Class Discussion: Rose
Onto Rose. A character I don’t play all that much, barring specific reasons, like when I need to get certain quests done (teleporters, vanquish streaks and especially with Druid Rose, assists). Anoth...
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@Iron_Guard8Probably my least favorite of the new classes in gw2. I can't really seem to excel as her and fighting her is a pain due to her skinny hitbox.
Beta rose was a nightmare and I think everyone is glad they nerfed her.
I liked how different her,guardians and teleporter was from engineer's.
She had the floaty jump in gw2 as well even producing a trail effect beneath her.
She is the only plant in gw2 able to ignore mech armor which makes her a decent threat against imps.
Her homing was always gimmicky but somehow feels even worse in bfn.
I kinda miss time snare as it was more in line with the stun grenade rather than the empeach dealing damage, which was a load of bull and I prefer the visual effect of knowing I'm slowed down rather than just suddenly turning into a snail in bfn from a rose hiding somewhere with vague upgrade icons on the vanquish screen.
Goatify could be faster in gw2 but it going through walls like its hanzos ult from overwatch is cheeky bs and it has little counterplay. Also small thing but they took away the goat animations from gw2, boo. Psychedelic goat could use a small buff.
Not too mention that the bfn goatify is really glitchy.
I like nec rose being her own variant as she was my favorite in gw2 but she could use a small nerf while the other charge roses could use a buff.
Gw2 rose just looks infinetly better than bfn rose and has more detail and better color scheme due to the lighting much like all star. Her hands are rose buds in gw2 where its just the vine in bfn. Her body thorns looked way better in gw2. Her thistles and wand reload are just much more vibrant and noticeable in gw2 and she doesn't have her eye width turned up to 100. The cape in gw2 is also way more appealing to look at with the flashing stars. Even arcane enigma is much more vibrant and noticeable in color and animation.
If they really wanted rose to be support they should've just given her arcane lotus in bfn imo. The rose in bfn looks like she has a reddish/pink filter over her whole body in arcane where as gw2 arcane transformed rose into energy. Rose in gw2 also has the clear turn animation before she transforms yet bfn rose already has the effect on before she turns, why?
I don't mind arcane having damage as it forces rose to choose to flee or attempt to take down her opponent. Remember bfn arcane before the cooldown being teammate dependent? The speed boost is nice but it also requires the team to group up and most rose will just use it for self defense.
I think trying to focus so much on team play hurts bfn as a whole and im gonna mention it in a retrospective post in september as it dictates the game design of the character changes which imo did not turn out well as many of the ideas are rushed or just not thought out well at all.
Thorn apart is an upgrade I never really cared for as the lack of aiming destroys her direct combat capabilities in her thistles. It also charges regardless of the rose using her support abilities so you can just wait or canp by your teamates in arcane then delete a scientist or imp from existence.
Her downed state looks ok in both games.
Overall never a character I really cared for but I think her gw2 is better than her bfn version and I hope we get a reversal of the character.
@stukapooka I thought she had a floaty jump in GW2, but if she does, I don't really notice it much as actual extra jump height/distance and in fact when going from BfN to GW2, get stuck on stuff I expect to clear because of that (the opposite of Super Brainz between the 2 games) as she can hover and such in BfN and can't do so in GW2, that's about the only BfN change I like for this character.
I too like how she had those guardians for her teleporters (also I like breaking her magic teleporters with a zombie with the Everlasting Crown and having it say stuff like; 'Magic? Shmagic!' I do want teleporters and bots/guardians back, but we don't need the GW1 bot upgrades as they never existed for the guardians and the upgrading could turn into a competition to get the final upgrade so you got credit for its vanquishes.
The homing is something I'd not be upset if she lost, although they'd have to speed up her projectiles if they do. It was mostly ok if a pain in GW2, it hardly even works most of the time in BfN, especially closeup.
Having Arcane Enigma give teammates speed still can be used to help teammates escape with you, or when losing a point to get the next one without needing to respawn or getting shot like mad trying to fall back. I don't really mind the damage on the ability in GW2, but it's honestly not that hot, best used against low level AI mobs with low health than anything else.
I'm mostly 'meh' about thorn apart, although I'd rather use it than Brainium Basher.
BfN Goatify is awful. Between how buggy it is and how it goes through walls, the ground, and everything else and is huge. I've been in matches where multiple Roses would launch them one after another so we had to bail off the cart we were trying to push over and over. I mentioned this in the main post of course, but BfN's Goatify is so obnoxious it had to mentioned again. GW2's version isn't all that hot right now, but reverting it to that version and buffing the 2 versions a bit would be so much better than in BfN.
@Iron_Guard8The jump is definetly more noticeable on bfn rose and hovergoat.
Upgrading did have engineers fight for the turrets but it was nice seeing all the different forms and I believe gw2 concept art had different crystal forms as well.
The everlasting crown was a blessing that needs to return.
The homing seemed ok in gw2 as it fell off at longer range but didnt seem to have much problens otherwise but in bfn the spread and homing just seem really awful to use and really ineffective at any range besides medium range when your zoomed. Same with space cadet. Can't believe they seriously gave this to the peashooter of all characters in bfn.
Yeah the damage wasnt to useful but most roses in bfn use the speed boost selfishly for their own preservation.
Thorn apart is meh but it isnt as terrible as shogun and doesnt break the game as badly as basher. I think legendary upgrades overall were very poor attempts at trying to get people interested in the game again due to the lack of variants.
Gw2 goatify could be better by increasing the speed of the attack but bfn goatify is really bad. Ai rose in bfn also seems to spam it everytime they have it even if one zombie is there almost like they have wallhacks.@stukapooka I haven't posted Space Cadet yet although it's written up in Word (I want to post 1 per weekday so we have time to talk about these), but I mention there that the Space Cadet can lose her homing and I'd not mind one bit, and she's my favorite new character in BfN. She doesn't need it, and some variant ideas I have couldn't use it anyway.
The Peashooter homing upgrade is a bad idea, but it also either doesn't work at all, or doesn't work very well.I feel that legendary upgrades could be turned into variants instead with some work and simultaneously give us some variants that stand out more from the standard fire, ice, toxic, electric, etc. variants and give us more like unusual ones. With some balancing of course.
As for upgrading the turrets (and as an extension of that, the Guardians), I'd not be against the idea, I actually did like it, but the last upgrader got all the credit for the bot's vanquishes which was a problem. If they wanted to bring that back, they'd have to either only let the original builder upgrade their own turret (not a fan of that idea), or everyone who built/upgraded it should get credit.
@Iron_Guard8Space cadet has the best chance of the new zombies imo. I like 80s visual design the most but I think cadet is the most salvageable from a gameplay perspective.
More variants in line with the more unique gw2 era ones like scuba, cozmic brains, or nec rose isn't a bad idea.
Not neccesarily a terrible idea but its one that was implemented horribly and wasn't thought out.
If the turrets gave xp to every engineer that worked on it, it could be good.
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