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Everything Wrong With UFC 3s New Striking...

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Obviously, this isn't going to be everything, just the very big gameplay changes I hope they make for UFC 4.

1. The biggest problem with the gameplay is the imaginary force field between fighters. It's completely unrealistic and really hurts the experience. In real life if you can smother someone's punches and/or enter clinch range simply by getting close enough to your opponent.

2. The controls aren't intuitive. And worse, we're being asked to hold both the trigger and bumper on the same side at the same time. On PS4 that is very uncomfortable to do. Make better use of the D-Pad.

3. The striking power is tuned badly overall (single punches are powerful enough unless thrown while countering), but then you also have certain strikes that are oddly overpowered or underpowered. Throwing a body kick that is caught does no damage. Catching a kick and then throwing a straight while holding the leg is almost an automatic health event. This is complete nonsense I'm guessing is meant to keep people from body kicking too often. Also, why can't you block while you're leg is caught? What about someone holding my leg makes my arms no longer work?

4. The block drain is completely unrealistic. That's not at all how blocking works. The system needs to be based on accuracy, block rating, and potential bleed through. Turtling up against the cage is not a good strategy not because your arms will get tired, but because punches will get throuh.

5. Uppercuts and hooks don't have enough range. You're going to have to blend a few animations so that you can still uppercut someone close to you, but that you can also step forward and uppercut someone who's in your kicking range.

6. Health events are too easy to trigger (fighters aren't knocked down that often). And leg health events don't cause any visible issues to your ability to move, kick, grapple, etc. You leg being damaged affects everything about you in real life. Especially movement.

7. Too many fights ended with jabs. The chin rating should have a lowest point. And that lowest point should be above what a jab can do dish out. This is especially true of the smallest divisions where knockouts aren't as common. Seriously, whens the last time you saw someone KO'd unconscious via jab?

8. There are too many long drawn out animations that can't be interrupted. People are learning that after a knockdown you have to wait for the entire animation to play out before resuming your attack. It's silly, in real life you can punch or tackle someone as they are in the process of getting back up.

9. Most basic movements don't affect stamina. This is why heavyweight fights don't feel as different from flyweight fights as they should. Heavyweights in real life don't move as much. They don't have as much energy to waste dancing.

10. Last thing on the list... the HUD! This is the comment that got the most support from the beta and it went ignored. In a fight I shouldn't be able to see exactly how tired or hurt you are. I should have to watch for physical cues. Please for online ranked turn off your opponents HUD.

Ok. That's enough for now. Tried to limit this to just striking. And things that aren't just what I like, but obvious things that affect the whole community. Also, tried to keep it constructive so hopefully everyone else does as well. With that said, feel free to add anything I missed, and hopefully the devs see this.

Replies

  • Agree with everything . Would also add KO animation still looks pretty terrible . It’s like 80% animation 20% rag doll , and the way they fall never looks realistic or satisfying . If I KO someone clean they’re not gonna topple over in their knees and lay on their side , they’re gonna collapse , shut off , completely . You just don’t see that .

    And let’s not get started on the ground game *cringe*
  • Obviously, this isn't going to be everything, just the very big gameplay changes I hope they make for UFC 4.

    1. The biggest problem with the gameplay is the imaginary force field between fighters. It's completely unrealistic and really hurts the experience. In real life if you can smother someone's punches and/or enter clinch range simply by getting close enough to your opponent.

    2. The controls aren't intuitive. And worse, we're being asked to hold both the trigger and bumper on the same side at the same time. On PS4 that is very uncomfortable to do. Make better use of the D-Pad.

    3. The striking power is tuned badly overall (single punches are powerful enough unless thrown while countering), but then you also have certain strikes that are oddly overpowered or underpowered. Throwing a body kick that is caught does no damage. Catching a kick and then throwing a straight while holding the leg is almost an automatic health event. This is complete nonsense I'm guessing is meant to keep people from body kicking too often. Also, why can't you block while you're leg is caught? What about someone holding my leg makes my arms no longer work?

