited June 2021
    EA_Aljo wrote: »

    The problem with this is that they can just leave the zone and reset the clock. People will figure out how to get around this. Regardless, I get your point and I promise you that ragging is something we'd all like to see resolved. Again, it's not as simple as many think.

    But that's why I proposed that the clock not reset when they leave the zone, but instead be cumulative as against say, "the last minute" of play. There's no legit, justifiable reason for a player to be spending 15 or 20 seconds per minute of play in their own zone, especially when there are no opposing players in their zone.

    We're not encouraging this behavior. It's not like there's a tip that pops up on loading screens telling you to rag the puck. Just like we don't offer tips saying you should backskate into the opposing zone. No matter the game, the community is going to find the easiest way to win and employ those tactics. We don't want to just remove mechanics that are good for the game, but are also exploited. We need to find a better way to encourage more realistic play from people without sacrificing those mechanics. I think we can all agree backskating has its time and place on offense, but obviously some take it too far. We don't want to punish the good with the bad so an appropriate solution isn't terribly easy to implement.

    Okay, but what about when the mechanics are not good or realistic to begin with? The objective bar needs to be the real world--not disney world. The puck does not need to be unrealistically magnetized to the puck carrier's stick. The devs made that call, presumably to artificially support more offense. Same with nerfing of hits at low speeds and back turning. Same with the ability to do all sorts of things on offense with no accountability, like no wind-up, back-hand no-look laser tape-to-tape passes. These things don't exist in the real world, which is also why ragging in your own zone doesn't work in the real world, as others have explained above.
    There are technical reasons for sticks dragging through solid objects. While the outcome isn't exactly unrealistic with the puck being dislodged, I get the optics of it. I would love to see that change. As far as hits go, if we have players too easily impacted at low speeds, we get the complaints that you breathe on a player and they lose the puck. There are different variables considered with these. Physical momentum of players, the angles they take, the directions they are traveling and facing and player ratings to name some. Every low-speed hit isn't going to have a big impact as the bigger the hit from higher speed is going to have a bigger result. Keep in mind, the game is supposed to mimic pro players. They don't always lose the puck with every low-speed collision.

    Okay, but see above. Why in the world did/should those that "complain that you breathe on a player and they lose the puck" carry the day??? There is not a "breathing" button or mechanic in this game. So losing the puck would be the result of contact that you failed to avoid. The puck is loose in an NHL hockey game. And that's one of the reasons they can't rag in the real world like you can in this game. Puck carrying is FAR more easily disrupted in real life. Avg. puck possession in the NHL lasts 2-3 seconds at most. That's objectively true. The real world should always win over the complaining of the twitch streamers that they should be able drag the puck through an entire team. Right now, the devs and their twitch friends seem to prefer disney world to the real world. A looser puck would help move this game forward light years, but we're stuck with devs who have been moving in the opposite direction year after year. So, we at least need a specific penalty or tweak to the rules as a counter-balance. Let's create one.
    There is no shrugging of shoulders. I get you don't see responses from devs these days, but that doesn't mean you're being ignored. There's a huge amount of feedback gathered across various channels that goes into the game each year.

    That's great to hear that the devs say they are listening, but they have not even attempted to implement anything on this issue over YEARS, right? So what about my opening proposition to get this actually solved .... "let the community help by sharing with us what EA has tried and why it does not/will not work. We'll brainstorm around this. Let's solve it." Is EA not willing to do that with us? You seem to be saying that it is too difficult, and we're saying we're here to help. Let's do this.
  • The best solution to this problem is to make the skating, passing, and stickhandling mechanics less forgiving and more realistic. The reason puck ragging happens so much in this game is because the risk of committing a costly turnover from doing it is minimal. If it were easier to force turnovers, due to a combination of less forgiving skating, passing, and stickhandling mechanics, then puck ragging wouldn't be a problem. How many times in a real NHL game to you see a player just chip the puck up ice or out of the zone to avoid pressure? (A lot) And how often does that happen in this game? (Never)

    Think about why NHL teams don't puck rag to win. Not because there is a timer or because they will get a penalty, but because they may commit a turnover that could lead to a chance/goal against. That just has to happen more frequently and easily in the video game.

    As long as puck carriers have insane acceleration and agility, can make perfect behind the back no look backhand passes, and can run into the boards with no consequences, puck ragging will be an issue. This is also why there is barely any neutral zone play or dump-ins in this game, but I guess that is a topic for another day.
  • EA_Aljo
    3229 posts EA Community Manager

    But that's why I proposed that the clock not reset when they leave the zone, but instead be cumulative as against say, "the last minute" of play. There's no legit, justifiable reason for a player to be spending 15 or 20 seconds per minute of play in their own zone, especially when there are no opposing players in their zone.

    You could still most likely skate farther up the ice and drop the puck back to kill time. I'm not saying what you're proposing is a bad idea at all. It just stands a chance to be worked around. We all want to see ragging removed. I know the dev team wants this too, but a good solution that actually works needs to be put in place.
    Okay, but what about when the mechanics are not good or realistic to begin with? The objective bar needs to be the real world--not disney world. The puck does not need to be unrealistically magnetized to the puck carrier's stick. The devs made that call, presumably to artificially support more offense. Same with nerfing of hits at low speeds and back turning. Same with the ability to do all sorts of things on offense with no accountability, like no wind-up, back-hand no-look laser tape-to-tape passes. These things don't exist in the real world, which is also why ragging in your own zone doesn't work in the real world, as others have explained above.

