Forum Discussion

Re: Nhl 21 suggestions

@EA_Aljo 

Is there another place where I can post these videos? The files are too large for this page to accept them and for some reason I've been having trouble replying on this forum.

In addition to the previous items I mentioned. I would like to add the fact when you body check someone so hard they flatten on the ice, it is impossible to get the puck and 9/10 the player will manage to stand back up and take the puck before you can manage to get it.

Also I would like to recommend increasing the success rate of poke checks. Most scenarios result in 3-5 missed poke check or bumps where they immediately retain possession and then usually results in a goal or penalty with another poke check. RB has essentially become a penalty button with no real upside. If it was as effective as stick lifts and had a similar penalty/miss😕uccess rate it would be much more realistic.

I have also done quite a bit of research in taking videos of nonsensical events regarding mainly goalie passes and 180° pass inaccuracy. Please let me know where I can post/send to share with you as requested.

24 Replies

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    You can post your videos to YouTube and then embed them here or provide a link to them. You also can publish videos through your console and provide a link to it.

    If you're missing 3 - 5 pokes on the same play, that would be spamming. Your pokes are less accurate the more you spam them. Being more precise with your pokes the first time will help them be more successful.

  • @EA_Aljo I'm not talking about spamming pole check. I'm talking about tracking the puck carrier down the entire ice and skating right in front of them and the best the player can do is bump the stick for maybe a quarter second before they regain control.

    Additionally, the CR system needs a MAJOR revamp. Losing 4-3 in OT to a guy with 10 shots and 3 min time on attack and you lose 10 CR but then beat someone 9-1 and you get 3 CR. The CR rating should not be a complete indicator because I have played many good players with low CR and many horrible players with astounding higher CR. 

    The AI intelligence needs to be increased immensely. My AI skate away from the puck carrier, direct the puck into my own net, skate away from the opposite post for the cross seams, skate offside and stay offside, miss passes consistently, that is if I can even get a pass to them because the passing in this game usually results in an icing because it is so off. goalie skill and intelligence needs to be regulated. Most games I play one goalie has a career game while the other posts a 75% save percentage on easy shots. 

    Scoring chances. This game seems to reward wrist shots from the blue line and 10 foot pass one timers with goals but great plays, cross seams, and nice passing plays get stumped by horrible passes and insane saves. I hate that I have to dumb down my play in order to compete in NHL. A player with 4 min time on attack and 10 wrist shots from the blue line should not beat 35+ shots on goal with 15 min TOA and actual chances.

    It just hurts to play this game now. Now I could be doing better things than complaining on an online forum about a video game but ever since this whole covid situation, there's no real hockey and limited options for entertainment. 

    The game looks beautiful, but the functionality needs multiple tweaks for next year.

    I will post those videos to YouTube soon, currently in exam season so I will post the videos once that's over.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    You can backskate as a defender with the carrier in front of you and poke the puck away. You don't have to rely on incidental contact.

    You're welcome to provide videos of your issues. That's the best way to show us what's happening is with video. Not all of us experience the same things as you do quite so often. Which mode are you seeing AI skate away from the carrier? I primarily play EASHL and HUT. In both modes I'm playing defense so my players aren't skating away from the carrier. Unless I miss a hit or something. I have had my players go offside though. That's frustrating for sure, but it doesn't happen all the time. They have been known to get stuck offside when trying to get back onside. The dev team is aware of that as well. My passes are consistently hitting their targets also, but I tend to not do so many stretch passes where I'm trying to hit them in front of the bench when they might be making a line change. I usually look for shorter passes so by the time I want to hit someone in the NZ, they've already made the line change. I also cover the puck with my goalie so I manage my line energy better and they aren't leaving the ice so unexpectedly. These are just a couple of examples of how we can play differently and not experience the same issues so often. I'm definitely not saying AI is perfect. I'm just saying how I minimize the issues many people have with them. The dev team is always looking to improve the AI players.

