Ice Rose
Ice Rose is pretty useless now. I made the mistake of starting to upgrade her to Max before the patch and she was pretty bad then. Since the patch though, it takes a millennia to actually freeze someo...
Forum Discussion
REPLYING TO:
Re: Ice Rose
Rhendyr
★★★★★ NOVICE
03-14-2016 07:47 AM - edited 03-14-2016 07:48 AM
ActiveMe4U2 wrote:
REPLYING TO:
Re: Ice Rose
Rhendyr
★★★★★ NOVICE
03-14-2016 07:02 AM
ActiveMe4U2 wrote:
Re: Ice Rose
JamesRivera88
★★★★ NOVICE
03-13-2016 07:52 PM - edited 03-13-2016 07:54 PM
She isn't supposed to be a terror with DPS, she is a support
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I was just talking to the scientist at close range, he sends his regards...
Scientist does the same dmg as Sunflower in a 10 second time period. Scientist does less dmg over a 10 minute time period. Math has been laid out in another thread for viewing.
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I know you are smarter than this reply.
Do I really need to point out the fact this information is irrelevant? The burst damage is what really counts here.
There isn't a single plant that will last 10 seconds vs a scientist at close range. The Sunflower won't last 3 seconds vs a scientist it will take 2 shots.
When the Sunflower does 40 DPS (dealing 400 dmg over 10 seconds), and the Scientist does 40 DPS (200 dmg over 5 seconds), which one is doing more damage per second?
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The damage is obviously the same, I get your point. What I am trying to say is the battle between those two will last 3 seconds the most.
With that said, who will have the clear advantage?
The Sunflower has good steady damage but it needs time to build up, the scientist has a crazy burst at the first few seconds, the Sunflower will need time to build up, which most likely won't have. But I admit you do make a good point.
Re: Ice Rose
Rhendyr
★★★★★ NOVICE
03-14-2016 07:47 AM - edited 03-14-2016 07:48 AM
ActiveMe4U2 wrote:
REPLYING TO:
Re: Ice Rose
Rhendyr
★★★★★ NOVICE
03-14-2016 07:02 AM
ActiveMe4U2 wrote:
Re: Ice Rose
JamesRivera88
★★★★ NOVICE
03-13-2016 07:52 PM - edited 03-13-2016 07:54 PM
She isn't supposed to be a terror with DPS, she is a support
_______________________
I was just talking to the scientist at close range, he sends his regards...
Scientist does the same dmg as Sunflower in a 10 second time period. Scientist does less dmg over a 10 minute time period. Math has been laid out in another thread for viewing.
_______________________________
I know you are smarter than this reply.
Do I really need to point out the fact this information is irrelevant? The burst damage is what really counts here.
There isn't a single plant that will last 10 seconds vs a scientist at close range. The Sunflower won't last 3 seconds vs a scientist it will take 2 shots.
When the Sunflower does 40 DPS (dealing 400 dmg over 10 seconds), and the Scientist does 40 DPS (200 dmg over 5 seconds), which one is doing more damage per second?
______________________
The damage is obviously the same, I get your point. What I am trying to say is the battle between those two will last 3 seconds the most.
With that said, who will have the clear advantage?
The Sunflower has good steady damage but it needs time to build up, the scientist has a crazy burst at the first few seconds, the Sunflower will need time to build up, which most likely won't have. But I admit you do make a good point.
It comes down to mobility, who seen who first, positioning, and if the cool down is up for warp or not, really. So, what it really comes down to isn't their dmg, it's the player skill, and the "luck of the draw" with cool downs, positioning and such, which to me, suggests, that at least damage-wise, those two are fairly balanced.
People are really quick to jump on the burst train, I mean it's easy to say the Scientist does more when you see bigger one hit numbers. I'm not saying this is you, but most wont ever fact check, and will just run off all willy nilly with conjecture, they then start spamming the forum with threads based on incomplete or incorrect information.
I've compared the Sunflower and Scientists raw dmg, and the new Rose and Engineers raw dmg, and am considering just doing a chart with all of their base classes dmg for easy comparison in hopes of maybe somehow dispelling some of those unfounded opinions.
- REPLYING TO:
Re: Ice Rose
Rhendyr
★★★★★ NOVICE
03-14-2016 08:11 AM
It comes down to mobility, who seen who first, positioning, and if the cool down is up for warp or not, really. So, what it really comes down to isn't their dmg, it's the player skill, and the "luck of the draw" with cool downs, positioning and such, which to me, suggests, that at least damage-wise, those two are fairly balanced.
People are really quick to jump on the burst train, I mean it's easy to say the Scientist does more when you see bigger one hit numbers. I'm not saying this is you, but most wont ever fact check, and will just run off all willy nilly with conjecture, they then start spamming the forum with threads based on incomplete or incorrect information.
