Why can't Ryder be actually mean?

But that's not really true. There may be single isolated instances but in general you can have a pretty antagonistic rapport with both Addison and Tann. My male Ryder tells them off at every conversation.

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For example...

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And yet, in your example the results are essentially the same.

What I would expect is a retorting option, mean as it may, that had the opposite result, going your own way or not accepting doing whatever was thrown at you. However, that said, plot-tied choices would be murky doing that way, they would have to limit effects to a single one, only adopting harsh language.

All in all, I'm not really bothered by the current situation. My mood and normal social goodness of heart is much akin to that of the Ryders. I would probably wander about doing mostly the same things, helping as much as I could.

Think there is a difference between being a Good Paragon character and a floor mat that's being trampled on.  I would very much love to help everyone and be generally nice, that's has been my play style as well, however standing up for oneself doesnt equate being a bad person.  Not standing up for oneself and one's father who gave his life to save yours is basically being a wuss.  Whilst I can understand a teenager getting a talking down to and not being able to defend himself, I cannot comprehend a Pathfinder, someone that stand up to kett armies being a floor mat walked upon by people like addison, "the angry woman" and some others(depending on your choices at the end of the game).
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That would require a better writing, I think, follow up conversations. There's a slot there to be used, actually. Although you can flirt with some characters, other characters that usually bicker or are harsh with you could also trigger an anti-flirting/snapping/retorting remark then. It wouldn't change the real result of your conversation, but only make it so you don't feel like accepting every hormonal tantrum crossing your path, even make that NPC less inclined to bash/talk to you.

Yeah it would be nice to * slap a few politicians on the nexus once in a while

What you gotta understand though is the background of the characters, they grew up to 2 extremely intelligent parents, then they had active scientific/military careers.  These Ryder twins have probably known some semblance of professionalism since they were younger.  They also have a much more solidified background than Shepard did.  Shepard was a true RPing character, who you could shape his history, and then determine his personality based on that.  We had alot more flexibility with Shep because his background wasn't tied to specifics.  

I think too the screening process for the Initiative was probably good enough to weed out radical thinker (Minor Spoiler: In background banter later in the game, they discuss the screening process and how they can't understand why the scavs and Raiders are all so messed up.  That also gets partially explained..).  By all rights, everybody on the Arks were supposed to stand up citizens.  Maybe not necessary nice, but professional.

Still, the more time you spend with Ryder - the more you will pick up on the subtle insults and sarcasm they use.  There are more obvious occasions too, like landing on Voeld, you ask Kallo if he wants you to get out and push.  To me that moment seemed like unnecessary sarcasm, and while not overly mean. it did highlight that the Ryders can make snide remarks.  

Alot of the characters are very tame when you think about it.  Drack is another one - he is still Krogan at heart, but he's alot more understanding and intelligent seeming than Krogans were in the original trilogy.  Again, could be the screening process - don't really know - but he isn't ready to kill everybody for everything like Wrex was lol.  

I actually like things this way - one thing I especially like now is no dumb trophies for beating the game on Paragon/Renegade.  I always hated that because, as a trophy hunter, it took away the ability to shape the character in any other way than bad or good.  With Ryder I can pick all across the wheel, and there will be no real consequences.  My first Ryder had a pretty fair split in all 4 dialogue categories - this time around I'm trying to do an 'all professional' run.   

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@lagruej wrote:

What you gotta understand though is the background of the characters, they grew up to 2 extremely intelligent parents, then they had active scientific/military careers.  These Ryder twins have probably known some semblance of professionalism since they were younger.  They also have a much more solidified background than Shepard did.  Shepard was a true RPing character, who you could shape his history, and then determine his personality based on that.  We had alot more flexibility with Shep because his background wasn't tied to specifics.  

I think too the screening process for the Initiative was probably good enough to weed out radical thinker (Minor Spoiler: In background banter later in the game, they discuss the screening process and how they can't understand why the scavs and Raiders are all so messed up.  That also gets partially explained..).  By all rights, everybody on the Arks were supposed to stand up citizens.  Maybe not necessary nice, but professional.

Still, the more time you spend with Ryder - the more you will pick up on the subtle insults and sarcasm they use.  There are more obvious occasions too, like landing on Voeld, you ask Kallo if he wants you to get out and push.  To me that moment seemed like unnecessary sarcasm, and while not overly mean. it did highlight that the Ryders can make snide remarks.  

Alot of the characters are very tame when you think about it.  Drack is another one - he is still Krogan at heart, but he's alot more understanding and intelligent seeming than Krogans were in the original trilogy.  Again, could be the screening process - don't really know - but he isn't ready to kill everybody for everything like Wrex was lol.  