    I see shots from high percentage scoring areas go in significantly higher than wristers from the blue line. Those, of course, will go in, but not at the same rate as a settled shooter that takes a well-aimed shot. More shots don't equate wins. It's more about quality shots. Yes, I agree a wrister from the blue line isn't as high quality a shot, but it's also not going in near as often as good shots are. That doesn't mean you won't have the occasional game where someone manages to score multiples of those shots. I haven't experienced someone exploiting that myself, but others may be. That also could be due to how I play as I don't skillzone and I'm always actively playing the carrier so I minimize their chances.

    Looking forward to your videos. Thanks for all the feedback.

  • @EA_Aljo 

    Here is the video as promised:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEHr3MJyHtg&feature=youtu.be

    Apologies for the horrible recording, I just learned how to record using the Xbox and I will do that in the future.

    Another to mention is missed penalties. I have noticed that sometimes penalties are missed. Is that a feature of the game? The player will go to his knees or do the hand shaking animation but then no penalty will be called when the other team touches the puck. A repetitive issue I have noticed is that when a player takes two penalties in the same play, sometimes it cancels them both out. I have noticed this primarily with a regular penalty followed by a penalty that should have led to a penalty shot, and then nothing happens and they can continue to play without a single call. Last time this happened I was unable to get it on video because instant replay only shows the last period online and I couldn't record it in time. I may be able to record the last 30 seconds of in game play with the xbox control but that does not guarantee the best angles, but I'll try that next time.

    To answer your question, I primarily play ONLINE VERSUS, PLAY NOW (Offline) and STANLEY CUP PLAYOFFS (Offline) mode, I haven't tried many other modes in NHL 20.

    ALSO, to explain some of the videos that might be ambiguous, some of them are to show AI skating away or not letting me swap to them leading to a goal I could have easily prevented, and the own goal resulted from an automatic spin to face up the ice which slid into my own net, losing me the game in OT without pressing a single control.

  • TTZ_Dipsy's avatar
    TTZ_Dipsy
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    Yeah there are times where a player is off balance and the defender barely makes contact - this one is rare to see but has been around since they added the 'on the knees' animations. Could be a feature (as in ref decided it wasn't a penalty), but I don't really know.

    Yup, I'm sure this was originally intended to reduce a troll's chances of completely screwing an entire team over but now it's really hard to get multiple penalties, leading to an 'anything goes' period of hockey.

    For the video...

    1. Lol yup the classic force field. For defenders this is supposed to decrease them scoring on themselves (because it's impossible to program literally any new animations or logic I guess).

    This has been around for years and I'm glad you recorded it.

    Everything the AI did up until 1:33 is all their fault for sure - this is just the norm you need to accept I'm afraid. The goalie pass was a big no no though.

    There don't seem to be enough animations for asthetically pleasing plays and passes, that's for sure. Random reverse shots and passes are again, nothing new this entire gen....; I don't think they'll ever be able to fix this.

    They'll say you just need to adjust strategies but believe me, most players 100% agree with you that AI defenders are living in their own dream world. AI logic is difficult to program but I wish they really try to hammer it our for 21.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    Thanks for the video. What is your concern with passing? It looks like they are going where you're aiming.

    As far as most everything else goes, thanks for the feedback. It's definitely appreciated. I haven't noticed the penalty issue you mentioned. Last night I played a team that took 2 penalties in one play, but they were from different players. Not the same player taking 2. I'll keep an eye out for this.

    In regards to autopassing (one-touch passing), that's a rare one for me, but happens once in a while. I agree it's annoying and it would be good to see these move to a different input so it isn't mapped to change player.

    Own goals are frustrating for sure. Even with the rarity they seem to occur in, it can decide the game for you. I know the dev team is always trying to minimize these from occurring and I think they're a lot better than they used to be, but of course, still happen. Hopefully, we'll see these improved in the future.

