Defenseman AI

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@RelentlessJ69 wrote:
@rsandersr47Well then we're playing different games, cause the AI on our team rarely wins puck battles, we'll poke check the puck and it'll go right to the other team, we hit someone, puck goes right back to them. I'm not talking about offensively, I'm talking about the defense AI, they should not be that bad. Not to mention, there's been games where our AI took FIVE penalties before the 3rd period even started.

Also, I don't like drops, out of the drop ins games I've played, I've met maybe one or two people that are decent, the others are either awful or troll the entire game.

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So the CPU you play with are bad AND the humans you play with are bad. How often are you guys winning games? Have you considered that defense is just hard and not particularly the AI? Or that maybe you're not doing enough on defense yourself? Do you feel in a mode that was created to have full teams of humans, the CPU players should be expected to perform better than a human you find in drop ins? To me it sounds like you just want someone on the backend to take care of everything for you.. I could be wrong.. personally I'd suggest you suffer through drops until you find a few guys to play with. It could take a few weeks but you could have a solid team for the rest of the year, and you could learn to play together. Of course IF you guys aren't doing enough on the backend the defenseman is probably gonna say something where as a cpu I just gonna look worse than they already have to be and you can continue to blame them. Again, not saying CPU is good, they are bad. But in EASHL a LOT of humans are bad so CPU should play like a base level human. Want a good defenseman? get a human and get them better. 

However, I do think we're playing diff games if you're not seeing them win puck battles or getting to loose pucks first. They will always take the perfect line to a puck. They know exactly the bounces it will take, they know when to stick lift you for it or bump you and they can feel much harder to knock. They are bad at a ton but getting the puck, making short passes, and getting 1Ts/ wristies in the slot they are pretty solid. Overall they're still better than most base level players.. which is roughly 30-50% of the community. If my life depended on winning 1 dropin game.. I'd prob take a cpu over a random. CPU is bad, you can skate right by them, but most humans are extremely bad at positioning and wont even be in place to attempt to make a play. Do you think the CPU should be better than humans? I'm sure it would make life easier for people who only play forward, of course then the they would complain the CPU defends too well on the other team.

I just personally feel a CPU should not perform better than a human. Personally if i made the game EASHL CPU players would be even worse, to the point people WOULD go out of their way to find other humans to play with. If youre not doing that still then it means you too feel a CPU is better than a random human. I remember drops back in the day and one team would go up 4-0 all but 2 of their guys quit and they come back to win 6-4. CPU gets all 6 goals and shuts down the other team. Been on both sides of this. Humans should not get punished for playing well or be punished for playing vs cpu. Playing with and against CPU is the most unrewarding experience. I would NEVER want to play a 6s game with 2 humans per side. I'll take the occasional trolls (and just quit out) as much as I hate them (trolls) over 3 cpu skaters. Also, I've played countless hours of quick 3s and have yet to find a single troll. Lots of decent teammates. Lots of bad teammates. But the stats don't matter, quit if you want. It's quick games and you can play with tons of diff people all night and see who plays well. If someone plays to your liking add them and invite them to 6s. I've added a lot of friends on there and now I get invited to games all the time. 

@rsandersr47 

Nobody expects the cpu to be as good as, let alone better than a human, we just need them to put in some minimal effort and not deliberatly hinder the experience.

And LOL, you couldn't possibly make them any worse. Like, sure, they can have their moments, even one of sheer brilliance even, but your chances pf finding a Samsquanch are way higher - Being in a constant mindset of them literally not even being there is a bad thing no matter how you look at it. 

You're absolutely right in just getting more humans but just like those who snub skill stick or can't figure out how to now hit (which once you learn is craaaaaazy OP like omg haha), I refuse to accept ai acting the way they do - This wouldn't just affect online though - it would trickle into framchise, BaP, etc so it should be a win/win for all the girls and boys.

https://tenor.com/bis4k.gif

@rsandersr47 

Humans will always be better than cpu (except when it comes to goalies - I've never seen a good human goalie).

A human, no matter how bad, can be taught - my team has done that with a few of our friend who didn't know hockey. We could tell em "just hang in this spot and hold out your stick" and they'd find success, way more so than any horrible ai.

I don't know what to tell you mate - not being able to learn how to pull back then forward is simply a skill issue and a lesson on getting good. Most people who claim ai are too good play 6v6 where everyone is able to play with a min/maxed build and they can all stick to zones -- Those who play 3v3 dont have that luxury and are forced into jack of all trades that need to travel further out of what the game consideres normal parameters -- an AI coach will have no context here and say our D is lacking when I've scored 6 goals and let them get 1 -- Now, if they added offline's AI learning, maybe we'd be getting somewhere...

The 3v3 ai here still uses 6v6 logic and the D position does what the F should be doing (according to the strategies charts) and even have a 1.5 second delay on all faceoffs!

Ai has never been updated to keep up with the new speed mechanics humans use so they are left in the dust.

I'd rather they just create a 2v2 mode so there are no what-ifs at play.

