NHL Team
Community ManagerWhat's your point? We get requests for features to return very frequently. Which often, doesn't happen. This time it did though. Seems like a win for the community as it's been requested since launch.
@EA_Aljo wrote:What's your point? We get requests for features to return very frequently. Which often, doesn't happen. This time it did though. Seems like a win for the community as it's been requested since launch.
I meant what was the point of EA changing it the first time?!
It wasn’t a problem before and the community liked it so EA thinks they know best and changes it. Then the community says they want it back so EA changes it back. That’s the problem a lot of the community has with EA. They “fix” things that aren’t “broken” all the time instead of fixing the things that actually are broken.
The new control system is another example. Nothing that wrong with the old one besides maybe a couple of adjustments that were needed. But let’s make it all about accessibility. I rather have something that is harder to do but is more rewarding than something that is easy to do yet unfulfilling.
Obviously it’s a video game but imagine if in the real NHL every player had the same abilities to do all the same skills, dekes and whatever else? That would make it a very unrealistic and unsatisfying league IMO.
@thebrazenhead75It was probably changed due to the pressure system. You get full pressure for what like 30 seconds. So they probably changed the last minute to 30 seconds because of that. But now with the full minute returning that is gonna make full pressure even crazier potentially now.
Controls were changed because they added some new things to the game and had to remap things around. They also were hoping probably that the 1 touch buttons would be a success into bringing new people into the game allowing them to learn faster and hopefully stay with the game longer.
People don't think enough about having to grow the game in terms of sales and such by bringing in new people. Maybe they have people who don't know hockey but play other sports give this a try and complain that controls are too complicated for them. Me personally I'm not a fan of the new controls for the most part. Guess we will see what from NHL 24 is gonna remain going into NHL 25. Might also mean they take less big chances in the future and could play it safe resulting in everyone saying it's just NHL 24.5 like they love to do.
@KlariskraysNHL wrote:@thebrazenhead75It was probably changed due to the pressure system. You get full pressure for what like 30 seconds. So they probably changed the last minute to 30 seconds because of that. But now with the full minute returning that is gonna make full pressure even crazier potentially now.
Controls were changed because they added some new things to the game and had to remap things around. They also were hoping probably that the 1 touch buttons would be a success into bringing new people into the game allowing them to learn faster and hopefully stay with the game longer.People don't think enough about having to grow the game in terms of sales and such by bringing in new people. Maybe they have people who don't know hockey but play other sports give this a try and complain that controls are too complicated for them. Me personally I'm not a fan of the new controls for the most part. Guess we will see what from NHL 24 is gonna remain going into NHL 25. Might also mean they take less big chances in the future and could play it safe resulting in everyone saying it's just NHL 24.5 like they love to do.
Then they should un nerf the puck dump then to balance things out then. But no, EA needs to force things to justify their pressure system. 😏
Also with the new controls as I’ve previously mentioned. Let’s remove a goalie ability (paddle down) and map another (desperation) save to two buttons. That’s incredibly stupid. Only morons would think that is a good idea.
Im all for bringing in new customers but not at the expense of existing ones. There are ways to do so without alienating the loyal ones that have been buying this game for years. New players should have to adapt. Not the existing ones.
If I like a game enough I’ll play it no matter the difficulty not because it’s easy to play. EA needs to concentrate their marketing on what makes playing online hockey fun and rewarding. Not because it’s easy. I remember playing Gran Turismo and I had to pass certain tests before being able to enter any races. Some were damn hard too but so rewarding when completed.
Keep that easy stuff to offline modes. For online modes that are competitive, maybe make new users pass some basic tests to be able to play. It would only help them rather than them drop into a game and embarrass themselves. Easy one touch dekes etc aren’t going to help them with that.
Community Manager
@thebrazenhead75 wrote:
@EA_Aljo wrote:
What's your point? We get requests for features to return very frequently. Which often, doesn't happen. This time it did though. Seems like a win for the community as it's been requested since launch.
I meant what was the point of EA changing it the first time?!
It wasn’t a problem before and the community liked it so EA thinks they know best and changes it. Then the community says they want it back so EA changes it back. That’s the problem a lot of the community has with EA. They “fix” things that aren’t “broken” all the time instead of fixing the things that actually are broken.
The new control system is another example. Nothing that wrong with the old one besides maybe a couple of adjustments that were needed. But let’s make it all about accessibility. I rather have something that is harder to do but is more rewarding than something that is easy to do yet unfulfilling.Obviously it’s a video game but imagine if in the real NHL every player had the same abilities to do all the same skills, dekes and whatever else? That would make it a very unrealistic and unsatisfying league IMO.
I don't know if it was a bug or if it was intended. If it was intended, why not try it out? We've had a lot of comments over the years that the game is just a copy and paste with updated rosters. Then again, we also hear how NHL 14 was perfect and we should just release that again and update those rosters. The sport of hockey is largely unchanged over the last 20 years. Yet, we're expected to either rehash a game from 10 years ago or recreate it and make it feel like a brand new game every year. Both of those scenarios are unrealistic. What is realistic is changing things up. That can mean removing features, modifying existing ones or adding new ones. Changing mechanics, updating modes, updating graphics and audio, etc. Yeah, it isn't always well received. We have to take some chances though.