    If you have any more videos, feel free to post them. Thanks!

  • Hi there, I was wondering if for the next NHL game there could be Mods? (Ex. Proper Goal Horns & Songs) I say this since I get annoyed with the same goal horn in pretty much every league other than NHL. I don’t like playing with a AHL team or CHL team since the horn is pretty much the same thing. If there were mods like for Proper goal horns for all the leagues. I would probably enjoy the game way more. 

  • @EA_Aljo @TTZ_Dipsy 

    Thank you for the replies.

    In regards to the passing, take a look at the moment I hit pass the passing direction immediately changes. In each scenario I am aiming to pass one way and as soon as I press the pass button the direction changes randomly to another direction (usually 180 degrees from where I am actually aiming). I am not suddenly changing passing directions in a split second before I hit pass. Take a look at it slowly. I am moving in one direction so I can aim to pass that way, as as soon as the pass is about to  leave my stick, the game suddenly changes the direction of my pass (very visible on the analog stick inputs at the bottom right) so it flings out to no one, or results in a turnover/icing or passes to the wrong player to kill the play.

    The inputs appear to be received too slow by the game to have the auto pass feature. You swap to a skater so you can pick up an open puck (because for some reason half the time they won't do it on their own) and even though you swapped to them a second or so before getting the puck, it processes to slow and buffers a pass to chuck the puck away.

    As another point to mention for the CR system, please remove D/C CR loss when the severs go down. There has been 3/4 games in the past couple weeks where suddenly the servers will crash or go down for maintenance when I am winning a game and I will lose CR. Very frustrating.

    This is not a result of a bad connection (330 MB/s nominal down speed internet, Moderate and Open NAT types) so I know this is not simply an issue on my end for the slow processing and disconnections from the servers.

    I will continue to post videos in groups as they occur. 

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    The representation on the controller overlay isn't exactly perfect. It's possible you're not noticing quick, twitchy movements and are accidentally aiming there. How often does this happen? We're also not getting a lot of other reports of this. Have you tried using a different controller?

    I'm also not aware of the servers going down recently. How often are you disconnecting? Also, are you on a wired or wireless connection?

  • @EA_Aljo 

    I really doubt this is a twitch or anything along those lines, I had had it where I have looked down and froze to not do anything after an opposite direction pass and I am still pointing in the direction I intended/the opposite of the way it went. This has happened with multiple controllers (I have 5) and both of my xboxs so I'm not sure if it's a result of something happening on my end. I also would assume this affects others too because often when I'm in a game my opponent will have multiple icings or missed passes in a game that I can tell were not intentional. Might be a control mistake on their end but pass accuracy is probably the number 1 complaint I hear from most Nhl playe

    In terms of connection I'm not complaining that the d/c happen too much, I'm saying we shouldn't lose CR when the server's go down or the game crashes or anything like that. I understand users could abuse it by unplugging their ethernet cords or something along those lines if they were losing but why should I have to lose a game I'm actually winning cause the server's d/c.

    My connection is wired, stable and fast. I just don't believe the game should be programmed that a d/c from the servers should be considered a loss. Probably lost about 10 games that way all together and it doesn't make sense.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    Thanks for the feedback.

    The problem with no CR being lost for a disconnect means people will do exactly what you said and cut their connection to avoid this happening. It would be too easy to manipulate your CR. Hopefully, a better solution can be found in the future. Maybe something like incurring a CR debt that you need to work off before progressing further.

    As far as your issue with passes goes, it's not one we see come up often and definitely not one I experience. When I pass in the wrong direction, I can tell it was because of my own twitchy movements and my replays show that. Unintended icings often happen when someone is switching players and they're hitting the trigger too fast so it initiates a one-touch pass. Normally, when there's an issue affecting everyone, we hear about it from a large part of the community, but that hasn't been happening. How frequently is this occurring for you? Also, can you tell me where in your video passes are going where you're not aiming? Because so far they are matching up with the stick movements.

