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[Wednesday Weekly] Patch Request/Feedback: Clinch & GnP

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  • mp2232 wrote: »
    Thanks guys! Let’s keep this going! More thoughts,

    RottenRonnie: what I’m hearing is we need better ability to defend takedowns.

    —-I do think in the last game at times it was too easy to defend the takedown. This is a hard line to tow as a developer I’m sure. In Simulation Gaming we attempt to create a “real” experience. In real life MMA wrestlers generally have good luck with takedowns, especially early in fights. Could use some more timing to deny the takedown slightly I think.

    Vlado: absolute no-brainer!! So true! Where the hell are the elbows and hammers?!? Also!! Where are the under hooks?!? So true.

    Métis: which fighters would u like to see added?

    Well I think they need to make it easier to defend from power takedowns, but fast takedowns doesn’t need any fixing
  • I know this isn't a big issue in terms of gameplay, but I'd like to see some of the customization issues addressed. Specifically, the fact that you can't choose trunk color pre-fight like you used to be able to, can't choose anything beyond black and white for UFC trunks on CAFs, and can't choose UFC gloves for CAFs. Little stuff, which you'd think would be easy to correct. Fingers crossed.
  • EA guy just said this topic is about clinch and GnP yet everybody spam **** about KO animation and other crap xd
  • A good format to use guys;


    Clinch:
    Tell me your thoughts about the clinch


    GnP:

    Tell me your thoughts about Ground n Pound
  • Agreed on the ground and pound...i miss arm traps!

    Joint submissions are very difficult to defend, needs a longer curve IMO.
  • Nashtalia
    9 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    patch in the Official UFC gloves in the players' glove choice options or add them in the store. it dont matter which they choose to do so. i just want the Official UFC gloves :s

    the other gloves as of current in the store look reeDUCK-ulos to be in the Official UFC Octagon.

    i still got the Starter gloves decked out since Launch day, that is how i feel about the other gloves in the store... :#

    *ediT
  • Please add various new punch strikes for our CAFs. If nothing else let us have a Wanderlei lead hook and a Wanderlei rear hook. Please!!
    If you can animate the useless Stockton slap just close the fist and there you have a Wanderlei style hook.
  • Clinch
    The clinch is trash, the fact that you rely on having grapple advantage to even break free from some positions is ridiculous. If you don't have the grapple advantage you can't even initiate the transition so you are literally stuck. It's broken. You can block all you want, he got you in that position with low stam and now you are stuck there until he moves. Thats not how it worked last game, its not how it works in real life either. The transition button combos are a disaster, keep grappling relegated to sticks and triggers. Lead overhands are nearly always telegraphed because the fighter pretends to clinch for a split second. THEY HAVE TO CHANGE THOSE CONTROLS. If they aren't going to give us the systems that actually worked back, they at least need to clean up this mess of a control scheme. Flicking away from clinch is supposed to be denial, but it literally never works.

    GNP
    The ground and pound is equally bad. The animations are hideous. I feel like I am playing a mobile game with the low quality sway animations. When it comes to the mechanics, its just all around a failure. The guy on bottom doesn't have to intelligently defend, he simply has to block and it will automatically take him out of danger. The guy on top is limited in that he only has two kinds of strikes and with the fact that he has a limited amount of time before the game auto postures back down. There is nothing they can fix with this system to make it work, the only acceptable course of action is a full reversion to the original system. The one they spent around six years developing not this slop job. This ground and pound system was a bad idea, its a bad implementation, it was all around bad. Just scrap it.

    CAF modes/OWC

    This is a trickier issue. You guys said that you wanted bring the player base together more, but I don't think you realize that the player base segregated itself for a reason. In UFC 3, people play ranked because they want competitive and fair fights. The fact that CAF were not allowed was a huge draw for many because in UFC 3 the CAF were almost always equipped with cheesy movesets created to get quick and easy wins. If I wanted to play some matches with my CAF I would go to ultimate team or quick play. In quick play I could use my CAF just as I created him which is what the entire point of a CAF.

