3 click swing feedback on power

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@TriumphRider wrote:

I enjoy this game even if it infuriates me at times. I haven't even played career mode or H2H. Been grinding the challenges.

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It might be that focusing on challenges is making you find the dispersion zone mechanic a bit more frustrating than you would just playing more normal rounds? I think it feels more natural in normal gameplay but will be more apparent when more artificially trying to repeatedly do the same thing.

On the pro stats front that were mentioned above bear in mind that the pros vary quite a bit - you can see their stats easily going into Quick Play mode and scrolling between them. I'd look much more at their skill trees that the level number, which doesn't really tell us much just as it doesn't for players. 

My natural reaction is to want no random element whatsoever by the way but the game developers clearly made the decision to make this a core part of the gameplay mechanic, with the skill point, shot type and spec elements all having part of their effects by changing this. I'll also say that while we see the dispersion zones we don't see the statistical distribution of where the ball is likely to land. As far as I can tell it's heavily weighted towards the centre of the zone when shots are hit well. Overall my personal take is that while there is some uncertainty to shot outcome it is what I do that still overwhelmingly determines how well I score and so I am still able to enjoy the game for what it is.

For context I'm currently level 35 and only have one low level spec I won the last weekly pro tournament. I do though favour lower dispersion shot types and have heavily favoured accuracy and control stats when using skill points to give me the best ability to put the ball where I want. I've spent very few points on power and so haven't unlocked the power drive or power approach but suspect I wouldn't use them much even if I had due to the higher dispersion. 

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@TriumphRider wrote:
....I actually don't pay a lot of attention to the dispersion zones...

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I think you may find your experience with the game improves dramatically if you do 🙂. Just cycle through the shot types and look at this and you'll see the differences can be huge. When I'm aiming shots I factor this range in too

I believe the tournament mode leaderboards are platform specific. I play on PS5 and see scores from YouTubers I know play on PS5 near the top but haven't for example seen the same leaderboards I've see pictures of shared here (I think from PC).

I play on Tour difficulty outside of the tournaments, where I do the daily arcade and pro tournaments and last week did the three weekly tournaments. I am not a top player though! To give you an honest idea, on the daily pro tournaments I generally finish roughly 50/50 in WR or ER, just having a single go. I finished 522nd in last weeks weekly Tour difficulty tournament around Harbour Town with my one attempt but haven't done this week's yet. Not that how good/bad I am is relevant to anything 🙂.

You do seem to be slightly misinterpreting my posts by the way. Please don't take my replies to somehow mean I think the game is unquestionably perfect as I don't!

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@Ultrasonic_77 wrote:
@TriumphRiderPutting is a totally separate discussion to at least everything I've said above. I don't think there is any equivalent to the dispersion zone in play for putting although I'm open to being corrected.

I'll be honest and say I'm not 100% sure what you're trying to demonstrate with your videos though, so mark me down as however clueless you feel is appropriate 🙂. I'll be curious to see what anyone else thinks.

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So watched them and thought...looks normal to me? 

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@Ultrasonic_77 wrote:

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@TriumphRider wrote:
....I actually don't pay a lot of attention to the dispersion zones...

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I think you may find your experience with the game improves dramatically if you do 🙂. Just cycle through the shot types and look at this and you'll see the differences can be huge. When I'm aiming shots I factor this range in too

I believe the tournament mode leaderboards are platform specific. I play on PS5 and see scores from YouTubers I know play on PS5 near the top but haven't for example seen the same leaderboards I've see pictures of shared here (I think from PC).

I play on Tour difficulty outside of the tournaments, where I do the daily arcade and pro tournaments and last week did the three weekly tournaments. I am not a top player though! To give you an honest idea, on the daily pro tournaments I generally finish roughly 50/50 in WR or ER, just having a single go. I finished 522nd in last weeks weekly Tour difficulty tournament around Harbour Town with my one attempt but haven't done this week's yet. Not that how good/bad I am is relevant to anything 🙂.