Accessibility is huge. We need to make a game that appeals to as large an audience as possible. You want the game to grow? Making it more accessible and drawing in a bigger playerbase is going to do that. Look at Madden and FC. Those have a huge, worldwide following. Hockey has a worldwide following as well. On a far smaller scale though. If you want the truly brand new game that represents a 100+ year old sport that sees little change year to year, it's got to grow. Limiting ourselves to the hardcore, sim, veteran crowd is not the way to do that. I've made it well known that I'm not a fan of the changes to controls. However, I'm glad we also made the game more accessible and drawn in players that otherwise wouldn't have been there. We all adapted when the skill stick controls were introduced. We can all adapt to the new controls. And if those new controls are unfulfilling, use the old ones. It's not like you're forced to use Total Control. Yes, Skill Stick had it's own changes, but it's also harder to use so maybe they would be more fulfilling for you.
The online community that asks for a sim game doesn't realize there's a bigger audience out there. If we only made a game that catered to that community, you'd see far less change year to year as the much lower sales wouldn't allow us to make the changes we do each year. Most likely, we'd be limited to fixing bugs and updating rosters. And if that's all you want, then I go back to my statement of the demands for a new game are more the demands for a rerelease of NHL 14. Today's casual, one button Michigans are tomorrows hardcore players. We all started with easy controls on a casual level and look where we all ended up? Some turned that passion into a career as an influencer. Some became world champs. In my case it put me here every day talking to you all. A lot of the people that make this game are here because they started playing it when they were kids. These forums are full of people that were once casual fans that have grown far beyond that.
I get this years game isn't exactly everyone's bag of pucks. There were a lot of big changes. We've had a huge amount of feedback from you all and that is going to help shape the future of this game. We'll keep trying to find ways to keep you all having fun regardless of being a grizzled veteran or someone stepping onto the ice for the first time.
@thebrazenhead75 wrote:
Keep that easy stuff to offline modes. For online modes that are competitive, maybe make new users pass some basic tests to be able to play. It would only help them rather than them drop into a game and embarrass themselves. Easy one touch dekes etc aren’t going to help them with that.
Drop-in games are where you're meant to learn those skills. That's where a huge amount of us learned how to play going back to NHL 09 with the first year of EASHL. It takes a lot more than mastering one touch dekes to be good at this game.
@EA_Aljo wrote:
@thebrazenhead75 wrote:
@EA_Aljo wrote:What's your point? We get requests for features to return very frequently. Which often, doesn't happen. This time it did though. Seems like a win for the community as it's been requested since launch.
I meant what was the point of EA changing it the first time?!
It wasn’t a problem before and the community liked it so EA thinks they know best and changes it. Then the community says they want it back so EA changes it back. That’s the problem a lot of the community has with EA. They “fix” things that aren’t “broken” all the time instead of fixing the things that actually are broken.
The new control system is another example. Nothing that wrong with the old one besides maybe a couple of adjustments that were needed. But let’s make it all about accessibility. I rather have something that is harder to do but is more rewarding than something that is easy to do yet unfulfilling.Obviously it’s a video game but imagine if in the real NHL every player had the same abilities to do all the same skills, dekes and whatever else? That would make it a very unrealistic and unsatisfying league IMO.
I don't know if it was a bug or if it was intended. If it was intended, why not try it out? We've had a lot of comments over the years that the game is just a copy and paste with updated rosters. Then again, we also hear how NHL 14 was perfect and we should just release that again and update those rosters. The sport of hockey is largely unchanged over the last 20 years. Yet, we're expected to either rehash a game from 10 years ago or recreate it and make it feel like a brand new game every year. Both of those scenarios are unrealistic. What is realistic is changing things up. That can mean removing features, modifying existing ones or adding new ones. Changing mechanics, updating modes, updating graphics and audio, etc. Yeah, it isn't always well received. We have to take some chances though.
Accessibility is huge. We need to make a game that appeals to as large an audience as possible. You want the game to grow? Making it more accessible and drawing in a bigger playerbase is going to do that. Look at Madden and FC. Those have a huge, worldwide following. Hockey has a worldwide following as well. On a far smaller scale though. If you want the truly brand new game that represents a 100+ year old sport that sees little change year to year, it's got to grow. Limiting ourselves to the hardcore, sim, veteran crowd is not the way to do that. I've made it well known that I'm not a fan of the changes to controls. However, I'm glad we also made the game more accessible and drawn in players that otherwise wouldn't have been there. We all adapted when the skill stick controls were introduced. We can all adapt to the new controls. And if those new controls are unfulfilling, use the old ones. It's not like you're forced to use Total Control. Yes, Skill Stick had it's own changes, but it's also harder to use so maybe they would be more fulfilling for you.
The online community that asks for a sim game doesn't realize there's a bigger audience out there. If we only made a game that catered to that community, you'd see far less change year to year as the much lower sales wouldn't allow us to make the changes we do each year. Most likely, we'd be limited to fixing bugs and updating rosters. And if that's all you want, then I go back to my statement of the demands for a new game are more the demands for a rerelease of NHL 14. Today's casual, one button Michigans are tomorrows hardcore players. We all started with easy controls on a casual level and look where we all ended up? Some turned that passion into a career as an influencer. Some became world champs. In my case it put me here every day talking to you all. A lot of the people that make this game are here because they started playing it when they were kids. These forums are full of people that were once casual fans that have grown far beyond that.
