Re: EA please tell us the requirements for Ultra Settings (with stable fps)

@SimmerGeorge  Feel free to upload a log from another game.  It would be interesting to compare the two side by side.  I'll take a look at both later today.

@puzzlezaddict So I chose Final Fantasy XV as the different game because I figured it's more graphically demanding than the Sims 4. I never really noticed any issues with it, except for like a crash once or twice which is allegedly a normal thing with a certain area in this game. 

Here's the link to that: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1P4ZNHFuUGk6_nArGfIrH4-bIUgnKqcxb/view?usp=sharing

Also I start playing around the 7-9 minute mark with this one. 

@SimmerGeorge  Your hardware is certainly performing as expected, or close enough, in the other game.  So the question is why it doesn't work harder in Sims 4 specifically.  I know you've tried uninstalling the game, using a clean folder, clearing Origin's cache, etc., but I (and more importantly, the much wiser second opinion) think it's time to do everything together.

Start by uninstalling Sims 4:

• Put aside your Sims 4 folder in Documents\Electronic Arts and rename it to something that doesn't include the words "Sims 4."
• Download Revo Uninstaller (the free version is fine) from here.
• Launch Revo, select Sims 4 from the list, and click Uninstall.
• Once the game is uninstalled, select "Moderate" under "scanning modes," and click Scan.
• Review the list, in case there's something you want to save; otherwise, click Select All, and then Delete.
• Close Revo, and restart your computer.

Next, uninstall Origin:

• First, clear Origin's cache.
• Quit Origin, then right-click on the Task Bar and open the Task Manager.  Scroll through looking for Origin entries.  If you find any, click on them and End Task.
• Launch Revo again and uninstall Origin, and when it's uninstalled, select "Moderate" again and Scan.
• If Revo finds any remaining registry entries, select all, delete, and click Next.
• Revo will display "Remaining Data and Folders.  Select all of them except for the "Origin Games" folder, if it appears.  (This is where other Origin games are installed by default.)  Delete the rest.
• Close Revo, and restart your computer.

Next, download and install Origin—the regular version, not the beta.  Here's the direct download link:

http://download.dm.origin.com/origin/live/OriginSetup.exe

Be sure to run both the installer and Origin itself as an admin: right-click on each and select "Run as Administrator."  When it's reinstalled, download Sims 4; you can just download the base game, to save time, if you want.

Restart after installing and before playing, and allow the game to create a(nother) new user folder rather than reusing your existing one.

@puzzlezaddict Okay so I don't want to dissapoint you but I don't know I think it didn't work. I did everything you listed today, took me almost 2 hours to complete, deleted the cache, removed the folder an renamed it,  unistalled the whole thing with Revo, both the game and then Origin, did the scan, deleted the leftovers. I did everything together and it still didn't work. I just tried to ultimate test, I put a Spa in San Myshuno and visited it with a sim and I got max 50 fps when zoomed in and staying completely still with the camera, and when I tried to rotate around the building (like in normal gameplay, not too zoomed out) I got fps in the 20s, for a second I hit 19 fps haha. 

I tried playing with vsync off right after reinstalling but the screen tearing is so bad, even though the fps isn't very high. But I have to say I had 120 fps in my isolated residential home lot and a second later 40 fps in a community lot. One would think this is definitely a hardware issue but I really almost never had problems with other games. I play Smite, FFXV with no problems but since I don't play a lot of games I couldn't tell you. It could very well be a hardware issue but Smite and FFXV just work for some reason?

Maybe this is just how it is, maybe this is the performance one gets with a gtx 1060 6gb in 1080p on ultra settings in the Sims 4. Maybe the card isn't capable of more.

Here another 10 minute log I made after I did what you suggested: https://drive.google.com/file/d/12GCMtRarpanOZ9j7zxl1BJJg5ZjJgBPt/view?usp=sharing

What I am going to try now is to play around with v-sync and maybe disable the Sims 4 one and use NVIDIA v-sync or I will try installing the game in D drive. I know it makes no sense that the problem would be which hard drive the game is on but since the Sims 4 is the only game in my SSD and also my only game not working I guess it's worth a try. 

