REAL Total Control (Not Arcade)

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@EA_Aljo wrote:

@Limp_KidzKit 

How are you personally at a disadvantage when you say this -

"Fully manual passing is easier than its ever been. My 60 year old dad can use it and loves it."

Not everyone has this same skill. Most likely, you're at an advantage since you can expertly pass the puck where you want it. You're able to lead the receiver, for example. Something that makes a big difference and is more difficult with assisted passing. So, I really don't understand your complaint. Unless you're just saying you want everyone else to be at a disadvantage to benefit your own play.

Yes. I've tried manual passing. I'd rather keep it assisted. The game flow is better and there are less frustrating moments. Fully manual passing is unnecessary and would enhance the experience for very few.

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While I will agree with you to some extent, it would add a skill that would need to be mastered which would then raise the skill ceiling of the game. Raising the skill ceiling makes there be something to play for (on top of rewards). What I suggest though is utilize divisions for this so at the div 10 (Rookie) tier level you are full pass assist and it progressively goes down at each tier to where even Div 1 (elite) tier have their pass assist set to maybe like 10-20 to allow for some ping error. This would keep the casual level being able to play while having actual prestige for being a Div 1 type player, which right now means very little in the grand scheme. If implemented correctly, it could then be set up in private matches to really push the competition to either go full 0 assist for those high prized esports events or maybe put it at a more balanced 40-50 for the Online League community to play at. When there is nothing to play for, there is little reason to be playing the game to improve. Just an idea though. 

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@EA_Aljo wrote:

@Limp_KidzKit 

How are you personally at a disadvantage when you say this -

"Fully manual passing is easier than its ever been. My 60 year old dad can use it and loves it."

Not everyone has this same skill. Most likely, you're at an advantage since you can expertly pass the puck where you want it. You're able to lead the receiver, for example. Something that makes a big difference and is more difficult with assisted passing. So, I really don't understand your complaint. Unless you're just saying you want everyone else to be at a disadvantage to benefit your own play.

Yes. I've tried manual passing. I'd rather keep it assisted. The game flow is better and there are less frustrating moments. Fully manual passing is unnecessary and would enhance the experience for very few.

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Wait wait wait, are you saying that having manual passing where every pass requires precision is somehow NOT at a disadvantage to someone who needs to put LS on maybe the same half of the ice at most of their intended receiver, hitting RT, then the game will even auto sauce if need be lol? So if I put a pro call of duty player vs a casual with an aimbot, you'd tell the casual that they're at a disadvantage because the pro has mastered manual aiming lol? That's what you're going with here huh?

How is the flow of the game better? Because you can whip a 400 mph no-look backhanded pass with almost zero precision required?

Have you watched a game of Rocket League? Have you watched a game of 6s NHL? One flows like water, one like a car on square wheels. I'll let you figure out which is which.

Less frustrating moments? For who? Unskilled offensive players? What metric you using to quantify this pain (or lack thereof)? What about all the defensive points I just brought up? Game less frustrating for those players who can't realistically contain offensive players who can easily whip ridiculous passes from bad body positions while skating at superman level speeds all while having almost zero incidental contact rendering body positioning nearly useless?

This isn't a "self-serving" request for winning online games lol....Are you actually implying that online glory is my primary motive here? This is a request for this game to become a legitimate competitive game like a rocket league because funny enough, a game that has rocket powered cars hitting a soccer ball somehow "feels" like hockey unlike the "simulation" hockey offering currently on the market. And you know why that is? Because both sides of the ball are balanced and the game requires skill to be successful. There's no way a game should be catering its COMPETITIVE default setting to people who want "easy flow" and success playing the game by mindlessly tap RT with their LS in the gneral vacinity of their target . 

And again, please address my defensive comments. I want you to comment on why we keep adding manual processes, more clicks, more user input and skill to all defensive aspects of the game while simultaneously dumbing down offense to an almost embarrasingly easy level for the sake of "flow" and "accesibility" if "flow" and "accessibility" are the two primary goals/objectives of the dev team's vision. It's a contradictory vision that leads to this laughable game balance currently felt in online games.

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@hiperay wrote:

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While I will agree with you to some extent, it would add a skill that would need to be mastered which would then raise the skill ceiling of the game. Raising the skill ceiling makes there be something to play for (on top of rewards). What I suggest though is utilize divisions for this so at the div 10 (Rookie) tier level you are full pass assist and it progressively goes down at each tier to where even Div 1 (elite) tier have their pass assist set to maybe like 10-20 to allow for some ping error. This would keep the casual level being able to play while having actual prestige for being a Div 1 type player, which right now means very little in the grand scheme. If implemented correctly, it could then be set up in private matches to really push the competition to either go full 0 assist for those high prized esports events or maybe put it at a more balanced 40-50 for the Online League community to play at. When there is nothing to play for, there is little reason to be playing the game to improve. Just an idea though. 

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I'm personally not a fan of this. I think changing up the gameplay difficulty as you rank up is going to be frustrating. There already is a skill gap with passing. Plus, you're going to be facing tougher opponents when you reach higher divisions. I don't see the need to make passing more difficult with higher ranks on top of the more challenging competition.

While I did come up with an alternative in my most recent post regarding the visual pass help tool, I will touch on this as well. I do disagree with you in thinking that passing requires skill in this game. For one, passes are constantly being forced cross crease to other players in the hopes they pick it up and bury it. Passes also have a large window of success, not a small one by any means. 

That Orange line means it will pass in that direction despite your joystick (identified by the yellow vision) being way off. I can show video if need be.
Anyways my other statement is that in this idea for it, you are lowering it gradually by 10% each division so it would not be a substantial change but a more slow paced and balanced. The idea that a Division 1, supposedly the most pristine rank in this game for a club has this passing assistance is absurd. This is four times their yellow vision at 100% pass assist.