I get this years game isn't exactly everyone's bag of pucks. There were a lot of big changes. We've had a huge amount of feedback from you all and that is going to help shape the future of this game. We'll keep trying to find ways to keep you all having fun regardless of being a grizzled veteran or someone stepping onto the ice for the first time.
@thebrazenhead75 wrote:
Keep that easy stuff to offline modes. For online modes that are competitive, maybe make new users pass some basic tests to be able to play. It would only help them rather than them drop into a game and embarrass themselves. Easy one touch dekes etc aren’t going to help them with that.
Drop-in games are where you're meant to learn those skills. That's where a huge amount of us learned how to play going back to NHL 09 with the first year of EASHL. It takes a lot more than mastering one touch dekes to be good at this game.
How much accessibility does EA need without alienating their current fanbase? Is it really worth the extra sales to gain a few players that might play one or two games a week at the expense of losing a couple of players that play one or two games every night of the week?
I see tons more people saying they quit buying and playing the game more than I see new players. This game is NEVER going to be on the same level of FIFA or MADDEN. They need to maximize their niche market and if they want to increase their player base (sales) then sell the game of hockey itself and what makes it great to play.
Im not one of those that needs a new revamped game every year. I buy it anyways because it’s the only hockey game and I grew up loving hockey What I do want though is fixes to be done that definitely need it and no changes to the things that aren’t broken. Once again, “paddle down” should absolutely be out back in. Take out one of the redundant “desperation saves”. I don’t need two buttons to do the same thing (which I rarely if ever use) while not being able to use an ability that I did quite often use. Whoever made that change and approved it is a * and should be fired!
How stupid would it be if a contractor/renovator took out your bathroom sink and added another toilet? That’s what EA essentially did.
I think the thing with people complaining about each release being a glorified roster update is that it's a self-inflicted wound. Nobody's forcing EA/NHL's hand to release a game every year that they can't make fresh and new. Those two corporations do that because it's an avenue to make more money every year. Kinda like how back in the day you'd get a new Saw movie every Halloween. Was the new sequel warranted? No, but it made money, so we got it.
Really, I think sports games should just be live service games. It makes way more sense than a yearly release imo. But, I'm sure there's profit considerations that would need to be made to do that.
I think a lot of frustration comes not from EA not making any changes to the game, because they do. Rather, I think it's that seemingly a lot of time gets allocated towards secondary, trivial, window dressings instead of important, game-changing issues. Like, I can only hope that maybe next game, goalies will be able to cover pucks that are sitting right next to the outside of the post, though I won't hold my breath. However, I sure as hell know that we'll get some idiotic cartoonish animated skates, or some fancy new glow-in-the-dark warewolf costume that nobody will ever use.
Idk, I'm sure the dev team works hard and is trying to make a good game. But, just as a fan, I feel like so many important issues just don't ever get addressed while nonsense that doesn't matter gets priority.
As far as the sim/arcade issue goes, I feel that's very easily resolved. Just make EASHL be a more hardcore, realistic, slower paced sim mode for the competitive 3s/6s communities, and have a second mode that's fast paced action with all the cartoonish abilities and perks, gigantic hits with guys flying through the glass and into the parking lot, etc. I think trying to blend the two is where you run into issues and leaving every unsatisfied.
@SummerOfDekes wrote:Really, I think sports games should just be live service games. It makes way more sense than a yearly release imo.
Ding ding ding! This is something I've agreed with forever. I would love it if NHL's model was something closer to Rocket League with just one version across years and platforms. Some benefits:
Look, I already know that I am just day dreaming. Monetization is the conundrum here and if EA is already getting a large chunk of the fanbase to buy the game annually and for HUT players to buy new cards annually, there is no business incentive to switch to live service. Still would be nice though.
Sports games are much harder to go as a live service because of the Sport Licenses and the fact they would need to remove players here or there when they expire. So it greatly would affect things like HUT and offline modes. People's saved files would end up getting corrupted because players would be removed from games each year for offline play. And if it did become a live service I would think it would be a subscription model And that could be a slippery slope.
They aren't going to make 2 different EASHL type modes. They aren't about to split the community up even more. I mean look they combined Drop-Ins to essentially be EASHL because of complaints of no one finding games. So they addressed that. Even traits are linear among all the modes.
I'm fully expecting NHL 25 to either give us an online franchise mode or they gonna give some life back to HUT with changes. Of course there will be gameplay changes too but I'm not expecting anything special to World of Chel.
@KlariskraysNHL wrote:Sports games are much harder to go as a live service because of the Sport Licenses and the fact they would need to remove players here or there when they expire. So it greatly would affect things like HUT and offline modes. People's saved files would end up getting corrupted because players would be removed from games each year for offline play. And if it did become a live service I would think it would be a subscription model And that could be a slippery slope.
They aren't going to make 2 different EASHL type modes. They aren't about to split the community up even more. I mean look they combined Drop-Ins to essentially be EASHL because of complaints of no one finding games. So they addressed that. Even traits are linear among all the modes.
I'm fully expecting NHL 25 to either give us an online franchise mode or they gonna give some life back to HUT with changes. Of course there will be gameplay changes too but I'm not expecting anything special to World of Chel.
