Forum Discussion
@VetteC5RX Okay, I understand. You have a lot of valid points, and perhaps Frenzy does deserve a buff. I can tell you’re intent on this and I concede on most of my points.
That being said, I still have a couple:
Most heroes and infantry only have two dodges. Only Infiltrators, Han, and Ariels can, and they need a card. Therefore, you will have a hard time dodging all three strikes.
I disagree with cancelling abilities. That just makes it OP. Obi Wan has that ability because he is defensively focused, and can’t do a lot of damage without his actual saber strikes. Say Leia has her E-11 active. When Kylo Ren uses Frenzy on her, it deactivates? What do you want for abilities already active?
Yeah, this isn’t an argument, true. How about debate?🥳
@Commander_Ney0 unless you’re running a card for Kylo “Frenzy” only has a 10 meter range; incredibly short for any ability on the roster. This makes staying out of the AOE fairly easy. For saber users all you have to do is block strikes 1 & 2 and then dodge the 3rd so for ALL saber users, there ya go, Frenzy negated. If you’re a Luke with insta-cast you can pop off a nice push in between strikes and essentially use Frenzy against Kylo; do you suggest this is balanced? Perhaps it should be a going rule that Kylo never use Frenzy against Luke or Han or even Rey who can pop her dash in between and hit Kylo multiple times? Given that those players are often staples in HvV that’s a pretty garbage scenario.
Blaster uses may not be able to dodge all 3 strikes but they can dodge out of the AOE. Remember base distance is 10 meters but that width narrows as you get closer to Kylo, an experienced blaster user can take advantage of that by closing distance and dodging out of the narrower portion of the AOE and thus Frenzy won’t register. Also consider they all have range and most have high DPS; this means that blasters using their abilities and attributes properly can deal damage to Kylo well before he’s in range of Frenzy which means any blaster has a real opportunity to kill Kylo during Frenzy which is fair.
Also, let’s evaluate the damage output; base, Frenzy deals LESS damage than a regular saber strike. If it were even moderately greater that would be one thing but less just doesn’t make sense and causes a hard choice to make. You can card buff Fenzys damage but consider the current state of gameplay with high movement characters. Remember the 10 meter issue; you can also buff that to 14 meters but this creates a bit of a paradox: do I 1.) buff the distance and have an actual “chance” of the ability activating or 2.) buff the damage and although the likelihood of use goes way down maybe net more damage?
Players are being forced to buff an ability just one TRY and get it to work and even then it often doesn’t due to other factors. If it worked either with activation OR the number of strikes I wouldn’t even make this post .. heck if it was a rare occurrence I wouldn’t but this is an every game multiple times per match issue.
as for “cancelling” NO, I’m not asking abilities to be cancelled! If a player triggers an ability prior to Frenzy they should keep it. If Leia activates her E-11 it should stay active; If Lando throws his disabler it should trigger at its specified time.I’m saying the restriction should prevent activation of currently non active abilities only for the duration of Frenzy, not to cancel ones that have been already turned on; that would be OP.
There are just too many scenarios where heroes can exploit Fenzy to do more damage to Kylo than he can do to his opponents and it’s not hard to do. If it try to trigger Frenzy I have to hope it activates (which btw this has been an issue for over a year now), then, if it wasn’t evaded, I have to hope it doles out all 3 strikes, then I have to hope it isn’t further blocked + evaded by a saber hero, then I have to hope it isn’t negated completely by a shoulder charge, dash strike, defensive rush, heroic might, unleash, rolling charge, charge slam, detonate charge, or any number of available stuns ... most all of those will end up doing more damage to Kylo than the one strike you might get with Frenzy plus exposes Kylo to combo counter attacks yielding even more risk.
That combined with its regular failure to activate plus its bugs plus is low damage output means that it needs something to make it a more competitive ability. It’s just not balanced in this gameplay environment.
- 5 years ago
A fair comparison would be GG thrust surge. It, too, is an automated ability that requires target tracking but it’s MUCH more reliable mainly due to the larger AOE; it’s base AOE is 15 meters; one more than the max you can buff Kylo’s Fenzy too AND it deals a lot more damage as well as being blockable / dodge able.
Similar to Thrust Surge; Frenzy has a combo potential; albeit not as easily as Thrust Surge.
If we accept that thrust surge is valid why isn’t Frenzy using a similar logic.
Thrust Surge CAN be disrupted by abilities and I don’t contest that but that’s because the AOE, tracking, and damage output makes that fair; with Frenzy, that’s not the case.
- 5 years ago
If i would have a dollar every time I just dodged/blocked/maybe parried thrust surge then I would get a proper gaming pc instead of my half-mediocre laptop😉
- 5 years ago
@soapy_catuses Right! Thrust Surge isn’t a guaranteed hit which is fair BUT it does have a greater AOE, greater tracking and therefore MUCH greater reliability than Frenzy; pair that with the much higher base damage Thrust Surge has (160) over Frenzy (115) and Thrust Surge is a valid ability to risk using ... Frenzy, not so much.
I don’t want to get push-popped by Luke while trying to use a low damage ability I have to pray to the gods will even activate in the first place.