    So now in UFC 4 you have made CAF available in all modes, but rather than fight with your CAF you really just have some stock fighter skills that happens to look like yours. The people that are really into CAF loved having their own movesets. I don't think CAF should be allowed in OWC. Every other mode should let the CAF guys use their own movesets. Make the cafs start at low rating and the guys can work them up through career. That way they can't just go make a cheap insta win fighter instantly, they would actually have to grow their fighters. It adds some balance to CAFs so they don't instantly dominate everything in quick play. It adds incentive for people to play through career mode. I think it would be very beneficial.

    OWC Weights
    Give us the freedom to choose. There is a reason Flyweight is played less in game, there is a reason it doesn't draw the same numbers IRL that heavier weights do. Some people are just not interested at all. I have no desire to play Women's Flyweight. There just aren't enough good fighter in the division for me to actually care. I would love to see some behind the scenes stats, because I would wager over 50% of matchups at that weight are JJ vs Shevchencko. Literally every fight for an hour is the exact same because they are the only two fighters in the division worth a damn. This is just the reality of how these divisions draw IRL. We are not interested in playing a division that is not exciting. You could remove mens flyweight from the game completely and most people wouldn't care at all. That just how it is. Forcing us to play some of these weight classes will just force us out of OWC completely. Turn it back to free choice ASAP.
  • ogin123
    1 posts New member
    > @TGFPdan said:
    > Clinch
    > The clinch is trash, the fact that you rely on having grapple advantage to even break free from some positions is ridiculous. If you don't have the grapple advantage you can't even initiate the transition so you are literally stuck. It's broken. You can block all you want, he got you in that position with low stam and now you are stuck there until he moves. Thats not how it worked last game, its not how it works in real life either. The transition button combos are a disaster, keep grappling relegated to sticks and triggers. Lead overhands are nearly always telegraphed because the fighter pretends to clinch for a split second. THEY HAVE TO CHANGE THOSE CONTROLS. If they aren't going to give us the systems that actually worked back, they at least need to clean up this mess of a control scheme. Flicking away from clinch is supposed to be denial, but it literally never works.
    >
    > GNP
    > The ground and pound is equally bad. The animations are hideous. I feel like I am playing a mobile game with the low quality sway animations. When it comes to the mechanics, its just all around a failure. The guy on bottom doesn't have to intelligently defend, he simply has to block and it will automatically take him out of danger. The guy on top is limited in that he only has two kinds of strikes and with the fact that he has a limited amount of time before the game auto postures back down. There is nothing they can fix with this system to make it work, the only acceptable course of action is a full reversion to the original system. The one they spent around six years developing not this slop job. This ground and pound system was a bad idea, its a bad implementation, it was all around bad. Just scrap it.
    >
    > CAF modes/OWC
    >
    > This is a trickier issue. You guys said that you wanted bring the player base together more, but I don't think you realize that the player base segregated itself for a reason. In UFC 3, people play ranked because they want competitive and fair fights. The fact that CAF were not allowed was a huge draw for many because in UFC 3 the CAF were almost always equipped with cheesy movesets created to get quick and easy wins. If I wanted to play some matches with my CAF I would go to ultimate team or quick play. In quick play I could use my CAF just as I created him which is what the entire point of a CAF.
    >
    > So now in UFC 4 you have made CAF available in all modes, but rather than fight with your CAF you really just have some stock fighter skills that happens to look like yours. The people that are really into CAF loved having their own movesets. I don't think CAF should be allowed in OWC. Every other mode should let the CAF guys use their own movesets. Make the cafs start at low rating and the guys can work them up through career. That way they can't just go make a cheap insta win fighter instantly, they would actually have to grow their fighters. It adds some balance to CAFs so they don't instantly dominate everything in quick play. It adds incentive for people to play through career mode. I think it would be very beneficial.
    >
    > OWC Weights
    > Give us the freedom to choose. There is a reason Flyweight is played less in game, there is a reason it doesn't draw the same numbers IRL that heavier weights do. Some people are just not interested at all. I have no desire to play Women's Flyweight. There just aren't enough good fighter in the division for me to actually care. I would love to see some behind the scenes stats, because I would wager over 50% of matchups at that weight are JJ vs Shevchencko. Literally every fight for an hour is the exact same because they are the only two fighters in the division worth a damn. This is just the reality of how these divisions draw IRL. We are not interested in playing a division that is not exciting. You could remove mens flyweight from the game completely and most people wouldn't care at all. That just how it is. Forcing us to play some of these weight classes will just force us out of OWC completely. Turn it back to free choice ASAP.