I'm not talking about two different EASHLs, I'm talking about a mode separate from EASHL. Some of the older games had the kind of mode I'm talking about, but I forget what it was called. It was a 6s online mode, tho. You could have EASHL be the gritty sim mode and have the other mode be the cartoony superhero hockey mode.
Or, they could just leave the game be and continue to lose players. Tbh, I don't necessarily care too much as I myself barely play this game anymore because of how poor it is.
@KlariskraysNHLI think it's possible. You just need to remove the offline component of the game completely. Realistically, I know it has been mentioned that down the road they will look at offline modes, but it doesn't make sense seeing the focus is solely on what they can sell (hence the cards, season pass, operators and fortnite type store for your player) You can build a model around selling a season pass and then have an ultimate pass for stuff like online franchise give you access to a server for you and your friends. You wouldn't need much else from the offline side of it.
Is it good... No... but with how the direction has been to make it more of an online/fast paced experience, goofy over the top celebrations and making it overall more flashy, to catering to the average player. I can't see it really going any other way.
Btw these thoughts are coming from a solely offline player (franchise and once be a pro) going back to NHL 94.
@SummerOfDekes wrote:
@KlariskraysNHL wrote:Sports games are much harder to go as a live service because of the Sport Licenses and the fact they would need to remove players here or there when they expire. So it greatly would affect things like HUT and offline modes. People's saved files would end up getting corrupted because players would be removed from games each year for offline play. And if it did become a live service I would think it would be a subscription model And that could be a slippery slope.
They aren't going to make 2 different EASHL type modes. They aren't about to split the community up even more. I mean look they combined Drop-Ins to essentially be EASHL because of complaints of no one finding games. So they addressed that. Even traits are linear among all the modes.
I'm fully expecting NHL 25 to either give us an online franchise mode or they gonna give some life back to HUT with changes. Of course there will be gameplay changes too but I'm not expecting anything special to World of Chel.
I'm not talking about two different EASHLs, I'm talking about a mode separate from EASHL. Some of the older games had the kind of mode I'm talking about, but I forget what it was called. It was a 6s online mode, tho. You could have EASHL be the gritty sim mode and have the other mode be the cartoony superhero hockey mode.
Or, they could just leave the game be and continue to lose players. Tbh, I don't necessarily care too much as I myself barely play this game anymore because of how poor it is.
You're talking about OTP (online team play), you play 6s with NHL players instead of your created player in club. OTP is also where they gave in and let us try out full collision physics for a week back in the day.
@EA_Aljo wrote:
@thebrazenhead75 wrote:
@EA_Aljo wrote:What's your point? We get requests for features to return very frequently. Which often, doesn't happen. This time it did though. Seems like a win for the community as it's been requested since launch.
I meant what was the point of EA changing it the first time?!
It wasn’t a problem before and the community liked it so EA thinks they know best and changes it. Then the community says they want it back so EA changes it back. That’s the problem a lot of the community has with EA. They “fix” things that aren’t “broken” all the time instead of fixing the things that actually are broken.
The new control system is another example. Nothing that wrong with the old one besides maybe a couple of adjustments that were needed. But let’s make it all about accessibility. I rather have something that is harder to do but is more rewarding than something that is easy to do yet unfulfilling.Obviously it’s a video game but imagine if in the real NHL every player had the same abilities to do all the same skills, dekes and whatever else? That would make it a very unrealistic and unsatisfying league IMO.
I don't know if it was a bug or if it was intended. If it was intended, why not try it out? We've had a lot of comments over the years that the game is just a copy and paste with updated rosters. Then again, we also hear how NHL 14 was perfect and we should just release that again and update those rosters. The sport of hockey is largely unchanged over the last 20 years. Yet, we're expected to either rehash a game from 10 years ago or recreate it and make it feel like a brand new game every year. Both of those scenarios are unrealistic. What is realistic is changing things up. That can mean removing features, modifying existing ones or adding new ones. Changing mechanics, updating modes, updating graphics and audio, etc. Yeah, it isn't always well received. We have to take some chances though.
Accessibility is huge. We need to make a game that appeals to as large an audience as possible. You want the game to grow? Making it more accessible and drawing in a bigger playerbase is going to do that. Look at Madden and FC. Those have a huge, worldwide following. Hockey has a worldwide following as well. On a far smaller scale though. If you want the truly brand new game that represents a 100+ year old sport that sees little change year to year, it's got to grow. Limiting ourselves to the hardcore, sim, veteran crowd is not the way to do that. I've made it well known that I'm not a fan of the changes to controls. However, I'm glad we also made the game more accessible and drawn in players that otherwise wouldn't have been there. We all adapted when the skill stick controls were introduced. We can all adapt to the new controls. And if those new controls are unfulfilling, use the old ones. It's not like you're forced to use Total Control. Yes, Skill Stick had it's own changes, but it's also harder to use so maybe they would be more fulfilling for you.
The online community that asks for a sim game doesn't realize there's a bigger audience out there. If we only made a game that catered to that community, you'd see far less change year to year as the much lower sales wouldn't allow us to make the changes we do each year. Most likely, we'd be limited to fixing bugs and updating rosters. And if that's all you want, then I go back to my statement of the demands for a new game are more the demands for a rerelease of NHL 14. Today's casual, one button Michigans are tomorrows hardcore players. We all started with easy controls on a casual level and look where we all ended up? Some turned that passion into a career as an influencer. Some became world champs. In my case it put me here every day talking to you all. A lot of the people that make this game are here because they started playing it when they were kids. These forums are full of people that were once casual fans that have grown far beyond that.