  • TTZ_Dipsy's avatar
    TTZ_Dipsy
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    5 years ago

    @xKnight70 

    We used to have custom horns; I really hope they make a return in 21 

    @Chaseinator5 @EA_Aljo 

    Passing complaints are actually fairly common (at least in the other forums), but most of the time the easiest answer is tweaking your pass assistance.

    I believe your problem stems from releasing the pass button while you are in the midst of twitch re-aiming; stuff like this happens with shooting too.

    With touch passing, assistance, atteibute ratings, and buffers it's no surprise passes can seem to feel "off" (especially when you're lagging). 

    Not what you want to hear but you just need to keep practicing; I commit to a specific pass ages before I actually do it in order stop getting mad.

    Real server disconnects shouldn't remove CR at all but people know how to exploit that and we all know the servers are finicky at best. The CR debt you're talking about is just a normal loss - you lose so dang much yet only win 1 or 2 CR at a time. I think it'd be much better to lose 5 but win 2 or 3  and get a +-10 against extreme teams.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @TTZ_Dipsy 

    My idea with a CR debt would be to lose the CR, but not have it actually change your overall CR. You just wouldn't be able to add more CR until you removed that debt. So, if you're at 800 for example and lose 20 from disconnecting, you're still at 800, but have 20 CR to make up before you start gaining any again. It was just a quick thought I had on a potential compromise for dealing with this. Probably not the best idea. Just kinda spitballing.

  • TTZ_Dipsy's avatar
    TTZ_Dipsy
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    5 years ago

    @EA_Aljo 

    Mulling it over, your idea is a great starting point but some things will need to be looked over. There are many things people can do to cause "you lost connection to the servers" - your debt system could work great if it was clear a team rage quit/pulled the plug/ whatever on purpose (in which case the message should say "your opponant was sour and left".

    Afaik, a real true EA server DC, whether its for maintenence or a rat chewed a wire somewhere and exploded a transformer, it's supposed causes a desync where nobody gets credit (ie the game didn't happen); 9 times out of 10 this works as intended but people have said sometimes they get a loss or even a win if their game is ending close to that DC.

    In any case, my team never really got a chance to consistantly play against similar teams; a win would be meh 3 or 4 CR whereas a loss would be 15 (the worst being over 30 which I didn't even think was possible) so your debt idea could work extremely well to stop a team from quitting but I'd like to see better matchmaking first so it'd be easier to make up the difference at first, but the more you did it the more that number would increase until maybe you were fixed to a lobby with other quitters.

    Speaking of leaving a game early, you've mentioned leaving drop in games to go play with your team - this is perfectly fine if you leave enough players behind but people doing it on purpose to hurt others is obviously bad and if you were to assign the debt to a single player, teams would just designate the worst player on their team/the person who cares the least so each league will need its own set up rules.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @TTZ_Dipsy 

    You bring up a good point. While I don't really mind quitting out of drop-ins, I'll think it about it twice next time because hurting the other players is not cool at all. Thanks for making me conscious of that. I just always looked at drop-in as practice and a way to kill some time before my club came on. I've always taken club and LG games way more seriously. I also don't really care about my own CR so dropping out never bothered me. However, it's kinda selfish not to consider the CR of the random guys I'm teamed up with. I'll have to change my ways about that.

    As far as detecting what kind of disconnect occurs and not incurring a CR penalty because of it goes, I hope there's a way to accurately do that. We'll have to see if it happens.

  • TTZ_Dipsy's avatar
    TTZ_Dipsy
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    5 years ago

    @EA_Aljo 

    Eh sorry, I didn't mean it like that; It's drop-ins so everyone should expect a more casual environment (and as long as you don't cause the game to end its all good) but for the trolls who intentionally mess with others it could be a problem.