    Everything this guy is saying is 100% Facts. Theres a difference between not being used to a specific system versus a system being objectively flawed. UFC 3 striking is substantially more fluid. This game is more arcade like than UFC 2. Ive played dozens of ranked matches and its literally just spam 1 2 because every other combo is out of range. not to mention endless stamina, and punishing the person who escapes the clinch. As well as not being able to see post fight judges scorecards, health/damage, and not being able to see the round by round stats in quick fight, no record in ranked, no fighter stats in ranked, and of course having to use boring **** divisions aka Shevchencko vs JJ makes me not even want to play the game. Feels as if theres no point in even playing ranked as there is a leaderboard in quick fight now. Not to mention created characters in ranked? the only competitive mode... And thats scratching the surface, Grappling is horrible. It may just be my opinion that I much rather prefer L2/L1/R1/R2 and right stick grapple HUD for the clinch. But what isnt subjective, is how bad GNP is. Completely unfluid and literally feels like a mobile game like this dude said. In ufc 3 you were able to throw hammer fist, hooks, elbows, punches to the head and body whenever you actually pressed those buttons, thus making the game fluid. As opposed to this game where I throw a left straight followed by a right hook but instead my character either ends up throwing 5 right hooks in a row or throws 1 straight and automatically postures down. Absolutely unrealistic and honestly quite pathetic system. Arm trapping system undoubtedly worked better. But even if EA wont resort back to that, atleast make the gnp cohesive to what i am actually pressing on the control at the bare minimum.
  • There has to be a clinch denial it's that simple. The ground and pound is a huge step back, Feels more like something you would get in the ufc mobile game. The fact you can't throw elbows is crazy. mind blowing how that was left out but the biggest problem is how unresponsive the guy on bottom feels when trying to post , That scenario might be ok for finish the fight but to get posture up and then spam hooks and straights is so unrealistic. UFC 3 was so much better. The striking is messed up also, Fighters can spam like crazy chucking overhand after overhand and with the fact that your block health is lowered people just spam clinch then head kicks or overhand it's ridiculous. In my honest opinion this games gonna take months to fix if ever.Also CAFs should never be in owc aka ranked.
  • EA has literally ruined my fighting style.... you lose stamina for leaning... just LEANING not even moving.... ****. You have literally created a stand up mode that is horrendous... you lie more stamina slipping punches than your opponent does for missing punches..... game sucks
  • You should have stuck with UFC 2 mechanics.... minus the dumb parry system.... and from there just improved graphics and content... I have jumped into UFC 4 from hammering UFC 2.... and I can’t believe how far a franchise can go backwards.... it’s a joke!
  • BWrizzle
    80 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    I know this is clinch and gnp but here's my two cents overall: I too was a huge fan of ranked online play on UFC 3, only mode I cared to play on there, almost 7,000 matches. I thought that game was beautiful, best UFC game to date by any company, true striking/mma simulation IMO. I would've been happy with just some small tweaks or additions to that game. OWC is all I'm really interested in on this game and it's been a struggle to adjust. I'm still learning and definitely getting better at playing the game to win but I can't necessarily say the game is better than UFC 3. After a while on UFC 3 ranked I only used B rated fighters to gain more points for wins and I would get plenty doing it. On this game I feel forced to pick the champs or one or two away from them just to feel comfortable in there. I know "get better at the game" would be the easy answer. I definitely have got better at the game and am currently a division 15 after almost 300 fights but I'm finding a lot of my wins are coming from the GnP I feel needs some tweaking. I'm a stand up fighter and definitely get work done in that area but in a lot of fights it seems like getting that take down is a "be first" type thing. The ranked mentality on this game feels a lot like THQ's UFC Undisputed 2010(the good old Lesnar/Mir challenge). Ranked play on UFC 3 just felt really balanced and competitive.