I get this years game isn't exactly everyone's bag of pucks. There were a lot of big changes. We've had a huge amount of feedback from you all and that is going to help shape the future of this game. We'll keep trying to find ways to keep you all having fun regardless of being a grizzled veteran or someone stepping onto the ice for the first time.------------------
I'm sorry you and the team are so misguided if you believe that a more sim game doesn't lead to a larger audience not a smaller one.
There has never been a sim hockey game, every year the game is arcadey. It's even more arcadey now than it has ever been. People want simulation style games. They want to replicate the sport they see on TV and the assertion that they don't is why this game gets disliked. If you have a passionate fan base word of mouth sells your game as we bring people into it. Making an arcade game and hoping people like it doesn't do that. It's just not correct in what brings people into video games I'm sorry. The highest selling games are hardcore that brings in casuals because the fanbase is rabid. You can see it with every game that gets big. They have arcade visuals with hardcore systems of gameplay.
In sports games you cite Madden and FC and for years they have gotten bad community reviews yet they still sell because the sports are popular not because the games are great. You literally own the rights to football it's the only football game people can play. Madden sells because of that. NHL is the same way. You are the only hockey game on the market. You get sales because of that. Not because your gameplay is amazing.
@llamaverox wrote:In sports games you cite Madden and FC and for years they have gotten bad community reviews yet they still sell
This is because people post and spread unfavorable "reviews" after they spend $100+ on a new HUt/FUT/MUt team and take a few losses.
When people spend money and expect to win and they don't, they're going to bash the game relentlessly and obsessively. It perfectly explains the reasoning as to why someone who "hates" the game, "will never buy it" and thinks "it will never get better" spends countless hours on all social channels for said game trying to convince anyone who will listen to agree with them.
Also, sports games change year after year. New Mechanics, New controls... if a certain segment of the population doesn't master the new controls and begin dominating the leaderboards "like they did last year" - then they think all of the changes are garbage and start bashing the game, posting poor reviews etc in some weird attempt to delfect any responsibility from actually learning new mechanics.
Obligatory - I Don't think the game is perfect. I'm not saying everyone who posts complaints or bad reviews is a butt hurt HUt bunny - Be a Pro, Franchise.. I don't play them but there are legit complaints about years long bugs in those modes.
My point being - sports games from any company are always going to have a subset of users who will obsessively spend their time arguing that the game sucks and insist everyone see things from their point of view, otherwise you're just a 'shill'
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@llamaverox wrote:In sports games you cite Madden and FC and for years they have gotten bad community reviews yet they still sell
This is because people post and spread unfavorable "reviews" after they spend $100+ on a new HUt/FUT/MUt team and take a few losses.
When people spend money and expect to win and they don't, they're going to bash the game relentlessly and obsessively. It perfectly explains the reasoning as to why someone who "hates" the game, "will never buy it" and thinks "it will never get better" spends countless hours on all social channels for said game trying to convince anyone who will listen to agree with them.
Also, sports games change year after year. New Mechanics, New controls... if a certain segment of the population doesn't master the new controls and begin dominating the leaderboards "like they did last year" - then they think all of the changes are garbage and start bashing the game, posting poor reviews etc in some weird attempt to delfect any responsibility from actually learning new mechanics.
Obligatory - I Don't think the game is perfect. I'm not saying everyone who posts complaints or bad reviews is a butt hurt HUt bunny - Be a Pro, Franchise.. I don't play them but there are legit complaints about years long bugs in those modes.
My point being - sports games from any company are always going to have a subset of users who will obsessively spend their time arguing that the game sucks and insist everyone see things from their point of view, otherwise you're just a 'shill'
That is completely your own opinion. I don't buy madden because the game is bad. Not because I take a few losses. NFL 2k5 is compared to madden every year and 2k5 is better in many aspects a now 20 year old game is a better simulation of football than a 2024 video game and it's extremely obtuse to suggest it's because people lose games of FuT. Please don't gaslight legitimate concerns about gameplay for a series that consistently ranks in the 60's on metacritic and an average 1.2 from the community on metacritic.
@llamaverox wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@llamaverox wrote:In sports games you cite Madden and FC and for years they have gotten bad community reviews yet they still sell
This is because people post and spread unfavorable "reviews" after they spend $100+ on a new HUt/FUT/MUt team and take a few losses.
When people spend money and expect to win and they don't, they're going to bash the game relentlessly and obsessively. It perfectly explains the reasoning as to why someone who "hates" the game, "will never buy it" and thinks "it will never get better" spends countless hours on all social channels for said game trying to convince anyone who will listen to agree with them.
Also, sports games change year after year. New Mechanics, New controls... if a certain segment of the population doesn't master the new controls and begin dominating the leaderboards "like they did last year" - then they think all of the changes are garbage and start bashing the game, posting poor reviews etc in some weird attempt to delfect any responsibility from actually learning new mechanics.
Obligatory - I Don't think the game is perfect. I'm not saying everyone who posts complaints or bad reviews is a butt hurt HUt bunny - Be a Pro, Franchise.. I don't play them but there are legit complaints about years long bugs in those modes.