I actually like things this way - one thing I especially like now is no dumb trophies for beating the game on Paragon/Renegade.  I always hated that because, as a trophy hunter, it took away the ability to shape the character in any other way than bad or good.  With Ryder I can pick all across the wheel, and there will be no real consequences.  My first Ryder had a pretty fair split in all 4 dialogue categories - this time around I'm trying to do an 'all professional' run.   

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This is me too. I actually like having the freedom to choose all the options on the wheel without taking a paragon or renegade hit.

My Ryder turned around and killed the kett after saving all of the angara for example, even though she isn't normally prone to such rash resoonses it allowed me to have the trauma of what she saw there, affect her decision at the time. Now that's true role playing. Previously I wouldn't have done it and taken the renegade hit becauae it might hurt paragon points and stop you talking someone down later.

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@lagruej wrote:

What you gotta understand though is the background of the characters, they grew up to 2 extremely intelligent parents, then they had active scientific/military careers.  These Ryder twins have probably known some semblance of professionalism since they were younger.  They also have a much more solidified background than Shepard did.  Shepard was a true RPing character, who you could shape his history, and then determine his personality based on that.  We had alot more flexibility with Shep because his background wasn't tied to specifics.  

Well you are right 2 out of 3 times, depending on what you chose as Shepard's background.  Earthborn,  Colonist or Spacer.  Think the Spacer one, Shepard's mother was a captain of an Alliance Ship and eventually promoted to Rear Admiral in ME3.  

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@VladVonCastein wrote:

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@lagruej wrote:

What you gotta understand though is the background of the characters, they grew up to 2 extremely intelligent parents, then they had active scientific/military careers.  These Ryder twins have probably known some semblance of professionalism since they were younger.  They also have a much more solidified background than Shepard did.  Shepard was a true RPing character, who you could shape his history, and then determine his personality based on that.  We had alot more flexibility with Shep because his background wasn't tied to specifics.  

Well you are right 2 out of 3 times, depending on what you chose as Shepard's background.  Earthborn,  Colonist or Spacer.  Think the Spacer one, Shepard's mother was a captain of an Alliance Ship and eventually promoted to Rear Admiral in ME3.  

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With all the extra auto dialogue in Andromeda for Ryder I think it would have been too hard to make a ruthless Ryder. Otherwise one min she would be patting the crew on the backs saying good job, the next in their faces. It wouldn't work out.

I personally prefer all of the extra during mission dialogue and banter from Ryder with the crew, if that means slightly less options on our chars overall personality its a hit worth taking.

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@lagruej wrote:

What you gotta understand though is the background of the characters, they grew up to 2 extremely intelligent parents, then they had active scientific/military careers.  These Ryder twins have probably known some semblance of professionalism since they were younger.  They also have a much more solidified background than Shepard did.  Shepard was a true RPing character, who you could shape his history, and then determine his personality based on that.  We had alot more flexibility with Shep because his background wasn't tied to specifics.  

I think too the screening process for the Initiative was probably good enough to weed out radical thinker (Minor Spoiler: In background banter later in the game, they discuss the screening process and how they can't understand why the scavs and Raiders are all so messed up.  That also gets partially explained..).  By all rights, everybody on the Arks were supposed to stand up citizens.  Maybe not necessary nice, but professional.

Still, the more time you spend with Ryder - the more you will pick up on the subtle insults and sarcasm they use.  There are more obvious occasions too, like landing on Voeld, you ask Kallo if he wants you to get out and push.  To me that moment seemed like unnecessary sarcasm, and while not overly mean. it did highlight that the Ryders can make snide remarks.  

Alot of the characters are very tame when you think about it.  Drack is another one - he is still Krogan at heart, but he's alot more understanding and intelligent seeming than Krogans were in the original trilogy.  Again, could be the screening process - don't really know - but he isn't ready to kill everybody for everything like Wrex was lol.  

I actually like things this way - one thing I especially like now is no dumb trophies for beating the game on Paragon/Renegade.  I always hated that because, as a trophy hunter, it took away the ability to shape the character in any other way than bad or good.  With Ryder I can pick all across the wheel, and there will be no real consequences.  My first Ryder had a pretty fair split in all 4 dialogue categories - this time around I'm trying to do an 'all professional' run.   

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Alec basically grandfathered his family into the Initiative, and based on some of the story/dialogue they received next to none of the training and screening the other candidates supposedly received.

I would also like the idea of a conversation option to tear a strip off someone's hide if they deserve it, plus more impulse actions are always fun