You do seem to be slightly misinterpreting my posts by the way. Please don't take my replies to somehow mean I think the game is unquestionably perfect as I don't!

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In response to this post...I don't ignore the dispersion zone, but on a DRIVE as we have spoken about before, if the entire zone is IN the fairway then what am I supposed to worry about? So when I hit the perfect/perfect on 3 click with level ground and end up in the rough like 10yards off the edge of the dispersion zone...that's normal? Oooh...randomness. got it.

We're doing circles, bud. Your saying account for this, account for that...and it it still happens? Well, account for something else...because it can't be the game, has to be the player. Hahaha.

Like I mentioned, we'll agree to disagree. I'm good with that.

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@Ultrasonic_77 wrote:
@TriumphRiderfor context are your videos from before or after the latest update designed to improve the putting experience?

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From an hour ago when I was playing. I described in detail what is happening.  Like you mentioned, I want someone to watch them...read my explanation...then EXPLAIN how I am seeing this wrong.

Also, I play this game probably 5 hours or more a day at the moment. Not crazy but a good amount of time. I'm not just talking out of my rear. I have literally experienced this as we have been replying to each other, real time.

Feel free to ignore my posts...rants...whatever they may be called. I can certainly show vids and explain, but everyone is entitled to their own "explanation" of what's happening.

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77For context on my vids, let me explain.

1st one) The grid shows left to right slightly. Where the hole is located the grid line before it is barely moving, the line after the hole is moving a bit faster though. No problem. Forgive me if I'm animated about this but...THE DAMN BALL MOVED AT A 45 DEGREE ANGLE 2 INCHES BEFORE THE HOLE!!! I mean seriously? No excuse for that dynamic...none.

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I've just looked at this first one again for now as I do have other things to do. What the ball roll is trying to simulate is how the gradient has more effect as the ball slows down. It could certainly be a bit smoother in how it handles this in your example but if that happened to me on a shot it isn't something I'd be getting annoyed about. Note that you under-hit the shot by 1.2% vs how you aimed, and the ball would have moved off less if you hadn't as the ball would have been travelling faster closer to the hole. It may even have gone in if you'd hit the power you intended. If I'd hit that shot myself I'd be thinking I slightly under-read it but mostly under-hit it.

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@TriumphRider wrote:

In response to this post...I don't ignore the dispersion zone, but on a DRIVE as we have spoken about before, if the entire zone is IN the fairway then what am I supposed to worry about? So when I hit the perfect/perfect on 3 click with level ground and end up in the rough like 10yards off the edge of the dispersion zone...that's normal? Oooh...randomness. got it.

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Are you accounting for the fact that the dispersion zone shows where the ball lands rather than the subsequent bounce and roll out? If you are and you hit a perfect shot then no, I don't think that is intended. And that's precisely the sort of thing where a video to prove this to the game devs to try to get something done about it would be helpful. Like I'm sure the videos proving the green grid beads were going the wrong way on some shots helped something happen about that quite as quickly as it did.

I hope it's clear I try to see both sides of this sort of thing by the way. The sort of things I'm asking are what I suspect any game dev reading this may be thinking so I'm trying to see if we can rule out factors that would make them more inclined to dismiss this as not an issue. Or possibly help explain what's going on if not.

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@Ultrasonic_77 wrote:

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77For context on my vids, let me explain.

1st one) The grid shows left to right slightly. Where the hole is located the grid line before it is barely moving, the line after the hole is moving a bit faster though. No problem. Forgive me if I'm animated about this but...THE DAMN BALL MOVED AT A 45 DEGREE ANGLE 2 INCHES BEFORE THE HOLE!!! I mean seriously? No excuse for that dynamic...none.

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I've just looked at this first one again for now as I do have other things to do. What the ball roll is trying to simulate is how the gradient has more effect as the ball slows down. It could certainly be a bit smoother in how it handles this in your example but if that happened to me on a shot it isn't something I'd be getting annoyed about. Note that you under-hit the shot by 1.2% vs how you aimed, and the ball would have moved off less if you hadn't as the ball would have been travelling faster closer to the hole. It may even have gone in if you'd hit the power you intended. If I'd hit that shot myself I'd be thinking I slightly under-read it but mostly under-hit it.

