Successor to the Xwing series?

The turning issue I'm guessing is because you're using a joystick? They dont work properly, use a pad you'll be a god 😉

Remember xwing alliance where the joystick worked 😉

Remember xwing in dos...where the joystick worked...

The technical issues are a separate thing I wont bang on about them again here and bore everyone 🙂

I appreciate that they've taken bits of the DNA of the old games, I like that there is power management and shield placement toggling, all good im not even really bothered that they've made them a bit simpler and dumbed them down somewhat. If anything I use them more on this than in xwing, on that you basically set the cannon to increased rate and rarely changed it during combat. Fly out of danger and recharging shields wasnt a quick thing on that.

Personally I'd have preferred a more expansive and engaging campaign. Whats all this nonsense inbetween missions...its a bit cringe. Tell me all about your past even though I never asked or cared.

That part feels like someones played wing commander...but in Wing Commander when you talk to people theres a point in there somewhere...like Dralthi always turn a certain direction. Not that this plastic Disney character never takes his helmet off. Meh maybe thats just an old man cynic view on that part 🙂

The budget and time that was spent on that part could have been used better elsewhere. How much is the mocap studio for a day ..

I imagine the people who made this would have loved to have made a more expansive game but their hands were tied quite firmly by the powers that be.

A 35 quid budget game with a focus on 5v5 one mode multiplayer from EA, dont worry I set my expectations realistically 😉

And actually the single player missions are a pleasant surprise, better than I thought they would be. Its fast and I can shoot Tie Fighters. Well...if you dont play it VR or a hi refresh monitor....

Its nice to see all the old XvT clans coming out of the woodwork, of course they would cause they think they're going to get a new xwing game with modern graphics and controls. Lets see how long they stick around 😉

But thats basically my point, this game is not comparable to the xwing series, but at the same time I never expected it to be but seems alot of other people are gushing over it. Gush over it cause its a fast paced star wars space shooter that you (maybe one day) can play in VR and its fun. Not cause its the spiritual successor to the xwing series.

@Savagebeasty I'm sorry you're having issues, as I said I play in VR and it's nearly perfect (Just the low res skybox that annoys me) and with a flight stick (A classic MS Sidewinder Forcefeedback 2 from the late 90s, which still works! Plus a second joystick next to it for more easily findable buttons) which works perfectly also. Maybe the bugs and issues you're having getting it to work is colouring your view, maybe you made your mind up that it was a battlefront 2 spin off and can't see the x-wing shining though. Maybe you just like a grumble (who doesn't). But all I can tell you is I'm not a fan boy, I can be highly critical of games and I had to give EA a suspension from the 10 year boycott I've had them under to get this game, but I'm loving this game precisely because of how much it reminds me of playing X-wing and Tie fighter. 

So for me, and lots of other people this absolutely is a successor to X-Wing, that's just the way it is. 

@Savagebeasty I can assure you I'm not lying, and don't blame me for EA. Like I said prior to Squadrons I'd not bought a game from them for 10 years. But just as I am prepared to punish companies for poor behaviours and products, I'm also prepare to reward them for good ones.

Sorry you don't like it. I hope you don't have to wait another 20 years for another star fighter game that might be more to your tastes.

Aha I'm not blaming you for EA that would be ridiculous. Im not blaming you for anything in fact 🙂

Im not even saying the game is rubbish no need to get offended for them. Didnt even say I didnt like it 🙂

Just saying its not xwing alliance.

Out of interest, what specs have you got and whats your headset if its working fine? Im not trying to catch you out or call you a liar, genuinely interested 🙂

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@JesuJuvaOU wrote:

Interesting thread. I think you overstate the case for their difference, but I want to understand what you are saying, because I am an old XWA player too and love the game. 

I never played Battlefront, so I can't make that comparison.

Here's what I know: I spent a great portion of my free time in college playing XvT and XWA. After that game faded away gradually (2004-2005 for me) I was not much of a "gamer" - with the exception of a recurring Civ4 addiction. When Star Citizen came around, I was excited for a "space combat sim," and I became a backer of the game. But *I never played.* Because it wasn't Star Wars. It just couldn't stir me out of my busy adult life.

But Squadrons *has* got me to play. That's why it is a "spiritual successor." It has got the Star Wars space sim community going again, guys who haven't done anything game-wise since XWA, guys like me who have to learn all about Steam and Discord and all this stuff that wasn't around or was in its infancy the last time we were active. And it is *enough* like X-wing, Tie Fighter, and XvT and XWA to keep me wanting to play repeatedly.