    The mechanics are a lot more realistic than they were in the 360/PS3 days. The puck is far looser as well. You used to be able to take a slapshot and have the puck stop moving while you wound up. You could also skate sideways, across your blades. While physics are far better than they used to be, I doubt it's ever going to be a 1:1 recreation of real-world physics. Sticks passing through objects is a good example of that. Sticks pass through due to technical reasons, but the puck is loose. If it were glued to the stick, the puck would drag through skates as well.

    I agree on the no look passes. I'd like to see the accuracy go down. While they aren't exactly unheard of in the real world, they're too easy to pull off in the game.
    Okay, but see above. Why in the world did/should those that "complain that you breathe on a player and they lose the puck" carry the day??? There is not a "breathing" button or mechanic in this game. So losing the puck would be the result of contact that you failed to avoid. The puck is loose in an NHL hockey game. And that's one of the reasons they can't rag in the real world like you can in this game. Puck carrying is FAR more easily disrupted in real life. Avg. puck possession in the NHL lasts 2-3 seconds at most. That's objectively true. The real world should always win over the complaining of the twitch streamers that they should be able drag the puck through an entire team. Right now, the devs and their twitch friends seem to prefer disney world to the real world. A looser puck would help move this game forward light years, but we're stuck with devs who have been moving in the opposite direction year after year. So, we at least need a specific penalty or tweak to the rules as a counter-balance. Let's create one.

    My average possession is probably 2 - 3 seconds. I do a ton of passing because it helps me retain possession and set up plays. The more I have it, the less chance my opponent gets to score. So, I constantly pass the puck around to create better breakouts and catch players out of position when I'm in their zone. When I go up against guys that don't pass much, I put a ton of pressure on the carrier. A lot of people like to play a more passive defense. That's just going to let them hang on to the puck more.

    As I said, we listen to players from different channels. It's not only Twitch. Can you get me that video of the puck being dragged through an entire team? I'm not saying it can't happen, but I'd like to see how they pulled it off.

  • GrundleDemon333
    107 posts Member
    edited June 2021
    Jagavekov wrote: »
    The best solution to this problem is to make the skating, passing, and stickhandling mechanics less forgiving and more realistic. The reason puck ragging happens so much in this game is because the risk of committing a costly turnover from doing it is minimal. If it were easier to force turnovers, due to a combination of less forgiving skating, passing, and stickhandling mechanics, then puck ragging wouldn't be a problem. How many times in a real NHL game to you see a player just chip the puck up ice or out of the zone to avoid pressure? (A lot) And how often does that happen in this game? (Never)

    Think about why NHL teams don't puck rag to win. Not because there is a timer or because they will get a penalty, but because they may commit a turnover that could lead to a chance/goal against. That just has to happen more frequently and easily in the video game.

    As long as puck carriers have insane acceleration and agility, can make perfect behind the back no look backhand passes, and can run into the boards with no consequences, puck ragging will be an issue. This is also why there is barely any neutral zone play or dump-ins in this game, but I guess that is a topic for another day.


    Could not agree more.

    My penalty proposal was based on the assumption that there is virtually zero chance of getting these devs to retreat from the fanciful puck-carrier abilities they've been fostering and selling the last 5 or so years now. I would take a delay of game penalty over nothing, but you're 100% correct. The gameplay is just astoundingly poor insofar as realism and balance is concerned. Unfortunately there is zero indication they care, or would be willing to lift a finger to address it (hell, we couldn't get a single gameplay update for the entire year).

    Post edited by GrundleDemon333 on
  • EA_Aljo wrote: »

    You could still most likely skate farther up the ice and drop the puck back to kill time. I'm not saying what you're proposing is a bad idea at all. It just stands a chance to be worked around. We all want to see ragging removed. I know the dev team wants this too, but a good solution that actually works needs to be put in place.

    Yeah, maybe, maybe not. I'm totally open to having my ideas shot down or refined. Again, what exactly have the devs have tried, and what have they not tried? We have no idea. Perhaps it was unintentional, but you have twice ignored my core proposal to help get this fixed (since that is apparently what the devs also want): "let the community help by sharing with us what EA has tried and why it does not/will not work. We'll brainstorm around this. Let's solve it." You seem to be saying that it is too difficult, and we're saying we're here to help. Let's do this.

    And thanks for the responses. It is appreciated.
  • Why do people rag? Because they can, because EA created a team game where your team doesn't matter most of the time. Take one player and spin and spin, don't forget to break your arms to get the puck behind you and then spin some more. Or don't move at all, break your arms to get the puck behind you and watch other players bounce off. Only pass for a cross crease attempt. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. Either way the focus is on the puck carrier and the puck carrier alone.

    I think the solution is obvious. Like in the past blowing a tire is a part of it. Another part is to nerf the puck protection and the bubble it causes.
  • EA_Aljo
    3229 posts EA Community Manager
    EA_Aljo wrote: »

    You could still most likely skate farther up the ice and drop the puck back to kill time. I'm not saying what you're proposing is a bad idea at all. It just stands a chance to be worked around. We all want to see ragging removed. I know the dev team wants this too, but a good solution that actually works needs to be put in place.

    Yeah, maybe, maybe not. I'm totally open to having my ideas shot down or refined. Again, what exactly have the devs have tried, and what have they not tried? We have no idea. Perhaps it was unintentional, but you have twice ignored my core proposal to help get this fixed (since that is apparently what the devs also want): "let the community help by sharing with us what EA has tried and why it does not/will not work. We'll brainstorm around this. Let's solve it." You seem to be saying that it is too difficult, and we're saying we're here to help. Let's do this.

    And thanks for the responses. It is appreciated.

    I'm not trying to ignore you. I don't have the details you're asking for. If we have something to share, we'll post it. You're welcome to keep providing ideas and they'll get passed on to the dev team.
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