Re: Aim Assist improvements or Crossplay Bunk Netcode?

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@Adamonic wrote:
@Echo6EchoI don't think PC controller use w/ aim assist is that high, but you are correct, it is not necessarily console only. People just associate it with console.

Either way, it does seem a little OP where before it was not working correctly. If all you have to do is get near the target and it sticks to them while you press fire, we might as well make the game one shot kill with every weapon to even the playing field.

The video seems like an honest assessment of the feature right now and even that guy, who seems like a seasoned player, agrees that it is a little bit too strong.

 

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It doesn't and I don't think the video is showing that. Firstly as he says he's a skilled player(consistently topping scoreboards, 100 kill games, comp play. Basically a top 0.1%player)so using his gameplay to judge what you experience from the other side isn't exactly fair (including before this update if I remember correctly). All the aiming requires input, but there is definitely help now. I honestly don't know any console player who wants the AA being too strong and playing the game for you, and I don't think we are at that stage.

@A_al_K_pacino_A 

Honestly how can you say this when after 5min30 you have an example of aim assist going straight to an enemy the player can't even see yet? Or when you see the perfect tracking at the vidéo starting?

Yes the player is experimented but the same goes with M&K, have you ever seeen a beginer vs experienced player with M&K?

This is not a console vs pc problem it's a problem of adjusting the game.

M&k are precise tools but you have to use them with precision by yourself.

Controllers aren't precise tools, they are perfect for other games but relly aren't suitable for precise games like FPS... How to make those games available to controler users? The solution? Aim assist. We all agree this tool is needed  if you want to put players using M&K against controller users.

BUT the players in both scenarios should have to play the game by themselves.

You don't have this kind of tracking on targets you see at the begining of the vidéo with M&K... Yes the tool is more precise but nothing helps you to be precise. The balance is subtle i agree, but the vidéo shows how it can goes too far with aim assist.

I'm playing PC games since 20 years.

I'm far away from console vs Pc stupid warfare.

I state that problem comes from controller (can be used on pc) and M&K.

M&K are inconsistent in this game, bug fix is needed. While controllers can track lock on tragets even behind cover?

Some adjustments are needed both for M&K and controllers.

I prey for M&K debug in next patch... since game's launch, but concerning aim assist as it's the point here:

I would say that Dice pushed aim assist too far in previous patches to help controllers while it was bugged, go look back previous patch notes they pushed aim aisst before bug fixing it. Now they patched the aim assist and as it is no longer bugged it works... far too well.

Aim assist is working now, great! Now what we need are slight adjustments to make it works well.

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@l_Grand_Vizir_l wrote:

@A_al_K_pacino_A 

Honestly how can you say this when after 5min30 you have an example of aim assist going straight to an enemy the player can't even see yet?

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I'll just answer this bit because life's too short. What you are seeing is not quite what the player is experiencing. What you are seeing as some sort of auto -locking onto the player is more of a feeling as the assist comes into affect(Tbh this isn't easy to describe). The player turning is human input, and the player stopping on the enemy when they feel the assist is also human input. 

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@l_Grand_Vizir_l wrote:

Now they patched the aim assist and as it is no longer bugged it works... far too well.

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The aim assist today feels similar to what we've had since BF1. In BF2042 aim assist has gone from broken to something resembling 'normal'.

What we have now has been the standard for at least the past six years (can't remember BF4 well enough to comment).  Whether you realized it or not PC players have been playing against this level of aim assist since BF1. I say this as someone who played BF1 on console,  on PC w/KBM and on PC w/controller w/aim assist.

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@A_al_K_pacino_A wrote:

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@l_Grand_Vizir_l wrote:

@A_al_K_pacino_A 

Honestly how can you say this when after 5min30 you have an example of aim assist going straight to an enemy the player can't even see yet?

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I'll just answer this bit because life's too short. What you are seeing is not quite what the player is experiencing.

It is tho, the number of time a console player just tracks me through a smoke or a bush I can't see through is too damn high

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

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@A_al_K_pacino_A wrote:

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@l_Grand_Vizir_l wrote:

@A_al_K_pacino_A 

Honestly how can you say this when after 5min30 you have an example of aim assist going straight to an enemy the player can't even see yet?

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I'll just answer this bit because life's too short. What you are seeing is not quite what the player is experiencing.

It is tho, the number of time a console player just tracks me through a smoke or a bush I can't see through is too damn high

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Any videos of aim assist tracking through smoke/bushes?  

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@AngrySquid270 wrote:

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

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@A_al_K_pacino_A wrote:

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@l_Grand_Vizir_l wrote:

@A_al_K_pacino_A 

Honestly how can you say this when after 5min30 you have an example of aim assist going straight to an enemy the player can't even see yet?

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I'll just answer this bit because life's too short. What you are seeing is not quite what the player is experiencing.

It is tho, the number of time a console player just tracks me through a smoke or a bush I can't see through is too damn high

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Any videos of aim assist tracking through smoke/bushes?  

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I don't record my gameplay but the way I think it works is if he sees you going into the smoke the aim assits locks on to what ever you're doing

@InS_Hypno 

In my experience aim assist switches off when there is smoke around - even when I can still make out a siloutte.  Any controller user who played Op underground in BFV can probably attest to the fact that aim assist isn't handing out any blind kills through smoke.

Smoke behavior seems similar in BF2042, but will pay more attention next time I'm in that situation.

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@AngrySquid270 wrote:

@InS_Hypno 

In my experience aim assist switches off when there is smoke around - even when I can still make out a siloutte.  Any controller user who played Op underground in BFV can probably attest to the fact that aim assist isn't handing out any blind kills through smoke.

Smoke behavior seems similar in BF2042, but will pay more attention next time I'm in that situation.