    Clinch
    I agree with what's being said in here that there needs to be a clinch denial other than just sways or a well timed punch. That's really my only complaint about the clinch. I like the concept and the direction it's going for fluidity but some kind of denial input would be good. I saw somebody suggest somewhere that LB/RB(xbox) may be a good idea.

    GnP
    I do like the change in grappling from the previous game as far as getting away from the your turn/my turn type transitions but this postured up GnP is a little out of control. I don't agree with those that say it's too hard to finish with the GnP. I have had many competitive matches on here where everything about how the game was working was making sense but I feel maybe the postured up strike damage should be toned down a bit for the head strikes. Body damage slightly up, head damage slightly down. I know the takedown defense window is a fine line. I'm not sure I feel it should be changed at all. Definitely miss the ground elbows, not sure why they weren't included, this is UFC not Strikeforce. The defense could possibly be swaying to the same side as the throwing arm.

    @EA_Blueberry I appreciate you guys taking the feedback into consideration.


  • In the last patch they fixed a good amount of the character models, but I think there’s still quite a few that could use some work. I can’t think of them all off the top of my head, but the two I think need changed the most are Zabit and Edson Barboza.
  • In the last patch they fixed a good amount of the character models, but I think there’s still quite a few that could use some work. I can’t think of them all off the top of my head, but the two I think need changed the most are Zabit and Edson Barboza.

    Zabit just has a big head in real life lol
  • Why are Division 6 guys getting matched with Division 20? As soon as I'm matched up with these guys , I know they are going to resort to exploiting the broken submission system. Maybe put a cap on the division gap like +5/-5?
  • Judge score has to be fixed
  • Why are Division 6 guys getting matched with Division 20? As soon as I'm matched up with these guys , I know they are going to resort to exploiting the broken submission system. Maybe put a cap on the division gap like +5/-5?
    yes pls, from division 20 perspective - we loose like 50-70 points if loose to low divisions while getting as little as 1-5 for a win

  • Just going to add that there needs to be a simpler way to avoid the clinch.
    3 ways you could do this?

    1. stamina cost on the clinch action itself? if there already is make it higher
    2. make the damage taken higher when getting punched in the middle of a clinch attempt
    3. make an animation like how when you are by the cage. where you can hold your opponents knee down because it shouldn't be that simple to just make a inescapable clinch in the UFC you usually see a fighter have their hand out to stop knees
  • EA_Blueberry
    4770 posts EA Community Manager
    The team is looking into a bunch of things for GnP balance, so stay tuned on that. Takedown denials should be better now since the patch, but it's clear you all here want an easier way to deny clinches. There were also some takedown and striking stamina adjustments some of you mentioned, btw. @MrMightyI do you see any improvements in takedown denials since the patch?

    Some related patch updates from Wednesday:
    • Fixed exploit with Cage Back Clinch drives
    AI Improvements
    • Reduced AI clinch frequency

    For a clinch denial, what would feel right in the sticks for you all. Thank you all for the detailed responded and I want to point to what @BWrizzle elaborated on how it should work. Any additional thoughts on this below?

    Clinch
    "I agree with what's being said in here that there needs to be a clinch denial other than just sways or a well timed punch. That's really my only complaint about the clinch. I like the concept and the direction it's going for fluidity but some kind of denial input would be good. I saw somebody suggest somewhere that LB/RB(xbox) may be a good idea."


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