    4. The block drain is completely unrealistic. That's not at all how blocking works. The system needs to be based on accuracy, block rating, and potential bleed through. Turtling up against the cage is not a good strategy not because your arms will get tired, but because punches will get throuh.

    5. Uppercuts and hooks don't have enough range. You're going to have to blend a few animations so that you can still uppercut someone close to you, but that you can also step forward and uppercut someone who's in your kicking range.

    6. Health events are too easy to trigger (fighters aren't knocked down that often). And leg health events don't cause any visible issues to your ability to move, kick, grapple, etc. You leg being damaged affects everything about you in real life. Especially movement.

    7. Too many fights ended with jabs. The chin rating should have a lowest point. And that lowest point should be above what a jab can do dish out. This is especially true of the smallest divisions where knockouts aren't as common. Seriously, whens the last time you saw someone KO'd unconscious via jab?

    8. There are too many long drawn out animations that can't be interrupted. People are learning that after a knockdown you have to wait for the entire animation to play out before resuming your attack. It's silly, in real life you can punch or tackle someone as they are in the process of getting back up.

    9. Most basic movements don't affect stamina. This is why heavyweight fights don't feel as different from flyweight fights as they should. Heavyweights in real life don't move as much. They don't have as much energy to waste dancing.

    10. Last thing on the list... the HUD! This is the comment that got the most support from the beta and it went ignored. In a fight I shouldn't be able to see exactly how tired or hurt you are. I should have to watch for physical cues. Please for online ranked turn off your opponents HUD.

    Ok. That's enough for now. Tried to limit this to just striking. And things that aren't just what I like, but obvious things that affect the whole community. Also, tried to keep it constructive so hopefully everyone else does as well. With that said, feel free to add anything I missed, and hopefully the devs see this.

    The imaginary force field is hilarious, if you're dashing forward while your opponent dashes backwards you get pushed by it away from them.
  • Exactly. The pre selected combos is pure horse ****
  • I agree 100%. There is so much wrong with this game it’s staggering trying to wrap my head around it.
  • One of the features boasted in EA's Fight Night Champion was the removal of the force field around the boxers. Almost 7 years later and it's back.

    It would actually be cool if moving into clinch range automatically initiated the clinch.
  • Also the awful sound effects for punches and kicks are way over the top
  • Alper_Turco
    5 posts Member
    edited February 2018
    Agree 100% !

    The striking feels so uncomfortable. You have to put your fingers on all buttons at the same time. Who the hell thought this was a good idea at EA ? The striking controls were actually pretty good in UFC 2. Im so frustrated with the controls, I´m about to sell this game again. This is the only reason I signed up in this forum lol.

    GIVE US THE OLD CONTROLS EA
  • I definitely agree with the previous posts. The force field effect is definitely present in certain situations as if there is a barrier between your fighter and your opponent even if you're in range. I've experienced input lag in most of the fights that i've had. When looking at the various combination list for the fighters I feel like i'm looking at the combo list for Marvel vs. Capcom or Street Fighter V. This isn't a fighting game, but the game requires you to memorize a bunch of combos along with pushing several buttons at the same time like a fighting game. I'm torn with the movement; sometimes it feels good with the sways and dodging, sometimes it feels like i'm skating. One thing I wish they would have kept from UFC 2 was the control scheme for blocking. I've noticed even when i'm facing opponents that the body and leg is even less blocked than in UFC 2. Having one button for blocking up high and one for low is definitely easier than having to use two buttons to block considering the fact that leg kicks causes more health events and leg health doesn't regenerate.
  • As it the game gets more realistic it’s called Learn to actually fight or not but don’t complain about such stuff when it’s not far from realistic. It’s their fault to provide players with every type of combo to non fighters. Hooks & uppercuts are in perfect range. Quit that smack.
  • I think ground game should change ... It is so hard to get up against grapplers and when they take you down to the ground no matter what round or what time in the game , it is GG time ! So it makes game so annoying ...
  • The striking is the worse, and that drain blocking is the worse thing i ever seen in fighting game.. Even the ai just spamming the jab like ****, haha..
  • As it the game gets more realistic it’s called Learn to actually fight or not but don’t complain about such stuff when it’s not far from realistic. It’s their fault to provide players with every type of combo to non fighters. Hooks & uppercuts are in perfect range. Quit that smack.

