Re: 2023 Season Grand Prix Megathread

You don't see steering and brake traces in the wild like this every day 💟

For reference, comparing to the other main concepts:

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@Meza994 wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77Everybody is able to take advantage of any loophole in the regulations, yet the FIA always tried to prevent that from happening and opposed to what many think, not all teams go to the lengths of gray areas as much as others..

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My point was for it not to be a loophole. Just the norm.

@Ultrasonic_77I'm with you on this one.

There's a rule, a sanction, and the offending conduct is getting rightfully penalized.

A loophole is when you get around the rule and avoid any sanction.

Managing components is on par with the ruleset and the desired outcome - even cranking up the PU here and there wouldn't be a consideration if they hadn't spent their R&D resources to achieve a reasonable reliability standard.

And if you're going to change the ruleset to hamper them down, it's reasonable to assume they'd have shifted those resources elsewhere. God knows they could have used some upgrades and further development in certain different areas, heh.

Otherwise, shouldn't Alpine be equally reprehend? It's well established that they spent all they could on PU performance before the engine freeze, reliability be damned (and their previous seasons showed), so that they could "work around" the rules allowing for reliability upgrades?

Deliberate quotes on that "work around" bit. It is not a loophole if you're working in accordance with the rules and respective sanctions.

Now if your penalties are too lenient or too strong, that's a whole different matter.

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@Meza994 wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77But its not the norm, you never saw teams use a new engine every 3rd or 4th race to maximise power before 2021.. Probably the cost of it being a problem too only enabling Ferrari, Merc and RB to afford it if they wanted..

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I was proposing a change to the rules, to basically allow teams to swap parts any time they wanted provided they stayed within the limit of the total available for the season. Then penalties if this number needed to be exceeded.

Another thing I would change just for stats purpose: the fastest on Qualifying = +1 Pole Position even if ‘virtual’ because of grid penalty. More fair

There is a god….  But can god stop Max from winning🤷🏻‍♂️😂. 

We will have lot of fun tomorrow but just one off. RB confirmed on another planet 

@NuvolarixAt least with the Lesser RB on pole LeCrash will have a chance off out racing him

Edit

Doh Forgot LeBroke has a grid penalty doesn’t he…. 

Much prefer Russell Green to Russell Blue

@Ultrasonic_77 But thats how it is currently.. They are allowed to change any part as long as its the same spec and within the limit without penalty.. As there are no power upgrades, most parts will be same spec so they can change them freely.. Dont really see the difference between your proposal and the current version, please enlighten me if im just too blind now😅

@mariohomoh5 places grid penalty supposed to equal a net gain of 5 tenths per second per lap is a way too lenient penalty especially with a tight field.. Managing components is not burning a whole PU in one race just to see how far you can push it so it holds 3-4 races.. FIA banned "legal" inventions last year because they were not in the spirit of the regulations yet they shouldnt change anything when the 5th ICE gaining you a big advantage for multiple races only costs 5 places in one race.. Its fairly simple, the component limit on PU parts was implemented to reduce costs etc. if the penalty would be completely neglected by teams because they gain much more than theyd lose its still a kind of loophole..

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@Meza994 wrote:

@mariohomohManaging components is not burning a whole PU in one race just to see how far you can push it so it holds 3-4 races..

[...]

its still a kind of loophole..

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First part: of course it is. It makes no sense to take a single rule in isolation when it is the ruleset or the system as a whole that is designed to keep the teams playing nicely.

What keeps teams in line: grid penalties and budget cap.

Can a team choose to burn through components indefinitely, on a whim, for future gains? Nope. Ask Mick Schumacher's career 🙃

If Mercedes managed that, kudos for them.

Curious to hear what you think about Alpine going ham on power before the engine freeze because "heh, whatever, we can catch up on reliability later 🤷‍♂️"

Merc went through 11 ICE in 2021 between their two drivers, and only 8 in 2022. Alpine went through 8 in 2021, but burned 12 ICEs in 2022. Also consumed more turbocharger, MGU-H and MGU-K units than Merc on their respective "wasteful" seasons.

Last part: that's an issue with the severity of the sanctions. Not a loophole.

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@Meza994 wrote:

@Ultrasonic_77 But thats how it is currently.. They are allowed to change any part as long as its the same spec and within the limit without penalty.. As there are no power upgrades, most parts will be same spec so they can change them freely.. Dont really see the difference between your proposal and the current version, please enlighten me if im just too blind now😅

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Hmmm.... I think you make a fair point! 🙂

For some reason when I read the original post I responded to I was thinking there were some penalties for parts swaps within the allocation if they happened during a race weekend rather than from the start. 

So I’ll be interested to see what happens if/when Max catches Sergio.  Will Sergio stick his elbows out and ignore any team orders he maybe given to let Max through.  After what happened in Brazil…. Could get real spicy.   Think it may be our only hope off some excitement at the top off the championship this season. 

After Jeddah qualifying the picture is even worse than what was seen in Bahrain where Ferrari was a tenth slower in pure performance and the problems seemed "only" with tyre management in the race.

Red Bull is a clear half second ahead in performance which is huge gap, also because the others are so close to each other.

My two cents on the future of the season: Mercedes openly declare that their project has failed and will soon align themselves with Red Bull style. They were fooled by the good performance of late 2022 otherwise they would have already done it.

Ferrari, which today has very similar performances to Mercedes, despite understanding the difficulties of doing so given that the F1-75 was an almost successful project (but mainly because the RB project was very crude and overweight at the beginning), should probably do it too, as soon as possible.

The SF-23 has lost the grip characteristics of its predecessor, I see no future. If they use the next 5-6 races or even half a season to develop a losing car, it will probably just be a waste of time.

Close battle and fun behind but boring ahead (except today 🥳).

@ScarDuck14 Sergio must do it today. If he doesn't even win when Verstappen starts 15th…

@Meza994It’s Jeddah there will be safety cars.😂 I was thinking sector 1 will hold him up getting through the field initially. Unless he gets caught up in a shunt I can see him winning.

Perez needs to take full advantage of pole.  And then pray no safety cars

@Meza994 without SC (and a clean start) I fear Max may reach the podium. Yes not Sergio I think

@ScarDuck14Of course there will be a safety car haha thing is sector 1 will not be a huge problem for Verstappen as the RB has so much downforce that they are barely slower through the corners than others but have that huge edge on the straights so he might even get throught the field in DRS trains.. but i totally believe in Perez having a chance, its up to him to use it..

@NuvolarixYeah i think so too, 2nd or 3rd is surely in for Verstappen

I also think Fernando will use his chance at the start and if Perez doesn't fly away (with strategy), but this would also help Max comeback.

Let’s enjoy this race, I just hope in a clean start for everyone…

Agreed! A very little glimpse of hope for a good race i just had is that considering Red Bulls current top speed they will have had much more downforce in comparison to the other teams in Bahrain.. Which also means they will have worse tyre wear in comparison to Bahrain.. Buut thats likely just wishful thinking haha

However another thing for the ones who watched the F2 race.. Martins vs. Bearman, Bearman getting overtaken by Martins around the outside and driving exactly to the line not leaving an ich of space so Martins HAS to go off track ot avoid a collision but then he is forced to give the position back to avoid a penalty.. We saw this a couple of time in recent years, even the exact same corner and i find myself more and more annoyed with the ruling for such situations.. What do others think?