My point being - sports games from any company are always going to have a subset of users who will obsessively spend their time arguing that the game sucks and insist everyone see things from their point of view, otherwise you're just a 'shill'
That is completely your own opinion. I don't buy madden because the game is bad. Not because I take a few losses. NFL 2k5 is compared to madden every year and 2k5 is better in many aspects a now 20 year old game is a better simulation of football than a 2024 video game and it's extremely obtuse to suggest it's because people lose games of FuT. Please don't gaslight legitimate concerns about gameplay for a series that consistently ranks in the 60's on metacritic and an average 1.2 from the community on metacritic.
I've seen people give 1 star because they couldn't figure out new controls. Reviews in the gaming industry mean nothing.
Only thing you can do is monitor community feedback and rectify any issues you see that are trends and make sense to the vision of the game. This NHL they cracked down hard on all the glitch goals which was much appreciated. Hopefully next year they tackle the META like big goalies, skill zoning defense, AI, and hitting mechanics.
It's the best NHL we have had in a while.
@phomi99 wrote:
@llamaverox wrote:
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@llamaverox wrote:In sports games you cite Madden and FC and for years they have gotten bad community reviews yet they still sell
This is because people post and spread unfavorable "reviews" after they spend $100+ on a new HUt/FUT/MUt team and take a few losses.
When people spend money and expect to win and they don't, they're going to bash the game relentlessly and obsessively. It perfectly explains the reasoning as to why someone who "hates" the game, "will never buy it" and thinks "it will never get better" spends countless hours on all social channels for said game trying to convince anyone who will listen to agree with them.
Also, sports games change year after year. New Mechanics, New controls... if a certain segment of the population doesn't master the new controls and begin dominating the leaderboards "like they did last year" - then they think all of the changes are garbage and start bashing the game, posting poor reviews etc in some weird attempt to delfect any responsibility from actually learning new mechanics.
Obligatory - I Don't think the game is perfect. I'm not saying everyone who posts complaints or bad reviews is a butt hurt HUt bunny - Be a Pro, Franchise.. I don't play them but there are legit complaints about years long bugs in those modes.
My point being - sports games from any company are always going to have a subset of users who will obsessively spend their time arguing that the game sucks and insist everyone see things from their point of view, otherwise you're just a 'shill'
That is completely your own opinion. I don't buy madden because the game is bad. Not because I take a few losses. NFL 2k5 is compared to madden every year and 2k5 is better in many aspects a now 20 year old game is a better simulation of football than a 2024 video game and it's extremely obtuse to suggest it's because people lose games of FuT. Please don't gaslight legitimate concerns about gameplay for a series that consistently ranks in the 60's on metacritic and an average 1.2 from the community on metacritic.
I've seen people give 1 star because they couldn't figure out new controls. Reviews in the gaming industry mean nothing.
Only thing you can do is monitor community feedback and rectify any issues you see that are trends and make sense to the vision of the game. This NHL they cracked down hard on all the glitch goals which was much appreciated. Hopefully next year they tackle the META like big goalies, skill zoning defense, AI, and hitting mechanics.
It's the best NHL we have had in a while.
We just flat out disagree, I think it's the worst nhl game I've played for 1v1, there are still a few glitch goals, and the gameplay is not fun to me as the AI continues to be horribly designed with trying to switch with players. I am in a community of players in 6s league and the overwhelming consensus with one or two outliers is the game is horrible. This is not just a few people it's 8/10 if not more of the people I play with.
@llamaverox wrote:We just flat out disagree, I think it's the worst nhl game I've played for 1v1, there are still a few glitch goals, and the gameplay is not fun to me as the AI continues to be horribly designed with trying to switch with players. I am in a community of players in 6s league and the overwhelming consensus with one or two outliers is the game is horrible. This is not just a few people it's 8/10 if not more of the people I play with.
There aren't any glitch goals. AI issues are mostly related to human controls and mistakes. Anyone playing in a 6s league doesn't think the game is horrible. They may tell everyone who will listen that "the game sucks" but they're literally playing the game. They've bought the game. They're putting in effort to track stats of the game. They're likely promoting on social media to get people to join their league to play the game. They go to the effort of coordinating amongst 6 people to play the game. They're literally telling EA, "I like this game, keep it coming" every single time they dish out $$ to play the game.
If someone hates a game, then why do they keep playing it?
And before we get all "tHiS iS tHe oNlY hOcKeY gAmE oN tHe mArKeT" - just stop. Nobody is forcing you to play this game.
The game clearly has a myriad of issues that plague all of the modes. There's no doubt about that. But this constant drumbeat of "everyone I know hates the game too" while simultaneously continuing to purchase it, play it, organize around it and generally enjoying it daily is just evidence that most of the "outrage" is performative hivemind stuff.
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@llamaverox wrote:We just flat out disagree, I think it's the worst nhl game I've played for 1v1, there are still a few glitch goals, and the gameplay is not fun to me as the AI continues to be horribly designed with trying to switch with players. I am in a community of players in 6s league and the overwhelming consensus with one or two outliers is the game is horrible. This is not just a few people it's 8/10 if not more of the people I play with.