@SimmerGeorge  You certainly don't need to worry about disappointing me.  After all, you're the one whose computer isn't cooperating.

Just to double-check, these tests are in a new save in a clean Sims 4 user folder, with absolutely no content transferred from your old user folder?  No mods or custom content, no old sims, nothing?  If you haven't done that yet, please try it now.

San Myshuno isn't the best place to test your framerates.  The world is not exactly optimized, and pretty much everyone has at least relatively poor performance there.  I usually test in Willow Creek, then compare it with Sulani, although most other worlds (not Del Sol Valley) are fine.  Please also test with post processing disabled in-game—I've noticed some strange fps drops with it enabled, not a steady hit but more like random lower framerates that don't correlate to any obvious cause.

I'd also be interested to see an hwinfo log with no vertical sync enabled at all.  I know the screen tearing is bad, but at least see how the graphics card performs when it's not limited.  Then you can compare it with the effects of enabling vertical sync or setting a max frame rate within the Nvidia Control Panel.

Your graphics card should absolutely be capable of running Sims 4 on ultra settings.  The hwinfo logs show it's not working hard at all, really nowhere near its theoretical capacity, and that's the reason why you're seeing such poor performance.  The stubborn question is why.

I have to admit I am exhausted from doing so many tests the last week but I thought I'd get it over with and tried a few more. I played for only like 15-20 minutes though:

First I tried disabling v-sync in game and had nvidia set to "use 3d application setting" for v-sync. The screen-tearing was terrible, fps reached max 104fps or something and min 28fps with drops and spikes all the time. The save I use, like with the last log too, is the new save created after re-installing, the folder is brand new and there is absolutely nothing from the old folder in there. The old folder is saved away in an external hard drive atm. 

When I did this I noticed GPU power slightly raised, but memory load stayed the same and CPU usage in still really low (which could be normal for this game?) 

"no game v-sync, 3d application setting" link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TRfdyqOWGG9E7lhWfzSB9rz5IPDpBseK/view?usp=sharing

Then I went into my NVIDIA control panel and decided I wanted to change v-sync from "let 3d application decide" to "off" just to be sure. The fps stayed at around the same range as above but I noticed a big difference in screen-tearing, is was a lot less noticable, though still visibly there: 

So here's the link to "no game v-sync, nvidia v-sync off" :  https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YH472UExpo_3YCfVhYeuFhVOCpew-57l/view?usp=sharing

Finally, I tried to play with no v-sync (either game or nvidia) and no post-processing effects. The fps did improve but didn't really become stable, it just had larger spikes. For example it still reached 28-30 while zoomed out observing an area but it was more rare. During normal gameplay in a busy lot it stayed between 60 and 40 but in residential lots, depending on what the screen was showing it went up to 180 fps pretty often. Also even though the fps got better, the game looked terrible without post-processing effects. Without the blur you can see the low quality set dressing all around the detailed active area in ultra settings and it is super yuck in my eyes. If Post-processing does indeed end up being the problem I'd rather play a this low fps mess than turn this setting off again :P

Here's the link to that then, "no v-sync, no post-processing": https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ku7bG6n9qrk47L03HVPDL1Z2G1M4XJCL/view?usp=sharing

In this logs I am usually jumping into the game right off the bat, not more than a minute waiting so take that into consideration. Usually the way I test this is starting in a residential area and the going to different community lots in Windenburg, Brindleton Bay, Britechester and then back to a residential area. 

Another thing I will try is playing another game from Origin and making a log. The only Origin game I play regurarly is the Sims 4 so I should test another game just to see if I face the same issues. 

