Re: EA/DICE respond to backlash

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@Kean_1111 wrote:

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@xeNizKing wrote:

@Kean_1111took the words right out of my mouth, I think my biggest issue with the response is not the content but the way he went about it and then following up with a somewhat jaded and childish sarcasm afterwards. Then this is followed up by tons of constructive feedback not being responded to but then instead he responded to trolls. 

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I any event, I just think they could handle the communication better moving forward.  

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Yep and the only way to do that properly is just say nothing.  Work on the game.  Put up patch notes when stuff is released.  

IT's pointless to communicate with the so-called "community" for a multitude of reasons.

1.  Everyone wants something different.

2.  They communicated with the "community" before the game came out.   Did that help the "community?"  No.

3.  Anything they say can and will be used against them. 

4.  It doesn't make anything come out sooner or better. 

5.  It doesn't change how the game plays currently.   

 I would just  release  patch notes in Swedish when stuff comes out.  And the only official communications would be highlighting cool things already in the game in an official channel.  And maybe  sticky "our team is hard at work on improving the game."  Maybe.    (And probably a more benign statement to 'sticky'  would be "We are committed to providing support for BF2042 into 2023.")

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@Kean_1111 wrote:

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@xeNizKing wrote:

@Kean_1111took the words right out of my mouth, I think my biggest issue with the response is not the content but the way he went about it and then following up with a somewhat jaded and childish sarcasm afterwards. Then this is followed up by tons of constructive feedback not being responded to but then instead he responded to trolls. 

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While the Tweet in this thread is nowhere near that, I still get that vibe with the "brutal" remark.  It came off as "I love you guys but your expectations are irrational".  ....it comes off as condescending. I would have never addressed paying customers in this fashion nor accepted that from others in our business.

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Personally, I think the "brutal" comment was misinterpreted and gave angry people another excuse to stay angry. I read the brutal expectations as "c'mon, it's Christmas and we've been on Christmas vacation; we can't fix the game in a two-week vacation." I fully expected the reeeeeeeeee to intensify because, well, that's what gamers do.

I was not disappointed.

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@filthy_vegans wrote:

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@Kean_1111 wrote:

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@xeNizKing wrote:

@Kean_1111took the words right out of my mouth, I think my biggest issue with the response is not the content but the way he went about it and then following up with a somewhat jaded and childish sarcasm afterwards. Then this is followed up by tons of constructive feedback not being responded to but then instead he responded to trolls. 

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While the Tweet in this thread is nowhere near that, I still get that vibe with the "brutal" remark.  It came off as "I love you guys but your expectations are irrational".  ....it comes off as condescending. I would have never addressed paying customers in this fashion nor accepted that from others in our business.

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Personally, I think the "brutal" comment was misinterpreted and gave angry people another excuse to stay angry. I read the brutal expectations as "c'mon, it's Christmas and we've been on Christmas vacation; we can't fix the game in a two-week vacation." I fully expected the reeeeeeeeee to intensify because, well, that's what gamers do.

I was not disappointed.

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Exactly.  That's why they can't say anything.  And why I wouldn't say anything as a company.  It's a no-win situation.  

@Kean_1111the reference of them being jaded and childish sarcasm comes in response to the initial tweet which Andy McNamara said "Deleted the tweets. It seems the message wasn't clear. Apologies"

Now on the surface sure, I could let that go and be like "yeah ok just annoyed" but considering the volatility of the situation between the devs and the community it just wasn't a smart thing to do.

There is intent in that one, I really didn't like that. The sarcy and prickly response I don't expect from developers. The only thing I expect of them is to do there jobs (which they are doing) and to not negatively engage with the fanbase, saying that and then prioritising engagements with trolls and not fans is just stupid.

I also disagree with a lot of people here who seem to think its a no win scenario for them. It really isn't, when they get back into the studio next week they just need to acknowledge it and then some. That's the first step, there will always be angry people, they cannot make everyone happy but they can make the majority happy. Much of what people want is common sense and much of it is the same.

Scoreboard.
Global Chat.
More cover on maps.
Regular Soldiers and classes, no specialists.
Balance.
A proper squad system.
VOIP
Optimisation.

These are the primary things people want.

In regards to the woman thing btw with BFV, I never took issue with it in BF1 but I did in BFV for the following reasons;

In BF1 how it was done made sense, when you spawned in as sniper on some Russian maps, you spawned in as a woman, it made sense because of the female sniper squads in that region of the world. They didn't just spam them everywhere like some medal to be had. Diminishes the importance of the women who did fight to do so in my opinion. Especially for the Russians.