That said, I am frustrated with the differences too. I just don't see the same ones as you.

On *power management* - I don't see how you could say that the Xwing series were "sims," but Squadrons is *not* a sim. Power management in Squadrons is actually *more* complicated and intricate than in those older games. I think it's great. This is not a defining factor for me; either system is fine.

I see your point about infinite re-spawns. That's definitely an "arcadey" thing. But it seems a small detail. Like, it could easily be re-programmed on a particular map to not be that way, right? And are we sure the old Xwing and Tie Fighter games never had infinite respawns? It was a long time ago that I played through both games, so I don't recall clearly. I think there were many waves of fighters in some missions, but you could eventually kill them all.

My main problems, as someone who was great at XWA but is just trying to be average in Squadrons, are these:

1) First and foremost, it's too freaking hard to come out of a turn facing the right direction! There is consistent "over-steering" across all ships and control inputs, as far as I can tell, making the need to "counter-steer" whenever you want to come out of a sharp turn. It feels like they did this on purpose to make it harder to hone in and shoot people. Just very frustrating. I used to be a good shot, able to go *quickly* from evasive maneuvers, to aiming and shooting, back to evasive maneuvers. But that kind of precise piloting is just not possible in this game. I SO wish they would change this, or at least dial it down (cut the response time of all the ships to the act of putting your controller back to neutral).

That is really the #1 main problem, with all other things being just interesting changes. But there are some other improvements they could make as options which would help us old XvT / XWA players:

2) Too much crap on the maps. I want to just focus on my opponents and my teammates, not constantly worry about running into a wall. I realize a lot of players like this, so that's fine. But I would like to see a preference for "style of map" in the matchmaking process just like there is a preference for faction. They could make options (with better names than this) for "crowded," "medium," and "open" (deep space).

3) Private matches, or the ability to select our opponents in some way. I know a lot of people are talking about this.

4) Empire vs Empire or New Republic vs New Republic options. Yeah, I know it's not "realistic," but it's the way these games used to be played *online,* so it would be nice to have as an *option* for Squadrons. The culture of the XvT / XWA communities was to get everything the same between the opposing teams, to isolate skill vs. skill and see which competitor would prevail. It would be nice to be able to do that here.

Those are all of the things I see as realistic changes or additions for them to make.

The final main complaint that I and other old players have is not one I would ever expect them to change, just something that's very annoying: it's much harder to kill stuff, in general. I miss the days of being able to take out a TF with one well-placed double laser shot, or a T/I with one well-placed quad shot. Squadrons is way different, way tougher. I am willing to accept that, and get used to that, and adjust tactics for it. I would just have a way easier time making that adjustment if I could TURN and AIM properly (see #1 above).

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Agree to all points. I do think that #1 comes from the need to support gamepads though. The more inertia, the more control inputs are used at the extremes, and the more timing inputs is emphasized (say, the timing to countersteer). These are all things that favor the gamepad. The inertia and the always-on aim assist are for gamepads, and every control method is dragged down to their level. Also the tanky TIEs are a result of aim assist that completely negates their advantage of smaller profile. There's no "well-placed quad shots" anymore, because all of them are well-placed, and hitbox sizes are of zero concern.

So yeah it's unfortunate things evolved this way. But it's better than not having a game.

@Savagebeasty I'm running a RTX2070 super and old i7 with16gb ram. The headset is an original Vive. Bought the game from steam and play it with steamVR. The joystick as I said is a really old Sidewinder 2 which I have tested and the 1% deadzone set in game is what I'm getting, very slight movements are enough to make fine adjustments and it scales up to full speed turns smoothly across the joysticks travel.

You were a little rude though eh 😉 Not that I did take offence but a robust response was none the less what ya got, all in good humour of course.

@CoreBlueDaveThen I apologise profusely sir no rudeness intended 🙂

None of my grumpiness was directed at you I assure you, a poor choice of wording on my part.

Maybe the oldness of the joystick haa worked in your favour on this 🙂

Actually I do have an old Saitek kicking about somewhere I'll give it a go.

Well...all I can say regarding the VR is you are a very lucky guy, Im not jealous at all...honest 🙂

Hopefully tomorrows fix will sort all the issues and I'll stop being a grump 🙂