Also a question, when uninstalling the Sims 4 on Reno, the game was listed as a 32-Bit application. Is that supposed to be this way? I'm sure I am playing 64-Bit since I am getting the updates and everything but I thought I'd ask. 

Now I have to say the amount of research we are doing on this game's performance in this thread is crazy haha, it's almost like playtesting for a game company.  

@SimmerGeorge  If you don't want to go without post processing, that's fine.  Your GPU performance was actually more unsteady with the setting disabled, so at the very least, it's probably not going to help.

Interestingly, with the in-game v-sync setting disabled, your GPU did perform somewhat better, although it's still unsteady.  But at least it was running at its peak clock speed for much of the time, and also maintaining a higher core load.  Here are the two readings for the first and second tests:

The question is why the load drops, even though the card still has a high enough workload available.  I'm sure you're tired of experimenting, so why not try everything at once?  Please do all of the following, together:

• Leave the in-game v-sync option disabled
• Leave the Nvidia v-sync disabled as well
• Clean boot the PC: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/929135/how-to-perform-a-clean-boot-in-windows
• When it reboots but before playing, go through the Task Manager's background processes list and shut down anything still running that isn't critical—anything from RGB software to MSI Afterburner might still be running
• Completely disable any antivirus you have
• Sign into Origin, put it in offline mode, then take your computer completely offline, as in, disable wifi and/or unplug the ethernet cable
• Disable Origin in-game (even though it shouldn't matter while offline): hover over your username, select Application Settings, then the Origin in-game header, and disable the option at the top
• Start logging, then launch the game
• And as always, clean user folder, no existing content, etc.

Let me know how the fps looks, and of course I'll be happy to see another hwinfo log.  Just so you know, I'm asking someone else who's better at this than I am to look at this too, so I don't miss anything useful.

@puzzlezaddict Good day. I tried what you suggested just now. I followed your instructions carefully and did everything with no issue. However one thing I couldn't manage was to get rid of Cortana and Microsoft Edge from running in the background, which is almost impossible. I tried ending the task, disabling the programs in settings and restarting, didn't work, they kept running in the background. 

As for the Anti-virus, I only use Windows Defender which I successfully disabled after restarting along with the firewall. 

Here's the link to the log:  https://drive.google.com/file/d/1delbd9ROGKpm1EP7h5in_-eVMvUdCDM8/view?usp=sharing

One thing I noticed this time around is that (I think) the GPU performance was a bit more stable in the beggining but then it started losing stability completely after like 15-20 minutes. I don't know if that is true or not, so it would be great if you checked for me. I don't know If I did anything to cause the performance to be unstable again. In the beggining I spent some time in CAS and just Sulani at home, I think the instability started when I visited community lots in other worlds. Or another thing I changed halfway during gameplay (which probably has no correlation but I'll mention anyway) was that I turned on The Sims 3 camera which was off for the first 15 minutes. 

Also for every log I make I delete the Sims 4 folder to have a fresh one.

One theory I have developed over the course of doing this is that maybe the real problem is my proccessor. The Sims 4 is a weirdly made game and if I'm not mistaken not so well-optimized in general. It's also pretty old right now. I own a Ryzen processor and the AMD Ryzen series only launched in 2017, so 3 years after the release of the game. My assumption is that the game just isn;t well-compatible with the Ryzen processors and the team didn't think it was a problem important enough to fix, since many Simmers either play in systems older than 2017 or they play on laptops which rarely have Ryzen processors, they mostly have Intel.

I think the processor could be bottlenecking my GPU because in order for the GPU to work harder it needs the CPU to work harder. Now if the game can only utilize max 30% of my CPU power but the GPU needs more than that to function at it's best then it hits a ceiling and cannot go over it unless it finds a way to utilize more CPU power. 

It's just a theory I have, since I know many Sims players have the gtx 1060 6gb card and most say it works fine. But I don't know many Sims players with my particular CPU. 

