@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@TheUnusedCrayon wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@TheUnusedCrayon wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@Jagavekov wrote: there should be way more dump ins than Michigan attempts in typical game of video game hockey, regardless of how "sim" you want it to be, and that is not the case with NHL 24. Unbelievable.So you want to artificially force players to dump the puck when they don't want to? If my opponent refuses to engage me through the neutral zone, you're suggesting EA should introduce some type of artificial mechanic that forces me to play dump and chase, just to satisfy this 'need' to have the game be completely 'sim'? When in actuality, I can just walk into their D-Zone and maintain puck pussession.. like why in the world would I want to dump the puck when 80% of the user-base plays defense in such a way that allows me free reign into their zone?
Would you say the same if the example was "should players be forced to pass if the game doesn't require them to because then it's more 'sim'?"
Players shouldn't be forced to do anything. The freeodm that this game allows is what makes it fun. People like to claim the offensive freedom trumps defensive skill, but that's not the case at all. I think people just hate defending and their hatred for it makes it seem like it's 'harder' than offense.
I find this a super odd take but you're entitled to your opinion.
The only odd take here is that EA is at fault for players not playing sim-style hockey in a videogame.
This is ridiculous. People will do anything they can to win in an online game, you and I both know that. To expect the "honor system" to be the reason people play sim hockey online is insane. A few years ago people flipped the puck over the glass for minutes on end to result in a desync to avoid a loss. Do you think these people will pressure at the blueline or clear the puck on the PK because if it is realistic, even if it puts them at a disadvantage? It is up to the game mechanics to reward certain things and punish others.
@Jagavekov wrote:This is ridiculous. People will do anything they can to win in an online game, you and I both know that. To expect the "honor system" to be the reason people play sim hockey online is insane.
Why are you making up things I'm saying and then saying those made-up things are insane? I never once said "I expect this game to have an honor system"
I said that if you want ANY sports game EVER made to play EXACTLY like the real world sport, you need BOTH parties to commit to playing a 'sim' style. Denying this fact while being completely absorbed in online play is what I could call "insane".
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@Jagavekov wrote:This is ridiculous. People will do anything they can to win in an online game, you and I both know that. To expect the "honor system" to be the reason people play sim hockey online is insane.
Why are you making up things I'm saying and then saying those made-up things are insane? I never once said "I expect this game to have an honor system"
I said that if you want ANY sports game EVER made to play EXACTLY like the real world sport, you need BOTH parties to commit to playing a 'sim' style. Denying this fact while being completely absorbed in online play is what I could call "insane".
That is exactly what you are saying. You are saying the people playing the game need to play sim, regardless of whether or not that is incentivized. That means you think it is up to the people playing the game to make it sim, not for the developers to do that. That is the honor system.
You think it should be this:
"I should ice the puck on the PK because it is sim, even though I could easily go end-to-end and get a scoring chance and increase my chances of winning"
I think it should be this:
"I should ice the puck on the PK because if I don't I will likely make a turnover which will result in the power play getting more zone time and possibly more scoring chances, which would decrease my chances of winning"
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
I said that if you want ANY sports game EVER made to play EXACTLY like the real world sport, you need BOTH parties to commit to playing a 'sim' style. Denying this fact while being completely absorbed in online play is what I could call "insane".
——————————
You wouldn’t need an honour system if the game played the "right" way… You would have to make all the little hockey plays that are irrelevant with the way the game is set up now…. Well, what am I saying, with the way it’s always been 😒
@PernellKarl027 wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
I said that if you want ANY sports game EVER made to play EXACTLY like the real world sport, you need BOTH parties to commit to playing a 'sim' style. Denying this fact while being completely absorbed in online play is what I could call "insane".——————————
You wouldn’t need an honour system if the game played the "right" way… You would have to make all the little hockey plays that are irrelevant with the way the game is set up now…. Well, what am I saying, with the way it’s always been 😒
lmao. Expecting sweaty HUT players to play the game the "right" way (whatever that means) is crazy.