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I think everyone will agree that how it was in bfv doesn't matter since they seem to handle inputs/aim assits differently in this game

@Adamonic 

How are you so sure?  Is your position based purely from being on the receiving end?  

What is your experience with aim assist from the giving end?

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@AngrySquid270 wrote:

@Adamonic 

How are you so sure?  Is your position based purely from being on the receiving end?  

What is your experience with aim assist from the giving end?

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there's literally evidence of it locking through the ground on someone is it really hard to believe it sometimes tracks through smokes lol

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

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I think everyone will agree that how it was in bfv doesn't matter since they seem to handle inputs/aim assits differently in this game

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I don't know about that.  Aim assist currently feels pretty close to what we had in BFV and BF1. That observation seems to be supported by the DICE Dev comments from SMK's video.

How much BF1/BFV did you play on console?  You seem to be taking the position that BF2042 aim assist is significantly better than what we had in BFV. What are you basing that position on?

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

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@AngrySquid270 wrote:

@Adamonic 

How are you so sure?  Is your position based purely from being on the receiving end?  

What is your experience with aim assist from the giving end?

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there's literally evidence of it locking through the ground on someone is it really hard to believe it sometimes tracks through smokes lol

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This reminds me of something pretty irritating and I think broken as this...on Exposure if you toss a pokey ball in by B on CQ, it will pick up players that are all the way on top by A...you start running around looking and they aren't there. Same kind of thing?

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

 

there's literally evidence of it locking through the ground on someone is it really hard to believe it sometimes tracks through smokes lol

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Certainly not impossible, but a few thousand hours of playing with aim assist in Battlefield games puts me in a pretty informed position on understanding the advantages and limitations of aim assist.

I don't claim to have a perfect understanding and am open to new information that may improve my understanding.

I'm just not ready to make the jump to the conclusion that aim assist sees through everything based on just SMK's video. Too much personal experience tells me it doesn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5F-qVP62uA&ab_channel=TheHypnotoad

Took me literally a single sector to get something ridiculous to happen

This is only gonna get worse as the devs keep buffing the aim assist

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5F-qVP62uA&ab_channel=TheHypnotoad

Took me literally a single sector to get something ridiculous to happen

This is only gonna get worse as the devs keep buffing the aim assist

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It kind of looks like an enemy Paik might have been scanning the area. When a Paik 3D scans someone with her wallhack does everyone on her team see the wallhack too, or just her? Because it looks like a Rao killed you so I'm wondering if he could see you through the smoke using Paik's wallhack scan.

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@OskooI_007 wrote:

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@InS_Hypno wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5F-qVP62uA&ab_channel=TheHypnotoad

Took me literally a single sector to get something ridiculous to happen

This is only gonna get worse as the devs keep buffing the aim assist

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It kind of looks like an enemy Paik might have been scanning the area. When a Paik 3D scans someone with her wallhack does everyone on her team see the wallhack too, or just her? Because it looks like a Rao killed you so I'm wondering if he could see you through the smoke using Paik's wallhack scan.

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Only Paik sees the wallhack outline. But, friendlies will see them 3d spotted. Friendlies also benefit from her threat perception trait and will see 3d spot of the enemy if they are damaging her.

@DigitalHype So red doritos above enemies is what Paik's teammates see. 2042 is still missing stealth heros to counter all this stuff. It would be nice if Rao could launch an area effect hack to counter Paik's area effect wallhack, lol.

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@OskooI_007 wrote:

@DigitalHype So red doritos above enemies is what Paik's teammates see. 2042 is still missing stealth heros to counter all this stuff. It would be nice if Rao could launch an area effect hack to counter Paik's area effect wallhack, lol.

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Whoever thought I was going for the revive I wasn't and the smoke wasn't even on the body

No the dorito is blocked by the smoke

If I'm 3D spotted why aren't the other people behind the smoke shooting at me?

What I think happened is exactly what I described in my earlier, the Rao saw me on the right side of the rock and tries to shoot at me and misses,I put the smoke between me and him, he re-adjust the aim assist locks in and tracks me through the smoke

Out of curiosity I Iooked up some of my accuracy stats for comparison between BF1, BFV and BF2042 (I use controller+aim assist).  I'll acknowledge this is just a few data points that could be explained by reasons other than, or in addition to, aim assist performance.

I share this to try and provide an objective indicator on where we were at with aim assist in BF2042 prior to 1.2.  

Spammy high RPM semi-auto:

1903X (BF1) = 34%

P08 (BFV) = 35.4%

VCAR (BF2042) = 28.9%

Semi-auto rifle:

Seb 1916 (BF1) = 40%

Seb 1916 (BFV) = 45.5%

DM7 (BF2042) = 32.3%

Big mag LMG:

Lewis (BF1) = 23%

Lewis (BFV) = 24.6%

LCMG (BF2042) = 17.4%

You can dismiss these numbers for a variety of reasons, but I feel the story that these numbers tell aligns with my in-game experience - aim assist in BF2042 was broken prior to 1.2 and landing shots was much harder than what I was used to in past BF games.

Starting with 1.2 I began using the SVK in 2042.  My numbers on the SVK should be purely from the new aim assist. Accuracy so far is 43% which makes it on par with my performance using similar guns (Seb 1916) in past titles.  Again, these numbers align with my in-game experience - post 1.2 the aim assist feels much closer to what I recall from past BF games.

Now PC players will likely still object to the effectiveness of aim assist in BF2042, but I hope when you do so you keep in mind that this level of aim assist has been the standard for the past few BF titles.  I've also taken screen shots of my BF2042 gun stats, if my accuracy numbers begin climbing higher than what I saw in past BF games I'll happily eat my words on this.