Forum Discussion
But Falk and Angel are both " Medic/support " so are both in the same branch and its fine to me .. Of course Angel can be considered better by some but Angel cannot heal himself with the Injector unless he trade his gadjet for a injector .. So yeah but you would argue on pure non sens ..
As for Who gets what gadjets .. Ive already asked Dice to improove this by making an Icon over peoples heads to show wich gadjets they are using ... But knowing who have amo crates or who have repair tool if you have played previous BF games and are honest you already know you could stand in front of a support screaming " I NEED AMO " to have them never give amo .. As for 2042 even if you know they have amo they might be on cool down or might not want to give you amo .. Thats the thing and the classes system never helped with that it only made it more frustrating ..
Thats said at least in BF2042 when you have health or Amo or whatever you can see who needs amo or who needs health so if you are a team players you will give them amo or health .. But it happen to me so many time already where i drop a health box on someones to help them and they run away from my health box and never take health from it lol So there is no garantee with you play with clueless blueberry .. It was true in past BF all of them and still is true in 2042 ..
The specialist system is AMASING for squads who are willing to play as a units , and if we had better platoon and squads structure and communication we could do amasing things with the specialist system ..
There is a lots of good teamplay combo .. like Locking on air vehicles combine with RAO hacking wich is insanely powerfull if used with the proper timing and communication .. Dozer can also be usefull to push elevator and corridor and his passive resistance to explosive help a lots .. Mckay and Sundance are amasing to flank Lanes campers .. Irish double walls can be used in many usefull manners . BOris turrets is great to spot or distract ennemys . and so on and on
As for loadout its way better the way it is .. MAG had a skilltrees system that can be compared to the " specialist " wich were active passive abilitys then the loadout was freeform just like BF now and the teamplay in MAG was a billions time better than it as ever been in ANY BF ever even BF2 wich was the best BF with the commander in terms of structure but was still chaotics .. WHY ?
Because MAG had a proper team structure .. An Officier in charge wich could broadcast to the entire team and not any Newbee could be OIC or platoon leader .. you had platoon leader who could speak to his 4 squads leaders but also broadcast to his entire platoon then you had squad leaders who could speak to others squad leaders and squad mates 8 players per squads 32 players platoon 128 players team .. 256 players match .. And we had engineers repairing bunkers , AA turrets , Arttilery battery , vehicles and so on . We had tons of medics . we had tons of demolitions who destroyed ennemy bunkers , we had everything that we needed without any rigid classes system because we could have 32 players lobby to get into 128 to 256 players games .. MAG also had proximity chat with team mates
BF need that at least 16 players lobby composed of 4 players squads ... so 16 players would be a " platoon " we need VOIP proximity chat with allies . We need Better squads and platoon and team structure its the only thing that would improove TEAM LEVEL team work ..not terrible classes system that made no sens like previous BF games ..
On a Squad level of friends the current 2042 system is better than any previous BF and allow more variety , more synergy in the squads , better mix and match of classes and gadjets and better controle on what the squads is meant to achieved .. there is no denial in that and none of your anecdotes would change that !
@Stew360okay step by step again then....
1."Wrong Angel can only revive faster . Angel cannot heal team mates at range and angel give 20% amor on revives so the player will gets 70HP being revive with angel and 120 later on if not shooted on .. And would get 100% HP right away being revived with Falk so in the heat of a battle being revived by Falk is better and being far from heavy combat being revived by angel is better"
- true Angel can not "heal at range", but the old medic class could do that. making falk the clostest thing we have to a classic class-set-up.... funny how that works out now don't you think?
2."But Falk and Angel are both " Medic/support " so are both in the same branch and its fine to me .. Of course Angel can be considered better by some but Angel cannot heal himself with the Injector unless he trade his gadjet for a injector .. So yeah but you would argue on pure non sens"
- the issue remains that Angel does nto need a different specialists, he can heal himslef with the med-bag/pen, he can rearm and replate himselfe and if he needs a mroe explosive approach he can just call in crate and switch... how do you synergise with that?
3."As for Who gets what gadjets .. Ive already asked Dice to improove this by making an Icon over peoples heads to show wich gadjets they are using"
- if that is the case then everything must be fine now.....
4."But knowing who have amo crates or who have repair tool if you have played previous BF games and are honest you already know you could stand in front of a support screaming " I NEED AMO " to have them never give amo .. As for 2042 even if you know they have amo they might be on cool down or might not want to give you amo .. Thats the thing and the classes system never helped with that it only made it more frustrating "
- true, but Visceral games fixed that issue in BF-Hardline. they impelmented the system in which you could just pick the ammo/health off from anyone using the according box of the players directly. DICE then copied that system in BFV... 2042 does not have this system.....
