Dumping the puck
What's the deal with the difficulty introduced this year with something as simple as dumping the puck? I mean, it's always been problematic, but this year, it's ridiculous that half the time your ska...
Forum Discussion
@EA_Aljo Why would anyone have a problem with making it easy for dumps to evade the pressure system? That’s a tool cpu D and human D should utilize. Easy clears. As of now it’s more difficult than it should be obviously but even in past games D men already had limited options and tools to quickly maneuver and execute proper D. You can be really good but as D men we are always striving for perfection.
EA_Aljo
Community Manager
Community ManagerIf it's too easy to dump the puck to the other end of the ice, it kills the pressure too easily. It's possible we'll see adjustments though. I've passed the feedback on to the team. Thank you.
- @EA_Aljo So they actually rigged the game to make sure this new offensive ragging tool works as intended ,what a joke
- EA_Aljo
@Treatmentworke66 wrote:
@EA_Aljo So they actually rigged the game to make sure this new offensive ragging tool works as intended ,what a jokeNo. The game is not rigged. The pressure system doesn't serve much of a purpose if it can be easily canceled. It is supposed to be challenging. I'm in agreement the puck doesn't dump high enough and would like to see it adjusted, but it's not rigged.
@EA_Aljo wrote:If it's too easy to dump the puck to the other end of the ice, it kills the pressure too easily. It's possible we'll see adjustments though. I've passed the feedback on to the team. Thank you.
This is literally what every NHL team does to relieve pressure when hemmed in their zone.
I get that the dev team has to come up with ways to combat the online meta, I just think it would be cool if they used creative hockey solutions instead of arcade features and complete nerfs of mechanics.
- @EA_Aljo well to make one thing work more efficiently and effectively while decreasing another is either rigging or manipulation
@EA_Aljo wrote:
@Treatmentworke66 wrote:
@EA_AljoSo they actually rigged the game to make sure this new offensive ragging tool works as intended ,what a jokeNo. The game is not rigged. The pressure system doesn't serve much of a purpose if it can be easily canceled. It is supposed to be challenging. I'm in agreement the puck doesn't dump high enough and would like to see it adjusted, but it's not rigged.
Why is the challenging part only applied to the defensive side of the situation? If it's supposed to be challenging, then it should be challenging on both sides. The offensive team losing control of the puck should face the possibility of the defensive team dumping the puck, and have to deal with that in the same way the defense has to deal with the consequences of not being able to gain control of the puck in their own zone. Why is it that only one side is penalized?
This mechanic seems to be shoehorned in to work by nerfing a viable defensive play. There should have been more thought around the design and implementation of this if the solution was to severely restrict a valid hockey play. Unless you are on the PK, you can't even slap the puck down because you'll just get an icing called. So sans PK, you don't have a valid way to decrease pressure other than skating it or passing it out, which by the way, is much harder when all of your energy is drained.
By the way, the Michigan was also challenging, but that was basically put into easy mode. So again, it seems like it's always the defensive side that is being nerfed while the offense gets easier every year. I know you are just the messenger, but I really hope the team starts to put more thought into both sides of play.
- EA_Aljo
I completely get what you're saying. Again, I fully agree with you all that this needs to be changed. Personally, I've been charging up the puck and dumping it off the glass. This has had some ok success. That and just shooting it out if I can get an open lane. In most cases, my teammates look to get open to break out.
As far as slapping the puck goes, of course I would only do that on the PK, just like I did previously with long dumps. I didn't do those at even strength since it would normally result in an icing.
Lets also keep in mind the game has been out for almost a week now. There are bound to be updates. This is one of the most complained about changes as well so it's entirely possible it could be modified in a future patch.
- @smugxb Yes its always the defensive side that gets nerfed ,and they make it as easy as possible for offense ,this new pressure system its just an updated ragging tool for the offense
So far just been using wrist shot on the penalty kill to dump the puck and or a slap shot if I'm not man on, then change my line, seems to work well, (dump puck) since it doesn't go to far been getting creative and using the glass to my advantage at times , one thing that I have to say is I love the jump and catch animations the players make lol,
- @EA_Aljo I’m watching the penguins/hawks opener now and it seems easy for them to clear the puck and clear the pressure. You have to remember if you’re an offensive player and make a mistake losing the puck shouldn’t you be punished and have the pressure cleared more easily? Or should it be harder than it should be to make a simple easy clear? I’m just saying I’m still struggling to understand the logic. Hockey is a simple game so let’s not overthink it! Also I’m not seeing a bunch of odd hip checks while I’m watching nhl hockey tonight! Just sayin..
Thank you for listening and giving us the time of day. I am actually having a lot of fun playing defense in nhl 24 because there’s many more shots, passes, and hockey plays as opposed to 1 man shows. Still lots to improve but much better than 22 and 23. Let’s go Hawks - @EA_Aljo So we create a completely unrealistic thing that does NOT happen in hockey.. but try to convince fans that it does because of momentum or being tired or w/e.. and then to make sure we see the macaroni art that you guys spent so much time on you FURTHER tampered with the real sport by removing something that is used in almost every real hockey game.. and we're all to beleive this franchise is heading in the right direction? You're making this ea hockey and drifting further from NHL hockey. I still have 0 idea why this was added. I guess kids just love macaroni art. It's too bad they didn't use the time it took to create the pressure system to do something like online franchise.. or find ways for the defense to have their own tools and advantages. The pressure system is a FAIL. Throwing this in our face is like Betman telling everyone that we are gonna keep digital boards because people like them!
