Horde mode feedback
So what do you think about the new horde mode introduced as the new weekly mode? Personally, I love it! ❤️ I had a blast playing it so far, but I have also talked to someone who hates it. In my op...
Forum Discussion
@benn1nat0ri think its kind of fun, but it gets old quick. It also shares problems with PVP in general. Primary weapons are pretty slow at killing, which makes it a little too difficult to stop players from escaping, especially when sprinting. I don't think its very fun when my damage is reduced to 6 or 7 because armor. More primary damage would help. Fights are too slow, and frequently games are filled with camping and sniping.
The drones are pretty fun but also very unbalanced and annoying with having extra hp and speed. Helps make camping even more frustrating to play against. The spawn point abilities are cool.
You know what? These classes are perfect campers. They can set their spawn point. They can snipe because no dropoff. And they can send in drones from a safe distance. It truly captures the spirit of bfn.
@Pheesley So far I haven't encountered any camping in this mode except spawn camping, which is terrible in any mode.
I don't think the primary damage is too low. In my opinion it's fine the way it is. I always read comments on the forums that healing is way too strong (although sunflower has been nerfed into the abyss) and primary damage is too low.
But seriously, why does everyone think so?
You can vanquish a player in a few seconds without using special abilities. If primary weapons were to be buffed even more everyone would just keep dying every few second.
Everyone always mentions gw2 in this context. I wouldn't want bfn to be like gw2. I liked gw1, hated gw2 and love bfn.
I quit gw2 because it was unbalanced (mainly op imp) and to me it seemed like healing had no impact whatsoever.
I don't think the primary damage is too low. In my opinion it's fine the way it is. I always read comments on the forums that healing is way too strong (although sunflower has been nerfed into the abyss) and primary damage is too low.
But seriously, why does everyone think so?
You can vanquish a player in a few seconds without using special abilities. If primary weapons were to be buffed even more everyone would just keep dying every few second.
Everyone always mentions gw2 in this context. I wouldn't want bfn to be like gw2. I liked gw1, hated gw2 and love bfn.
I quit gw2 because it was unbalanced (mainly op imp) and to me it seemed like healing had no impact whatsoever.
- @benn1nat0r primary damage being too low and healing being to high is true. Healing slows down fights so much, and unless you have abilities, there's not much you can do except snipe from a safe distance. Its pretty unfun to fight. And sunflower isn't bad because her healing is so good.
When people mention gw2, its probably because gw2 is just designed better. Gw2 had low damage, only a little higher than BFN's. Movement was slow enough, and there wasn't any sprinting, so there wasn't constant hiding and running away. The damage and movement mixed together pretty well.
In BFN, they lower the damage even more, and then added sprinting, making movement faster, made healing faster, and added Overhealth. The damage is too low to combat any of this well, and it makes running and hiding constant.- @Pheesley First of all I want to thank you for your detailed reply!
I know I'm probably in a minority with my opinions on these issues but I can't really agree with many points you make.
I wouldn't say gw2 was better designed. Especially in the beginning things were extremely unbalanced and it stayed that way for much longer than it did in bfn founder's edition. I get that all of this is subjective, but I found the maps to be way worse, the art style was much darker and didn't reflect PvZ, they added so many variants that it got way too complicated.
Bfn improved on the art style, soundtrack, things to do besides pvp, maps (except maybe the lack of verticality) and much more.It made the experience more accessible. The new character are awesome as well,
I played gw1 a lot and felt like gw2 was a rushed downgrade from the original. I couldn't stand playing it anymore after 20 hours. So far I have played bfn for 600+ hours.
I think sunflower's healing was nerfed so much that it's nearly useless already. They removed the ability to combine the upgrade that makes healing faster and enables her to heal 2 plants. Sunny Side up has a high recharge time.
Scientist can easily heal entire groups and himself while also having great mobility.
And I couldn't play the gw games anymore nowadays because of the lack of sprinting. Honestly, without it getting anywhere would be way too tedious. While playing the gw games I felt that movement was way too slow.
As for the primary damaged, I think they have sufficiently increased that a number of updates ago. I like the TTK the way it is now. I believe it is more forgiving while also enabling more strategic play. I know it sound like characters having better primaries would require more strategy, but I disagree. In gw2 players always used the most op high dps characters and you were obliterated before even making a move. It wasn't fun.
Sniping is a problem and damage drop off would help, but Im' not sure it would fit with bfn's map design. The maps are very big and most of the time combat isn't close up. I think it could end up being tiresome if you always had to cross half the map before being able to do any damage as a non sniper.@benn1nat0r im happy to discuss this stuff! i do like that bfn returned to the more colorful artstyle. I like that there are more suburban maps. The game definitely feels like pvz. The music is nice. And I used to be against sprinting, but I think it will be a nice change of pace, if it is added in correctly.
I was willing to say goodbye to variants. But the upgrade system that was put in their place does not provide nearly as much variety as variants did. Most of the perks feel like gimmicks rather than anything interesting.
My main problem is the gameplay. From what I understand, the lower damage makes BFN a much slower, more team oriented game. I basically have to stick near teammates to succeed most of the time.
The problem of having no Damage Dropoff is that in allowing players to snipe with no incentive to get closer, it ends up creating these fights where players are constantly hiding and shooting behind cover. And because damage is so low, these fights can be very long and slow. Then there are other factors like healing and sprinting, which allows player to escape more easily. For me, it makes the pvp very unsatisfying.
With the gw games, i felt that most characters had an overall forgiving TTK that allowed players to react somewhat. I think if damage dropoff was added, they would probably have to increase damage a little, but it wouldn't be too high, and it would not intrude on the map designs. For example, soldier or corn could be able to deal up to 9 damage, instead of constant 5, 6, or sometimes 7 on critical hits.