There aren't any glitch goals. AI issues are mostly related to human controls and mistakes. Anyone playing in a 6s league doesn't think the game is horrible. They may tell everyone who will listen that "the game sucks" but they're literally playing the game. They've bought the game. They're putting in effort to track stats of the game. They're likely promoting on social media to get people to join their league to play the game. They go to the effort of coordinating amongst 6 people to play the game. They're literally telling EA, "I like this game, keep it coming" every single time they dish out $$ to play the game.
If someone hates a game, then why do they keep playing it?
And before we get all "tHiS iS tHe oNlY hOcKeY gAmE oN tHe mArKeT" - just stop. Nobody is forcing you to play this game.
The game clearly has a myriad of issues that plague all of the modes. There's no doubt about that. But this constant drumbeat of "everyone I know hates the game too" while simultaneously continuing to purchase it, play it, organize around it and generally enjoying it daily is just evidence that most of the "outrage" is performative hivemind stuff.
I'm not buying it again. Many of the people I play with are not as well. So let's get that out of the way right now.
It is the only hockey game on the market. I don't think you understand why I or many others play the game. I love the sport of hockey, I love the 6s dynamic of teamplay what I don't like is being annoyed at playing the video game of the sport I love. So yeah, to answer your question I'm done. The game is horrible. Hopefully when I get it on gamepass for free next year to test it out it's better. They aren't getting 70+ from me anymore.
I'd like to point out that anyone not finding issues with the game in a 6v6 setting are mostly due to the fact these are usually highly tuned leagues that outright ban certain abilities and every single person on the ice has a min/maxed build based around their exact position and, usually, have mics to communicate and uphold accountability for position -- Once you introduce even 1 single AI player this all falls apart and you see how bad the game is for the vast majority of players. It's easy to talk from your high horse dedicated Defensive Defenseman with 99 stick check and awareness when you still have a decked out Sniper, Grinder, and Playmaker backing you up, y'know?
Most of the EASHL community plays 3v3 hockey usually with just 2v2 humans a side - even if it's 3v3 you still have AI goalies which are beyond garbage. You are all forced to create jack of all trades builds which seriously hamper the ability to play "properly". You are forced to play "out of position" and the AI just cannot handle it. At this point, the AI is messing up, not the humans so you can see the issue this causes.
0 anticipation, 0 accountability, 0 learning ability from the AI makes the game so bad. I don't need them to be amazing or even good; I just want them to not be beyond useless/an actual detriment to the game.
The term "glitch goal" gets thrown around so much it's lost all meaning. Look, I don't mean it's a literal glitch, just that certain goals are a major problem. If I can basically guarantee something will be a goal, like a 95+ % chance of going in, something is seriously wrong and that needs to be addressed for balance reasons. I'm talking just make the "% chance the goalie will make a save on a left right left deke wrister slider" was shifted over just 5 extra percent, not make them literally impossible or give you an automatic game ejection. Small and deliberate changes are so much better than knee jerk huge changes.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:I'd like to point out that anyone not finding issues with the game in a 6v6 setting are mostly due to the fact these are usually highly tuned leagues that outright ban certain abilities and every single person on the ice has a min/maxed build based around their exact position and, usually, have mics to communicate and uphold accountability for position -- Once you introduce even 1 single AI player this all falls apart and you see how bad the game is for the vast majority of players
Because those players are good at making videogame decisions, but terrible at making hockey decisions. The AI is programmed to play hockey. Most sweaty elites are making decisions based on a videogame. These two don't jive and you'll always see griping about the A.I.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:0 anticipation, 0 accountability, 0 learning ability from the AI makes the game so bad.
This is so wrong. I don't think the AI 'learns' in the sense that it is keeping a database of analytics and then using that information to adjust on the fly. However, it does have anticipation and I think many people ignore it or don't see it because they're too busy blaming the AI for everything.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote: If I can basically guarantee something will be a goal, like a 95+ % chance of going in, something is seriously wrong and that needs to be addressed for balance reasons.
You're making gross generalizations here. I highly doubt there are a lot of incidents that you can guarantee a goal is going in, outside of a penalty shot/breakaway. When it comes to those plays, the player has already made an error in letting the opponent get that close to their net.
@llamaverox wrote:I don't think you understand why I or many others play the game. I love the sport of hockey, I love the 6s dynamic of teamplay
This isn't a unique or profound viewpoint or something difficult to understand. That's why we're all here.
@KidShowtime1867 wrote:
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:
I'd like to point out that anyone not finding issues with the game in a 6v6 setting are mostly due to the fact these are usually highly tuned leagues that outright ban certain abilities and every single person on the ice has a min/maxed build based around their exact position and, usually, have mics to communicate and uphold accountability for position -- Once you introduce even 1 single AI player this all falls apart and you see how bad the game is for the vast majority of players
Because those players are good at making videogame decisions, but terrible at making hockey decisions. The AI is programmed to play hockey. Most sweaty elites are making decisions based on a videogame. These two don't jive and you'll always see griping about the A.I.
I'm just saying that full human teams bypass most gameplay related issues. Sure, there are still controls, the fact the playable surface is actually slightly above the ice which can cause puck issues, clipping etc. etc. to contend with, but at the end of the day, most grading and positional awareness is on the player.
As a 2v2 player I'm forced to play the game different than what the game/devs expect and am punished for it. Balance should be centered around the fact its a video game that has a meta. If you want a more authentic experience you should be playing offline with custom sliders.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:0 anticipation, 0 accountability, 0 learning ability from the AI makes the game so bad.This is so wrong. I don't think the AI 'learns' in the sense that it is keeping a database of analytics and then using that information to adjust on the fly. However, it does have anticipation and I think many people ignore it or don't see it because they're too busy blaming the AI for everything.
