Stop the TW mismatches

"DarjeloSalas;c-2125493" wrote:
Here’s one for you...



We went in on 43/50 (226M). We have several guild members on vacation / travelling this weekend. I guess opponents went in on 45/50.

Here’s the board after 2hrs 45 mins


We’re quite TW focused, but the margin of victory can’t just be down to us having 2 less players than them, surely?

Yes, which is exactly what I (and others) have been saying for over a year. Even being 2 players off is enough to throw the MM out of whack to get matches exactly like what you showed.

Although, margin of victory... did they eventually clear? Lots of guilds just can't be that active in the first 3 hours.

Simple solution: do exactly what they do now but only match guilds with the same record in their last 10 TWs. Perhaps give higher rewards for wins in 10-0 vs 10-0 matches than in 2-8 vs 2-8 matches. At least matches will be more competitive.

"DarjeloSalas;c-2125493" wrote:
Here’s one for you...



We went in on 43/50 (226M). We have several guild members on vacation / travelling this weekend. I guess opponents went in on 45/50.

Here’s the board after 2hrs 45 mins


We’re quite TW focused, but the margin of victory can’t just be down to us having 2 less players than them, surely?

"Margin of victory 21h hours" BEFORE TW ends.... yeah yeah,

"DarjeloSalas;c-2126489" wrote:

"StarSon;c-2126483" wrote:

"DarjeloSalas;c-2125493" wrote:
Here’s one for you...



We went in on 43/50 (226M). We have several guild members on vacation / travelling this weekend. I guess opponents went in on 45/50.

Here’s the board after 2hrs 45 mins


We’re quite TW focused, but the margin of victory can’t just be down to us having 2 less players than them, surely?

Yes, which is exactly what I (and others) have been saying for over a year. Even being 2 players off is enough to throw the MM out of whack to get matches exactly like what you showed.

Although, margin of victory... did they eventually clear? Lots of guilds just can't be that active in the first 3 hours.

They did eventually, but the winning margin was ~400 points.

We dropped 9 battles total. They dropped 79.

I don’t think a 2 player difference was the cause here. We are PvP focused (we’ve had fewer than 9 drops on several occasions) and our opponents obviously aren’t.

I mean, they dropped more than 9 clearing a zone of Bossk led Bounty Hunters - that’s surely got nothing to do with one guild having 2 more members? They dropped 7 clearing a Carth lead OR team zone.

You have to remember that matchups analysed on paper don’t tell the whole story. If you’ve got one guild who have a problem with TM-loading Geos and Nightsisters facing another who know their counters, the result is pretty clear regardless of the stats.

C'mon, everybody simply KNOWS: whoever enter with signifcant less players will win (2~3+). If you want make a point, bring a TW when your guild had 5+ more members than the adversary and got a win. Then, you goint a point.

P.S.: We do use that, we limit players to 42. Still unbeaten this year this way. When we relax and accept 45 to 47 members max, we have a winning rate of 66%. The last one we got sandbagged, 45 players against 40. No need to try.

P.S.2: Easy fix for Cg, just add to the code to pair guilds with 1+, 1- players assigned to TW. If you enter with 48, you'll be assigned against a guild with 47, 48 or 49. The prizes are not so good, so keep it funny at least.

"orangelights;c-2126525" wrote:
Simple solution: do exactly what they do now but only match guilds with the same record in their last 10 TWs. Perhaps give higher rewards for wins in 10-0 vs 10-0 matches than in 2-8 vs 2-8 matches. At least matches will be more competitive.

Lots of simple options. But based on Kyno's responses, it's pretty clear that CG still doesn't even see this as a problem, so it's not going to change.

"MaruMaru;c-2126542" wrote:

"GJO;c-2126533" wrote:

"DarjeloSalas;c-2126489" wrote:

"StarSon;c-2126483" wrote:

"DarjeloSalas;c-2125493" wrote:
Here’s one for you...



We went in on 43/50 (226M). We have several guild members on vacation / travelling this weekend. I guess opponents went in on 45/50.

Here’s the board after 2hrs 45 mins


We’re quite TW focused, but the margin of victory can’t just be down to us having 2 less players than them, surely?

Yes, which is exactly what I (and others) have been saying for over a year. Even being 2 players off is enough to throw the MM out of whack to get matches exactly like what you showed.

Although, margin of victory... did they eventually clear? Lots of guilds just can't be that active in the first 3 hours.

They did eventually, but the winning margin was ~400 points.

We dropped 9 battles total. They dropped 79.

I don’t think a 2 player difference was the cause here. We are PvP focused (we’ve had fewer than 9 drops on several occasions) and our opponents obviously aren’t.

I mean, they dropped more than 9 clearing a zone of Bossk led Bounty Hunters - that’s surely got nothing to do with one guild having 2 more members? They dropped 7 clearing a Carth lead OR team zone.