But a British woman on the frontlines of world war II? Nope. That in no way happened officially and if it did it was extremely limited and off the books and seeing that pissed me off immensely because I knew exactly what they were doing and I didn't like it one bit. It was outlawed in the British army at the time  that's historical fact and still isn't practiced today because mixed squads would NOT be a good thing tactically, squad strength wise and general resilience due to existential differences between men and women. 

However I don't care in a modern or future setting because its malleable due to the way things are now (regardless of whether I approve or not) but I am very protective of our history and I will be damned if I allow even "entertainment" to take advantage of that. I also have blood that served in those wars, I take it as disrespectful (massively) when they try to insert for inclusion purposes, which are ostensibly political purposes. We're told by ideologs today to respect other peoples history and culture, just a shame nobody can respect ours, not even our own people nor try to protect it. Because you know 'intersectional feminist creative vision' or whatever other ideological nonsense they support, the same thing the entire industry and eaten up our own fault for not pushing back early enough really though (in the industry generally).

And then this happened again with the Norwegian War Story where they completely cut out the Norwegian commandos from their own historical operation just to tell a inclusive work of fiction. I was disgusted by that.

However even for artistic integrity and all those excuses for subverting history that seem never ending (historical games regardless should be used to educate not indoctrinate), the worst part of BFVs trailer was the fact she was also missing a proper arm, extremely few individuals (even men) were allowed on the front with crippled legs or arms. They were sent home. It made no sense to have her there at all especially in that state.

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@xeNizKing wrote:

@Kean_1111the reference of them being jaded and childish sarcasm comes in response to the initial tweet which Andy McNamara said "Deleted the tweets. It seems the message wasn't clear. Apologies"

Now on the surface sure, I could let that go and be like "yeah ok just annoyed" but considering the volitility of the situation between the devs and the community it just wasn't a smart thing to do.

There is intent in that one, I really didn't like that. The sarcy and prickly response I dont expect from developers. The only thing I expect of them is to do there jobs (which they are doing) and to not negatively engage with the fanbase, saying that and then prioritising engagements with trolls and not fans is just stupid.

I also disagree with a lot of people here who seem to think its a no win scenario for them. It really isn't, when they get back into the studio next week they just need to acknowledge it and then some. Thats the first step, there will always be angry people, they cannot make everyone happy but they can make the majority happy. Much of what people want is common sense and much of it is the same.

Scoreboard.
Global Chat.
More cover on maps.
Regular Soliders and classes, no specialists.
Balance.
A proper squad system.
VOIP
Optimisation.

These are the primary things people want.

In regards to the woman thing btw with BFV, I never took issue with it in BF1 but I did in BFV for the following reasons;

In BF1 how it was done made sense, when you spawned in as sniper on some Russian maps, you spawned in as a woman, it made sense because of the female sniper squads in that region of the world. They didn't just spam them everywhere like some medal to be had. Diminishes the importance of the women who did fight to do so in my opinion. Especially for the Russians.

A British woman on the frontlines of world war II? Nope. That in no way happened officially and if it did it was extremely limited and off the books. It was outlawed in the British army at the time  that's historical fact and still isn't practiced today because mixed squads would NOT be a good thing from a tactically, squad strength and general resilience due to existential differences. 
However I don't care in a modern or future setting because its malleable due to the way things are now (regardless of whether I approve or not) but I am very protective of our history and I will be damned if I allow even "entertainment" to take advantage of that. I also have blood that served in those wars, I take it as disrespectful (massively) when they try to insert for inclusion purposes. We're told by ideologs today to respect other peoples history and culture, just a shame nobody can respect ours. Because you know 'muh creative feminist vision'.

However even for artistic integrity and all those excuses for subverting history that seem never ending (historical games regardless should be used to educate not indoctrinate), the worst part of BFVs trailer was the fact she was also a *, extremely few individuals (even men) were allowed on the front with crippled legs or arms. They were sent home. It made no sense. 

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Ah, I see.  I missed that follow up Tweet from Andy.  

.....and yes, I agree that even that message has the scent of the same patronizing tone of the first. Basically just saying, "sorry you couldn't understand what I was trying to say".  It's like someone apologizing to you by saying "I'm sorry you were offended".  .....it's classic deflection and not a trait I'm very fond of at all in people that use it to be honest.  

Folks can read my posts and see I'm not part of the angry, irrational few who are trolling threads, etc. but even I can see where his remarks are inflammatory to an already tense situation.  .....a little tact and diplomacy can go a long way.