    By removing CR from drop-in I think you'd get rid of any potential problems, including pub stacking for easy xp.

    Load times should be extremely fast with the new conses so hopefully that will reduce things like pause glitches and other desyncs

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @TTZ_Dipsy 

    I wouldn't want to see CR removed from drop-ins as there are some that depend on it rather than play club games. Maybe it would be good to earn/lose less in drop-ins than club games. Regardless, I'd rather see a way to handle people trolling. EA has been taking a much bigger stance against toxicity over the last year or so. It's possible we'll see better ways to handle trolls in the future.

  • TTZ_Dipsy's avatar
    TTZ_Dipsy
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    5 years ago

    @EA_Aljo 

    You can customize your searches to only see drop-in records but would it be possible to also seperate CR so it's unique like EASHL is to VS and Threes?

    People can still rank their characters this way, players can leave for their more competitive league without any real penalty, and it wouldn't make collecting weekly drop-in rewards such a risk for competitive players who also like to collect stuff.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @TTZ_Dipsy 

    I imagine something like that could be done. It's not a bad idea. We'll just have to wait and see what happens in the future with CR though.

  • Is there something built into the game that promotes AI gameplay to be better or worse? I find that game to game one team gets a definite bonus depending on their AI play. As in there is no possible way to win when you play a player whose AI outplay your's 1000%. 

    I have played around with my strategies and I've found what works best for me. I just don't understand how I'm supposed to change my gameplay to adjust for my opponent's goalie posting a 95+ sv% with 10-15 open net cross crease or AAA+ scoring chances and my goalies collectively boast a 50-55 sv% on shots from the blue line and single pass plays. I've played this series for years and I still can't come to understand how the system determines how well AIs play. Either your forwards are consistently in the perfect position for cross seams and one timers and your goalie makes multiple impossible saves or your forwards go for a change on breakaways, leave the post once you get the perfect lane for a cross seam, skate away as the last or second last defender back and your goalie can't make a basic save to save his life.

    Is this simply a matter of how strategies line up and the ratings between teams? If this is so, is there a way to make a more level playing field for players by introducing the ability to change strats during intermissions or that calling a time out will smarten up your AI after completely blowing your game? It gets frusterating when you completely outplay your opponent and you can tell how unequal the gameplay is but you still manage to lose 8-2 when you triple or quadruple their TOA, shots and chances.

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    The biggest contributor to how AI play are what the human-controlled players are doing. For example, if you are skating out of position constantly, the AI are going to adjust and cover the open ice you're leaving. This puts them out of position so they aren't going to have the same opportunities for offense/defense. As far as goalies go, it's possible your opponent is selling the shot better. If you put the puck on your forehand, they think you're going to shoot so they prepare for a shot. If you pass across the slot for a one timer when holding the puck on your forehand, the goalie isn't as prepared for the shot so it's going to be easier to score.

    You're always welcome to post videos of the goals you feel should have gone in. I'd be happy to review them for any odd behavior.

    The AI are not boosted though. They are identical on both sides. What affects their behavior are human input, strategies and overalls. Otherwise, their behavior is exactly the same. 

  • @EA_Aljo 

    Thank you for all the replies and all the advice. Every recommendation you have made I have tried to incorporate into my game. Regardless of any changes though, nearly every game I play feels like the ice is tilted. 

    I will say this, and I can't stress this enough. There is 100% something in this game that gives a performance boost to a team that is significantly worse. When I start a game by about the 10 minute mark if I notice that I am significantly better than my opponent and we haven't even played a minute my zone I know I am going to lose. 