I don't have 5 other friends I can trust to win the way my one buddy and I do so i'm stuck with 3v3 since 6v6 with more ai is just a clog fest and is boring since other full teams dont wanna play us. Add our 3rd friend who is a top HUT player we'd be a top 5 team easy, we just all cant get a good schedule going.

Base level fresh off the boat humans who know nothing about hockey will be better than a 3v3 AI defenseman 100%.

My buddy and I play plenty of defense and do pretty well despite being a sniper and playmaker combo and the fact the new pressure system was never tested and defensive capabilities as a whole are severely lacking overall.

I'd like to nudge you in the direction of this post I made: https://answers.ea.com/t5/General-Discussion-News/I-hate-the-AI/m-p/13224521#M9336 -- it doesn't show everything they do but gives a taste of what I see.

I think it's a terrible thing what they did to human goalie controls but honestly, how can they make it any better without VR? There are just way too many animations and moves for a simple controller to accomodate.

I believe there was 1 or 2 times when we had 5 best friends (3 of whom weren't all that great but were having fun) and it was some of the most entertaining gaming we've ever had. Of it weren't for nostalgia sake, I doubt my buddy and I would play at all -- I get the game for free and gameshare with him and we still feel ripped off at times. Being competitive (or rather just hating to lose) can come back to bite you at times.

@TTZ_DipsyI'm competitive and hate to lose, but the most fun I've had is playing with a full team of friends whether is 3's or 6's. I'll play drops until I find a suitable club.

I know how bad CPU D can be. I'm not arguing that at all. But I disagree. I'd take cpu D (or as others have said I'd prob just play d and make them a forward if we're being honest) over a base level player. Base level players almost always lose where they are on the ice. Get too aggressive either in the offensive zone, on the forecheck, or as they enter the zone and give up goals. At Least the CPU will make you skate around them (as little of an issue as that is) I'm by no means suggesting these CPU players are competent. They are "good" at a few things and absolutely unforgivingly bad at most things. I still take them over a base level player and that's why we still see lots of players choosing to play 6's with 2 people. Why would you want to play dropin or find human defensemen when the avg base level player has proven to be worse? Ask anyone who plays 6's with 2 people. Or 3's people who refuse to find a third. Most will say they at least know where the cpu will be and they typically place them in the best place. I.e. in front of the net on offense and in front of the net on defense. They snag those loose pucks so often getting rebound goals, getting 1t's making sure the other team can't do the same. A base level player just wouldn't know to even be in that position in my experience. And most of those little things the CPU goes unnoticed or unappreciated. Now if the cpu snag a rebound or picks off a cross crease pass and then gets bumped or a cherry picker calls for it and the other team gets in front of that pass and it gets picked, you will hear those forwards who were cherry picking yell about how awful their CPU was despite them making a potential saved goal and them calling for it at a bad time.

Idk I think we agree with eacjother on most stuff but I'm 100% taking the cpu even if they are bad. I've played with some BAD dropin players.

I do think a potential idea would be more incentives to get a 6 man team (or 4 man team for 3's) and also add more ways to meet free agents and for free agents to meet teams. Having players have a "FA" or which club they're affiliated with while in drops would be nice. Having the players stats all on one player profile would be cool. Same with clubs Having in game club profiles. I could see how defensive minded a player/ club is, how they handle a puck or pass % I could see what mode(s) they tend to play. Or if they're like me and play a lot of diff modes. I like that they allowed clubs to have skaters join their team when searching but most clubs would rather have the CPU still. I think they need to dump dropin and KEEP that quick mode but have quick 6's too. That mode tracks no stats, you can quit if you get trolls, you can play with your club. You can play 3x or 4x as many players in as much time. It's a great mode to find players/ clubs (in my experience) they just need to build on it and show which players are free agents and give incentives for club play.

@rsandersr47 

I should clarify that when I say a newbie human, I mean someone we already have a rapport with outside of the game who has a mic -- I would NEVER opt to bring in strangers to my clubs because the chemistry just wouldn't be there (at least not on a consistent basis). Drop-ins is just... unpleasant.

I was the one clammoring for 1 button hipchecks (I mean, I expected them to at least balance it so I'm sorry about that), but I was and am definitely opposed to drop-ins in clubs. At the very least, let me match up with others using drop-ins but allow me to block them from joining my very personal club.

Hmm well my team used to play with 2 or 3 humans in 6v6 because, lets be honest, 3v3 is very sweaty and tryhard-y -- we never wanted to play .. those people unless there were absolutely no games to play... fast forward we now just had to adapt since 6v6 is bogged down by all the bodies.

Yeah, that quick 3's carries no rank, no tracked stats, nothing. What I'd love is for clubs to be able to play there, and you get matched up vs other clubs but all the spots that you don't have players are filled with randoms. Clubs can send club invites or players can request to join after games.. they can also request to join the opposing team. If you get trolls it's easy to quit out, no penalty.. don't like any of the guys? It's only a 5 min game and it's over. This is a much better system than the current dropins imo.