Will not purchase next year...
To whom it may concern, I have owned every NHL games since NHL 94 and I actually even had NHLPA 93 before the rights to players association and were acquired and NHL 23 will be my last one. I have ...
Forum Discussion
@frenchie5280 Yeah, HUT challenges are boring and career mode in 2K is at least 30 year ahead of anything EA is doing.. a new story every year, last gen and new gen even have different worlds (at least last year they did, only know ps5 this year) full voice acting, walk around the arena and the whole city. I have no idea how the 2k devs do it. The game is actually unreal. The fact I can just see other real life people playing on the blacktop while I walk into the store to buy clothes??? Meanwhile, in NHL we hope to get into a lobby together then hope we all make it into the game together. Character creation and the rpg elements in 2k are a ton of fun. I hate the NBA but the 2K game is so good and so far ahead.every year 2k updates how players create their players and the boosts and changes to balance and builds. Playing career games are a ton of fun and so much going on between games. NHL just feels like an unfun grind.. and a grind to get the same stuff unlocked that I've unlocked the last 5 years.. fun.. they also completely patch/ fix and may QOL changes every year. I dunno if their devs are just much better or their direction/ business strategy is better? It's just unreal to me how far ahead 2K is.. look at the trailer for an nhl game from 10 years ago and the latest one. Then look at a trailer for NBA 2k from 10 years ago and one from now.. the game is SO deep. There is SO much to do.. I get there is only 1 year between games but maybe EA needs to hire more devs and one team starts making updates that may not go into the game for 2-3 years so they don't feel rushed? Idk.. it's just sad how far behind this has gotten. Years ago this series was thought to be ahead of a lot of other sports titles.
The one thing that helps 2k is the esports league that generates millions in revenue which the NBA sponsors and players can be drafted and be paid to play wich often adds to the number of people who buy the guy and play regularly something NHL games desperately needs
- @frenchie5280 Some of the NHL teams actually do some sponsored esport events. Most notably the Columbus Blue Jackets are probably the most into it. But for something like what 2K has the NHL would need to get on board with EA for something like that. The 6s community would instantly turn way more competitive.
@KlariskraysNHL wrote:
@frenchie5280Some of the NHL teams actually do some sponsored esport events. Most notably the Columbus Blue Jackets are probably the most into it. But for something like what 2K has the NHL would need to get on board with EA for something like that. The 6s community would instantly turn way more competitive.I find the current landscape very "clique-y".
An official path to gaining a spot on an esports team would be awesome. Right now, you have to buddy-up with whoever 'runs' these teams to try and crack a roster spot, which is typically impossible unless you're personally known.
It would be cool if people were put in place to manage a team much like in real life with coaches holding try-outs, maybe even a draft, etc.
- @frenchie5280 I respectfully disagree. The NBA 2k e-sports league is a relatively new thing and I feel like pointing to an e-sports league (an industry which is actually in DECLINE) as the "one thing" (I know you didn't mean that literally but you're saying it's the most IMPORTANT thing) that helps 2k is short-sighted and incorrect.
The "one thing" (if you want to boil it down) that makes 2k so much BETTER than Chel is the fact that Take Two is willing to invest so much money/resources into it because so many people play it BECAUSE basketball is an infinitely more popular sport than hockey.
2k is miles ahead of the NHL series but that's to be expected... Basketball is a WILDLY more popular sport than hockey and this means the number of fans of the sport is much higher which in turn means the number of gamers willing to buy the sport's game-version is much higher, right? In turn, this allows for 2k to allocate more resources( i.e. DEVS) to the yearly project which results in the product you're raving about.
NHL will quite literally NEVER be on par (or even close) with NBA 2k. It's just a fact of life. Reality, if you will.
Another thing that should be noted is that it isn't "easy" to add a fully voiced, fully acted, fully animated career mode to ANY game. It's basically the equivalent of building a game within your game. I'm not saying that means it shouldn't be done, so don't get me wrong... but saying things like "It would be so easy to just do X thing," shows in ignorance in regards to software development.
Again, just because something is hard/labor-intensive doesn't mean it shouldn't be done... it just means sacrifices would have to be made in other areas to re-allocate those resources. The bottom line is this: In order for EA NHL to become the game we all want it to be, the sport of hockey would have to SOAR in terms in popularity, become a world-wide phenomenon, and become something that most sports fans are interested in. That's never going to happen.
- @NeonSkyline21 I agree we can't expect NHL to be on par with 2K.. I don't need a whole city to walk around.. a small block would be cool, again not needed. Voiced characters wouldn't be hard NHL BAP starts with that.