@Jagavekov wrote:I think it should be this:
"I should ice the puck on the PK because if I don't I will likely make a turnover which will result in the power play getting more zone time and possibly more scoring chances, which would decrease my chances of winning"
You're not wrong, but playing HUT - you will NEVER encounter anyone who thinks like this. It will be constant exploiting, gaming the mechanics, forever and ever until EA becomes the first developer in history to recreate a sport 1:1.
Just saying man - a lot of your gripes are due to the nature of HUt itself, and nothing to do about whether anyone on the development team knows hockey as well as you.
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@PernellKarl027 wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
I said that if you want ANY sports game EVER made to play EXACTLY like the real world sport, you need BOTH parties to commit to playing a 'sim' style. Denying this fact while being completely absorbed in online play is what I could call "insane".——————————
You wouldn’t need an honour system if the game played the "right" way… You would have to make all the little hockey plays that are irrelevant with the way the game is set up now…. Well, what am I saying, with the way it’s always been 😒
lmao. Expecting sweaty HUT players to play the game the "right" way (whatever that means) is crazy.
Of course I’m not expecting sweaty HUT players to play the right way. Because, once again, the game by itself doesn’t… So why should they ?
@PernellKarl027 wrote:Of course I’m not expecting sweaty HUT players to play the right way. Because, once again, the game by itself doesn’t… So why should they ?
Again, you want to remove the fun and creative elements of the game in order to force players into playing YOUR idea of realistic hockey
For example; why wouldn't I constantly drive the slot and score an against-the-grain top shelf wrister all game long if my opponent is playing terrible defense and not defending that offensive progression?
Based on some opinions here, you would like EA to introduce some type of artificially induced 'realism' component where the game says "well.. this guy is finding too much success with this one move, and despite the opponent playing in such a way that allows that user to keep being successful with that move, we're just gonna go ahead and artificially nerf it so that some users get a sense of 'realism'"
I mean, they've done something like this with the pressure system. It's meant to force a sense of perceived 'realism' and was based on feedback like, "Goalies don't have any fatigue", "cycling the puck isn't rewarding", "real hockey plays don't work". So EA Said fine, we'll put a meter on the ice and introduce a mechanic that artificially forces otherwise defensively adept users to adapt to a sudden onset of dementia of their players. Based on some arbitrary 'clock' - now our players go from full energy to zero - NOT because they've been skating and chasing a player around the Zone but because the other team got a couple of shots on the goalie. Like.. what? My 100% fresh defensive pair is INSTANTLY gasping for air and unable to corral a loose puck because the other team got 3 consecutive shots? That's friggin DUMB.
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@PernellKarl027 wrote:Of course I’m not expecting sweaty HUT players to play the right way. Because, once again, the game by itself doesn’t… So why should they ?
Again, you want to remove the fun and creative elements of the game in order to force players into playing YOUR idea of realistic hockey
For example; why wouldn't I constantly drive the slot and score an against-the-grain top shelf wrister all game long if my opponent is playing terrible defense and not defending that offensive progression?
Based on some opinions here, you would like EA to introduce some type of artificially induced 'realism' component where the game says "well.. this guy is finding too much success with this one move, and despite the opponent playing in such a way that allows that user to keep being successful with that move, we're just gonna go ahead and artificially nerf it so that some users get a sense of 'realism'"
No no no....this is not what is meant. You misunderstand what those posters debating you are saying.
What would be great is the game to reward proper hockey plays.
If Im playing a player who understands the nuances of hockey, the game will punish me if I make unrealistic hockey plays organically.
how can this be achieved online? Make the gameplay truer to life. Game speed right now is too fast, slow it down. Hit power too strong. Agility too high, reduce them. Make passes less accurate and harder to control. The game will then naturally move towards a more realistic hockey to achieve success, and not just playing sim just to be sim.
The problem is will most people want to play this brand of hockey?? Will the casual gamer dump the puck in with the 4th line in a 3rd period tie game instead of trying to dangle in and shoot? Because that is definitely what I do when I play offline and I have the 4th line on the puck in a close game.