    Not far from realistic? Lol.
    On average in this game you can throw and lands 50 -70 standing strikes per minute if you don't spam and your stamina doesn't rapidly deplete. The average strikes per minute in real life on average are around 9-10 strikes per minute. In real life you also cannot stand and throw several fast snap jabs at super speed.

    on average in any single round no fighter has every been rocked 12+ times or more times, you can easily check these stats online.

    No fighter would be able to take being rocked 20 times in a round without being stopped.

    If a fighter did land 50-70 standing power strikes per minute every **** fighter in the world would have brain damaged.

    If a fighter got rocked and dropped 15 plus times in real life the ref would stop the fight for the fighters safety.

    Also the invisible force field that surrounds both fighters, that if you dash in towards your opponent of they dash back the force field pushes you away.

    Or the fact that it sounds like hitting stone with a hammer every time you hit someone.

    It's much more unrealistic and arcadey
  • Don't forget being able to catch about every body kick that gets thrown and then combine that with the automatic rock when you get hit.
  • Jamiea1862 wrote: »
    As it the game gets more realistic it’s called Learn to actually fight or not but don’t complain about such stuff when it’s not far from realistic. It’s their fault to provide players with every type of combo to non fighters. Hooks & uppercuts are in perfect range. Quit that smack.

    Not far from realistic? Lol.
    On average in this game you can throw and lands 50 -70 standing strikes per minute if you don't spam and your stamina doesn't rapidly deplete. The average strikes per minute in real life on average are around 9-10 strikes per minute. In real life you also cannot stand and throw several fast snap jabs at super speed.

    on average in any single round no fighter has every been rocked 12+ times or more times, you can easily check these stats online.

    No fighter would be able to take being rocked 20 times in a round without being stopped.

    If a fighter did land 50-70 standing power strikes per minute every **** fighter in the world would have brain damaged.

    If a fighter got rocked and dropped 15 plus times in real life the ref would stop the fight for the fighters safety.

    Also the invisible force field that surrounds both fighters, that if you dash in towards your opponent of they dash back the force field pushes you away.

    Or the fact that it sounds like hitting stone with a hammer every time you hit someone.

    It's much more unrealistic and arcadey
    Yo guy . They obviously want you to enjoy the game .The stand up mechanics is quite real is what I’m saying not the very physical part of it. Lol
  • Jamiea1862
    80 posts Member
    edited February 2018
    Jamiea1862 wrote: »
    As it the game gets more realistic it’s called Learn to actually fight or not but don’t complain about such stuff when it’s not far from realistic. It’s their fault to provide players with every type of combo to non fighters. Hooks & uppercuts are in perfect range. Quit that smack.

    Not far from realistic? Lol.
    On average in this game you can throw and lands 50 -70 standing strikes per minute if you don't spam and your stamina doesn't rapidly deplete. The average strikes per minute in real life on average are around 9-10 strikes per minute. In real life you also cannot stand and throw several fast snap jabs at super speed.

    on average in any single round no fighter has every been rocked 12+ times or more times, you can easily check these stats online.

    No fighter would be able to take being rocked 20 times in a round without being stopped.

    If a fighter did land 50-70 standing power strikes per minute every **** fighter in the world would have brain damaged.

    If a fighter got rocked and dropped 15 plus times in real life the ref would stop the fight for the fighters safety.