@hiperay 

Even on full assist, you still have to aim your passes. There is less margin for error though. 

Thanks for the feedback on this.

All I am saying is that the margin for error is way to big for people who are good at the game and in the Division One clubs or Elite Ranks. Maybe this belongs in a different thread but still gonna post it here.

100 Assist.

50 Assist

10 Assist

Remember that yellow IS where I am aiming. So you are saying I could miss my player by as much as what is shown in order to still make a tape to tape pass to them? Is it so much to ask of good players to be actually good at hitting their targets? I am not saying bring it down to 0 here where even the slightest miss forces the responding player to have to skate towards the puck but is asking them to hit a target this wide (at 100) vs this wide (at 10) that bad if they are indeed this good at the game?

@hiperay 

I don't know what the exact margin for error is. I'm sure someone can go into practice mode and try it out. I do know that I occasionally miss that window though and my passes don't go where I thought I was aiming. Even with 100% assistance, you can certainly miss your target if your aim is off.

As far as your suggestion goes though, again, thanks for the feedback. 

I want to reiterate something I’ve mentioned earlier in this thread:

I would have no problem using a very involved/nuanced control layout like the one I proposed while at the same time other players use “Total Control” or any other layout in the same game.

It’s just a matter of how much control/freedom vs. how much cpu-assistance you want:

-if you want more control, more freedom, and more room for creativity, then take on a layout like the one I propose, but do so knowing it’ll be more difficult to master. 

-if you want more cpu-assistance, something simpler to learn, and don’t mind sacrificing a little creative freedom, then use a layout like Total Control and just have fun.

This way, everyone can get into the game as a beginner and have a lot of fun playing against newbies and experts alike.

If you’re a casual gamer, you don’t want to have to “train” to play a game.  But as you get better and better, you can begin to add more and more nuanced control to your layout, providing you with the freedom to be more creative.

I think, over time, a lot of people would see the advantage of having more control.   Especially people that play the game daily. I know geeks like myself don’t mind putting in a little extra practice to develop skills that give you more control. 

There are a lot of us that want more control.  And yes @EA_Aljo , for many it will be too frustrating to want to learn. But like golf and anything else worth spending time on, the challenge of mastering a skill set is most of the fun and more rewarding.  So why not provide it as an option for people like us?

Also, similar (but different) to what @hiperay suggests about divisions, give leagues the option to limit which layouts can be used.

All I know is the saucer pass needs greatly buffed.  It gets intercepted way too often and needs a speed increase on it when charged.  It was great in NHL 23 and now it's picked off by everyone with low defensive stats even up close.  It was once an important dman function but I guess with the zone pressure system they wanted to ruin that method too.  But the saucer is a manual pass so it should be rewarded for proper usage and power charged on it.

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@EA_Aljo wrote:

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@hiperay wrote:

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While I will agree with you to some extent, it would add a skill that would need to be mastered which would then raise the skill ceiling of the game. Raising the skill ceiling makes there be something to play for (on top of rewards). What I suggest though is utilize divisions for this so at the div 10 (Rookie) tier level you are full pass assist and it progressively goes down at each tier to where even Div 1 (elite) tier have their pass assist set to maybe like 10-20 to allow for some ping error. This would keep the casual level being able to play while having actual prestige for being a Div 1 type player, which right now means very little in the grand scheme. If implemented correctly, it could then be set up in private matches to really push the competition to either go full 0 assist for those high prized esports events or maybe put it at a more balanced 40-50 for the Online League community to play at. When there is nothing to play for, there is little reason to be playing the game to improve. Just an idea though. 

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I'm personally not a fan of this. I think changing up the gameplay difficulty as you rank up is going to be frustrating. There already is a skill gap with passing. Plus, you're going to be facing tougher opponents when you reach higher divisions. I don't see the need to make passing more difficult with higher ranks on top of the more challenging competition.

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The "skill gap" seen in passing is basically making sure you're not aiming the direct opposite of your stick. That's not a skill gap.

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@ssoliz91 wrote:

I want to reiterate something I’ve mentioned earlier in this thread:

 

I would have no problem using a very involved/nuanced control layout like the one I proposed while at the same time other players use “Total Control” or any other layout in the same game.

 

It’s just a matter of how much control/freedom vs. how much cpu-assistance you want:

-if you want more control, more freedom, and more room for creativity, then take on a layout like the one I propose, but do so knowing it’ll be more difficult to master. 

-if you want more cpu-assistance, something simpler to learn, and don’t mind sacrificing a little creative freedom, then use a layout like Total Control and just have fun.

This way, everyone can get into the game as a beginner and have a lot of fun playing against newbies and experts alike.

 

If you’re a casual gamer, you don’t want to have to “train” to play a game.  But as you get better and better, you can begin to add more and more nuanced control to your layout, providing you with the freedom to be more creative.

 

I think, over time, a lot of people would see the advantage of having more control.   Especially people that play the game daily. I know geeks like myself don’t mind putting in a little extra practice to develop skills that give you more control. 

 

 

There are a lot of us that want more control.  And yes @EA_Aljo , for many it will be too frustrating to want to learn. But like golf and anything else worth spending time on, the challenge of mastering a skill set is most of the fun and more rewarding.  So why not provide it as an option for people like us?

 

 

 

 

 

Also, similar (but different) to what @hiperay suggests about divisions, give leagues the option to limit which layouts can be used.

 

 

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🤞 hope to see at least some of these control options in NHL 25.

Don't wish too hard, we know EA's track record for giving us what we want LOL