Offline has a literal AI learning slider - They are more than capable of noticing if a player has a bias going to one side or taking a certain shot. The old CM said introducing something like that could be exploited but the AI has already been hard countered years ago -- they literally don't defend on purpose. The goalies are absolute garbage, not even at par with beer league hockey. They have no "do not dump" command. They literally try to cover zones that shouldn't be covered. They use a 6v6 logic system in 3v3 which is completely asinine as it causes the 3rd man (assuming 2v2 humans) to take the role of 3rd attacker, even with all defensive settings, etc. etc.. You can't honestly sit there and say they cant drastically improve AI - I have posted numerous videos showing just how bad they can be.
Awareness, anticipation, and learning are fundamental parts of real hockey so what I'm asking for isn't crazy. We're still playing with AI that hasn't improved in over a decade.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote: If I can basically guarantee something will be a goal, like a 95+ % chance of going in, something is seriously wrong and that needs to be addressed for balance reasons.You're making gross generalizations here. I highly doubt there are a lot of incidents that you can guarantee a goal is going in, outside of a penalty shot/breakaway. When it comes to those plays, the player has already made an error in letting the opponent get that close to their net.
I'm just trying to make my point more simple but yes there are tons of ways you can almost guarantee a goal. My clubs are always top 50 and we've played/beaten every time you can think of.
- Cross creasers
- One timers from the circles
- Stop and go on the AI to force them moving to one side ao you can easily score on goalie
- Certain build types and L2 combos that negate hits allowing for you to just get up close on a goalie
There are tons of ways outside of just penalty shots and forced breakaways to get scoring opportunities. You're talking about a game where literally even a 1mph shot from behind your own net has the ability to freak the other goalie out and score on himself - there is plenty to fix
Ahhh so I made an error when I have the puck, all alone, and my AI on defensive settings, is in the neutral zone, chopping and slashing, and grinding people along the boards for penalties in 3v3?
My error blocking an easy cross cross only to find that the puck slid under my stick?
My bad when the AI D man literally just stands there for 2 seconds after ever faceoff?
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:
As a 2v2 player I'm forced to play the game different than what the game/devs expect and am punished for it.
I don't think the A.I. has been upgraded enough to facilitate all of the decision making involved in 3v3. That said, I don't understand why you think you're being 'forced' to play the game differently than the devs expected and then go on to say you're actively being punished for that?
It's quite simple; The AI wants you to be positionally perfect. If you slightly deviate, they will adjust and/or expose themselves. If you play with the ai enough, you can learn to anticipate when they're going to make a pass or change positions and adjust accordingly. This is part of the skill of the game (learning to work with ai). I'm not quite sure what happened where everyone expected the ai to be absolutely perfect regardless of human decision-making.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote:- Cross creasers
- One timers from the circles
- Stop and go on the AI to force them moving to one side ao you can easily score on goalie
- Certain build types and L2 combos that negate hits allowing for you to just get up close on a goalie
Cross-creasers are not glitch goals. Even when you aren't considering the literal meaning of the word glitch. Let's say 'always' or 'go-to' goals. Cross creasers are the direct result of defensive deficiencies. You can't let skilled players execute a pass and uncontested one-timer and have the expectation that it should be stopped more often than not. Those are good goals because it's ALWAYS the result of a defender making a bad decision.
One-timers from the circles.. again.. not an 'always' or 'go-to' goal, unless you're a team that has become skilled at forcing players to make bad defensive decisions.
Stutter step to throw the A.I. off - this is known by even the offline communities as a method to throw off the a.i. It's also a real-world tactic that works wonders to get a step on an opponent. I understand the susceptibility of the CPU to fall victim to this is rather unrealistic and that could be improved upon, however, if you're a team relying on an a.i. defender - you need to learn to anticipate these actions and adapt. Again, that's part of the skill of this game if you're relying on a.i.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote: Ahhh so I made an error when I have the puck, all alone, and my AI on defensive settings, is in the neutral zone, chopping and slashing, and grinding people along the boards for penalties in 3v3?
This scenario doesn't happen as often as you may think. There's clearly an issue with CPU taking penalties, especially in 3v3. However, I'm certain that there's a human element to CPU taking agressive actions on non-puck carrying opponents. I haven't been able to pinpoint exactly what the human actions is that results in a CPU taking a penalty, but I've got some evidence and theories around that subject. Once I can nail down the theory, I'll present it here for sure.
@TTZ_Dipsy wrote: My error blocking an easy cross cross only to find that the puck slid under my stick?
My bad when the AI D man literally just stands there for 2 seconds after ever faceoff?
Sometimes, in real life, players can think they're blocking a lane but the puck goes under their stick, blade, etc. It happens. I can block 90% of the cross-crease attempts I see developing by getting into the passing lane and actively facing the puck carrier and/or engaging the anticipated recipient to disrupt their shot or pass reception. Relying on LB to crouch and block a lane has never been the best method, especially with xfactors and such that add auto-sauce.
And again, the bug with the ai standing there is well-known and I wish it would be fixed, but it's clearly not intended behaviour.