Hi @SimmerGeorge 

I am the person @puzzlezaddict  refereed to as "someone else who's better at this than I am" which may or may not be true. 😉

First I like to address your other thread about EA support, and wile I will not comment on the quality of that support, in your case there is just very little they can do.

The support of a gaming developer is for problems caused by the game, in your case it is very unlikely that this is a game problem and much more likely that it is a problem with other components on your system, and then it is jut not something EA would be responsible for nor something they could provide support for.

For your theory it is true that your system as a whole is underperforming when you use Sims 4, so it can't be ruled out, that is why I asked Puzzle to see to a newer Bios that might address that problem.  (Unfortunately the only newer BIOS that is available for your board is a beta BIOS, so we should take this as a last resort.)

But I don't think that there is a general problem between the game and AMDs Zen possessors. We would see much more feedback in this regard here if that would be the case.

After all what was done I like to get a fresh overview of your system. Please create a new DxDiag and attach it to your next post.

@holger1405 Hey hey, thanks for taking time to help haha. It's so awesome people are so helpful in here. 

Just to clear things up I have to add that my complaint on the other thread is not about me finding a solution to my problem not about me thinking the issue is caused by the game and the game alone. It's more that, no matter what kind of a technical issue one is facing, there shouldn't be advisors telling people to launch video games in safe mode. It was more about having competent people who take time to listen to the issue rather than read down a list of possible solutions that aren't nearly related to the problem, or even are destructive. 

I was thinking about trying to update my BIOS again and I'm really almost convinced it could work but first I am going to write an E-mail to the company that built my PC and ask them for their help on choosing the correct BIOS for my computer. They have my specs in their database and know the most about my system so hopefully they will provide me with the right update. It can take some time for them to reply but I'll let you know as soon as they do.

I just updated my DxDiag on my original post. 

Thanks in advance for your help. 

@SimmerGeorge 

---

SimmerGeorge wrote:

there shouldn't be advisors telling people to launch video games in safe mode.

---

Well, that is true. 😃
Before you update the BIOS, and it is not nearly as dangerous as some seem to think, 😉 I would recommend a different approach, namely to upgrade to the newest Windows build.

You are still on Windows build 18363. That build will lose support in Mai 2021, so you need to update soon anyway.

To make this clear, you don't have a performance problem in the sense of the word.

This has nothing to do with the game getting "bigger" and your CPU could not handle it. The HWinfo logs show clearly that neither your CPU nor your GPU are utilized as they should be.  

@holger1405 Do you know why my Windows update doesn't automatically suggest those new build updates? 

I could download them manually though. Can I just install the latest 20H2 version or do I have install them one after the other? 

@SimmerGeorge 

Many possible reasons, but not easy to determine. The update will most probably take care of that issue as well.

You can directly install 20H2. Easiest way is to use MS Edge to go to this MS side.

Than click on "Update now", download the Update exe, run it and let Windows do its work.

@holger1405 The company that built my PC just contacted me. They said I do have an A320M Pro installed inside, but it just happens that MSI uses the term MS-7B84 for both my and the B450 motherboards. 

They said my BIOS could have failed due to issues with the USB not being read correctly. To be honest I do think there's something more happening there. When I tried the BIOS Update the first time the USB I wanted to use got corrupt after putting the BIOS files in there, since I always double-check everything, I took a second look in my USB contents before doing the update and found the flash drive had created tons of files, all with unreadable names like "78($%+_aθι" and so on. So I just redownloaded the BIOS files, put them in another (kind of cheap 4GB FAT32) USB and tried -the now failed- BIOS update. I also did a Windows Defender scan later on, but nothing came up. 

Maybe I should get a new USB for this update, not sure but I think I'm certain the issue with the update came from the sytem not being able to read the USB files correctly. 

Also I did do the 20H2 update, thanks again! 🙂

For now I am waiting on what the company (called Megaport, if you're German you might know them) is going to suggest, unless you have anything else you can suggest? 