    When these games happen (4/5 games) I will outplay TOA 15 min - 4 min and lose by multiple goals. If I have a 10 foot head start on a puck that slides down the ice, full out sprinting I will lose the race every time by 5 feet. If I have a 20 foot headstart on a breakaway his defenders will catch up and somehow without taking a penalty simply steal the puck from behind and start down the ice. My players cannot be lower energy the entire game but they will always skate slower in these scenarios. It's also impossible to set up odd man rushes when my players skate so slow, and when I finally do my skater on the other wings skates away. All my opponent has to do is enter the zone and fire a wrister at the net and it will blow past my goalie.  How do I defend that? How do I play better? 25% of passes will for some reason go directly to my opponent's stick and not my player I aimed at about 30° difference in pass angle. This is extremely frusterating. My last game I played I made a pass diagonally across the O zone and it passed directly by 3 of my skaters and hit the boards, and when I used my last skater to go grab it, they skated over the puck, my opponent grabbed it and launched an immediate stretch pass to a guy that was covered but it went through him and once he hit the blue line yet another wrist shot goal.

    Perfect cross seam plays and his goalie jumps and makes the save, perfect shot opportunities that my players will miss 9/10 times. One timer set ups and my player turns as I pass to them and they fire it weakly on a backhand that doesn't even make it to the net. This last second turn as they are about to or as they get the puck cause so many more problems, as they turn into opponent AI and redirect pucks into your own net. Also my AI seem to skate into each other and bunch up leaving large sections of the ice open. Or they will skate into me, effectively slowing me down allowing the opponent to set up and destroying the play. 

    Check them into the boards full force and they slither through with the puck. Pass to an open player? Puck magnetizes off my stick and onto my opponents. Skating up the ice and my player randomly looses the puck without cause. Any press of RB is a penalty, regardless of if the poke check was even close to their feet, and I have videos of poke checking 3 feet out and they fall over...

    Meanwhile the puck is attached to their stick with a string. If I poke it lose it makes a tick sound and they get it back, or it perfectly passing to their other player. They can skate through multiple of my players with the skaters passing right through their stick but they don't lose it. Or if I check them they will instantly regain it. 

    I also have video of cross seam passes that make it to my second skater and then it suddenly floats off and magnetizes to my opponent's defender.

    It absolutely wrecks the game when you outplay and outskill your opponent in every way but you lose. Time and time again I have 10 more mins of attack, 15-20 more shots, 10x their grade A scoring chances but my goalie kicks pucks into his own net and randomly gets halted half way through sliding to the other post and my AI are a div 3 peewee team.

    On a separate note, trips resulting from poke checks where the hand contacts the waist should be removed. It makes no sense that a glove grazing a player's waist sweeps out their feet. And especially when you are in front of them when you're chasing them back.

    I love hockey and I loved playing the NHL games but every game I play it pushes me farther from wanting to give the next game in the series a try. I want to contribute to the next game by providing these issues and the video evidence so it can be fixed but it honestly wrecks this game for me. I'm at the rate of recording 2-3 obvious game changing errors a game, but the majority of the problems like loosing a long lead on a puck race or passing to the wrong person can't simply be recorded as proof of a problem. 

    Also there is definitely a problem with AI penalties in offline play. It is outrageous how my AI can take 5+ penalties a game when I am the one playing the puck carrier. ESPECIALLY when you're already on the pk to put you on a 5 on 3. Online play seems to be much better for some reason. 

  • EA_Aljo's avatar
    EA_Aljo
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    5 years ago

    @Chaseinator5 

    There absolutely is no ice tilt. One team is not boosted over the other. This 1000% does not exist.

    If you can get some video of your issues, I'll gladly review them. There just isn't really anything we can do without it as I can play a much slower team and very clearly notice a difference. For example, playing Squad Battles against an 80 OVR club with a 97 OVR club. There are various reasons a defender can catch up on a breakaway. Most often, from the videos I've seen, it's due to the carrier making slight turns. The carrier also has a small penalty to speed, but this is negated if you hustle. Speaking of hustle, if you're using it all the time and not just when you're skating in a straight line, you'll wear out your players a lot faster. The only time you really are going to notice a difference is if you're skating in a straight line. It doesn't work if you're using it in turns.