4."Thats said at least in BF2042 when you have health or Amo or whatever you can see who needs amo or who needs health so if you are a team players you will give them amo or health"
- yes if i teamplay i can do that, how does that help me if i am in need of supplies myself? i can not even begin to guess who can give me what in my squad or clsoe area, unless i find a Falk player or Angel player and they then do what they need to to help me. Funny how these two are again the clostest we have currently to a classic class set up isn't it.....
5."The specialist system is AMASING for squads who are willing to play as a units "
- oh you mean how classes have been since the dawn oh BF1942? an organised squad can always make the best out of what is given but most players do not play in organised squad, so they get the worst of it more often then not...
6."There is a lots of good teamplay combo .. like Locking on air vehicles combine with RAO hacking wich is insanely powerfull if used with the proper timing and communication .. Dozer can also be usefull to push elevator and corridor and his passive resistance to explosive help a lots .. Mckay and Sundance are amasing to flank Lanes campers .. Irish double walls can be used in many usefull manners . BOris turrets is great to spot or distract ennemys . and so on and on"
- true, but like i said before classes in essence did the same, only difference was he did not really hava a hacking gadget since BF2142s engineer class, that could hack ground vehicles and force the users out of said vehicle. While Mckay and Sundance are better at flanking, they are still more or less selfish at it and rather cheap i might add since both make the flow of the game go out the window for anyone else. Dozer is rather one dimensional and i do nto remember anyone beign very fond of any shield in any BF game ever, so take it as you want. Irishs barricade is also rather minute i find the "thropy system" much more interesting since it does combat some grenade and rocket fire coming in for and take some heat off the area, but again his passive could've just as well be a simple gadget. fpr example an engineer class... but hey details. as for Boris, i persoanlly find the idea of automated turrets that then spot you and keep you 3D spotted and outilne spotted trough walls, essentailly a wall-hack, downright insulting. but DICE does as DICE does..... looking at you Paik.
7."As for loadout its way better the way it is"
- the issue is in any other BF game until BFV you were able to * any situation and get a general idea of what you are facing and plan accordingly. BFV and 2042 have tossed out any semblance of this out the window, the latter even more then the former. in 2042 i can only guess/hope to see the outilne of the weapon the enemy is using. as for what gadet they might have i know nothing. are they healing themselves again with a med-bag/pen? are they aiming a rocket at me to finish me off? are they placing beacons i have to search for?... again organised chaos vs. pure chaos there is a difference.
8."MAG had a skilltrees system that can be compared to the " specialist " wich were active passive abilitys then the loadout was freeform just like BF now and the teamplay in MAG was a billions time better than it as ever been in ANY BF ever even BF2 wich was the best BF with the commander in terms of structure but was still chaotics "
- Hell Let Loose has a class-system with teamplay deeply engrained into it, you are comparing apples and pears. 2042 takes a gadget slot away from the player. in BF4 for example the support could use the ammo-box and C4 to really help clearing out tanks or areas. in 2042 i must pick Angel to get the same uttility, given i can pick any primary weapon now but that opens a new can of worms. (weapon balance becoames very very difficult then..... either play the META or get played by the META)
9."Because MAG had a proper team structure .. An Officier in charge wich could broadcast to the entire team and not any Newbee could be OIC or platoon leader .. you had platoon leader who could speak to his 4 squads leaders but also broadcast to his entire platoon then you had squad leaders who could speak to others squad leaders and squad mates 8 players per squads 32 players platoon 128 players team .. 256 players match .. And we had engineers repairing bunkers , AA turrets , Arttilery battery , vehicles and so on . We had tons of medics . we had tons of demolitions who destroyed ennemy bunkers , we had everything that we needed without any rigid classes system because we could have 32 players lobby to get into 128 to 256 players games .. MAG also had proximity chat with team mates"
- again different games have different design choices, 2042 just took the worst idea in my opinion and ran with it. games like Hell Let Loose are using classes, in fact i think most casual games in the niche are using classes for ease of use and readibility.