    Also the invisible force field that surrounds both fighters, that if you dash in towards your opponent of they dash back the force field pushes you away.

    Or the fact that it sounds like hitting stone with a hammer every time you hit someone.

    It's much more unrealistic and arcadey
    Yo guy . They obviously want you to enjoy the game .The stand up mechanics is quite real is what I’m saying not the very physical part of it. Lol

    Sure they have realistic moves

    But

    That doesn't stop the actual striking gameplay being street fighter meshed with ufc. Let's be real

    What's the point of how certain real mechanics when the game is arcadey and unrealistic as hell.

    It's definitely not aimed at fans who want a realistic representation of this sport.
    Post edited by Jamiea1862 on
  • Agreed with everything from the original post.

    In addition to catching leg kicks which deal no damage, and grant nearly automatic rocked state, this can also be followed up with a power head kick for nearly automatic knockdown and eventually KO.

    The way to finish a rocked opponent is either; as you said, let them stand up, which if the animation doesn't happen and they hit the ground they can lay and recover, you have to manually adjust to the side in order to get a decent position to attempt to finish, otherwise you flop into their guard.

    OR; and this is the exploitable mechanic in their KO system that has to be corrected, you simply follow up with jabs and straights, and if you touch an opponent that has be staggered by a rocked motion or knocked down before they hit the ground, you can literally graze their head with a jab or straight and they go out.

    Yet if they recover to their feet, hardly defending at all, this rocked / knock down can repeat 5-10+ times depending on a few factors before they eventually collapse from anything even a jab.

    Again as mentioned in the original post, the body kicks that are caught should deal damage, if not perfectly timed they should probably do more significant damage unless the opponent closes the range of the kick and times it well.

    Their should be options to pull the leg out, or block, and I'd like to see fighters with the ability to hop on one leg and throw punches and kicks, even an enziguri kick like Benson Henderson attempted.

    MAJOR POINT: Nothing should be in the game without a defense/answer to it. Their should be multiple options to avoid, block, counter, escape, etc. There should not be positions, animations, or strikes that simply cannot be avoided, especially if/when you know its coming. There's nothing worse than knowing exactly what your opponent is doing (catch leg, straight, head kick for example) and being completely helpless simply because you through a body kick in range and the animation makes it very predictable and easy to time.

    They're already blocking their head, all they have to do is tap body block when the strike is incoming, throw a punch with opposite, and LB kick with opposite and follow up with jab straights and the fight can be over.

    As much as I loved the Anderson Silva catch body kick counter with heavy strike that put his opponent down, that is a rare instance and shouldn't be in every single fight. It should be a rare instance, say if the kick is so telegraphed that the opponent is able to perfectly time the kick, while stepping in to close the distance or in the least willing and able to absorb the damage, and then instantly combo the follow up strike(s).

    Maybe there is a way to sway your head last second to avoid the kick I haven't messed with it enough but you definitely aren't able to block either the straight or follow up head kick, which almost always equals rocked + knocked down / rocked again which puts you an inch away from death.

    Grappling and Submissions are very poor IMO, EA MMA was on a better path than EA UFC IMO, THQ also had and more balanced system. I think a transition based system would be much more exciting as well as favoring the skilled player making the right choices, timing, patience, etc. vs someone who realizes they're getting beat and shoots a takedown and spams submissions for a chance to win at a mini game which is poor design especially when lag is involved.

    I reluctantly bought the title knowing it was poorly executed because I love MMA and UFC and don't have time to play any other games competitively. It has a 2-3 star rating on XBOX and many other user based rating systems for a reason. This has turned into a good game to throw on at a party and let a bunch of people who have never played try it out once or twice for a laugh, but poorly designed for fair and competitive gamers.
  • And anyone who says "Don't complain", this is a message board, its called constructive criticism, and most who will say this enjoy exploiting broken systems for easy wins and stroke their own ego knowing full well exactly what they're doing. No matter what game, rules, or system it is people can learn the ins and outs and exploits and be a top player, that doesn't mean things aren't broken or need fine tuning.