@EA_Aljo
The Pressure System is a cool idea and can be an awesome part of the game but it should not be the focus of the game. The game should not be re-engineered to showcase it and it should not be a given that it will activate on every zone entry, this is vastly overdoing it and will make everyone hate it. It should be a reward for sustained offensive zone control and setup, and likewise it should be prevented/extinguished quickly by good defensive play. The players negatively effected by Full Pressure shouldn't remain slugs after the pressure is broken or at the very least they should get their * to the bench and change out for fresh legs.
Dumps are a fundamental part of hockey, and every pro player knows exactly how much height and force to put on one depending on the circumstances. The "hold to charge" method worked perfectly fine in previous releases and if you're dumping at even strength then you risk icing. A disincentive on Icing could be as simple as adding 2 ticks on the pressure meter before the face-off and another on a face-off win so only 2 more are required to quickly activate the system...that would perfectly mimic the real life pressure of losing a draw after a poor icing. Obviously on a PK there IS an incentive to ice with the lack of an icing whistle, ergo the dump is an essential tool in a PK'rs toolbox and the controls should reflect that.- EA_Aljo
Thank you for the constructive feedback. It's most definitely appreciated.
As I've said, we are very well aware of the feedback on dumps. Changes could be coming. We'll have to wait and see if that happens.
Yup, charging it up as a player works, but the problem is when your CPU player keeps throwing up pizzas that can’t clear the blueline while on the PK.
The fact the pressure system relies on what amounts to a bug is terrible. Maybe ask your devs to watch a real NHL game or two and see if players have spaghetti arms that can’t muster the strength to clear THEIR OWN blueline.
- EA_Aljo
As previously mentioned, the low dumps are so that you can't use dumps as a get out of jail free card when there's full pressure. The team is aware of the feedback on this though so it's possible changes could be made.
- @tinybabyrobot How do you “charge” it up?
- @EA_Aljo I hope so. When there's full pressure you can barely skate, passes don't connect, shots go awry and puck pick-ups don't exist. The high-clear is usually all that's left AND it's one of the more realistic aspects of the game (that seem to keep disappearing).
- @EA_Aljo That is a joke you saying, "get out of jail free card " this game is supposed to have some kind of resemblance to hockey which every year gets less and less
It should fall on the offensive team to keep the pressure up so you can't just clear the puck ,your just making easier for puck ragging My point still stands. When the CPU doesn’t behave properly, it’s a big issue. They have the time and space to do whatever they want on the PK where the correct move is to ice the puck… and they can’t clear the blueline. Either change the AI behaviour or fix the puck dump.
- @tinybabyrobot ye it looks ridiculous...
I've had countless times when a defenseman had all the time in the world and still couldn't get the puck past the first forward. - The comment about puck dumps being a 'get out of jail free card' is so amusing to me. Like, my man, have you watched a hockey game? That's exactly what the puck dump is for - to alleviate pressure! You don't suppose NHLers are just high flipping the puck to see if they can hit the jumbotron, do you?
The pressure system isn't a terrible idea in theory, but the execution is super flawed. Like, yes, players get exhausted from defending for extended periods in real life, but it doesn't turn the attacking team into superheroes. The ability to keep the puck and generate good chances in real hockey doesn't come from a stat boost (obviously), it comes from time and space created by defenders being tired.
You need to balance out the pressure system. Having defenders barely able to move + a boost in stats for the attacking team + a reduction in stats for the defending team + not being able to flip the puck out is just ridiculously weighted in favor of the offense. - EA_Aljo
Yes. I fully understand dumping the puck alleviates pressure. However, if dumps worked the way they did previously, you could almost instantly kill full pressure. It would pretty much make that system useless. I absolutely understand the frustration though and I hope it changes because I completely agree dumps are too weak. While I typically don't have a problem clearing, it's very annoying. I used to use dumps more frequently on breakouts and can't do that now. It was nice for hitting that forward across the ice breaking out when I had the puck deep in my own zone in a corner. Regardless, the weak dumps are just really unrealistic, but I also get the point of having them for the reason I previously mentioned.
- @EA_Aljo
It wouldn't instantly negate the pressure at all. I routinely play in games where a team is able to get a cleared puck from their end of neutral ice and skate it back into the offensive zone without losing full pressure. And even if they DID lose full pressure, the defending team still doesn't have any energy at that point, so the attacking team can just skate back into the zone, take a few weak shots on net, retrieve the puck from exhausted defenders who still can barely skate, and voila! Full pressure again!
If you have to intentionally break a simple, realistic mechanic to make your system work, maybe the system is badly designed.
But, what do I know.
@EA_Aljo wrote:Yes. I fully understand dumping the puck alleviates pressure. However, if dumps worked the way they did previously, you could almost instantly kill full pressure. It would pretty much make that system useless. I absolutely understand the frustration though and I hope it changes because I completely agree dumps are too weak. While I typically don't have a problem clearing, it's very annoying. I used to use dumps more frequently on breakouts and can't do that now. It was nice for hitting that forward across the ice breaking out when I had the puck deep in my own zone in a corner. Regardless, the weak dumps are just really unrealistic, but I also get the point of having them for the reason I previously mentioned.
So they basically NERF a real hockey mechanic, so that it doesn’t affect their new and shiny gimmick…. Yikes ! It’s even worse than what I originally thought…
Defensive tools, you have no business in a hockey game, now go sit in a corner 😒
Honestly, I’m not even using dump pick this year. I’m having great success by just getting space, and slap shorting the puck to the other side of the rink on penalty kill. Unfortunately at 5 on 5 this would be icing but I have no problem clearing the zone at 5 on 5 so I can’t speak on this