I've compared the Sunflower and Scientists raw dmg, and the new Rose and Engineers raw dmg, and am considering just doing a chart with all of their base classes dmg for easy comparison in hopes of maybe somehow dispelling some of those unfounded opinions.
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Right, I agree with everything you mentioned. I think the map and game type will also benefit each character depending on the circumstances.
For example I can see the Sunflower having more chances on a big turf map and the scientist having advantage on gnome bomb.
How is the Raw damage of the scientist vs the Rose? The math is for base variants, as that, the current Rose does 9 dmg per thistle, she has 20 rounds, and unloads those 20 rounds in 4.5 seconds
So, 9×20/4.5 = 40 DPS
For a reference, the Engineer is 20 dmg per body shot, 12 rounds and takes 11 seconds to unload. So 20×12/11 = 21.8 DPS (rounded down). Or, Headshots does 35 dmg, so if you get all headshots, that's 35×12/11 = 38.2 DPS (rounded up).
I haven't tested any others yet. That would involve triple checking their dmg, then timing how long a clip takes to unload with a stop watch 10 times and then averaging that out. Not a lot of work, but more than I'm willing to do at the moment . =)
@Rhendyr wrote:The math is for base variants, as that, the current Rose does 9 dmg per thistle, she has 20 rounds, and unloads those 20 rounds in 4.5 seconds
So, 9×20/4.5 = 40 DPS
For a reference, the Engineer is 20 dmg per body shot, 12 rounds and takes 11 seconds to unload. So 20×12/11 = 21.8 DPS (rounded down). Or, Headshots does 35 dmg, so if you get all headshots, that's 35×12/11 = 38.2 DPS (rounded up).
I haven't tested any others yet. That would involve triple checking their dmg, then timing how long a clip takes to unload with a stop watch 10 times and then averaging that out. Not a lot of work, but more than I'm willing to do at the moment . =)
How are you doing Master of Making Up DPS Values?
It's rather amusing to see you're still comparing stock variants. Nobody uses stock Engineer, why don't you compare Electrican to stock Rose/Party Rose?
Compare the best Engineer variant to the best Rose variant, I think you'll find the DPS to be one sided. Oh and I find it rather strange you comparing Sunflower and stock Scientist on the Ice Rose thread too, why? Nobody plays stock Scientist.
Why don't you compare the DPS of variants people are playing? Zoologist, Marine Biologist, Chemist etc against Stuffy or Vampire, Fire even...
Still waiting on that Excel Spreadsheet you were creating? That is however a lot of work, and impossible to make in GW2.
When each character is below 15% health, shots only do half the damage if not less. Some characters seem to become immune to others, I was hitting a string of 1s when classes were in the immunity phase. This damage reduction is completely eliminated with burst damage. Fundamentally making it so the zombies virtually never lose to slow and steady damage in the timeframe it'll take a zombie to burst down a plant. I know you know this, and I'm astonished that after weeks nobody has pointed it out to you.
And one last thing man...this isn't World of Warcraft, you don't need to calculate the DPS for 10 minutes when a Scientist can kill 3-4 Plants in 5 seconds. It takes a Sunflower that same time to kill ONE zombie, if, and it's a pretty big IF, every shot lands.
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Rose, Ice, Fire, Druid and Party variants don't need better CC, she has great CC but she has pathetic damage output and low health.
Shots aren't homing or registering and there is no splash to compensate for this. It is unwise to play her right now unless you want to get 2-3 shot by Zoologists and Biologists, and any other zombie class for that matter. Sure you can get 10-15 kills with her if you play the entire game hiding behind walls and playing like a coward but I'd rather be on the front line with something that hits more than 2s and 3s, and is capable of killing someone without having to fire 50 unregistered shots against their 2-3 shots.
- Yeah this whole dps over 10 minutes is hilariously unscientific. Someone like the zoologist can kill a sunflower or a Rose in 1 second. It takes him 3 seconds to dump 9 shots at 30 damage a piece. What kind of dps can a flower do in 1 second? Wow, definitely not 100 damage lol. What a joke. Your math and actual real game application of that math is laughable. Did you know it takes almost a full second to even just turn around. I got about .8 seconds to look 180 degrees in the other direction on default look sensitivity. A scientist can easily just Teleport behind you and you're dead as you're adjusting for a shot.
The actual dps of someone like the zoologist is 90-120 damage. Per ACTUAL second. Computer scientist can do 100 damage in about .85 seconds. 150 damage in about 1.35 seconds.
The DPS os the sunflower is 7-8 shots, and at 8 damage per shot. So that's about 56-64 damage.
Math guy in here is crazy with his 10 minute long dps run. The sunflower died about 9 minutes and 59 seconds ago. I was missing his comical posts actually, and so I had to find him! Here he is, brainwashing some of these peeps without a clue.
Go take a look at the new thread I just posted, that's fundamentally why burst damage is so much better in this game.