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Hahaha...you don't necessarily have to respond. Believe me, I wouldn't hold it against you. I wouldn't let this convo keep me from doing whatever I needed to.

 

Although your explanation has me just shaking my head...I mean, wow. I believe we are the same age if the 77 represents the year you were born. As 2 individuals in their 40s, we should be able to look at things as they are...not get down to the microcosm of the putt in a video game.

 

This..."if that happened to me on a shot it isn't something I'd be getting annoyed about."...is a personal feeling. That's cool. You basically admitted it could be smoother. I've played golf over 20years...no ball takes an immediate 45 degree angle 2 inches before the cup. It would take a couple inches to physically make that move in reality. It may be a video game but EA's own hype video claims fantastic ball physics.

 

THEN you said..."Note that you under-hit the shot by 1.2% vs how you aimed, and the ball would have moved off less if you hadn't as the ball would have been travelling faster closer to the hole."...WELL, you may want to re-watch. There was virtually ZERO movement in the green UNTIL after the hole..that's first thing. Secondly, I didn't under hit by 1.2% as you said, it was an OVERSWING by 1.1%. Which means I would have hit THROUGH any break...oh, you like to mention ball lie quite a bit, it was ABOVE. All of these factors lead to going through the break. Also, the swing was a tad fast as well, which you never mentioned so let's not use that as an excuse now. Where is the under-hit coming from you mentioned?

 

I won't lie, I do get a tad frustrated by your responses to an extent. I've mentioned, you provide various "reasons"/"explanations"...but none have really refuted or disproved what I have experienced. I'm open to corrections that would make gameplay better. However, I showed 4 examples where there are obscurities...and the outcome is essentially no, no, you did something wrong or it's a game nothings perfect!

 

So forgive me if my responses are a bit terse but it feels like there is ALWAYS something wrong with the player...even with vids.  My explanations are concise...in fact I write reports for a living where sometimes people's freedoms depend upon them. Not saying I'm not wrong about video games, but I usually EXPLAIN concisely. 

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@Ultrasonic_77 wrote:

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@TriumphRider wrote:

In response to this post...I don't ignore the dispersion zone, but on a DRIVE as we have spoken about before, if the entire zone is IN the fairway then what am I supposed to worry about? So when I hit the perfect/perfect on 3 click with level ground and end up in the rough like 10yards off the edge of the dispersion zone...that's normal? Oooh...randomness. got it.

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Are you accounting for the fact that the dispersion zone shows where the ball lands rather than the subsequent bounce and roll out? If you are and you hit a perfect shot then no, I don't think that is intended. And that's precisely the sort of thing where a video to prove this to the game devs to try to get something done about it would be helpful. Like I'm sure the videos proving the green grid beads were going the wrong way on some shots helped something happen about that quite as quickly as it did.

I hope it's clear I try to see both sides of this sort of thing by the way. The sort of things I'm asking are what I suspect any game dev reading this may be thinking so I'm trying to see if we can rule out factors that would make them more inclined to dismiss this as not an issue. Or possibly help explain what's going on if not.

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I'll post next time it lands outside the dispersion zone on a perfect drive...it happened with the Bubba Watson challenge we spoke about before. That's when you mentioned randomness.

Also, I get you are trying to assist...not sure if it's players or EA, hahaha. However, I understand ball roll, angle hit, etc, etc, etc.

Honestly, after speaking with you I actually think they completely messed up and made the game WAY to technical. Every time we go around around a topic...it's did you acount for these 20 things. At some point as a golfer in real life you start to think...I don't account for even 1/3 of that when I actually play. 

