Re: New game discussion time again

That long and insightful video from GW content creators about BfN and what they all wanted is representative of the fandom in general. We really wanted GW3, and while BfN has its fans, it just fell short in so many ways, even though the potential there was massive.

GW2 improved a lot of things GW missed at; no more cheap respawning to avoid being vanquished, tweaked Toxic Pea and Super Commando to be less oppressive, more PvE content, some improved balancing (although GW2 still has balance issues; including, although not limited to detonation characters, toxic brainz being too good, while some like Disco Chomper being underpowered), less roof top camping, private matches and more. I do feel like GW was more true to the original PvZ look and feel, and I know many commentators like to bag on GW2's zombified look, but I like both styles and they could fit well with PvZ2's time travel theme for GW3.

GW3 could easily give us more of what we love while adding new stuff so it isn't just 'more GW2', although I wouldn't mind more GW2 at all. So a list of stuff they could do to make it stand out while having the same solid gameplay as GW2 (although please fix the netcode so we get less hit registration issues!):

• Bring back the GW and GW2 maps. Make any changes needed for bigger characters, each map needs a night version, and add new ones. (BfN maps could use the themes involved but the TT maps need work to have enough points and for teleporters to return). Add more new maps after launch more often. I want to be flooded with maps, especially for TT games.
• Bring back the GW2 versions of characters and variants, although engineer should revert to GW, or at the least, let us choose drones as alternates to the big bolt blaster. For BfN characters, as long as they get needed balancing work and variants, I'd be happy to see them back.
• Make Ops like it was in GW2. A casual mode where its only 5 rounds like BfN could be an option, but we need the old GW/GW2 Ops back, especially the evacuation period as it adds some nice tension.
• Lots of PvE and PvP options. 
• Community challenges return.
• Everlasting Crown returns.
• Expanded Gnomiverse.
• More 'end game' content like I've suggested before in lieu of Infinity Time; i.e. free roam regions with more to do and other options.
• Lots of customization of our own little place, the personal neighborhood I mentioned before or something along those lines would be very welcome.
• Public places to hang out and meet/fight other players.
• Solid upgrade system.
• Boss Hunts and other great and challenging content for teams. Some of the missing GW2 boss hunts sound amazing.
• More exciting mystery portals. We need Capture the Taco, Soil Survivors, and other fun and unique stuff over rando's for the umpteenth time.
• Stickerbook/almanac
• Tons of customizations; especially the better ones from GW and BfN.
• Lots of consumables. We need more than BfN gave us, regardless of how we summon them.
• Cross-play with all platforms with powerful anti-cheat
• Other stuff? I'm sure I missed something.

GW2 was and still is a huge game and taking that basic success and iterating on it means you can take stuff you know people love and just build on that. Newer consoles like the latest PS and XBox as well as more powerful PCs mean more can be in the game, hopefully avoiding stuff like the missing water in Tourist Trap Island! Imagine how much more GW3 could be!

We all can hope and dream for another installment in the Garden Warfare series. Like Iron_Guard8 said, I think it would be best if another EA studio can take charge of developing the game while PopCap provides guidance and research materials for the main studio team. PopCap should have final say on what should be included in the game to ensure that the unique identity and themes of PvZ are preserved and that the game doesn't turn into another failed shooter. I'm not sure which EA studio would be suited for this endeavor, but they ideally should have plenty of experience developing third person shooters and are able to effectively communicate with their fanbase. They should use GW2 as a starting point and build on from there. They don't need to reinvent the wheel.

Even though BFN's core mechanics were inferior to those of GW1 & GW2, it did introduce a lot of things that I did like to some degree such as:

1. Citron's new primary, Rose's Goatify, All-Star's Dummy Shield, & Engineer's primary projectile traveling longer distances
   
   
2. The new plant & zombie classes, except for the unoriginal TV Head & Wildflower
3. The new revive circle mechanic in general & how it makes reviving risky
4. Informative HUD elements for health, XP, ability cooldown/availability, & weapon overheat
5. The free roam PvE areas 
6. The unique customizations (i.e. no duplicates), victory slabs, & most of the expanded communication options

I hope that they keep sprinting in the next game, but changes should be made so that characters don't have unlimited stamina, sprint speed is affected if you're getting hit by enemy fire/abilities or if you jump too much, & you're able to use weapons/abilities much faster after ending your sprint by default instead of having to use the "Ready Up" class upgrade.