You have to remember that matchups analysed on paper don’t tell the whole story. If you’ve got one guild who have a problem with TM-loading Geos and Nightsisters facing another who know their counters, the result is pretty clear regardless of the stats.

C'mon, everybody simply KNOWS: whoever enter with signifcant less players will win (2~3+). If you want make a point, bring a TW when your guild had 5+ more members than the adversary and got a win. Then, you goint a point.

P.S.: We do use that, we limit players to 42. Still unbeaten this year this way. When we relax and accept 45 to 47 members max, we have a winning rate of 66%. The last one we got sandbagged, 45 players against 40. No need to try.

P.S.2: Easy fix for Cg, just add to the code to pair guilds with 1+, 1- players assigned to TW. If you enter with 48, you'll be assigned against a guild with 47, 48 or 49. The prizes are not so good, so keep it funny at least.

No idea why they haven't dunnit to this day. One problem with it though; scarcity of guild at high gp. When the equation involves mm with actives only, it becomes harder to solve. And CG may be specifically wary of this since their highest paying customers are there.

True, but they really bother about "Tw's prizes"? Not much, tw is about fun, not about prizes

"DarjeloSalas;c-2123682" wrote:

It’s a shame you don’t care, because I could do with a pointer to where my comprehension is letting me down.

"Starl0rd;c-2121572" wrote:

"I used 6m GP vs two 3m GP to make the point of the active GP argument. While I agree, and didn't intend, that this isn't the normal matchup...what is normal is seeing 38-40 vs 50, of the same "active" guild GP."

The quote above was made on June 10, earlier in the 2nd page where I said that it was an EXAMPLE of an active GP issue, but also stated that I didn't intend or say that this is the normal TW mismatch ...YOU were the only person in this thread that believes I specifically claimed two 3m GP players vs a 6m GP ...everyone else understood it as the example I used regarding the issue of the "active GP" claim.

StarSon posted a screen of an actual TW mismatch, not only showing a 20m GP difference, but a major difference in rosters ...

now you need to digest it all and figure it out, and I'll move along..

"orangelights;c-2126525" wrote:
Simple solution: do exactly what they do now but only match guilds with the same record in their last 10 TWs. Perhaps give higher rewards for wins in 10-0 vs 10-0 matches than in 2-8 vs 2-8 matches. At least matches will be more competitive.

The only problem with win records, is that guilds can be fluid and a system like that could be manipulated too.

"StarSon;c-2126538" wrote:

"orangelights;c-2126525" wrote:
Simple solution: do exactly what they do now but only match guilds with the same record in their last 10 TWs. Perhaps give higher rewards for wins in 10-0 vs 10-0 matches than in 2-8 vs 2-8 matches. At least matches will be more competitive.

Lots of simple options. But based on Kyno's responses, it's pretty clear that CG still doesn't even see this as a problem, so it's not going to change.

Not that they dont see it as a problem, but nothing in the data is jumping out that this is as much of a thing as the player base sees it as.

If every guild is within a margin of error around the 50% win mark, then there is no red flag on their end. Which would also point to the fact that this may not be as viable a strategy as some think, if no guild is just popping off wins due to being at 40+/- 5.

"Kyno;c-2126840" wrote:

"StarSon;c-2126538" wrote:

"orangelights;c-2126525" wrote:
Simple solution: do exactly what they do now but only match guilds with the same record in their last 10 TWs. Perhaps give higher rewards for wins in 10-0 vs 10-0 matches than in 2-8 vs 2-8 matches. At least matches will be more competitive.

Lots of simple options. But based on Kyno's responses, it's pretty clear that CG still doesn't even see this as a problem, so it's not going to change.

Not that they dont see it as a problem, but nothing in the data is jumping out that this is as much of a thing as the player base sees it as.

If every guild is within a margin of error around the 50% win mark, then there is no red flag on their end. Which would also point to the fact that this may not be as viable a strategy as some think, if no guild is just popping off wins due to being at 40+/- 5.

My guild has not won a TW since March due to this exact reason. A 0% win rate over our last 10 or more TWs would fall well below this "margin of error" wouldn't you say? Why is that not "jumping out" over there? We used to win 40-50% of the time but as soon as April hit, we have only ever seen way more powerful guilds with less participation than us completely demolishing us. It's not even close. This is absolutely a problem at the moment. I know that not every guild is exploiting this but the algorithm is in serious need of updating. The fact that it can be exploited in the first place should be a red flag. I can also see in the comments here that some people are very pleased with the status quo and will accuse anyone who is trying to get this looked at by the devs of exaggerating. We are drowning here. There has not been any parity for us in months. This has to change.

Kyno, none of this is directed towards you. I know that you are volunteering your time here. I'm sorry if anything I said or how I said it didn't sit well with anyone. I am absolutely fed up with this problem. I know that I am not the only one. I contacted EA help about this last month. I was told it would be looked into. Since then it has gotten worse for us. Our last 2 match ups completely cleared our whole map within hours. We couldn't do more than half of theirs. Please someone fix this.