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77Check these out...these are from an arcade tourney.

https://www.xbox.com/play/media/EVWLXL97DL
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/RGBHYLW8J3
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/YZ78R5DCKK
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/24XHDZ4MUX

Regardless of tourney type, mode of play, etc...ball physics, putt reads, green grids, etc SHOULD ALWAYS BE CONSISTENT. Everyone is entitled to their opinions but those are mine. CONSISTENCY makes a great game, regardless of how hard or easy it is.

All of these examples (regardless of the putt being made or not) has something wrong in them. Usually it's the way the ball reacts. In one of them I made the damn put but on the way to the hole the ball literally shimmies back and forth...in what damn world does that ever happen to a super slow putt???

The reads are astronomically off in some of them too. Like absurdly. Please, OH GOD PLEASE, do not mention the infinitesimal degree of ball lie...because in the 100,000 other putts I have accomplished it never mattered.

So...if you watch these and don't think ANYTHING is wrong...well let's agree to disagree, and go our separate ways, hahaha.

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You're over hitting putts on all those videos (or at least the 3 that are not private). The Putt has to be on the line in order for it to be consistent yet you're over swinging every time. The last video you also have the marker quite far past the hole despite it being level, this also means you're putting far too much power into the shot itself. 

Try lowering the camera angle to the lowest one so the putt meter is closer to the camera and you can dial it in more easily. 

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@theycagednon wrote:

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@Ultrasonic_77Check these out...these are from an arcade tourney.

https://www.xbox.com/play/media/EVWLXL97DL
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/RGBHYLW8J3
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/YZ78R5DCKK
https://www.xbox.com/play/media/24XHDZ4MUX

Regardless of tourney type, mode of play, etc...ball physics, putt reads, green grids, etc SHOULD ALWAYS BE CONSISTENT. Everyone is entitled to their opinions but those are mine. CONSISTENCY makes a great game, regardless of how hard or easy it is.

All of these examples (regardless of the putt being made or not) has something wrong in them. Usually it's the way the ball reacts. In one of them I made the damn put but on the way to the hole the ball literally shimmies back and forth...in what damn world does that ever happen to a super slow putt???

The reads are astronomically off in some of them too. Like absurdly. Please, OH GOD PLEASE, do not mention the infinitesimal degree of ball lie...because in the 100,000 other putts I have accomplished it never mattered.

So...if you watch these and don't think ANYTHING is wrong...well let's agree to disagree, and go our separate ways, hahaha.

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You're over hitting putts on all those videos (or at least the 3 that are not private). The Putt has to be on the line in order for it to be consistent yet you're over swinging every time. The last video you also have the marker quite far past the hole despite it being level, this also means you're putting far too much power into the shot itself. 

Try lowering the camera angle to the lowest one so the putt meter is closer to the camera and you can dial it in more easily. 

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Ok, I'm going to try to understand your explanation here...because I'm quite aware of what I was doing by putting "too much" into the swing.

So am I to understand it that overswing can't be used to a player's advantage? OR, when something doesn't go a player's way we get to just use it as an "explanation". This also an example of a problem putt in my opinion...I have made several others using the same adjustments.

Listen I can appreciate your point of view but let's take a look at this first putt again

1) So at first glance, the first grid lines move left slowly but are moving. The next set of grid lines are BARELY moving right, almost at a stand still. So the putt SHOULD move left more, correct? So why does it go right on a straight swing with over power? Saying over power makes things move in opposite directions would be wildly ridiculous...and against physics, which I happen to keep stating since EA used it in their hype video but everyone ignores.

2) You say the putt has to be on the line for it to be consistent...what line are we referring to? The actual shot line is wrong as in several of the other videos. If I hit a "perfect" shot, meaning speed then my shot would have went further right according to the game which means the shot line is WRONG because the line showed the ball going LEFT.

