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CountSero's avatar
CountSero
Seasoned Ace
3 years ago

Re: EA Lag Compensation Deep Dive

@DeepSixxxx thnx for the summary

but i think it should be mentioned that battlefield has also two different zones with different tick rates depending how far the enemy is away from you. This adds also up into the latency delay (because of the different refresh rate of information).

Also, when you playing the game on PC and your FPS is lower than the tick rate (I think 45Hz is the one for BF2042) the system gets F* Up also.

I hope that nobody plays the games below 60fps but we all now how demanding BF2042 related to the hardware (so it is possible that there are some players which play below 45 fps)


Also, what is the tick rate of Apex? 20-25? (Because I think that apex feels ok for such a tick rate)

But at the same time you never will have 100 player at one screen at the same time in Apex.

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  • DeepSixxxx's avatar
    DeepSixxxx
    Seasoned Ace
    3 years ago
    @CountSero I agree CountSero.

    I think the real difficulty with BF net code is having 128 players on one server, running 3-5 different platforms, without enough players online at one time to allow MM system to group players at acceptable average latency (pings) to allow a consistently smooth gaming experience. For example, I do know that I have a better experience in portal TDM/Rush/Hardcore when there are 16x16 or less players. 45 Hz is no problem on a small map, without ground or air vehicles, with only 32 or less total players to track. What is unusual is I can compete on a 130ms server as good if not better than a 40ms server in Portal, so also the reason I believe 130ms is inside the sweet spot. The real issues IMHO is when 250-300ms players with packet loss connect, and the BF lag compensation simply can't compute reality anymore. Server browsers and/or dedicated rental servers with latency limits solves most of these issues, but Dice seems to have painted themselves into a corner as MM has issues filling now, and so adding any other player drain to MM will simply make it worse and make it even more difficult to finalize their obligations to season pass holders. What a mess, right?

    As for Apex, tick rate is only 20Hz, yet the entire map and all variables are refreshed each tick rate, unlike BF 2042 which has the "zone refresh" which like you said creates a whole new set of issues. Plus Apex has only 60 players max, only one transport type that doen't even shoot, "cartoon graphics", no air vehicles, etc. Also Apex increases and decreases the amount of bandwidth to each player as necessary, etc. Honestly Apex is a work of art when it comes to net code, I wish they would have copied it form BF 2042 and kept player maximums at 64 players, yet the BF battle royal attempt pushed it to above 100 so thanks Fortnite...😳

    And your comment of having 45fps with 45 Hz, been there, done that. My Xbox Series X isn't capable of handling Hourglass 128 player AOW, and my fps drops from 119 (my TV doubles the 60fps for smoother gameplay) to the mid 40 fps, and I have to disconnect as it is like being in a dark room with a strobe light flashing on and off. Note the Xbox Series X is capable of 120fps if a game is programmed efficiently, but obviously BF 2042 has some really serious net code programming inefficiencies if it has to drop from 60fps to only 45fps on a platform that other developers are already pushing to 120 fps...

    Yet honestly I don't blame Dice, if the suits at EA would have given them back the 3-6 months lost during the pandemic, this game would have been super clean IMHO...
  • DeepSixxxx's avatar
    DeepSixxxx
    Seasoned Ace
    3 years ago

    What Dice may not be giving enough attention to is the fact that humans don't like "unfair".  Just watch someone cut in line and see what happens, people get upset quickly, in mass. 

    Like an unfair referee, the net code will ultimately be the buzzkill that gets more players to quit versus stick around at higher ping levels.  So in reality, Dice makes the issues worse as low latency players stop playing as they get one shot constantly and killed behind cover, and high latency players ironically get much better with magic bullets that track around corners and up ladders and stairs like the screenshot of me below in TDM running 40ms ping Xbox, getting killed with magic bullets from a high ping Xbox player down a ladder and around the corner. 

    When the BF referee/net code keeps cheating low latency players at ever increasing rates as the game keeps losing player count, at some point the majority of low latency gamers patience will run out, and the servers will be filled with high latency players.  So in the end Dice is only making the issues worse long term with the latest net code changes after Season 1 launch....the irony, right???

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