Despite the fact that the shooter franchise is not in a great state right now, I will continue to have hope for the future of the franchise. The shooter series is in a weird and unknown place right now, as EA has not stated anything or communicated with us yet. I have had lots of fun with Garden Warfare 2 and Battle for Neighborville in the past and still continue to play them to this day. 

The original Garden Warfare games were much more popular and more appreciated by the community, compared to Battle for Neighborville. When Battle for Neighborville was in the making, it seemed like they decided to venture on a different path and take a risk by heading in a different direction, as opposed to directly building on the Garden Warfare games. It obviously did not work out as planned, however we got some cool mechanics and features from Battle for Neighborville, which could be transfered into a new shooter game.

I honestly would like any sort of communication from EA which could inform us of what they have planned for the future of the franchise. The PvZ3 game is still being created and PvZ2 is being updated to this day, so PvZ is still going strong. The shooters are still played by many players, even though they are not receiving updates anymore. Hopefully we hear news regarding the future of the franchise from EA, and that we get this communication soon! 🤞

@Positronic-Rift I largely agree with your ideas here, with a points of contention, but nothing major or insurmountable.

Part of why GW and GW2 are so good is exactly the PvZ look and feel. I play a lot of shooters and many are good, but none are as great as these games and especially GW2. PopCap absolutely must have input on how the game world looks, character design and so on. As for the mechanics, like you post early on, they don't need to reinvent the wheel, which is at least partially why BfN was a mess, but just take what works and expand upon it. GW3 doesn't have to be just more GW, it can and should do more than just add more variants and customizations, but it also can't lose the spirit of the GW games we love. BfN did indeed add some good ideas and nice touches like multiple builds and overheat indicators on t e HUD, and those should be kept for a new game.

On your points:

1. I do like Citron's new primary as the beam weapon was a serious problem in GW2; it's very easy to aim as it has no projectile mechanics to deal with and was too good at sniping in GW2. Goatify needs a look at as it feels a bit off in GW2 after they nerfed it, and it's a bit too good most of the time in BfN. Perhaps they could leave it large like it is in BfN but walls or a certain travel distance stop it. I really hate being goatified when I can't even see it coming. All-Star's dummy shield could be a little easier to see through, and I find it more useful than the old dummy shields from GW and GW2, although some other veterans don't like this shield. Citron's shield needs a serious look at though! For the engineer, as long as they can't bounce it so much, especially on certain maps like turning point even without that upgrade, more range wouldn't be an issue. It's the combination of range and bouncing that makes it so obnoxious to fight against. Engineer's kit needs some work after BfN for sure.
2. 100% agreed, and hoping for variants of them and needed balancing.
3. I also like how teammates can help with revives and everyone gets XP now.
4. I prefer the look of the GW2 HUD, but with the BfN upgrades, so we have more info at a glance. That would be great.
5. Free roam regions are a personal favorite. They do need more stuff to do though as they get a bit dull after you 100% them. they need more reasons to return, kind of like how in Warframe you will visit the same location many times for various reasons, just not as grindy as Warframe gets!
6. Agreed here too of course, although don't have stuff like a 'poop' emote. It may just make some of us roll our eyes, but a lot of kids play so things need to be handled a bit differently. Victory slabs should be customizable per character at the least, and for each build would be ideal, of course we need variants back too, and more build slots per character/variant as 3 is not enough. While GW2 is my favorite, and reading comments and watching videos, is the most loved of all 3 games, it has overall the least appealing customizations, and I'd say BfN has the best. I would like zombie weapon skins back and we can lose the foot customization though. Also, we need GW2's everlasting crown, that thing is amazing, and bring back all the customizations from all the games, maybe without all the alternate versions though.

I'd be fine with sprinting going away to be honest as it's part of why shooting and moving in BfN is off compared to the GW games. That being said, if they make less of a problem, give characters different base and sprinting speeds (which can be used as a balance factor and to give characters flavor), and do make the sprint/slowing down shooting interaction less of a pain, I'd be fine with sprint coming back.

I love Gw2 but BFN absolutely sucks. BROOO like scientist snipes u from 420,000 miles away and the gameplay is repetitave af because there are no variants