3) I used overswing to push through ANY and ALL break. That's the point. Golfers do this all the time. So this "line" you are referring to...is it the power line or maybe my swing? Well, my swing is straight as a damn arrow. It's literally shown on the video. So what exaggeration would there be on a completely straight swing with a little extra power (1.1% to be specific) on a 6-7ft putt? Are we seriously the 45 degree angle this thing took like 2 inches from the cup is in anyway accurate? 🙄

Again...I get the excuse, because that is what it is an excuse, of "if you are not in a perfect swing speed the shot is exaggerated", but on a 6ft putt??? Hahaha. Exaggerated how exactly, where the shot can do literally whatever it wants? That's a HUGE get out of jail free card for a developer. At that point no shot could be questioned. 

I get you are offering a differing opinion...however if I was to show you 50-100 other putts where overswing worked to my advantage, and very rarely on a putt does it not which is why i do it, would you still use the same excuse? Also...something that evades a lot of folks is we are talking MINIMAL power 1% or less most of the time.

On the fourth video you mentioned the marker was past the cup "quite far". Well, I guess the video throws thing off but it's only like 1 foot past the cup really...not too far. Also, half of the putt was actually uphill as referenced by the grid lines rolling towards the ball. In arcade mode from my experience, the actual marker isn't far off SPEED wise (i usually don't mess with it in arcade mode)...directionally is a whole other story.

From what I see you and ultraviolet offered insight...but from the video I see grid lines, speed, swing line, etc and the only thing that is jacked up is the ball making an unimaginable right before the cup. Which I still haven't read of an acceptably valid reason as to why...because every argument I have read works against the person in several other ways, as does overswing...ball should move left according to the shot line, BUT moved right.

When will will look at a video and say...yea, that's not right. There may not be a fix, but yea, that's messed up.

What im telling you is you are approaching those shots incorrectly and over swinging every Putt, it's that simple. 

I wouldn't approach any of those shots in the way you did, because I know it would result in the shot missing. 

Below is a link to a thread I started yesterday (that rather unsurprisingly on this forum hasn't had any engagement), in the thread I posted my best round, that I did on Tour Mode with no shot arc or putting guide enabled, during the US Open on Career mode with a 12mph wind. Based on that I can tell you that im able to consistently hit Putts from a variety of angles in order to get a low score, on one of the more difficult modes. 

https://answers.ea.com/t5/General-Discussion/The-post-your-best-round-Thread/m-p/12495031#M3035

Go and watch Tony Turbo's Youtube channel and see how he sets up for his putts and the methodology he uses, it's vastly different to yours and he is consistently scoring under par. 

I understand you don't want to accept any responsibility whatsoever for the missed shots, and its all the games fault etc, but perhaps if you could move past that denial you might actually start improving how you approach the shots. 

I'll use the 4th video of yours as an example, its level so you dont need to move the marker past the hole at all, even move it back a little, you also then over swing the shot so both together result in removing the break from the ball, yet you still played the break, it was missing all day long because of poor technique and nothing more. But hey, keep shouting at people on here who are trying to explain this to you, it's not going to hole the shot. 

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@jitter77Hahaha...I was just messing with you, partner. Although I didn't realize you meant the actual accuracy skill specifically...I thought you were talking about your player level.

I have a few legendary specs myself, irons and wedges though.

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@jitter77 

I enjoy this game even if it infuriates me at times.

Wow, now that statement indicates this game is extremely realistic!

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@Buzmaniii wrote:

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@jitter77Hahaha...I was just messing with you, partner. Although I didn't realize you meant the actual accuracy skill specifically...I thought you were talking about your player level.

I have a few legendary specs myself, irons and wedges though.

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@TriumphRider wrote:
@jitter77 

I enjoy this game even if it infuriates me at times.

Wow, now that statement indicates this game is extremely realistic!

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Hahaha.. like REAL golf. Anyone who plays understands, for sure. A lot of us amateur golfers get super pissed on the course...but we are right back out there next weekend!

This game has flaws, 100%...but I paid for it. So I damn sure will play it. And, for all the discussions I had in this thread, the fact is...I still place fairly high in tourneys and I hit a lot of damn good shots, probably mostly good shots. I just don't ignore or bury my head in the sand to the fact that the game has issues. What game doesn't? Dang near all do!