@SimmerGeorge 

So the performance after the update did not changed at all?

From the Windows build update? Idk I still can't zoom out to view the whole are without my fps dropping to 28 and in community lots the more sims come, the lower it drops reaching 27-35 average. I don't know, should I make a video or something? 

This is my latest log: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-FMu6W-RthuAjChqOgYIYHNy95oM6j_L/view?usp=sharing

I also updated my DxDiag. Is there anything we haven't tried yet? 

@SimmerGeorge 

Did you heard back from Megaport?
And no, a video is not necessary.

Now that we are on the newest chipset driver and Windows build I like to focus on the driver.

• Follow this manual to the letter to cleanly uninstall all NVIDIA components.
• Install the graphics driver and GFE. > Go online.
• Test.

@holger1405 Yes, Megaport did actually reply after viewing my logs and said everything with the hardware should be fine, if I have been experiencing issues with a certain game (but not all my games) then they unfortunately cannot provide any specific game support (which is understable).

Thank you for sending me this manual. I did everything exactly as this manual suggested. Since you can't really tell, you'd have to trust me on that one. I paid a lot of attention (since I am honestly also getting tired of the situation). As always I made a new log after finishing up the process https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uwTp3iv9_lsVFiWMgH2SoUqce1rTAkE7/view?usp=sharing

I used another fresh Sims 4 folder for this log aswell. 

From an fps point of view I have to say I am not facing any issues in residential lots. The big problems happen when I visit community lots, especially in areas like Britechester or the pier area with the bar and lounge in Brindelton Bay or even some Newcrest areas that have a lot of lots. Generally, where there are Sims, lots of objects and water the fps drops to the 20-30s almost instantly. I still have this issue this time around, though I might be wrong but it seems a little more stable now. It's just those massive drop in GPU usage I cannot understand that happen for several minutes at a time, especially towards the end. 

I do not think there's hope here, I have literally cleanly uninstalled and reinstalled everything even a bit related to the game's performance. It must be something else and even if it is, I doubt it is fixable at this point. 

As always, I immensly apprieciate any help or suggestion you might have and if you have any other I will gladly try them. And thanks a lot again!

@SimmerGeorge 

Ok, your GPU clocks look considerable better in this last HWInfo log than in the first one.

The GPU usage is hard to compare for me.

With my RTX 3080 I get 144FPS (Caped) in normal game play, but even with this GPU I get FPS droops to 60 - 70 if I zoom out to max.
But the GPU goes never over 30% usage and I have no way itm to compare usage of a 1060.

@puzzlezaddict certainly knows more about the typical usage of different GPUs in the Sims 4 than I do.

• Make sure the game is closed.
• Open the NVIDIA Control panel.
• Choose "Manage 3D settings".
• Choose "Program Settings"
• Choose the "Sims 4" (If it is not in the list, search for it: "TS4_x64.exe" Standard path C:\Program Files (x86)\Origin Games\The Sims 4\Game\Bin\.
• Go to "Power Management Mode"
• Set it to "Prefer Maximum Performance"
• Apply
• Test.

@holger1405 Yeah again this whole thing could be fully normal. This is why I named the thread the way I named it when I first started the thread. I simply assumed that 30fps when zommed out was normal for my card in the Sims 4. But then again, how unstable can a game be when you get min 100 to max 180 fps in small residential lots and then suddenly min 28 to max 60fps in community lots. It's such a crazy difference. Are few more sims and few more objects so incredibly demanding that you lose so much fps? 

Coincidentally I did try the maximum performance thing out yesterday after looking around in the NVIDIA settings and made a really short log with it, since I didn't notice that much of an fps difference in community lots, only thing I noticed was that the fps for once didn't drop below 30 and it stayed at min 33 fps but I thought that nothing really changed so I got bored and exited the game and stopped the log. I could make a longer one if needed. This is the one I did yetserday. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZJEwlb_LF58jIr4WdZwiQEh4huKuMFS8/view?usp=sharing

I would really love to compare my performance or at least know what the gtx1060 6gb is in general capable of, in order to understand if this is a normal occurence or not. Maybe someone who knows about how certain cards perform like @puzzlezaddict or someone from EA could comment, because I know some EA people have seen this thread but didn't feel it was neccesary to step in. Maybe now is a good time?