Why? Because my sliders make it hard for 4th liners to dangle in, and if I do try to dangle in, 8 times out of 10, I make a bad turnover and give up scoring chances.
So its not forcing player to play sim, it will naturally move that direction because it is the shortest route to success. Same as now, online play the shortest route to sucess, is dangle
dangle shot, pressure meter activation scor
so the job of the developers is to create that short route based on realistic methods like I described above.
@phillyfan2233 wrote:If Im playing a player who understands the nuances of hockey, the game will punish me if I make unrealistic hockey plays organically.
Yes. That's how it works now.
But some people get burned by poke checking at the wrong time or they don't obtain possession of the puck after a poke, and they deem the game 'broken' and 'unrealistic'. Subsequent observation of the clips show blatant errors made, you point those errors out and are told "no no no you don't understand, my opponent doesn't 'know hockey' and just 'got lucky' because the 'game' decided he gets to win'"
@phillyfan2233 wrote:Game speed right now is too fast, slow it down.
Ea has given us the ability to decide whether our player bursts with speed or accelerates at a manageable rate so as not to limit agility, passing and the overall ability to make a real hockey play.
This creative decision allows me to glide or slowly skate up the side boards, recognize when my opponent is about to attack with a defender, then push LS to 100% and burst with speed in a direction that allows me to avoid the interaction altogether. It also punishes me by adding error to my maneuvers if I'm skating at full speed/hustle.
Slowing the game down in order to cater to players who are constantly pushing LS to 100% all the time and completely disregarding the spectrum of speed available to you would be such a bad move. Then you remove a tool from the toolbelt of those users who DO play realistically just to cater to players who refuse to adapt to the controls.
the reason why online games appear to move so fast is that 90% of players are always instructing every player they control to skate with 100% acceleration at any given moment. Whereas, realistic players such as myself., understand that pushing Ls to 100% while controlling the puck is something you should NOT be doing very often at all. This gives you higher pass acc, shot acc, agility, balance, etc.
Again - asking EA to slow the gamespeed down (despite them using real footage to demonstrate that the game moves at almost the precise speed of real life) just to cater to users who ignore and otherwise refuse to adapt to the controls at hand is something I will always rail against.
@phillyfan2233 wrote:Hit power too strong. Agility too high, reduce them.
I feel like this feedback is based on opponents having hitting success against you and being able to use agility in such a way that makes you feel at a disadvantage. It's up to YOU to alter your game to get better at defending that stuff.
@phillyfan2233 wrote:The problem is will most people want to play this brand of hockey?? Will the casual gamer dump the puck in with the 4th line in a 3rd period tie game instead of trying to dangle in and shoot? Because that is definitely what I do when I play offline and I have the 4th line on the puck in a close game.
Why? Because my sliders make it hard for 4th liners to dangle in, and if I do try to dangle in, 8 times out of 10, I make a bad turnover and give up scoring chances.
You're also playing against a CPU designed to use hockey plays. Of course you'll have a more realistic experience because the human aspect of exploiting another users poor defensive decisions just isn't there. Playing vs CPU is a completely different beast than playing against humans.
If you began to force users to dump the puck with the 4th line in the 3rd just because EA decides that's how hockey should be played, it would be an abysmal experience. Why would I want to dump the puck when my opponent is charging his defenders at me, giving me all the open ice in the world to just walk into the zone, dangle and snipe?
the reason why online games appear to move so fast is that 90% of players are always instructing every player they control to skate with 100% acceleration at any given moment. Whereas, realistic players such as myself., understand that pushing Ls to 100% while controlling the puck is something you should NOT be doing very often at all. This gives you higher pass acc, shot acc, agility, balance, etc.
Every top 6s player skates 90% of the game with hustle. This isn't even an exaggeration. You can watch a pro player like Hxndry (LW) multiple nights a week and his stamina is lucky to be over half empty.
The only reason you see it less frequently in HUT or VS is because you can only control one player at a time. In 6s anybody that's any good is spamming it all game long inconsequentially because you don't ever get fatigued enough from sprinting literally the whole game.
LOL.
Add in full pressure and what do you get... 😃
