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VetteC5RX's avatar
6 years ago

If you do nothing else FIX KYLO’s Frenzy

Before I get a ton of “oh it’s a great ability” ... no, it’s not; in its current state it’s garbage against other heroes. 

other characters such as Vader received an adjustment because the Devs realized that the risk vs reward for using some abilities was more risk than reward. In Kylo’s case he got a nerf in damage.

I’m saying this because all of the following are true:

1.) Frenzy will OFTEN bug and fall to register all 3 leaps, sometimes just doing one and then stopping & standing still, leaving you vulnerable. 

2.) Frenzy can be 100% countered with abilities such as Push or Shoulder Charge that negate the ability, and, if well timed; can see the opponent taking zero damage. 

3.) Frenzy can be 100% dodged / evaded resulting in zero damage done. 

4.) Frenzy cannot resolve most map elevation changes (this will never be fixed, I get that, but it’s a factor none the less).

5.) Frenzy’s AOE (even with full star card) is SO narrow that given the higher degree of mobility the Devs have put into the game its opportunity for use shrinks. Often when a player properly intends to use Frenzy at a critical point it will not activate because the target that “was” intent AOE now isn’t. If you attempt to activate Frenzy while your opponent simultaneously dodges / evades or otherwise uses an ability you’re beat. Because Frenzy requires you to trigger it and essentially let the automation take over this is VERY disadvantageous if the ability fails to trigger because you’re standing there like a bump on a log. 

It seems clear Fenzy was built with infantry more in mind but that means against other heroes he’s far weaker. His long cast time abilities, lackluster swings, and mediocre dodge rate make him less than balanced unless you’re playing with a squad .. news flash; that’s OFTEN not the case and in random lobbies all characters should be balanced. 

Yes, Kylo can take advantage of sensitivity and “dodge dance” his way into strikes on his own but that’s not exactly a comprehensive strat. 

The Devs resized Leia’s abilities were weak, they realized even Vader had a risky ability but somehow forgot that among all the changes they’ve made over the last year that Kylo got left behind. His Frenzy ability is SO conditional that’s its only usable in certain circumstances and even then.

this is easily fixed by doing two things; increasing the AOE to compensate for the high movements and server lag & 2; restrict opponent ability use for the duration of Frenzy. If an opponent wants to dodge all 3 strikes, that’s fine, if they want to block and then dodge the last one, fine; but what they shouldn’t do is be able to slip crowd control or high damage abilities in between Frenzy strikes to basically use Kylo’s own ability against him. 

18 Replies

  • A fair comparison would be GG thrust surge. It, too, is an automated ability that requires target tracking but it’s MUCH more reliable mainly due to the larger AOE; it’s base AOE is 15 meters; one more than the max you can buff Kylo’s Fenzy too AND it deals a lot more damage as well as being blockable / dodge able.

    Similar to Thrust Surge; Frenzy has a combo potential; albeit not as easily as Thrust Surge. 

    If we accept that thrust surge is valid why isn’t Frenzy using a similar logic. 

    Thrust Surge CAN be disrupted by abilities and I don’t contest that but that’s because the AOE, tracking, and damage output makes that fair; with Frenzy, that’s not the case. 

  • If i would have a dollar every time I just dodged/blocked/maybe parried thrust surge then I would get a proper gaming pc instead of my half-mediocre laptop😉

  • VetteC5RX's avatar
    VetteC5RX
    6 years ago

    @soapy_catuses Right! Thrust Surge isn’t a guaranteed hit which is fair BUT it does have a greater AOE, greater tracking and therefore MUCH greater reliability than Frenzy; pair that with the much higher base damage Thrust Surge has (160) over Frenzy (115) and Thrust Surge is a valid ability to risk using ... Frenzy, not so much. 

    I don’t want to get push-popped by Luke while trying to use a low damage ability I have to pray to the gods will even activate in the first place. 

  • Frenzy needs no buffs/CC immunity.

    I do agree about the terrain issues/angle issues however.

    It’s a slightly OP ability. 10 seconds on strikes with damage reduction and block break. It also melts stamina sometimes. 

    Like any ability in the game there are counters. 

    Just double parry the first two hits then dodge the third. 

    It could use some improvements like damage and range, but it would have to loose its blockbreaking attribute.

  • VetteC5RX's avatar
    VetteC5RX
    6 years ago

    @Frostwing2615  Not if you consider that the ability doesn’t regularly work or activate. 

    the ability is FAR from OP. As stated previously the ability has such a narrow and short AOE that combined with the high mobility of many characters it doesn’t resolve so while you attempt to activate it fails to. In the moment it takes to actually trigger the ability the target is no longer locked by the system. 

    Also, your also not considering the fact that the block bypass isn’t a guarantee and can be evaded by most players. 

    also, there is no real parry mechanic in this game; you can’t realistically have a parry system and also be able to strike from block .. what people here are referring to as a parry is a strike, from a block, properly timed after an opponent strikes; that’s not a “parry” ... a parry would be precisely timing a block as an opponent strikes and if done so causes the opponent to be staggered. 

    I agree, there are counters to Frenzy and that’s ok; I agree with that, there are counters to Thrust Surge too but at least Thrust Surge works consistently and has a reasonable damage output, Frenzy does neither. 

    the ability doesn’t correctly register and the reasons why can’t all be resolved realistically. 

    also, Frenzy doesn’t break blocks it bypasses them; there’s a significant difference. Breaking a block would see your opponent lose all of their block stamina; a bypass simply registers a hit through a block but your opponent can maintain their block afterward. 

  • I honestly agree. (By break blocks I meant bypass, that’s just the term I use)

    it could use some buffs, but when you have to carry 3 level 5 swingspammers as your tertiary main having a kilo constantly stopping you from regening gets annoying. 

    I know there I no actual parry mechanism, but that’s what the exploit system if called I guess. 

    It’s so busted that if someone swings once they can die.

    You can chain someone five times off of one swing, proven by myself.

    Frenzy is op against noobs/decent players (95% of the playerbase) and sucks against people who know parrying.

  • VetteC5RX's avatar
    VetteC5RX
    6 years ago

    @Frostwing2615 it wouldn’t be good gameplay balance to base ability stats on low level or noob players. 

    Better if we look at experienced players vs experienced players that gives us a more even field to gauge the abilities themselves. 

    I’ve been playing Kylo since day one and am a higher level with him and I base my testing on matches with other experienced players. A noob player won’t counter Frenzy like they could potentially do and should but a stronger player will. 

    Anything is technically OP against noobs so we can’t use that as a good basis. What I can tell you is that Frenzy is broken whereby it will not trigger when activated because the game can’t resolve the high movement with the small AOE; when it does happen to work the damage is so low that the risk of damage from counters is greater than the damage it “might” do. 

    Nothing in the game will effectively counter swing spammers, especially multiple ones .. at least buffing Frenzy will make the ability competitive.

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