10."On a Squad level of friends the current 2042 system is better than any previous BF and allow more variety , more synergy in the squads , better mix and match of classes and gadjets and better controle on what the squads is meant to achieved .. there is no denial in that and none of your anecdotes would change that "
- i do agree, better/bigger squad systems could help with improving some issues but for the most part the issue remains. in any previous BF game i could tell at a glance what my squad needs. 2 medics already in it? okay so i will pick support to resupply them, or engineer to help fight away tanks, or recon to spot for them. in 2042 all i can see i stheir specialists with no clue in the world of what they might need. is that Sundance using the inerstion beacon? should i spawn on her and place it or does she need supplies ? should i pick the M5 to help combat the inevitable vehicles? what about the McKay swinging up the building, does he need healing or does he use the med-bag/pen? ammo or armor? what about the 4 caspers over on the map-border?
2042 has not really improved much with specialist. in fact any "passive" ability they have could just as well have been a gadget and it would not have made any difference. what you also seem to have forgotten is teh fact 2042 takes one gadget slot away from you, unlike any BF game since BF3 where you had 2 slots to pick and choose from a class-specific selection.....
but hey details
- 4 years ago@X-Sunslayer-X Quote : " oh you mean how classes have been since the dawn oh BF1942? an organised squad can always make the best out of what is given but most players do not play in organised squad, so they get the worst of it more often then not..."
Actually while indeed organised team made the best out of what they can traditional classes were a pain in so many ways comppare to the new system where we have more granular control over our setup for the squad and we can be morre efficient in the way our goals are set to . - X-Sunslayer-X4 years agoSeasoned Ace@Stew360 i what way were you more limited? the weapon selection? the gadget selection?
was it that horrible for you to pick a different class inbetween respawns?
every single specialists ability is basically a gadget, only instead of giving you two slots to use in your selection, now they take away options from you.... - 4 years ago
I want to play Battlefield,not some half-assed cod/apex wanna be game. If EA is trying to get more people on board, its not through some half-assed cod/apex wanna be game. People play those games do their thing,and they do it well. Battlefield needs to do its thing and not try to be something its not
- 4 years ago@X-Sunslayer-X Basically everything , specialist offer new gameplay oportunity and passive skills while specialist gadjet is tied to the specialist it kinda act as a class that have a passive . I like that the second gadjet is free to choose among a variety of usefull things depending on squads missions / goals .
Weapon limitations was the worst of it all because it hurted how poeoples choose or play . Those pretending specialist encourage solo play do not play with squads for sure and ate projecting what they want to see rather than whats happening .. Classes system as never ever promoted teamplay . The only thing that promote teamplay is communications , team structure and organization as well as common goals . BF has forever missed the mark on this . 4 to 5 players squads only dont help . The only time ive experienced true teamwork in BF was playing Scrim in 16 vs 16 match where 100% of both teams are clan mates and shared a teamspeak/ ventrillo back then now replaced by discord - 4 years ago@Stew360 You say: " The only thing that promote teamplay is communications , team structure and organization as well as common goals . BF has forever missed the mark on this ."
But this game has NO VOIP, NO squad managment! Then it's stupid to have specialist which rely on exactly this. I and several other experience the opposite of what you experience. Because of the lack of communications, it's would be easier to get good teamwork by having different designated certain roles. A game should not rely on 3rd party software as teamspeak/ventrilo/discord.
Maybe a commander would do the trick, designating orders. - 4 years ago
Meh I'm with the OG classes, haven't seen anything ground breaking or game enhancing that the old class system didn't cover! Think matey is in the minority!
- 4 years ago@Zoikon And its a issue they need to resolve and update . We need stats , we need VOIP with need bigger squad even 16 player " platoon " lobby so we can match up and communicate with 16 players of our clans or friends at least . We need squad and platoon structure and team structure .. when that is in the game will be in good shape
- X-Sunslayer-X4 years agoSeasoned Ace@Stew360 okay, but you do see the simple flaw in your argumentation?
you said that players chose classes based on their weaponry instead of what their class-role was supposed to be.
but the specialist system does not fix this issue, in fact in my opinion it is made worse. in BFV for example if i saw a a scope-glint i new what to expect from this player in terms of his TTK, movement speed and gadget selection. in 2042 i have to guess what specialist it is, is a Sundance with her grenades and wingsuit? is it a McKay that will out ADAD-spam any wellaimed shots ?
all this opening up of player choice trough the removal of load-out limitation has acomplished is that any semblence of readibility has been tossed out the window for the sake of an unpopular change.
and even thinking about comparing R6S and BF as you do in a different post is beyond redundant...
R6S has even strikter limitations in fact. since the operators have only 2 options per slot....