@SimmerGeorge 

OK, there are two things I like to test.

First, I noticed a anomaly in the HWinfo log.

Please go here and download GPU-Z. 

The Tool don't requires a installation, just run it > Start TS4 and post a screenshot of the Sensor panel of GPU-Z.

Second:

• Make sure the game is closed.
• Open the NVIDIA Control panel.
• Choose "Manage 3D settings".
• Choose "Global Settings"
• Go to "DSR Factors"
• Enable: 1.78x
• Apply
• Now you should be able to choose 2156x1440 as in game Resolution > Set it this way.
• Run HWinfo log > Run the game for 10 minutes.
• Post the HW info log and tell us please what differences in FPS you see.

So I don't know if I got it right since the info changes once I go into desktop from my game but you can see the history. It reads around 30-45%

I will post the log from the NVIDIA thing as soon as I'm done. 

@holger1405 Okay so I just finished logging the Sims 4 in 1440p and I am a bit confused as to what to say about the fps. Overall I think the fps went up about 5-8fps in general. I particularly noticed that it dropped below 35 only for maybe a split second, before it used to stay at 26-28 for several seconds at once. I tried many different areas, residential as always around min 80 to max 180fps depending on how big and crowded the lot is. Community lots with the camera looking at the active lot I would say min 40 to max 90fps. If a lot of Sims are on the lot maybe 2-3 fps lower. And looking at the whole neighborhood area at around 33-38 (again weirdly enough depending on if it is residential or community, in residential lots looking around the hood zoomed out gives around 45-50 fps maybe it has to do with the amount of sims idk). 

One thing I noticed for the first time, yet I think it has always been happening was that I can be zoomed in at two sims having a conversation, no moving the camera, completely still and the fps will go from 70 then a second later 58 then 63 then 51 then back up to 70 without me moving anything and I also noticed it does that with the game paused aswell. Maybe this is normal in the Sims 4 not sure (maybe the fps meter that is built in with the game just works this way?). 

Other than that it looked smoother in my eyes, idk I couldn't tell you an average fps since I'm still playing with vsync off and it varies so much.

The link to the new log:  https://drive.google.com/file/d/1sYOZUMfGcWf7SQVDFJvSnVGjNoR3MYXa/view?usp=sharing##

Also I just restored my NVIDIA settings back to normal after this post.

@holger1405 Would playing in 1440p cause any problems in the long run? 

Also yeah, I figured that there's something wrong with the compatibility and my game just doesn't run as it should. It's crazy that it runs so fine in 2k. I expected performance to drop massively but I guess not. It's such a bummer this game is this way. 

However, I still wanted to ask if you think there are any issues in the logs of me playing other games or at least the FFXV log since I think I haven't posted any others. I am now a little bit worried that there could be  something wrong with my GPU so I think I'll try to look for the same issue in other games too just to rule out the possibility of faulty hardware. Maybe take a look at this, it's need for speed most wanted on Origin and I'm not sure if it shows a similar problem as the Sims 4.  https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eilKkNoV8o3ncVWR_IY8i5z82isSYGIa/view?usp=sharing

Keep in mind this is also a very old game so it probably doesn't use much GPU power anyway. I just hope it doesn't do the whole peak and drop thing too.

Thanks again for your help. It's unfortunate nobody from EA Support here and in the Live Chat could help or even cared to help really. 

I'll keep this thread open for maybe a day or two in case someone from EA wants to take a look, comment, agree or disagree, just anything really. After that I'll just use your reply as the solution. Also big thanks to @puzzlezaddict too.