6 years ago

Nightcap sucks and needs help

Nightcap was always bad since Founders. At the time, nobody knew how to play around a stealth character and Damage was too low across the board. So what's wrong with Nightcap?

Let's start with her primary. It is not good. She takes too long to kill even 125 HP classes, which is pretty important for a "stealth" class that needs to kill enemies quickly in order to remain hidden. For being a "stealth" character, she seems to get spotted pretty easily as a result of not getting kills quickly enough. Which leads to my next point...

Nightcap is not rewarded for sneaking up on enemies. Her DPS is simply too slow for her to fight zombies head on in most situations. What would make her better as a "stealth" character, is having an assassination mechanic. This can be as simple as getting bonus damage from hitting the zombies' backs.

An assassination mechanic would be great because it would help Nightcap really stand out from other classes. Interestingly, she is the ONLY class that can't do Critical damage. Nightcap's damage is so low that she gets outshined by Corn, Peashooter, and most of the zombies. Not only that, but right now she feels too similar to the Imp class, another class that is small, can double jump; just slightly more mobile.

It would also encourage Nightcap players to get closer to their enemies, instead of sniping very unstealthily.

The Final issue that I have is her Walking speed. With Parkour being nerfed like it deserved, there isn't much mobility for Nightcap besides Double Jump and Shadow Sneak. Since it doesn't seem like Nightcap should be too effective with Jump Spam in head to head combat, why not buff her Walking? She walks way too slow to rely on strafing, and like many other Low HP classes, the walking speed difference is barely noticeable. Bottom line, Nightcap (and other Low HP classes) need a Walking speed buff.

I think the Parkour and Shadow Dome nerf were a step in the right direction, but the problems that make Nightcap bad need to be addressed.

At best, Nightcap is just an annoying class that constantly runs away, snipes, and can traverse the map quickly with her mobility. She Is TF2 Spy with a gun, and no assassination mechanic. She is very easily the worst plant. (heck, the worst character)

24 Replies

GutmanSca
6 years ago
@Pheesley If she couldn't camp I would agree with you, but nah man, she is good, just need more time in the character.

I agree in a rework for the character btw.
GraveledStoopid
6 years ago
@Pheesley Nightcap is incredibly loud and easy to detect. Sneaking up on someone with all the goofy sound effects is impossible. Then the auto-aim in game detects mushroom while invisible, so you have that going for you as well. But my biggest complaint now with mushroom is the hit misses. With all the lagging animations in game, it appears the falloff and drag was added in theory. The visuals depicted seem to convey direct hits that don’t register. I can only attribute this to the falloff effect, just wish the visuals were a bit more telling.

I agree with you, mushroom went from extreme OP to dud. We need a middle ground with her! 🤙
GraveledStoopid
6 years ago
@Pheesley Slingshot is a great mobility feature for mushroom. I will say I haven’t played her since this latest patch, but I’m sure my assessment still holds true.
Pheesley
6 years ago
@GutmanSca nice to hear that you like my idea 🙂
Yeah, she is usable, but being able to Snipe at mid-range is probably the only thing that makes her effective, like she can actually help her team.
If Damage Falloff was a thing and she couldn't snipe, she would be almost useless.
chogath_player
6 years ago
@Pheesleyannoyingly, i can do really well with her. I keep telling myself shes god awful but i can consistently do well with her on good ping. id say her biggest weakness is how incredibly insanely easy it has always been to kill her. if you aren't positioned correctly expect to die in 0.001 milleseconds. zombies have a ton of attacks that oneshot her. she doesnt have anything that can oneshot people. fully landing fung fu on someone wont kill them for some reason. most games i perform well with her i almost rarely ever use fung fu. she could definitely use a buff/ rework.
Shinobicap
6 years ago
Anyone else notice that the aiming reticle is off? I think this is a new issue because I didn’t have this problem last patch.
Like, you could be on a rooftop with a clear view but sometimes the reticle is aiming at the roof below your feet, causing you to miss your target. This also happens on platform that is just slightly raised or slanted. It’s SUPER annoying!
Btw, I personally think Nightcap is in a pretty good spot, but I'm happy with whatever directing Popcap decides to take her. I do agree she's very easy to kill and it can be very hard to go head on with zombies 😞
@Pheesley I really like the idea of an assassination mechanic.
SockReverie
6 years ago
@Pheesley I’ve always thought that Fung Fu should be reverted to the damage it dealt in Founders but reduce it’s radius so that it can be used as an assassination move against one Zombie or two tightly packed ones. That would help make it a true “assassinate” maneuver, instead of the “i’ll just jump in the middle of a group and try to do something before being swatted like a fly” ability
Iron_Guard8
Legend
6 years ago
I find it interesting that we've had a thread on Nightcap being too good and too weak in close proximity to each other.

This usually indicates that the character being discussed is about where they should be. I would say she feels decent to me but is risky to do really well with as she's very fragile when hit. She's small and nimble so can be hard to hit but when she is hit, she often doesn't survive. I certainly can't see her getting any more nerfs, but does she need a buff, or is she in good shape?
Pheesley
6 years ago
@SockReverieI dont think of Fung fu as an assassination since you can usually sprint out of it. It has a long cool down and is very loud. I guess if she got Founders Fung fu back it wouldnt be bad. I personally dont mind either way.
Seems like Nightcap always has to setup Fung fu by putting a little damage in. It is a big commitment but you should be fine if the zombies die.
Pheesley
6 years ago
@GraveledStoopid Yeah, the aim assist detecting Shadow Sneak is ridiculous. I haven't noticed that with light aim assist, which is what i've been using since heavy feels so awkward.
So when it doesnt register, the projectile looks like it hit but it actually didn't due to lag animations?
Slingshot is still kind of usable despite the nerf. It's good for running away. She still sucks on the ground though.