    I think the stamina drain is excessive, damage isn't realistic or balanced, animations need work, and if the developers aren't true fans of the sport they need to go over all the issues with someone who is in the least a hardcore fan if not someone who trains who can testify that certain aspects are unrealistic. Most MMA fighters kick pads for minutes straight non stop, they're not going to gas more than their opponent simply by being blocked and missing a few if they're also connecting, they're also going to recover much more quickly and more overall because their simply using oxygen where their opponent is taking damage that is causing a much more long term effect on their health and stamina.

    The idea itself is right, bigger flashier moves and throwing combinations should cause higher stamina loss and susceptibility to damage, but certain elements are off when you can dominate a round or two with a high level top UFC fighter and be extremely fatigued from it while they're hardly effected. It shouldn't be so extreme that it becomes a strategy to walk forward and block and let your opponent drain themselves, no one in MMA is walking through any and everything knowing they can take it all no problem and come out like superman in round 2 or 3. When you combine that with the ability to run around and occasionally zap the body the stamina loss is crazy high. There has to be a balance, and the main point is a fighter shouldn't be penalized more than their opponent for successfully striking whether blocked or not, and most strikes in MMA that are completely out of range aren't thrown with enough force to gas.

    I definitely believe that the two button strikes is a poor decision. It doesn't feel right at all it doesn't fit with the rest of the controls its just awkward. The idea should be make it effortless to command your fighter to do what you want it to. And the reason I bring it up is because this and stamina problems go hand in hand.

    In prior games, there was normal strikes and power strikes but with UFC 3 we have some weird in between where there is no way to throw a body or head kick without it being power and zapping stamina, the controls are off which I understand is to make it possible to strike while moving but it has to go back.

    There needs to be a basic way to throw every type of strike with 1 button and max 1 modify trigger, never two buttons. And this would help the issue of stamina determining every fight by allowing point striking without costing all your stamina and choosing when to throw modified power strikes.

    On that note I felt UFC didn't have it bad, a lot of people complained about the ability to throw 100 spin kicks, I believe the short term stamina loss is enough penalty especially considering the increased damage while countered during or after, and the effect of that on health and stamina. Again I think the idea is right the numbers just need balancing and tuning. A full stamina fighter should be able to throw big single moves with huge short term loss, but as long as its managed correctly it shouldn't be nearly as impactful as it is, and when a fighter is fatigued, 1 spin kick to the body shouldn't completely zap their stamina to 0 and take a big chunk off permanent stamina, it needs to be slightly tweaked.

    I have play mostly in lightweight and that is not a very heavy class, these guys have stamina for days and the ones who don't like McGregor have the power to finish with 1 strike at any time and really does have decent stamina, went 5 rounds with Nate Diaz who looked just as tired if not more at times, and the major winded moments came from events like I just mentioned.

    Like I said the idea behind it isn't wrong but the execution isn't perfect. Certain values need to be tweaked.
  • JayRamoz123
    4 posts Member
    edited February 2018
    ufc 2 had better ko's, better blood, better controls. but the damage multiplier was straight cheese from the "magic combinations" people would throw, and parry spammers were cheese.

    ufc 3 had a better striking concept but was not well executed.
  • This new game is just terrible. That's all there is to it.
  • I can't believe how much they messed up the striking so we could move our heads with the right stick. I can't detect any real changes or improvements in the grappling either. I'm surprised, I was really hoping there was going to be an evolution in the grappling and transition departments. I'm disappointed, this is an area of the game that has improved from version to version and I thought they would have tweaked it a little bit and found a way to improve it. Instead ... nothing.
    Another thing that's really lacking is any feedback from EA on this forum. This is a fairly extensive thread about some critical topics regarding gameplay and I feel some people have shared some valuable insights and again... nothing.
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