My problem is that NHL is at keast 30 years behind. It's one thing to not be on par.. it's another to be MILES behind. The fact these games are made in the same year and at the same price is insane. I also think FAR more people would buy if they improved the game (not to 2k levels)
It's too easy to give them the pass and say they don't have the resources.. resources for what? Look at the list of things they added last year and the year before that. Do you think their budget is so small that that's all they can do? No matter how you dice it they're not doing enough. It's extremely frustrating. There are some devs of games that LOVE their own games, are always asking the opinions of their fans and trying to make a game everyone loves as well. EA Vancouver hides behind a wall, we dunno what they're working on, what direction they're going in, who they're taking idea ls from, if they read these forums. We just wait until just before release to hear the few things they changed.. then we write pages upon pages of bugs and we all stand around doing rain dances hoping the next game fixes probs, improves the game more, fixes bugs and every year it's the same.
Does anyone get the feeling the devs/ management at top cares about this game or making a quality game? I'm really wondering.. the fact we have the same bugs every year makes me think they don't care, they likely don't even play it.. If I made a game that I loved and played it, I would at least have some common bugs fixed after a year.
@rsandersr47 wrote:
Does anyone get the feeling the devs/ management at top cares about this game or making a quality game? I'm really wondering.. the fact we have the same bugs every year makes me think they don't care, they likely don't even play it.. If I made a game that I loved and played it, I would at least have some common bugs fixed after a year.My opinion is that those in positions to direct massive, fundamental changes to gameplay, modes etc. are not willing to take that risk and/or they don't feel supported from the people above THEM to take those risks. They may also feel shorthanded with such a small development team. Deciding to take a risk on a big change to any given mode comes with so much anxiety at effecting the bottom line - they give into complacency in an effort to ensure just enough things change so that the game can be marketed with 'new' features, and the ROI is .025% higher than previous years.
The loss of Ben Ross (and the loss of Geoff Harrower, who developed big things for the motion engine in NHL/UFC) does not bode well for either series. Although it might be refreshing to get some new blood under the hood of these things, the fact that these two left EA (and now Brian Hayes as well) sets of alarm bells that maybe there is a lack of vision coming from the top and a lack of trust in the truly creative people within their development teams.
That said, executives at EA need to take a long, hard look at the NHL series and its current stalemate when it comes to modes, features and being compared to other games such as MLB The Show and NBA2K. What really grinds me as a fan of sports games is the drumbeat of microtransactions and how a majority of time and effort goes into ensuring players are coming back to those modes by way of addiction rather than by way of an immersive and compelling virtualization of our favorite sports.
I don't think the core development team of the NHL series "doesn't care". Sure, there are people there just collecting a decent paycheque for software development, engineering, etc. But having actually met with and interacted with the development team in-person, albeit 10 years ago, they are genuinely passionate about the product they put out.
I disagree. They used to have a much larger community that stopped playing because their voices we're and still are being ignored. There are two options for this series to grow: New management, or time in between to make a make a better product. That's why they are so gung-ho on adding the "new crowd" because you're not getting most of the old ones back.
EA_AljoCommunity Manager
While I get that not everything has been added that the community has requested, we're not ignoring you all. Many changes have happened due to community feedback. If you're talking about regular patches to address gameplay with 23, obviously, that hasn't happened. That doesn't mean the feedback you all provide is being ignored. It's entirely possible we'll see that incorporated in a future release.
In a perfect world, we could easily make the changes being asked, but that's not the case. Most often, making a positive change in one area results in a negative effect in another. So, we have to take the time necessary to make sure that doesn't happen or is minimized as much as possible. This is often why feedback we receive doesn't make it in to the game until years later.
You also mention taking time in between to make a better product. We haven't had many updates for 23, but this hasn't gone over well. So, it doesn't seem that the community really wants this. We can't take that time while simultaneously providing frequent gameplay updates.
As far as having a larger community before goes, keep in mind that a lot has changed with the community over the last 10 years. The same people playing then have moved on to having careers and families. My club that started with NHL 09 played almost daily. Now, we're lucky to get one night a week together just because our schedules don't line up. I'm not saying this is the sole reason for what is perceived to be a smaller community, but it needs to be considered.
I definitely understand there's many of you wishing for the days of old while continually adding new updates and features. I'd love that as well, but the sport of hockey is essentially the same year after year. It's not exactly easy to keep the game fresh and new while also retaining legacy gameplay. Overhauling the gameplay year after year would probably be pretty frustrating for the playerbase. There's also the issue of dealing with a new meta every year from making gameplay changes to move away from the previous meta. People are always going to seek out the easiest ways to score so it's a constant battle of trying to stop one meta, without introducing another. Having goalies cover the short side, but now leaving the far side open is a good example.
Thanks for all the feedback here. I know many of you are upset at the lack of attention said feedback has received. The team is very well aware of that and I'm hopeful we'll see this put in to action better in the future. We'll just have to wait for news about that in the coming months.
